Contador positive!!!!!

[nicholaaaas]

It doesnt matter if it benefitted him or not. As this thread indicates with the new but unproven evidence of plascticizer in his urine-which is not sanctionable unfortunatley-the presence of clenbuterol and now plasticizer, the mere presence is indicative of something unusual and almost certainly wrong.

Its like if a bank robber is caught after the police have recovered all the money but he still has minute traces of invisible dye on his fingers or clothes from handling the money---it indicates the fact of wrongdoing. Regular folks just dont have clenbuterol floating around in their pee.

regular folks probably do, they're just not in the UCI testing pool. and this second "smoking gun" is even more ***. guess what HE DID TAKE SOMETHING INTRAVENOUSLY; probably an iv for dehydration. Is he dirty? probably. is this proof? no. should this be his downfall? no. Jesus got a more fair trial

 

[Ripper]

Let's play multiple choice.

Contador is a:

A. Hose
B. Window
C. Shoe
D. Door
E. Napkin
F. Flexible container
G. Professional cyclist

I'll go with G. But hey, if you disagree with that answer, good luck showing otherwise.

Priceless!

 

[nicholaaaas]

None of the articles in that link is less than 14 years old.

Keep trying, though.

so farmers stopped taking shortcuts 14 years ago? they're all clean?

 

[icefire]

As well as in
Hoses and profiles: DEHP is used to plasticise PVC, which is then used for flexible hoses and profiles (gaskets) that are durable and highly resistant to weathering.

Shoe soles: DEHP-plasticised PVC is used for many shoe soles because of its flexibility, durability and anti-slip properties.

Sealings: One of the non-PVC applications of DEHP are sealings, which are often applied to windows and doors for improved insulation.

Others: industrial doors, flexible containers, curtains for lorries and train compartments, sports mats, swimming pool covers, tarpaulins, signs, shower curtains, napkins, stationery films, book binding, maps and folders, roofing materials, water beds, furniture, luggage, traffic cones, buoys, disposable gloves and dipped tool handles.

Good luck on establishing as fact that the DEHP and its metabolites in Contas urine stems from blood bags!

Mmm... let me think... Plasticiser got into Contador's bodily fluids because he was chewing his shoe soles waiting for his meat while Vino was having dinner

 

[Ferminal]

regular folks probably do, they're just not in the UCI testing pool. and this second "smoking gun" is even more ***. guess what HE DID TAKE SOMETHING INTRAVENOUSLY; probably an iv for dehydration. Is he dirty? probably. is this proof? no. should this be his downfall? no. Jesus got a more fair trial

It's the same as Astana 2009... Signs of IVs used but not enough evidence to qualify as a breach of the Code.

(Just so you know, IVs of any sort are banned).

 

[GJB123]

It doesnt matter if it benefitted him or not. As this thread indicates with the new but unproven evidence of plascticizer in his urine-which is not sanctionable unfortunatley-the presence of clenbuterol and now plasticizer, the mere presence is indicative of something unusual and almost certainly wrong.

Its like if a bank robber is caught after the police have recovered all the money but he still has minute traces of invisible dye on his fingers or clothes from handling the money---it indicates the fact of wrongdoing. Regular folks just dont have clenbuterol floating around in their pee.

That is the million dollar question here and it seems that regular folks do if we are to trust consumer reports in for example Belgium. It is just that regaulr folk never have to pee in a cup in order for their pee to be analyzed, so in reality we (as in you, I and the rest of the people here) really do not know.

Regards
GJ

 

[Anonymous]

As well as in
Hoses and profiles: DEHP is used to plasticise PVC, which is then used for flexible hoses and profiles (gaskets) that are durable and highly resistant to weathering.

Shoe soles: DEHP-plasticised PVC is used for many shoe soles because of its flexibility, durability and anti-slip properties.

Sealings: One of the non-PVC applications of DEHP are sealings, which are often applied to windows and doors for improved insulation.

Others: industrial doors, flexible containers, curtains for lorries and train compartments, sports mats, swimming pool covers, tarpaulins, signs, shower curtains, napkins, stationery films, book binding, maps and folders, roofing materials, water beds, furniture, luggage, traffic cones, buoys, disposable gloves and dipped tool handles.

Good luck on establishing as fact that the DEHP and its metabolites in Contas urine stems from blood bags!

Oh yea, I get it now, the cow was injected with Clenbuterol and then the farmer stuck his gloved hand up the cow's a$$ after having picked the gloves up off of the industrial floor from a flexible container, then took a train to the farm where he hit some golf balls off of a mat onto a swimming pool that was covered, then grabbing a tarpaulin to put over the sign that said "WE DON'T USE CLENBUTEROL IN BEEF" where upon he felt dirty for what he was about to do, and decided to take a shower first in hopes of cleaning off the immoral feeling he was having, and in the absence of towels he used napkins and because he still felt a bit guilty, he wrote his feelings of guilt down in his journal which he keeps protected from the elements of a farm by placing the pages in stationary film, but he still needed some absolution for the sin he was readying to commit, so he picked up a very old bible that had the spine torn off, and he decided that maybe it would be a good idea to visit the Vatican after it was all over, so he real quick looked to see what the best route would be from Spain to Italy via car, and just then he remembered his wife had been all over him about fixing the hole in the roof, so he real quick took that off the "Honey Do" list, and went to tell her, and she thanked him with a little trip of the light fantastic on their water bed and the night table, but he once again failed to perform to her satisfaction so she told him to pack his **** and get out, so he got the luggage all ready, and he packed some traffic cones in case he got a flat on the way to Italy because he is just like that and always plans ahead, and he also packed a buoy because he might try to charter a boat on his trip because he loves the Mediterranean in the summer and he would like to get started early on finding a new wife, and what do chicks dig more than a boat, but he didn't want to move too fast on that because he was headed to the Vatican for goodness sake, but right now, time for fantasy was over, and he needed to get on with putting on those disposable gloves and injecting his cow with Clenbuterol and then reaching up its a$$ to feel for whatever it is farmers feel for when they stick their hands up cow's asses, and he realized that he would need a pair of pliers for whatever job it was that necessitates a farmer sticking his hand up a cow's a$$.

Too bad Contador got a steak from that guy, huh?

 

[nicholaaaas]

It's the same as Astana 2009... Signs of IVs used but not enough evidence to qualify as a breach of the Code.

(Just so you know, IVs of any sort are banned).

yes but the wording leaves ambiguous loopholes

"Legitimate medical indications for IV infusions are well documented and are most commonly associated with medical emergencies. Some examples include: ...Drug and fluid supply in situations of volume replacement when other routes of administration are not available (e.g. intractable vomiting) "

so after a hard day you're dehydrated and nauseous an iv for fluid replacement would be allowed

http://www.wada-ama.org/rtecontent/document/intravenous_infusion_en.pdf

 

[meandmygitane]

http://translate.google.com/transla.../1.2171754/expert_contador_var_dopad&from=rss

"Sweden's famous [should be "leading"] doping expert saw [verb "saws", that is: he disputes it strongly] Alberto Contadora's claim that he received in the doping agent clenbuterol after eating meat.

-You have to eat enormous quantities of meat to give a positive. I have also consulted with other experts and none of them think it's reasonable, "says Mats Garle, the doping lab at Huddinge hospital, the SVT Sport.

---

However a expert from the agricultural department said that, although hard to judge, it was possible that the positive could be due to contaminated food. (see eurosport.se)


Conflicting statements..

 

[nicholaaaas]

http://translate.google.com/transla.../1.2171754/expert_contador_var_dopad&from=rss

"Sweden's famous [should be "leading"] doping expert saw [verb "saws", that is: he disputes it strongly] Alberto Contadora's claim that he received in the doping agent clenbuterol after eating meat.

-You have to eat enormous quantities of meat to give a positive. I have also consulted with other experts and none of them think it's reasonable, "says Mats Garle, the doping lab at Huddinge hospital, the SVT Sport.

---

However a expert from the agricultural department said that, although hard to judge, it was possible that the positive could be due to contaminated food. (see eurosport.se)


Conflicting statements..

this guy is saying that the amount is consistent, but slightly high< with contaminated meat. he also assumes that the test was 24 hours after ingestion which it wasn't... it was later that evening... so the amount he had to ingest would be lower

http://martinbudden.wordpress.com/2010/10/01/contador-–-cheat-or-bad-meat/

 

[Barrus]

this guy is saying that the amount is consistent, but slightly high< with contaminated meat. he also assumes that the test was 24 hours after ingestion which it wasn't... it was later that evening... so the amount he had to ingest would be lower

http://martinbudden.wordpress.com/2010/10/01/contador-–-cheat-or-bad-meat/

No not really, Contador stated that he ate the contaminated meat on the 20th, the positive pee was on the 21st
At least that was what I've seen

 

[Climbing]

I agree completely. That is the real rub. Like I said, imagine if they retroactively introduce positives for blood doping based on finding di(2-ethylhexyl) in your system. We could see the exclusion of over half or more of the participants in any GT.

You are completely wrong.
I would say 99%, but probably 100%... even 110%

 

[Machu Picchu]

No not really, Contador stated that he ate the contaminated meat on the 20th, the positive pee was on the 21st
At least that was what I've seen

I read somewhere that he actually ate the meat in two sittings, both the day before and then again on the actual rest day.

 

[imcdn69]

yes but the wording leaves ambiguous loopholes

"Legitimate medical indications for IV infusions are well documented and are most commonly associated with medical emergencies. Some examples include: ...Drug and fluid supply in situations of volume replacement when other routes of administration are not available (e.g. intractable vomiting) "

so after a hard day you're dehydrated and nauseous an iv for fluid replacement would be allowed

http://www.wada-ama.org/rtecontent/document/intravenous_infusion_en.pdf

True ... but is the chemical compound found in IV fluid bags the same that is found in the bags that are utilized for the storing and transportation of blood?

 

[nicholaaaas]

No not really, Contador stated that he ate the contaminated meat on the 20th, the positive pee was on the 21st
At least that was what I've seen

i guess that would make more sense then eating a big *** steak the day before the tourmalet

 

[nicholaaaas]

True ... but is the chemical compound found in IV fluid bags the same that is found in the bags that are utilized for the storing and transportation of blood?

i would assume so... unless blood bags cost a **** ton of money to produce; using various materials for iv bags would be cost prohibitive

 

[theswordsman]

I read somewhere that he actually ate the meat in two sittings, both the day before and then again on the actual rest day.

That's what he said at his press conference. He had it for supper the first night, then again at lunch on the rest day. It sounded like he had it the second time because he didn't want to seem unappreciative to the guy who traveled with meat. The video of the press conference with Eurosport translation is at AlbertoContadorNotebook.info

Contador's spokesman has reacted to the blood transfusion story.

Contador spokesman Jacinto Vidarte told The Associated Press the Spanish rider "categorically denies having a blood transfusion."

"There is nothing to that," he said. "It is a science fiction story."

Vidarte said no one at the international cycling federation, which announced Contador's positive test Thursday and his temporary suspension, has told Contador that plastic residues were found in his urine.

Vidarte claimed the World Anti-Doping Agency has not validated a method for detecting plastic from blood transfusion bags.

WADA Director General David Howman, however, told the AP that a method was "fully validated and has been used in the food industry for years."

"Its use for anti-doping purposes is partially validated and evidence from it, among others, can be used before tribunals," Howman said.

http://www.universalsports.com/news/article/newsid=494403.html

 

[Machu Picchu]

Contador then ate the meat in two sittings, one before the second rest day and one during it. The only reason he had eaten it, he said, was because he felt morally obliged to Lopez Cerron after the Spaniard had brought it all the way to him in France.

from cyclingweekly

This is the only place that I've heard this though, anyone ?_?

 

[Maxiton]

Oh yea, I get it now, the cow was injected with Clenbuterol and then the farmer stuck his gloved hand up the cow's a$$ after having picked the gloves up off of the industrial floor from a flexible container, then took a train to the farm where he hit some golf balls off of a mat onto a swimming pool that was covered, then grabbing a tarpaulin to put over the sign that said "WE DON'T USE CLENBUTEROL IN BEEF" where upon he felt dirty for what he was about to do, and decided to take a shower first in hopes of cleaning off the immoral feeling he was having, and in the absence of towels he used napkins and because he still felt a bit guilty, he wrote his feelings of guilt down in his journal which he keeps protected from the elements of a farm by placing the pages in stationary film, but he still needed some absolution for the sin he was readying to commit, so he picked up a very old bible that had the spine torn off, and he decided that maybe it would be a good idea to visit the Vatican after it was all over, so he real quick looked to see what the best route would be from Spain to Italy via car, and just then he remembered his wife had been all over him about fixing the hole in the roof, so he real quick took that off the "Honey Do" list, and went to tell her, and she thanked him with a little trip of the light fantastic on their water bed and the night table, but he once again failed to perform to her satisfaction so she told him to pack his **** and get out, so he got the luggage all ready, and he packed some traffic cones in case he got a flat on the way to Italy because he is just like that and always plans ahead, and he also packed a buoy because he might try to charter a boat on his trip because he loves the Mediterranean in the summer and he would like to get started early on finding a new wife, and what do chicks dig more than a boat, but he didn't want to move too fast on that because he was headed to the Vatican for goodness sake, but right now, time for fantasy was over, and he needed to get on with putting on those disposable gloves and injecting his cow with Clenbuterol and then reaching up its a$$ to feel for whatever it is farmers feel for when they stick their hands up cow's asses, and he realized that he would need a pair of pliers for whatever job it was that necessitates a farmer sticking his hand up a cow's a$$.

Too bad Contador got a steak from that guy, huh?

Wait. Could you run that by me one more time?

Anyway, an "inside source" tells me that, while all the above is very likely true, the plasticizers would have showed up in Contador's blood anyway, because he was chewing on the shower curtain while being ******ed by Armstrong in the bathroom.

These guys need to be more careful.

 

[Machu Picchu]

This is the only place that I've heard this though, anyone ?_?

Contador said he and four other Astana teammates ate the beef on July 20 and that he was the only one who underwent a doping test on July 21. He ate more of the meat that day, explaining that although it wasn't normal to eat steak a day before racing, it was too good to waste.

here as well

 

[theswordsman]

Contador categorically refuted rumours of a possible blood transfusion during the Tour.

"If they want to test every sample I've given in the Tour, as many different laboratories as they want, or if they want to freeze it for three or five years until other future tests are scientifically validated and then check it, they can do it," he said. "I have nothing to hide."

http://www.nytimes.com/reuters/2010/10/01/sports/sports-uk-cycling-contador.html?_r=1&ref=global

 

[slowoldman]

Contador categorically refuted rumours of a possible blood transfusion during the Tour.
http://www.nytimes.com/reuters/2010/10/01/sports/sports-uk-cycling-contador.html?_r=1&ref=global

So has every other doper.

 

[frenchfry]

from Contador then ate the meat in two sittings, one before the second rest day and one during it. The only reason he had eaten it, he said, was because he felt morally obliged to Lopez Cerron after the Spaniard had brought it all the way to him in France.

This is the only place that I've heard this though, anyone ?_?

So Contador goes to the trouble in the middle of the TDF to ask someone he probably hardly knows to deliver him some meat that has to be transported 100's of kms that he can only eat the day before a rest day (because he doesn't eat meat the day before a racing day) and that meat, apparently against all odds, is contaminated by a substance that is banned for cyclists.

Is asking others to bring meat from home a Spanish custom?

Does Contador really think we are that stupid?

 

[131313]

It seems everyone is looking for an excuse as to why he didn't dope. Problem is that he doped. It is no secret that they blood refill on the rest day. If you follow the sport, and you don't know this, you have been blind. The reports from Germany and France are telling, and make much more sense than tainted beef. Sorry, almost every rider caught comes up with an excuse as to why it was a mistake. I know there are those here who support Contador, and have railed against Armstrong. I implore you to be consistent in your application of suspicion.

I haven't seen too many people looking for an excuse, or claiming that Contador didn't dope. I'm certainly not. What I do believe is that he was not using Clenbuterol, because it's easily detected and not effective for a cyclist.

Given the amounts in question, it wouldn't surprise me at all if he transfused blood which contained trace amounts of Clenbuterol from tainted meat. Who knows, maybe they found elevated amounts of DEHP from his baseline levels and that's why they drilled down to find something which yields a binary positive test, like some sort of steroid or stimulant?

The DEHP levels are a lot more damning, if they are indeed elevated. It's certainly not unlike the UCI to sweep things under the rug.

That said, if someone gets pulled over for speeding while robbing a bank, and he wasn't speeding, do you still punish him for speeding? Make the case for bank robbery, yes. Speeding, no.

I'm not in the habit of defending dopers, but I also believe in basic fairness. I simply don't see any possible way he was doping with Clenbuterol. Given its half-life, if he were doping with it in training it almost certainly would have shown up in another control.

 

[uspostal]

"Contador categorically refuted rumours of a possible blood transfusion during the Tour."



I almost beleived him up to this point, everybody's that guilty always categorically denies the charge : OJ, Tiger, Roger Clemens,Mark Mcguire, Rafael Polmariero, A Roid, God the list could get really long of innocent people who categorically denied being guilty and end up guilty