Coronavirus: How dangerous a threat?

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Chris Gadsden

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Until very recently, all the pictures I've seen of Trump rallies show unmasked supporters sitting close together, and frequently in indoor venues. While I'm not arguing the protests weren't risky--they clearly were--they were outside, people generally wore masks, they were further apart, and they were moving, which helps diffuse the virus.

When asked about masks, Mark Meadows made the false argument that mandates violate freedom. Anyone holding a rally can mandate masks without violating anyone's freedom, because anyone who doesn't want to wear a mask doesn't have to attend the rally. Moreover, we all know that if Trump, at the very beginning of any of these rallies, had made a personal plea for supporters to put on the masks that were handed to them when they entered, most would have complied. No mandate would have even been necessary.

Finally, the President is supposed to be setting an example for the rest of the country. The protesters were never elected to anything. The notion that what the President can do is justified by what ordinary citizens do is ridiculous. He shouldn't even be compared to what private businesses are allowed to do, and even there, he falls short. For example, the MLB season recently concluded. No fans were allowed at regular season games. In the late stages of the playoffs, including the World Series, fans were permitted, but at very reduced numbers. Masks were mandated, and social distancing was required. Why wouldn't any political rally be held to at least the same standard?
Rally goers rightly assumed since Antifa and BLM protesters were safe then so should they be.

If pro ball sports in he US didn’t take their lead from the covid-safe riots then that’s their fault.

That said we both know neither was safe but one side argues differently. My question is why?

Yes, it’s rhetorical.
 
Rally goers rightly assumed since Antifa and BLM protesters were safe then so should they be.
There were four campaign rallies beginning at the end of March, and before Floyd's death, so obviously rally goers were not taking their cue from protests. Not to mention that when rally goers were interviewed, AFAIK, they never mentioned protests as a reason for not needing precautions. If they had believed that, they would have taken masks and social distancing more seriously, and clearly they didn't.

That said we both know neither was safe but one side argues differently. My question is why?
Both sides actually make the same argument, one with at least a little more justification.

A lot of resistance by Americans to contact tracing, much of it based on privacy concerns:

For contact tracing to work, people have to agree to talk with public health figures, share some of their health information with them, share their recent activities with them, and then agree to self-isolate for an extended period of time. These are each very different hurdles that someone has to agree to clear for contact tracing to work.

The good news is that almost everyone would take the most difficult step: self-quarantining if asked to do so by a health official. On average, 73 percent said they definitely would, and another 20 percent that they probably would.
This really surprises me. Given all the resistance to masks, I would have thought a large proportion of the population would refuse to self-quarantine if they were told they had come into contact with someone who had tested positive.

The biggest problem for contact tracing may be, unexpectedly, the bombardment of the US population with spam phone calls. Only about 20 percent of US adults would pick up the phone if an unidentified number is calling them, and 15 percent wouldn't even listen to a voicemail left by one of these callers...Another fear is that, in the age of online and phone scams, people are justifiably leery of giving out their personal information...The end result of this is that only about 40 percent of the public said they'd be likely to speak to a public health official either by phone or in person.
I understand this unwillingness to answer calls from unknown numbers. If contact tracing were established, though, I'd answer calls, knowing they might be from health officials. The obvious problem arises when they ask you for information, and you aren't sure they're who they claim to be.


Again, a country with a strong tradition of individualism, as the U.S. has, is in a very difficult position in a pandemic.


i will agree with Chris to this extent. It's not just the U.S. that has been exposed. It's much of the West.
 
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Rally goers rightly assumed since Antifa and BLM protesters were safe then so should they be.

If pro ball sports in he US didn’t take their lead from the covid-safe riots then that’s their fault.

That said we both know neither was safe but one side argues differently. My question is why?

Yes, it’s rhetorical.
This is simply untrue. In its entirety.
Black Lives Matter and Antifa..what ever that is..protesters that participated in gatherings without masks,social distancing and safety measures are wrong ,they should not do it..
This constant new math..where two wrongs make a right..or for Team Trump..100's of wrongs equalling a right is ridiculous and wrong.
The next few days will illustrate ugly and dumb, or measured and humane.
The simple principles of -the ends justifying the means- do as I say not as I do - and the ultra Trump popular..it's better to ask for forgiveness than permission..
John Fogerty, Pink Floyd,Estates of dead artists, Queen..Rolling Stones..all demanding that Trump not use their music during these rallies of sickness..but instead the legal process will push past Nov3rd and a parking ticket type fine is anticipated.
 
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It's not just the U.S. that has been exposed. It's much of the West.
This is absolutely true IMO. I was curious how the test and track system would hold up in Europe given that they were starting from a much lower baseline. But it has pretty much crumbled under the weight of new infections. Of course this doesn't in any way excuse the USA for any of our failures, or the complete lack of ambition to try anything besides wait around aimlessly for a vaccine.
 
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Chris Gadsden

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This is simply untrue. In its entirety.
Not a single word is untrue. The corrupt press and their lackey’s told us over and over how safe the protests were/are. I think we all know why.

Logical conclusions therefore were drawn.

Given where the globe is wrt the pandemic, given the rates of infections seen should pro sports have taken a hunker-down position or that of the protestors?

Since we want so badly to point fingers let’s point to the liars. And there’s a bunch of them.
 
Our immediate neighborhood and part of my more emotional aspect to the C19 response. All the local hospitals immediately coordinated with UW, the Governor (vilified by Trump during the middle of the chaos and to this day) and First Responders. Medical staff were literal triage warriors working with skant PPE but stuck it out and, at first, it was all hands/citizens on deck to help out. Once it became politicized we got some pushback on masks but retailers and most institutions weren't having that sh*t and things became more manageable and orderly. Microsoft, Amazon and almost any business that could have folks work from home made it the crisis policy and most plan that protocol until end of Summer 2021 at this point. Construction resumed with what has been reasonably successful precautions so some of the economic pain was avoided except the previously robust hospitality industry.
Our biggest statewide outbreaks centered around the usual suspects: meat packing, food processing in Eastern Washington; classified as "essential", then agricultural workers in temporary or communal housing. Currently it's mostly nay-sayers and college students but this winter could be challenging with increases and state to state mobility. Canada isn't interested in our visits to November 20th at this point but that likely will be extended indefinitely with 47 states on the infection rise today.
Everyone knew early, knows now and will still know for the next year. Hopefully we'll know enough to not be featured on 60 minutes again.
 
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Not a single word is untrue. The corrupt press and their lackey’s told us over and over how safe the protests were/are. I think we all know why.

Logical conclusions therefore were drawn.

Given where the globe is wrt the pandemic, given the rates of infections seen should pro sports have taken a hunker-down position or that of the protestors?

Since we want so badly to point fingers let’s point to the liars. And there’s a bunch of them.
I thought you decided to check out? Shame you didn't research much while your were gone.

We've had many demonstrations in Seattle and no one....NO ONE condoned the BLM and associated demonstrators lack of precaution and press here was abundant on the matter. That the patriuts of poseurs mugging for the camera at the recent Trump Tour use your justification to not practice protection pretty much defines their intellect. As for press; they listen to the fabrications from the Poseur pulpit and see their lack of protection as a badge of fealty to their Master. They certainly didn't get that from the disregarded fake media, did they? Your expression of willful ignorance is curable: go work as a hospital volunteer or food bank worker. You won't find many MAGA hats there but you will find some masks to wear.
 
Good Lord.... That is a new one. It is funny how people like Atlas try to minimize what Korea has done.
We may have to get used to him. At a recent rally, Trump dropped a strong hint that he will fire Fauci. He can't actually do that, unless he can provide evidence of misconduct.: you know, like telling the truth. But Trump can bar Fauci from his circle of advisors. In fact, he's been doing that off and on de facto, anyway. There have been long periods of time during which, according to Fauci, he hasn't talked to the President. But Trump could make life difficult for Fauci, forcing him to mount a legal defense, or perhaps, re-classifying his position, so that it's dependent on the President.

Good grief, that it's come to this, that the head of a major scientific institution has to worry that a politician, who knows sh!t about science, could threaten his position. Atlas calls to mind Lysenko in Russia, though we haven't reached that point, and probably couldn't, without a far more authoritarian government than we have so far.
 
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Mass testing in Slovakia final results
Tests 3 625 332
Positives 38 359

There will be retest this weekend in counties with 0,7% positives and more. The interesting part is that it will be 54% and basically whole north. The more interesting part is that two bigest cities ( ok towns, we have not cities :D ) are excluded because there is better situation. Bratislava is 5th best region.

They want test every hospital and home care every two weeks and test on borders.

I am telling about antigent tests to be clear.
 
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Mass testing in Slovakia final results
Tests 3 625 332
Positives 38 359

There will be retest this weekend in counties with 0,7% positives and more. The interesting part is that it will be 54% and basically whole north. The more interesting part is that two bigest cities ( ok towns, we have not cities :D ) are excluded because there is better situation. Bratislava is 5th best region.

They want test every hospital and home care every two weeks and test on borders.

I am telling about antigent tests to be clear.
I applaud the Serbian Government for their efforts - Yes, it is easier to complete this activity with a smaller population but it should have been a template for many more countries or states/provinces.
 

Chris Gadsden

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I thought you decided to check out? Shame you didn't research much while your were gone.

We've had many demonstrations in Seattle and no one....NO ONE condoned the BLM and associated demonstrators lack of precaution and press here was abundant on the matter. That the patriuts of poseurs mugging for the camera at the recent Trump Tour use your justification to not practice protection pretty much defines their intellect. As for press; they listen to the fabrications from the Poseur pulpit and see their lack of protection as a badge of fealty to their Master. They certainly didn't get that from the disregarded fake media, did they? Your expression of willful ignorance is curable: go work as a hospital volunteer or food bank worker. You won't find many MAGA hats there but you will find some masks to wear.
It takes very little effort to find page after page extolling the ability of the virus to bypass the months of on-going protests.

Odd how you choose to define intellect. In the end, at least until today, people are pretty much free to do what they wish. I think the rally’s could be considered protests and protests could be considered a rally. You only condemn one which tells anyone all they need to know about the balance of your criticism.
 
I my ride to work..I will stop at the unicorn ranch and visit with the horned wonders and all the masses of Antifa ..both are there in equal numbers.
Chris no "media" or " press" or " liberal press" ever said holding events without best practices is\was prudent.
Regardless of race,creed,color,sex whatever or politics,spitting droplets on one another is dumb,destructive. Counter -F-ing productive.
But if you insist..I am guessing you will or must..feel free to show a published article from a decent source saying " hell yeah go out hug,kiss rejoice,maskless, cause the man is holdin' you down"..after you post that..put up the Antifa wife swapping site and their weekly picnic locations..it's imaginary.
Covid is killing Americans,not Antifa, not Afflac, not Ben Affleck..it's a virus..50% of all dead in San Diego county, Latino..@62% of all infected ..Latino..
All you need to answer is why that is no big deal..
Jack and coke( liquid) flowing here..hoping that your answer is not my answer..
John McCain..American hero..minus bone spurs and 3 wives!!!
Viva!! USA..
No more Covid denial..embrace science!! Embrace all in the country!! Everyone dying of this Corona Virus is important..don't believe the fake news..
 
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Chris Gadsden

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I my ride to work..I will stop at the unicorn ranch and visit with the horned wonders and all the masses of Antifa ..both are there in equal numbers.
Chris no "media" or " press" or " liberal press" ever said holding events without best practices is\was prudent.
Regardless of race,creed,color,sex whatever or politics,spitting droplets on one another is dumb,destructive. Counter -F-ing productive.
But if you insist..I am guessing you will or must..feel free to show a published article from a decent source saying " hell yeah go out hug,kiss rejoice,maskless, cause the man is holdin' you down"..after you post that..put up the Antifa wife swapping site and their weekly picnic locations..it's imaginary.
Covid is killing Americans,not Antifa, not Afflac, not Ben Affleck..it's a virus..50% of all dead in San Diego county, Latino..@62% of all infected ..Latino..
All you need to answer is why that is no big deal..
Jack and coke( liquid) flowing here..hoping that your answer is not my answer..
John McCain..American hero..minus bone spurs and 3 wives!!!
Viva!! USA..
No more Covid denial..embrace science!! Embrace all in the country!! Everyone dying of this Corona Virus is important..don't believe the fake news..
lol. Watch the re-winds of the news networks you can’t live without.

Loving, loving, loving the obfuscation. You people are absolutely nothing if not boringly predictable.
 
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If by you people you mean..a person that can meet another w empathy..Covid is killing Americans..yes so is cancer,car crashes and diabetes..but issues like Covid and gun violence don't go away just because you say that they are unpopular.
I will conclude that the major news outlet saying it is swell to safely spit on each other for political gain was difficult to link to..
Yes raking forrest floors here in California could be part of a strategy for colossal destructive wild fire prevention..but pause and take note that vast swaths of the land in need of attention is controlled by the federal government..
California's economy? What part of America's overall output? America's job growth and creation? Helping with anything and everything to lesson Covid's impact on California should have been priority one for the American government..it's great to paint a pretty car..but you need an engine,you need spark plugs and gas..or you could spend a disproportionate, crazy amount of time pandering to coal miners..rural folks ..Covid unconscious and economically insignificant..in plain language..if an American says they don't believe in the virus..we don't need squat from the Feds..listen to them!! If these turds say their lives are unimportant..why argue?
If you have communities that say that this is all fake..God bless them..move on..others have been asking for help and still nothing
 
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And I really don't mind saying..as an American,a Republican,a veteran and a human being..I find it disgusting and disgraceful that the federal government saying that a 1000 + deaths a day is inconsequential.
that is too wrong to debate.
I find banter about why we have 70,000+ new cases a day to be deranged at the least. How in the world can a society be expected to function,to prosper,when top leadership has such contempt for it's citizenry..
 
Famous German quote of Lothar Matthäus, then soccer player: Mailand oder Madrid, Hauptsache Italien. (Milano or Madrid, the main thing is Italy.)
You're German, so you should know this things better, but I've seen the same quote attributed to Andy Möller.

I guess the quote itself is apocryphal enough to be attributed to most (any?) German player who played in Italy at the time?
 
You're German, so you should know this things better, but I've seen the same quote attributed to Andy Möller.

I guess the quote itself is apocryphal enough to be attributed to most (any?) German player who played in Italy at the time?
You're right! I guess I just thought of Matthäus because he's usually the go-to guy for these quotes, but in that case of cause it was Möller!
 

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