Contador vs. Froome

[Merckx index]

Obviously they’re the two best GT riders of this generation. Contador has 7 GT wins (+ 2 more DQd) vs. 4 for Froome, but all of Froome’s are in the TDF. Froome also has four other podiums in GTs (though only one in the TDF), while Contador has 4 other top tens (three in the TDF).

If we use the current WT points system, Contador has 7985 WT points in eleven GTs (+ 2325 points DQd in three GTs), while Froome has 7320 points in ten GTs (including 20 points for a 36th place in the 2009 Giro). These totals are for GC finishes only, and do not include stage wins. The points system has changed several times in recent years, and I’ve made no attempt to award points in an individual year according to the scale in use at that time, as I believe the current one is a fairly accurate reflection of the difference between these three GTs (though one could argue that the Giro finishes should be worth a little more than the Vuelta’s).

Contador is near the end of his career, and is unlikely to win or perhaps even podium in another GT. If he were to race in two more GTs—say the Vuelta this year and the Giro next year—and finish well in both, I'd guess he could pick up at best maybe about 1000 more points. Froome, OTOH, will be a GT contender for probably another two or three years, and could potentially pick up several thousand more points. It will be interesting to see if he can top the 10,000+ points Contador has currently accumulated on the road.

 

[Gigs_98]

Pretty sure there already is a Contador vs Froome thread

 

[Merckx index]

Pretty sure there already is a Contador vs Froome thread

I tried to find it, but the search would not work because the names are so common. Even with titles only it didn't work.

If there is such a thread, the OP in this one can be added to it.

 

[Red Rick]

There are many ways to look at this, depending on who you like more.

 

[Red Rick]

Pretty sure there already is a Contador vs Froome thread

It got locked. Found it with a google search. Gonna let this one open.

 

[deValtos]

Re:

There are many ways to look at this, depending on who you like more.

:lol:

This is very true.

 

[northernsong]

If Froome wins one more TDF I think the debate is over on results. As of today there are good arguments both ways. More interesting will be their legacies. Froome has managed his career incredibly well, done so with a hyper-professional team and will end up with results that probably exceed in some ways his individual talent. Contador will always have that element of what if. Cycling is such a dysfunctional sport and while he has navigated it gracefully I feel like he was never able to escape that. So ultimately I think Froome will be viewed as the bigger champion but Contador will have the more romanticized career, sort of a less polarizing version of Armstrong v. Pantani.

 

[spalco]

I like Froome, but I don't see how you can make the argument in his favour. If he wins his 5th Tour and maybe the Vuelta, it get closer, but I really value winning all 3 GTs very highly.

 

[Red Rick]

Obviously, this is only about GTs, but if we're going by the complete palmares, Nibali vs Froome is a more interesting case.

 

[silvergrenade]

Can we not have this thread please?
It really doesnt matter and will definitely create bad blood between members....It has happened before and will happen again..

 

[Scarponi]

Contador would have 5 TDF is he was allowed to race in 2008 and he knew he could race it in 2011. 2012 is 50/50 if he could overcome those TT minutes but if he brought that 2011 Giro form I think he could

So out of those three years he could have won easily two of those or all three.

Froome bar 2014 crash has not had the disruptions like Contador in his peak years.

Froome who knows where he goes from here? I feel like its the same as saying in 2010 Contador wont win another Tour but the difference is Froome wouldnt target the Giro if he wasnt good enough for the Tour.

 

[carton]

I think 5 GTs (4TdF) > 7 GTs (2TdF). But Froome hasn't gotten there. So I think Contador is still ahead.

I can imagine Froome riding a la Contador as he ages, and finds himself behind the 8-ball more often. At their dominant peaks, they were very calculating riders reliant on their time-trialling but similarly given to take risks to try to stamp their authority on a race (even when they didn't have it, see Froome in Semnoz or Izoard or Contador on Mortirolo or Tourmalet).

 

[LaFlorecita]

Re:

I don't see how you can make the argument in his favour. If he wins his 5th Tour and maybe the Vuelta, it get closer, but I really value winning all 3 GTs very highly.

Same here
& even if their palmares objectively will end up on a similar level, I think Contador will be regarded higher as someone else mentioned here. His career will be romanticized.
I also think Alberto could have won more TDFs if his career had been a bit smoother.

 

[Pennino]

This must be a joke. Contador any time, any day. Wait, why couldn't I just ignore this topic.

 

[Hugo Koblet]

Contador would have 5 TDF is he was allowed to race in 2008 and he knew he could race it in 2011. 2012 is 50/50 if he could overcome those TT minutes but if he brought that 2011 Giro form I think he could

So out of those three years he could have won easily two of those or all three.

Froome bar 2014 crash has not had the disruptions like Contador in his peak years.

Froome who knows where he goes from here? I feel like its the same as saying in 2010 Contador wont win another Tour but the difference is Froome wouldnt target the Giro if he wasnt good enough for the Tour.

Froome would have won 8 Tours by now if he hadn't had bilharzia and hadn't crashed out of the 2014 Tour.

On a serious note, Froome's palmarès aren't that of Contador's at the moment. He can certainly get there, perhaps even just with another Tour win. I don't think he'll leave a mark like Contador has though.

 

[Escarabajo]

I don't know where this is going!!

 

[dacooley]

lol at opinions massively driven by huge bias. let's also add contador might have won 15 grand tours over the whole career if froome hadn't made one of a kind transformation in 2011. -) on a serious note, Bertie is still ahead, and the chance of froome overtaking him is quite small.

 

[Blanco]

Re:

I think 5 GTs (4TdF) > 7 GTs (2TdF). But Froome hasn't gotten there. So I think Contador is still ahead.

I can imagine Froome riding a la Contador as he ages, and finds himself behind the 8-ball more often. At their dominant peaks, they were very calculating riders reliant on their time-trialling but similarly given to take risks to try to stamp their authority on a race (even when they didn't have it, see Froome in Semnoz or Izoard or Contador on Mortirolo or Tourmalet).

Equal at best.

 

[Angliru]

Re:

lol at opinions massively driven by huge bias. let's also add contador might have won 15 grand tours over the whole career if froome hadn't made one of a kind transformation in 2011. -) on a serious note, Bertie is still ahead, and the chance of froome overtaking him is quite small.

...and of course this guy ^^^^^is free of any hint of bias.

Froome could and likely will overtake Contador in terms of the value of his grand tour wins. Staying with one team with a singular focus and with such depth of talent will almost guarantee it unless injuries to Froome sideline him. The biggest problem though is that many of the Sky/Froome fans simply can't fathom why Contador has such a huge passionate following and Froome does not and likely still will not when his career ends.

 

[deValtos]

Re: Re:

The biggest problem though is that many of the Sky/Froome fans simply can't fathom why Contador has such a huge passionate following and Froome does not and likely still will not when his career ends.

What huge following?

For reference mr evergreen Valverde outstrips Contador in terms of popularity in Spain by a long way and he's only won one GT though Contador is respected.

I think sometimes people on here forget they post on a cycling forum and it's a very small/niche group of people. Ofc it's no surprise that people who enjoy and watch so much cycling to discuss it on a forum value other races in the year (Giro/Vuelta) extremely highly if not more than TDF under certain circumstances.

I think maybe you could argue though that more of Contadors fans are die-hard and Froome maybe has more casual fans due to the nature of Froome targeting the TDF. Though many Froome fans are passionate and it would be unfair to say otherwise.

In terms of general following I just saw the Froomester overtook Contador on twitter. Not to mention you don't even have to be liked to create a legacy, check Armstrong, the evil villain role is actually quite a popular one.

 

[Angliru]

Re: Re:

The biggest problem though is that many of the Sky/Froome fans simply can't fathom why Contador has such a huge passionate following and Froome does not and likely still will not when his career ends.

What huge following?

For reference mr evergreen Valverde outstrips Contador in terms of popularity in Spain by a long way and he's only won one GT though Contador is respected.

I think sometimes people on here forget they post on a cycling forum and it's a very small/niche group of people. Ofc it's no surprise that people who enjoy and watch so much cycling to discuss it on a forum value other races in the year (Giro/Vuelta) extremely highly if not more than TDF under certain circumstances.

I think maybe you could argue though that more of Contadors fans are die-hard and Froome maybe has more casual fans due to the nature of Froome targeting the TDF. Though many Froome fans are passionate and it would be unfair to say otherwise.

In terms of general following I just saw the Froomester overtook Contador on twitter. Not to mention you don't even have to be liked to create a legacy, check Armstrong, the evil villain role is actually quite a popular one.

Fortunately, I don't have anything to do with Twitter, so thanks for bringing that bit of info to my attention. You question Contador's following but then use it as a measuring stick to prove Froome's popularity.

...and where did I say that Froome's fans weren't passionate, just that, in my observations, they aren't as large in their numbers as Contador's. My post was unclear. My bad.

Contador is seen as an evil habitual liar by some (especially some LA fans) so with the good goes the bad.

 

[Rollthedice]

Re:

Obviously, this is only about GTs, but if we're going by the complete palmares, Nibali vs Froome is a more interesting case.

Only about GTs, going by OPs logic Vincenzo Nibali has 8319 points. How about that?

 

[deValtos]

Re: Re:

Fortunately, I don't have anything to do with Twitter, so thanks for bringing that bit of info to my attention. You question Contador's following but then use it as a measuring stick to prove Froome's popularity.

I'm not trying to prove Froome's popularity per se, for his achievements so far he probably isn't as popular as other riders would've been honestly. I'm just pointing that sometimes people forget that the views of a very niche group (people that post on cycling forums) are not representative of overall popularity/following since you made the claim in your initial post Contador has a large/passionate following and Froome does not and probably never will have. To which I don't see any evidence for.

 

[Põhja Konn]

Contador has shown wider variety of ways to win, has shown himself to be much more adaptable to different demands posed by different races and races situations. In short, he has shown to be less dependent on phyical superiority over his rivals in order to win a GT when compared to Froome. Winning all three GTs 3 times is in my eyes worth much more than winning one of them 4 times, even if that one is the Tour.

Contrary to Contador, Froome most likely isn't done with winning GTs yet, and thus can close the gap in the future. Also there's little doubt he has been physically the strongest and most complete GT rider during the last 5 years, but when comparing his entire career achievements with Contador's, Froome right now is still clearly behind.

For clarification, due to the clinic related baggage Froome and his team have, I don't see a point in scratching Tour '10 and Giro '11 from Contador's palmares when comparing it to Froome's.

 

[Jspear]

Contador would have 5 TDF is he was allowed to race in 2008 and he knew he could race it in 2011. 2012 is 50/50 if he could overcome those TT minutes but if he brought that 2011 Giro form I think he could

So out of those three years he could have won easily two of those or all three.

Froome bar 2014 crash has not had the disruptions like Contador in his peak years.

Froome who knows where he goes from here? I feel like its the same as saying in 2010 Contador wont win another Tour but the difference is Froome wouldnt target the Giro if he wasnt good enough for the Tour.

If he had won the 2008 Tour, then he wouldn't have won the Giro and Vuelta. Then we'd have people saying he wasn't as great because he didn't win all the grand tours. Not racing the Tour in 2008 was a blessing in disguise. I'm not even as bummed about him missing the 2011 Tour. He gave us an amazing Giro that year. The 2014 Tour is the only one that makes me sad when I think about it.

Froome might come away with "better" palmares, but I doubt his career will ever be looked upon as fondly as AC's is and will be. If Froome wins the Vuelta this year (I think he will), then that will help his career. That's a very hard feat to accomplish. If he'd go for the Giro next year I might like him just a little little bit.