Coronavirus: How dangerous a threat?

[Ultrairon]

Iron, I get a kick out of your chronology..I own a house full of animals,looks like a birth to death relationship for me..few horses but mostly dogs and cats. I support animal testing. I lost balance when you used Dr. Bronners products to reinforce your point,as a longtime( lifelong) user I cried tears in between gasps of laughter. Dr. Bronners in dispensed in a variety of sizes, given management changes over the decades, the label on each size bottle contains different messages and product use suggestions. I use peppermint. I have used it to brush my teeth,wash clothes,insect repellent, disinfect dishes and utensils. My primary use is bathing during camping trips..get body and hair wet, lather up..and a cool tingling sensation and no matter how cold the water you are forced to get the soap off.. Feather, Snake,Colorado and Mississippi are a few that I have jumped into to work in combo with Dr.Bronners brand of clean. The old label included ratios of soap to water for enemas,douche and birth control..The products have not always included an animal testing free designation..and for those of us participating in races in the South western US..Paul Mitchell sponsored bike races of all varieties..beach volleyball..OTL tournament here in San Diego..those products additionally were not originally marketed as free from animal testing.
Peta, has had a number of confusing actions were it's supporters threw paint on people,in their eyes,mouth and nose,ears for the offense of wearing animal fur, only to find out later the person assaulted w paint was wearing faux fur..the ooops, or apologies not really there. I hardly s see the objectives of Peta..or Peta like organizations having much to say as a pandemic swept the country and the world.
I ate chicken,fish,oysters and beef this week..I would be able to make eye contact with everything I have eaten..I could share a gaze w their families as I consumed them.
I think to have a Covid animal testing argument could have value,now,here..no. Any discussion about a few,or one specific doctor's views or practice on animal testing as a byproduct of Covid views is simply ridiculous. To do some kind of logical causal link between Vivid-Fauci-animal testing is silly..first making the dots..then trying to connect them..
millions worldwide have died..more than three quarters of a million in the United States alone. 1100+ per day.
I certainly hope that animal testing can be discontinued completely,that's a worthy goal..but to try and associate soap or shampoo,body wash w lifesaving emergency medication, emergency life saving technique is plain crazy..

Dr. Bronner's Soap Label Summary & Moral ABCs (+ Visuals)

Who is Dr. Bronner? Ever wonder what his soap labels really say? Check out this Dr. Bronner's label summary, his Moral ABCs, Spaceship Earth, and more.

www.sloww.co

Yeah I never did make that arguement and once again you misunderstand and tell some long drawn out story that makes little or no sense. I will use the words of someone else and say you are huffing gas.

 

[Ultrairon]

I want to keep this from going too political because then it will just get deleted, but its strange that anyone would think that people want to wear masks, want to get more shots, want to skip/cancel large events, not travel, not visit family, not eat out, etc. That's absurd! How is that even considered a real discussion?!

Who are you having a discussion with on those issues? Then again I have seen some insults with respect to people who don't share the same opinions in this thread.
The discussion here appears or has the appearance that some are happy for masks to last forever along with lock downs etc. I am against both.

 

[Unchained]

Yeah I never did make that arguement and once again you misunderstand and tell some long drawn out story that makes little or no sense. I will use the words of someone else and say you are huffing gas.

I guess I misunderstood your reference to Dr. Fauci heading an agency that harmed animals. And I am sure that the Peta you are talking about didn't pitch paint on people, must be the spin off faction Misguided Peta..
The only reason I try and hold your feet to any fire is rape, murder, and other horrible threats made against Dr. Fauci's wife and children. I think that is wrong. Obviously saying your going to rape someone's kid registers different on the out of bounds meter for everyone..that in the American lexicon is revealing itself.more daily,more drastically.
I supported President Trump hiring Fauci, I support President Biden keeping him. I don't think that he plays much of a role in the agency for overall mission and doubt that he is included on technical briefs that I am sure unfold rapidly as new data of all kinds comes to light daily. Instead he is a steady,measured voice of experience and reason,rational and calm.
I think that statements about him harming animals to whatever motivation are dangerous and a national security threat. ..
Any mention of Tucker..always means Tucker Carlson, it's shorter than typing completely ignorant lying mother Tucker..that's just too long.
So I am guessing that you really didn't have much history on Dr. Bronner..anything..or the whole mother ship thing appeals to you.
Aveda also was a sub sponsor of a team but overall I like the fragrance of Paul Mitchell Awapuhi shampoo which I used for years..I hope that some of these cosmetics companies,there products,testing, views on animals,animal welfare,testing can be tied into Fauci, Covid ..or..?
I am going to the cabinet for tinfoil for a better hat
And yes I am huffing gas today is Baja 1000
Score International
Score-international.com

 

[Unchained]

Woman accused of threatening health officials over mask mandate bound over for trial

A Grand Blanc Township woman charged with threatening to kill two top officials in the Genesee County Health Department because of a student mask mandate has been bound over for trial in Genesee Circuit Court.

www.mlive.com

From Congress To Local Health Boards, Public Officials Suffer Threats And Harassment

COVID-19, polarization and election misinformation — including from the president — are three factors in politicians suffering harassment and even threats from voters in recent weeks.

www.npr.org

Far-Right Commentator Issues Public Death Threat To Fauci

Reprinted with permission from Alternet

www.nationalmemo.com

Coronavirus (COVID-19) Overview

COVID-19 is a new type of coronavirus that causes mild to severe cases. Here’s a quick guide on how to spot symptoms, risk factors, prevent spread of the disease, and find out what to do if you think you have it.

www.webmd.com

 

[Keram]

‘Zero-Covid is not going to happen’: experts predict a steep rise in US cases this winter

Total US deaths from Covid may reach 1 million by spring as vaccination rates remain lower than 60%

www.theguardian.com

Related: In Belgium we have about 15.000 cases a day now, which is nearly on par with the peak of the second wave in October-November last year. Nevertheless, much less people in IC, much less deaths compared to a year ago. Still, the situation is worse than almost everyone expected, and some mild new rules came into place (more face masks, more working at home - mostly). I think many people are disappointed, but OK, we've got to keep moving. ICs are at about 25-30% capacity with respect to covid patients, but this still means non-urgent surgery etc. is largely postponed once more.

Imunity is waning quicker than expected so situation is worse than expected. It is disapointing indeed. I know lot of people who were vaccinated and were positive recently. They had all mild to non covid though different age group. I know at least three people unvaccinated with hell of a covid last month. Younger than 65.

I have expectations from third dose but I cant find if imunity is better or on par with second dose ( first month after it). I hope it will be waning slower because if not we will be vaccinated every year. Not a fan of that.

Vaccines seems not to be silver bullet. I naively thought it will be. It is kinda hopeless. Even Portugal is rising again with their more than 90 percent vax adults.

 

[FrankB]

Who are you having a discussion with on those issues? Then again I have seen some insults with respect to people who don't share the same opinions in this thread.
The discussion here appears or has the appearance that some are happy for masks to last forever along with lock downs etc. I am against both.

i've had covid and i am vaccinated, so i refuse to mask up for any reason other than commission of a felony.

 

[dusty red roads]

AZ unveils trial results of a promising new treatment:

AstraZeneca unveils antibody treatment, preventative shot for those who can’t get vaccinated:

https://www.smh.com.au/world/europe...who-can-t-get-vaccinated-20211119-p59a94.html

 

[jmdirt]

Imunity is waning quicker than expected so situation is worse than expected. It is disapointing indeed. I know lot of people who were vaccinated and were positive recently. They had all mild to non covid though different age group. I know at least three people unvaccinated with hell of a covid last month. Younger than 65.

I have expectations from third dose but I cant find if imunity is better or on par with second dose ( first month after it). I hope it will be waning slower because if not we will be vaccinated every year. Not a fan of that.

Vaccines seems not to be silver bullet. I naively thought it will be. It is kinda hopeless. Even Portugal is rising again with their more than 90 percent vax adults.

I feel yah! Even though I knew better, I hoped that a couple of shots would put this in our rear view mirrors.

 

[Oldermanish]

This isn't from the interview that I was looking for, but Dr. Fauci answers in a similar way:
"“So it is conceivable that you got infected, you’re protected, but you may not be protected for an indefinite amount of time,” Fauci said. “So, I think that is something that we need to sit down and discuss seriously because you very appropriately pointed out, it is an issue and there could be an argument saying what you said (ED: that naturally acquired immunity is strong).” (September 2021). I watched a news conference at the end of Oct. where he discussed it, but I'm not finding it via Google search.

I think that much of the discussion centers around the risks with 'waiting' for natural immunity.

EDIT: To reiterate, I hope that naturally acquired immunity does protect people.

Politicians like Paul and Johnson are now push this narrative "research has found that natural immunity from Covid-19 could last for decades". There is no way to extrapolate that at this point. They are probably using the flu & cold as an example because once we catch those we...ooops never mind.

Currently there are increasing cases of people that have been vaccinated but not recently. Cases where folks have tested (had) Covid, took a vaccine and still got a dose of Delta. I can only guess that an evolving virus can outlast what prior immunity existed and that cycle can be maddening for the most conscientious of us.

It's more maddening that some people make the same arguments about wearing masks, immunization and whatever history exists about fighting the viral outbreaks. They use outdated statements, protocols and ignore the fact that there is still a significant portion of the population that will not observe precautions until they get sick. Then the final argument is that we shouldn't do fu*k-all based on individual rights. The politicians have funds to raise and outrage to forment to maintain that financial momentum. IMO that does much more damage than the actual pandemic.

 

[movingtarget]

Imunity is waning quicker than expected so situation is worse than expected. It is disapointing indeed. I know lot of people who were vaccinated and were positive recently. They had all mild to non covid though different age group. I know at least three people unvaccinated with hell of a covid last month. Younger than 65.

I have expectations from third dose but I cant find if imunity is better or on par with second dose ( first month after it). I hope it will be waning slower because if not we will be vaccinated every year. Not a fan of that.

Vaccines seems not to be silver bullet. I naively thought it will be. It is kinda hopeless. Even Portugal is rising again with their more than 90 percent vax adults.

Virologists seem to be split over the status of the virus at the moment Some seem to think the worst has passed while others think its too soon to say. It all depends on the new variants. The AZ Vaxx seems to be the least effective over time according to the latest research.

 

[limak_]

COVID-19 Mortality Risk Correlates Inversely with Vitamin D3 Status, and a Mortality Rate Close to Zero Could Theoretically Be Achieved at 50 ng/mL 25(OH)D3: Results of a Systematic Review and Meta-Analysis

Background: Much research shows that blood calcidiol (25(OH)D3) levels correlate strongly with SARS-CoV-2 infection severity. There is open discussion regarding whether low D3 is caused by the infection or if deficiency negatively affects immune defense. The aim of this study was to collect...

www.mdpi.com

That's an interesting one.

I'm wondering, why checking vitamin D level isn't obligatory (at least where I live). Considering that most people have deficiency (median level in the study I quoted was 23 ng/ml (!), while the optimal is 40-60 and some other sources say it should be at least 60-80), it correlates that strongly with covid mortality and it's also cheap and widely available.

How many of you (and your relatives) have had your vitamin D level checked lately?

 

[BlueRoads]

Imunity is waning quicker than expected so situation is worse than expected. It is disapointing indeed. I know lot of people who were vaccinated and were positive recently. They had all mild to non covid though different age group. I know at least three people unvaccinated with hell of a covid last month. Younger than 65.

I have expectations from third dose but I cant find if imunity is better or on par with second dose ( first month after it). I hope it will be waning slower because if not we will be vaccinated every year. Not a fan of that.

Vaccines seems not to be silver bullet. I naively thought it will be. It is kinda hopeless. Even Portugal is rising again with their more than 90 percent vax adults.

I read that immunity is better with third dose - so, basically, it adds something, does not just renew your immunity.
And therefor they are advising a third dose for everyone.
The most common recommendation, though, seems to be that you get it a bit before 6 months are over, because from 6 months on the immunity starts to wane.
I think they aren't a silver bullet, but a bronze one. Obviously, statistically, they make an immense difference. From what I read Moderna is the most effective against the Delta variant, Biontech/Pfizer a bit behind, and AZ a good deal behind, but not uneffective.

The biggest problem seems to be the lack of ICU, in Germany not due to the equipment or beds, but mostly because they don't have enough staff. There just isn't a huge amount of free beds in normal times - in a town of 100.000 people it might be like 3 beds that are usually free for emergencies - and with Covid you just have numbers exceeding these very, very soon. And that seems to be the biggest problem here, that doctors are very afraid of having to do a triage - for which they have now started to set up a special panel, which in normal times isn't necessary.

 

[Keram]

Austria is the first country of the western world to make vaccines mandatory for whole population. Interesting. Will it cause domino effect?

 

[yaco]

My suspicion is that when we get to the third booster shot which is 12+ months away, that's when transmission will reduce and the world will get on top of the virus.

DJ Baltimore can shed more light on my hypothesis.

 

[jmdirt]

I think that the FDA just approved a third shot (2 J&J) for everyone. We'll see what the press release says, but I haven't heard of anyone getting turned away anyway.

 

[Jagartrott]

It's interesting to see how the proportion of infections/deaths differs between countries in Europe. It seems that the importance of vaccination is: infection < hospitalization < IC < death. Which is not that surprising. Flanders now has most infections/million of the regions in Belgium, despite having the highest vaccination rate (92.5% of adults), but it has the lowest death/day/million proportion (2) of the regions. Similarly, in Germany more people are dying proportionately than in Belgium, although the number of infections is about half per capita. Difference: Germany has a lower vaccination rate.

 

[Ultrairon]

So until the 3rd shot no one should get moving along with life? After the 3rd there will be a 4th etc etc etc. That seems obvious. Why not just accept that we will have to take a vax every 6 to 9 months? No lockdown mandates No mask mandates. Do either if you want but don't put out government mandates.

 

[Ultrairon]

Fauci in DC where the rules say he is in a congrgate facilites and crowded indoor gatherings and should be wearing a mask. Here is how he does it. Is that all for show?

Quote From Politico.

• Mask on, mask off. That as the name of the game for ANTHONY FAUCI at JONATHAN KARL’s book party Tuesday night at Café Milano. As gawkers tried to snap pictures of him indoors not wearing a mask, America’s doc would put it on and take it off depending on whom he was around. SALLY QUINN — who’s known Fauci since his days as a young NIH doctor, when he inspired a love interest in one of her erotic novels — asked him why he was at a party with a mask in hand, not on face. “I said, ‘You seem pretty ambivalent about your mask’ because no one else was wearing one,” Quinn told Playbook. “He said, ‘I just decided that if anyone came up that I didn’t know, I would put my mask on.’”
  
  Quinn added that “paparazzi” were surrounding Fauci trying to get that “gotcha moment” of the Covid czar without a mask on. Guests had to show proof of vaccination to enter the party. “He was being safe,” Quinn said in his defense. “He knew everyone was vaccinated. If it was someone we knew, he would trust them, and if it was somebody else, he didn’t.” Another guest observed Fauci’s mask on/mask off dance, but said that the mask was firmly on when he came to the rescue of a guest who had collapsed. We reached out to Fauci via NIH but didn’t hear back Thursday night.

 

[Unchained]

Fauci in DC where the rules say he is in a congrgate facilites and crowded indoor gatherings and should be wearing a mask. Here is how he does it. Is that all for show?

Quote From Politico.

• Mask on, mask off. That as the name of the game for ANTHONY FAUCI at JONATHAN KARL’s book party Tuesday night at Café Milano. As gawkers tried to snap pictures of him indoors not wearing a mask, America’s doc would put it on and take it off depending on whom he was around. SALLY QUINN — who’s known Fauci since his days as a young NIH doctor, when he inspired a love interest in one of her erotic novels — asked him why he was at a party with a mask in hand, not on face. “I said, ‘You seem pretty ambivalent about your mask’ because no one else was wearing one,” Quinn told Playbook. “He said, ‘I just decided that if anyone came up that I didn’t know, I would put my mask on.’”
  
  Quinn added that “paparazzi” were surrounding Fauci trying to get that “gotcha moment” of the Covid czar without a mask on. Guests had to show proof of vaccination to enter the party. “He was being safe,” Quinn said in his defense. “He knew everyone was vaccinated. If it was someone we knew, he would trust them, and if it was somebody else, he didn’t.” Another guest observed Fauci’s mask on/mask off dance, but said that the mask was firmly on when he came to the rescue of a guest who had collapsed. We reached out to Fauci via NIH but didn’t hear back Thursday night.

I definitely get your point..and I certainly don't think that anybody,including front line doctors are not suffering from Covid fatigue. Fauci is wrong not to wear the mask in a public service capacity. He is human I am guessing and makes mistakes.
Your post reflects an ugly unworkable reality in the United States.
The formula goes something like this..@90-100 million unvaccinated.
So millions of walking disease vessels traveling about cross contaminating and allowing further variants on scale,when we didn't get the 1st three under control.
National attitude..I give you a few of the 10s of thousands of examples of threats,physical violence, domestic terrorism and your counter point is one prominent doctor doesn't wear masks at parties. That is in the public mind..people are threatening to rape and kill people and in some bizarre social rock,paper scissors..that is equal to non masking..
it's not.
If people don't want to get a vaccine,cool..take it in stride with a desire for a drivers license, plane ticket..there are alternatives. You don't have to drive or fly and you can live..Grocery stores,coffee shop,restaurants,bars..same thing as @2 years ago..if widespread testing was available..it's not now, and it sure wasn't 2 years ago despite the claim..easy..I don't know..pick a color..purple outside means vaccine needed..blue means come on in without one..businesses have the right to look at a recent negative or positive test and act accordingly.
The idea that we still don't know who is sick and who is not is done disgraceful.by now combing your hair,brushing your teeth..you should know your status..complete government failure..especially after 1\3 of the population says that they don't give a f-ck about the other 2\3..
I think that the best solution can be done in private partnership with government. Big government is not,can't solve it.
January 2022, you pay your own way, insurance premiums and coverage partly based on vaccine status..if you get Covid anything unvaccinated you pay soup to nuts..no disability,no insurance responsibility. Have non vax folks pay premiums in the group that plays Russian roulette,skydives, rock climbs, heli ski..just high risk factors..still can get insurance but pay based on behavior..some countries are trying it..we should..we should stop arguing and go ala carte..you want to run w the bulls? Cool but you should pay more than a bingo night participant..

 

[Ultrairon]

I definitely get your point..and I certainly don't think that anybody,including front line doctors are not suffering from Covid fatigue. Fauci is wrong not to wear the mask in a public service capacity. He is human I am guessing and makes mistakes.
Your post reflects an ugly unworkable reality in the United States.
The formula goes something like this..@90-100 million unvaccinated.
So millions of walking disease vessels traveling about cross contaminating and allowing further variants on scale,when we didn't get the 1st three under control.
National attitude..I give you a few of the 10s of thousands of examples of threats,physical violence, domestic terrorism and your counter point is one prominent doctor doesn't wear masks at parties. That is in the public mind..people are threatening to rape and kill people and in some bizarre social rock,paper scissors..that is equal to non masking..
it's not.
If people don't want to get a vaccine,cool..take it in stride with a desire for a drivers license, plane ticket..there are alternatives. You don't have to drive or fly and you can live..Grocery stores,coffee shop,restaurants,bars..same thing as @2 years ago..if widespread testing was available..it's not now, and it sure wasn't 2 years ago despite the claim..easy..I don't know..pick a color..purple outside means vaccine needed..blue means come on in without one..businesses have the right to look at a recent negative or positive test and act accordingly.
The idea that we still don't know who is sick and who is not is done disgraceful.by now combing your hair,brushing your teeth..you should know your status..complete government failure..especially after 1\3 of the population says that they don't give a f-ck about the other 2\3..
I think that the best solution can be done in private partnership with government. Big government is not,can't solve it.
January 2022, you pay your own way, insurance premiums and coverage partly based on vaccine status..if you get Covid anything unvaccinated you pay soup to nuts..no disability,no insurance responsibility. Have non vax folks pay premiums in the group that plays Russian roulette,skydives, rock climbs, heli ski..just high risk factors..still can get insurance but pay based on behavior..some countries are trying it..we should..we should stop arguing and go ala carte..you want to run w the bulls? Cool but you should pay more than a bingo night participant..

I like the coverage based on health status. Same goes for these examples Fat / Smokers / Diabetes / HIV,AIDS . If you have things like that you should pay through the nose for health inssurance. If you are Fat and get any sickness you have to pay soup to nuts all the cost. Also if you are fat then you should be denied any medical benefits from the federal government. Great idea. Same for drinking. If you drink any alchol or use rec drugs then you should have to pay much higher prices for coverage. They can do this by every 3 months or 6 months having to take a drug test along with blood testing.

 

[Oldermanish]

I like the coverage based on health status. Same goes for these examples Fat / Smokers / Diabetes / HIV,AIDS . If you have things like that you should pay through the nose for health inssurance. If you are Fat and get any sickness you have to pay soup to nuts all the cost. Also if you are fat then you should be denied any medical benefits from the federal government. Great idea. Same for drinking. If you drink any alchol or use rec drugs then you should have to pay much higher prices for coverage. They can do this by every 3 months or 6 months having to take a drug test along with blood testing.

So as long as you're mandating behavior or penalizing people:
Let's not forget the hyped-up gym rats that take prescribed steroids to stay young and do reckless things and get heart problems and cancer.
Also; anyone with a conceal-carry gun permit should pay more than anyone because of the risk they pose to themselves and others?
You mixed HIV/AIDs and diabetes in with smoking, any alcohol or rec drug use consumption. The problem with those prejudicial judgements: is people genetically have diabetic destinies, people are exposed to HIV/AIDS by undisclosed carriers and children are born with both conditions. You'd really want that to penalize those folks when it does happen?

I guess the weak will die and leave only the strong. Sounds like a manifesto from a country in the 20th Century.

 

[Keram]

Home - The Switzerland Times

www.theswitzerlandtimes.com

What do you think about this? Too good to be true imho but I dont know judge it with my knowledge

 

[Ultrairon]

So as long as you're mandating behavior or penalizing people:
Let's not forget the hyped-up gym rats that take prescribed steroids to stay young and do reckless things and get heart problems and cancer.
Also; anyone with a conceal-carry gun permit should pay more than anyone because of the risk they pose to themselves and others?
You mixed HIV/AIDs and diabetes in with smoking, any alcohol or rec drug use consumption. The problem with those prejudicial judgements: is people genetically have diabetic destinies, people are exposed to HIV/AIDS by undisclosed carriers and children are born with both conditions. You'd really want that to penalize those folks when it does happen?

I guess the weak will die and leave only the strong. Sounds like a manifesto from a country in the 20th Century.

Yes any roid use use should be included. You bring up guns, sure i don't go around carrying gunz. Are you huffing gas with the other person?
Anything else no problem either. Eventually covid will be all over and unavoidable. We see now that the vax is not protecting us like we first thought. The points made in the post I replied to about covid are ridiculous in my opinion. I decided to add some more things that people are putting us at risk with.

 

[djpbaltimore]

My suspicion is that when we get to the third booster shot which is 12+ months away, that's when transmission will reduce and the world will get on top of the virus.

DJ Baltimore can shed more light on my hypothesis.

Agreed. The booster data presented today looks really promising. I think the booster helps decrease transmission.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1461786768131465219

View: https://mobile.twitter.com/EricTopol/status/1461786768131465219

 

[Ultrairon]

Home - The Switzerland Times

www.theswitzerlandtimes.com

What do you think about this? Too good to be true imho but I dont know judge it with my knowledge

Any good news with respect to covid is not allowed in here. Just give it a few minutes and some will come reply with negatives about the rapid demise of the delta variant in Japan.