Controversies!!!

[pmcg76]

I dont want to rehash the whole chaingate incident from the Tour but the way some people reacted is hilarious, Contador is like the devil incarnate according to some.Personally, I feel he should have rode tempr for a bit but I aint going to crucify the guy either. Whilst there are unwritten rules in cycling, they are broken more often than some people think or realise. I want people to list incidents when the unwritten rules have been broken.

These include, taking advantage of a mechanical, crash, pee-stop etc.

Attacking your team leader or chasing down a team-mate.

Sitting on and then outsprinting breakaway colleagues when you are not protecting a team-mate.

Attacking in the feed zone, unlit tunnel when everyone has agreed to go slow etc.

I will kick of with some, 87 was a vintage year for breaking unwritten rules, Kelly and his team pushing the pace when race leader Roche punctured in Paris-Nice.

Roche attacking his team-mate/leader Roberto Visentini in the 87 Giro.

Systeme-U team of Fignon/Mottet attacking in the feed zone to isolate MJ Jean-Francois Bernard after he had punctured, Tour 87. Roche also joined in the attacks so we can see why Roche backed what Cotador done.

This year, Tour of Oman, manys teams v SKY when race leader Boasson Hagen took a pee stop, this was revenge fpr SKY attacking in feed zone apparently.

Luc LeBlanc attacking and catching his team-mate Gerard Rue at the 92 French nationals, Rue was on his way to a solo victory but LeBlanc won.

Oscar Sevilla v Aitor Gonzalez at a Vuelta from the early 00s when Gonzalez didnt wait on his Kelme leader.

Many Spaniards ganging up against Robert Millar in the 85 Vuelta to ensure a Spaniard Delgado won.

The peloton with US Postal to the fore pushing on when race favourite Alex Zulle crashed on the Passage du Gois in 99, Zulle lost 6 minutes.

Lance v Simeoni, the race leader chasing down a nobody on an insignificant stage for GC riders and telling the breakaway riders he would only drop back if Simeoni did too, he then famopusly gave Simeoni the a zip the lips signal.

Jacky Durand, Tour of Flanders 92, Durand seen breakaway companion Tommy Wegmuller fiddling with his gears on the Bosberg climb, Durand attacked and won.

Tour 1990, Greg LeMond has a mechanical on a mountain stage, race leader Chiappucci attacks. LeMond is livid and catches up and leaves El Diablo behind.

Tour, early 00s, Richard Virenque and Roberto Heras are all set to contest a finish of a mountain stage but Heras crashes in final KM, Virenque doesnt wait and celebrates like he won on his own merits

Tour 88, breakaway riders Robert Millar and Philipe Bouvatier are sent the wrong way near the finish, Massimo Ghirotto isnt and he doent wait for the other guys to catch up and takes the victory.

Nico Mattan slipstreaming a motorcycle and passing Juan Antonio Flecha to win Het Volk a few years back.

Phew, thats a lot already and I have just skimmed a few. Others....

 

[Ryo Hazuki]

the thing is the guys screaming the loudest about contador being a bad sportsman are the guys who have been following cycling for 3 weeks in the past few years at the most. anyone with even a decent awareness of cyclinghistory knows better

 

[sadfitty]

Tour, early 00s, Richard Virenque and Roberto Heras are all set to contest a finish of a mountain stage but Heras crashes in final KM, Virenque doesnt wait and celebrates like he won on his own merits

The finish in Morzine, year 2000. Don't think Virenque should have waited here. Heras was 10 meters behind him going into a left turn, and decided to go straight ahead instead of actually turning left. He f**k his front wheel, and it took quite a while to get a new one. Was Virenque supposed to get of his bike and wait for 30 sek?

 

[outrage9]

the thing is the guys screaming the loudest about contador being a bad sportsman are the guys who have been following cycling for 3 weeks in the past few years at the most. anyone with even a decent awareness of cyclinghistory knows better

Not true, it was pretty much a controversy with everyone.

 

[hrotha]

The incident with Mattan and Flecha happened in the 2005 Gent-Wevelgem.
The one with Sevilla and Aitor González was the 2002 Vuelta.

The 1998 Vuelta also comes to mind. Jiménez attacking in the mountains leaving his teammate Olano alone to defend his yellow jersey. Jiménez ended 3rd in the GC and at times it looked like he was going to try to win the race.

 

[junkie]

I can't see how these examples of poor spotrsmanship can justify AC's poor sportsmanship.

 

[indurain666]

I can't see how these examples of poor spotrsmanship can justify AC's poor sportsmanship.

The point is that it is only poor sportsmanship (learn how to spell the word) in the eyes of LA fanboys. All of the above cited incidents were just bike racing. Get over it, Lance is done.

 

[indurain666]

I dont want to rehash the whole chaingate incident from the Tour but the way some people reacted is hilarious, Contador is like the devil incarnate according to some.Personally, I feel he should have rode tempr for a bit but I aint going to crucify the guy either. Whilst there are unwritten rules in cycling, they are broken more often than some people think or realise. I want people to list incidents when the unwritten rules have been broken.

These include, taking advantage of a mechanical, crash, pee-stop etc.

Attacking your team leader or chasing down a team-mate.

Sitting on and then outsprinting breakaway colleagues when you are not protecting a team-mate.

Attacking in the feed zone, unlit tunnel when everyone has agreed to go slow etc.

I will kick of with some, 87 was a vintage year for breaking unwritten rules, Kelly and his team pushing the pace when race leader Roche punctured in Paris-Nice.

Roche attacking his team-mate/leader Roberto Visentini in the 87 Giro.

Systeme-U team of Fignon/Mottet attacking in the feed zone to isolate MJ Jean-Francois Bernard after he had punctured, Tour 87. Roche also joined in the attacks so we can see why Roche backed what Cotador done.

This year, Tour of Oman, manys teams v SKY when race leader Boasson Hagen took a pee stop, this was revenge fpr SKY attacking in feed zone apparently.

Luc LeBlanc attacking and catching his team-mate Gerard Rue at the 92 French nationals, Rue was on his way to a solo victory but LeBlanc won.

Oscar Sevilla v Aitor Gonzalez at a Vuelta from the early 00s when Gonzalez didnt wait on his Kelme leader.

Many Spaniards ganging up against Robert Millar in the 85 Vuelta to ensure a Spaniard Delgado won.

The peloton with US Postal to the fore pushing on when race favourite Alex Zulle crashed on the Passage du Gois in 99, Zulle lost 6 minutes.

Lance v Simeoni, the race leader chasing down a nobody on an insignificant stage for GC riders and telling the breakaway riders he would only drop back if Simeoni did too, he then famopusly gave Simeoni the a zip the lips signal.

Jacky Durand, Tour of Flanders 92, Durand seen breakaway companion Tommy Wegmuller fiddling with his gears on the Bosberg climb, Durand attacked and won.

Tour 1990, Greg LeMond has a mechanical on a mountain stage, race leader Chiappucci attacks. LeMond is livid and catches up and leaves El Diablo behind.

Tour, early 00s, Richard Virenque and Roberto Heras are all set to contest a finish of a mountain stage but Heras crashes in final KM, Virenque doesnt wait and celebrates like he won on his own merits

Tour 88, breakaway riders Robert Millar and Philipe Bouvatier are sent the wrong way near the finish, Massimo Ghirotto isnt and he doent wait for the other guys to catch up and takes the victory.

Nico Mattan slipstreaming a motorcycle and passing Juan Antonio Flecha to win Het Volk a few years back.

Phew, thats a lot already and I have just skimmed a few. Others....

You forgot Tour 07 AC's rear flat tire on the road to Briancon, none of the favorites waited for him!

 

[Kodiak]

In case I'm mistaken, every rider enters a race to win or at least attempt to. should another rider have an issue no matter what I don't see it as any reason to hold up. I don't have a problem with AC attacking. From what I saw Shleck did it himself shifting. Quit whining about it and move on.

 

[hrotha]

Instead of having that debate yet again it might be interesting to just remember past controversies.

 

[Steel4Ever]

I can't see how these examples of poor spotrsmanship can justify AC's poor sportsmanship.

Or Shrek's utterly (and sh!tty) amateurish "control" over his racing machine.
Watch the AC/AS Stage 20 "attack" -- Baby Andy screws up yet another shift!
Conti shouldn't wait for anyone who doesn't know how to ride a bike.

Oh, BTW, Stage 3 was it, when the yellow jersey crashed...didn't see Baby Andy/Saxo sitting up and waiting -- just the opposite, they attacked.

Guess it's only "poor sportsmanship" when it's to your detriment.

 

[Ryo Hazuki]

Not true, it was pretty much a controversy with everyone.

uh no. nobody in spanish, italian, dutch, french or flemish press talked about itr really. it was more a shock that the rest was shocked.

you should've heard eddy mercks about it.

 

[ustabe]

you should've heard eddy mercks about it.

That's Merckx. M-E-R-C-K-X.

So what did Eddy Merckx have to say about it? Post link, please.

 

[pmcg76]

Oh jeez, we are going back to rehashing what happened. My original point was just to highlight that these unwritten rules are broken all the time and it doesnt mean Contador should become some hate figure. Racing situations are different and people react differently and until they themselves are in the same situation they dont know how they will react, they can say I wouldnt do that but could be different if it actually happened, lets stick with examples of riders breaking unwritten rules whether you think its right or wrong.

 

[cycledan]

the thing is the guys screaming the loudest about contador being a bad sportsman are the guys who have been following cycling for 3 weeks in the past few years at the most. anyone with even a decent awareness of cyclinghistory knows better

Well I found it interesting that here in the USA coverage, the two former cyclists who had ridden the Tour said Contador should have waited. Phil Liggett thought he shouldn't have waited. Then again Greg Lemond sided with Contador. My personal opinion is that Schleck had just attacked and it was near the top of the last mountain. If Contador soft pedals it, then there is no way to gain any time. Menchov and Sanchez were also pushing the pace.

 

[dgodave]

Oh jeez, we are going back to rehashing what happened. My original point was just to highlight that these unwritten rules are broken all the time and it doesnt mean Contador should become some hate figure. Racing situations are different and people react differently and until they themselves are in the same situation they dont know how they will react, they can say I wouldnt do that but could be different if it actually happened, lets stick with examples of riders breaking unwritten rules whether you think its right or wrong.

I agree with you about Contador.
.
But I dont think you can open the thread with YOUR opinion on the incident, and then demand no one pick up on it.
.

 

[junkie]

Cunego '04 attacking Gibo.

This year's Giro: Vino and Garzelli attacking when Nibali crashed;
later on Astana did not defend their Maglia Rosa at l'Aquila.

 

[outrage9]

You forgot Tour 07 AC's rear flat tire on the road to Briancon, none of the favorites waited for him!

I don't know if I would consider him a strong GC contender at this point yet, he was a co-captain with Levi and Discovery had several lighting that day up and thats just from one team. I think if he had been a tour winner prior to 07 it would have been a little different. I believe part of this "unwritten code" is in earning it to begin with. He was known to be a good climber prior to this tour but his abilities to be what he's known for today in a GT weren't there yet, IMO.

 

[Ryo Hazuki]

That's Merckx. M-E-R-C-K-X.

So what did Eddy Merckx have to say about it? Post link, please.

He said how ridiculous it was that media were even talking about this as unfair sports and that in his place Merckx would've always attacked and said Contador did the only thing right to do. It was on Belgian tv, pls any Belgian or Duchtman can confirm this.

 

[Obeeone]

Al of my Euro friends are laughing at this incident....... it was a non-incident in their opinion. May the Schlecks never win a GT....... Well that may be a bit harsh.
I think it will be sweet retribution .. Bjarne wins 2011 TDF with Alberto....

 

[Polish]

I dont want to rehash the whole chaingate incident from the Tour but the way some people reacted is hilarious, Contador is like the devil incarnate according to some.Personally, I feel he should have rode tempr for a bit but I aint going to crucify the guy either. Whilst there are unwritten rules in cycling, they are broken more often than some people think or realise. I want people to list incidents when the unwritten rules have been broken.

These include, taking advantage of a mechanical, crash, pee-stop etc.

Attacking your team leader or chasing down a team-mate.

Sitting on and then outsprinting breakaway colleagues when you are not protecting a team-mate.

Attacking in the feed zone, unlit tunnel when everyone has agreed to go slow etc.

I will kick of with some, 87 was a vintage year for breaking unwritten rules, Kelly and his team pushing the pace when race leader Roche punctured in Paris-Nice.

Roche attacking his team-mate/leader Roberto Visentini in the 87 Giro.

Systeme-U team of Fignon/Mottet attacking in the feed zone to isolate MJ Jean-Francois Bernard after he had punctured, Tour 87. Roche also joined in the attacks so we can see why Roche backed what Cotador done.

This year, Tour of Oman, manys teams v SKY when race leader Boasson Hagen took a pee stop, this was revenge fpr SKY attacking in feed zone apparently.

Luc LeBlanc attacking and catching his team-mate Gerard Rue at the 92 French nationals, Rue was on his way to a solo victory but LeBlanc won.

Oscar Sevilla v Aitor Gonzalez at a Vuelta from the early 00s when Gonzalez didnt wait on his Kelme leader.

Many Spaniards ganging up against Robert Millar in the 85 Vuelta to ensure a Spaniard Delgado won.

The peloton with US Postal to the fore pushing on when race favourite Alex Zulle crashed on the Passage du Gois in 99, Zulle lost 6 minutes.

Lance v Simeoni, the race leader chasing down a nobody on an insignificant stage for GC riders and telling the breakaway riders he would only drop back if Simeoni did too, he then famopusly gave Simeoni the a zip the lips signal.

Jacky Durand, Tour of Flanders 92, Durand seen breakaway companion Tommy Wegmuller fiddling with his gears on the Bosberg climb, Durand attacked and won.

Tour 1990, Greg LeMond has a mechanical on a mountain stage, race leader Chiappucci attacks. LeMond is livid and catches up and leaves El Diablo behind.

Tour, early 00s, Richard Virenque and Roberto Heras are all set to contest a finish of a mountain stage but Heras crashes in final KM, Virenque doesnt wait and celebrates like he won on his own merits

Tour 88, breakaway riders Robert Millar and Philipe Bouvatier are sent the wrong way near the finish, Massimo Ghirotto isnt and he doent wait for the other guys to catch up and takes the victory.

Nico Mattan slipstreaming a motorcycle and passing Juan Antonio Flecha to win Het Volk a few years back.

Phew, thats a lot already and I have just skimmed a few. Others....

Thanks for the many examples of Bad Sportsmanship
Nothing to be proud of.
Plenty to be ashamed of.

But Alberto Tops the List.
Is there ANY doubt?

The only example of WINNING the Tour de France by attacking the Yellow.

If Chiappucci had defeated Greg by attacking during his mechanical, we would still be discussing it today.

Just like the "Contador Attack" will be discussed 20 years from now....

 

[Dedelou]

I dont want to rehash the whole chaingate incident from the Tour but the way some people reacted is hilarious, Contador is like the devil incarnate according to some.Personally, I feel he should have rode tempr for a bit but I aint going to crucify the guy either. Whilst there are unwritten rules in cycling, they are broken more often than some people think or realise. I want people to list incidents when the unwritten rules have been broken.

These include, taking advantage of a mechanical, crash, pee-stop etc.

Attacking your team leader or chasing down a team-mate.

Sitting on and then outsprinting breakaway colleagues when you are not protecting a team-mate.

Attacking in the feed zone, unlit tunnel when everyone has agreed to go slow etc.

I will kick of with some, 87 was a vintage year for breaking unwritten rules, Kelly and his team pushing the pace when race leader Roche punctured in Paris-Nice.

Roche attacking his team-mate/leader Roberto Visentini in the 87 Giro.

Systeme-U team of Fignon/Mottet attacking in the feed zone to isolate MJ Jean-Francois Bernard after he had punctured, Tour 87. Roche also joined in the attacks so we can see why Roche backed what Cotador done.

This year, Tour of Oman, manys teams v SKY when race leader Boasson Hagen took a pee stop, this was revenge fpr SKY attacking in feed zone apparently.

Luc LeBlanc attacking and catching his team-mate Gerard Rue at the 92 French nationals, Rue was on his way to a solo victory but LeBlanc won.

Oscar Sevilla v Aitor Gonzalez at a Vuelta from the early 00s when Gonzalez didnt wait on his Kelme leader.

Many Spaniards ganging up against Robert Millar in the 85 Vuelta to ensure a Spaniard Delgado won.

The peloton with US Postal to the fore pushing on when race favourite Alex Zulle crashed on the Passage du Gois in 99, Zulle lost 6 minutes.

Lance v Simeoni, the race leader chasing down a nobody on an insignificant stage for GC riders and telling the breakaway riders he would only drop back if Simeoni did too, he then famopusly gave Simeoni the a zip the lips signal.

Jacky Durand, Tour of Flanders 92, Durand seen breakaway companion Tommy Wegmuller fiddling with his gears on the Bosberg climb, Durand attacked and won.

Tour 1990, Greg LeMond has a mechanical on a mountain stage, race leader Chiappucci attacks. LeMond is livid and catches up and leaves El Diablo behind.

Tour, early 00s, Richard Virenque and Roberto Heras are all set to contest a finish of a mountain stage but Heras crashes in final KM, Virenque doesnt wait and celebrates like he won on his own merits

Tour 88, breakaway riders Robert Millar and Philipe Bouvatier are sent the wrong way near the finish, Massimo Ghirotto isnt and he doent wait for the other guys to catch up and takes the victory.

Nico Mattan slipstreaming a motorcycle and passing Juan Antonio Flecha to win Het Volk a few years back.

Phew, thats a lot already and I have just skimmed a few. Others....

How about ramaming your thread : "The art of racing" and leave "controversies" for hacks like the Versus channel and other TV commentators, who fears they might not have anything to contribute to cycling coverage, unless they can whipp the public into some emotions about something.

 

[Nick C.]

What about '04 in the Tour when Axel Merckx and Virenque were in a breakaway thru the Massif Central and after Merckx doesn't contest the KOMs (so I recall correct me if I am wrong) Virenque attacks over the top of the final climb.

 

[Dedelou]

Not true, it was pretty much a controversy with everyone.

you are right .. 3 weeks seniority is not an acurate representation of that group . Let us make make it 22 days for the rest days

 

[Polish]

What about '04 in the Tour when Axel Merckx and Virenque were in a breakaway thru the Massif Central and after Merckx doesn't contest the KOMs (so I recall correct me if I am wrong) Virenque attacks over the top of the final climb.

Yes, Virenque was certainly a turd sandwich that day.

But not nearly as bad as Alberto attacking the Yellow during a mechanical lol.

Not even close.