It would possibly be a better idea to have two or more riders with different skill sets, since the Aru-type of rider can crash somewhere a sprinter wouldn't necessarily find dangerous.
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It would possibly be a better idea to have two or more riders with different skill sets, since the Aru-type of rider can crash somewhere a sprinter wouldn't necessarily find dangerous.
One event recently was called off by rider protest because of heavy rain, not stopped by race organizers.. Would appear to be the root cause of many safety issues, people running the race think something is OK, not that dangerous, riders think something completely different. UCI or someone need a predetermined set of parameters for what constitutes unsafe, un-raceable conditions.. Can't be done seat of the pants all the time
For sprints I was mostly thinking the actual sprinting, the last KM or so. Where the Aru-types would not be anywhere near the front.
Still, I doubt all sprinters would agree on the degree of danger in all finishes. That said, a lot of finishes probably can't be changed that much since the finish itself is often the only thing that is set in stone.
Sprinters seem to be lowly rated by many here, so my recommendation is that Mountain or hill top finishes are compulsory for all races!
No hills near the race finish, simple then move the race to near where I live. I can recommend many.
No hills near the race finish, simple then move the race to near where I live. I can recommend many.
So have multiple sprinters, as well as lead-out men.
Of course, there are also places where any rider would be able to see the dangers.
Yeah, would probably make more sense to have it checked well in advance. As soon as the finish town is made public.
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Armchair Cyclist
Moderator
I thought the technical term would be... technicaller. Which is not a technical term.
So considering riders are getting seriously injured and are even dying, what new injury and death prevention measures does UCI plan to implement for the upcoming 2025 season?
Riders will now have to dismount when they approach a 90 degree corner.
OK, but said that i feel serious injuries and deaths are now to common to continue to joke about it. So for people that want to continue to perceive this area as a joke, please open separate thread.
So the question remains and lets see on what the answers will be. As likely UCI is working hard behind the scenes and the results of such work to be presented before the 2025 season start. If by any chance that is not the case then in my opinion the time has come to held them responsible.
Enough is enough.
The point being i will keep an eye on it and if somebody else hears something about it please post it in this thread. Then at the beginning of the 2025 season we or i can make a list of measures implemented by UCI, to prevent serious injuries and deaths in pro peloton. I will list the things mentioned from here on till February 2025 (at beginning of the Tour Down Under). If there was some measure taken already in the last month or so that you are aware of it please share that info too as it can be included in such list.
The UCI have zero ideas. They're talking about having a spreadsheet to monitor crashes to see if anything can be learned. After Basque, they decided they were going to do risk assessments & one of the main part of these 'risk assessments' was 'what happens if a rider crashes & leaves the road?' They never did any.
But at least the UCI banned professional cyclists from holding the handlebars a certain way.
But at least the UCI banned professional cyclists from holding the handlebars a certain way.
@Izzyeviel
OK, so there were some commitments made, lets give them time till the start of the 2025 season. For them to think it through and to act on it and i am sure that popular news sites will pick it up. So a pledge to anybody interested in this subject to link such announcements in this thread. I follow popular news sites on daily/weekly basis and i will do the same. A list of measures taken, based on such links, will then be made at the beginning of the 2025 season. If by any chance they will do nothing, then in case of a serious injury or death UCI will need to take objective responsibility for being negligent.
OK, so there were some commitments made, lets give them time till the start of the 2025 season. For them to think it through and to act on it and i am sure that popular news sites will pick it up. So a pledge to anybody interested in this subject to link such announcements in this thread. I follow popular news sites on daily/weekly basis and i will do the same. A list of measures taken, based on such links, will then be made at the beginning of the 2025 season. If by any chance they will do nothing, then in case of a serious injury or death UCI will need to take objective responsibility for being negligent.
Armchair Cyclist
Moderator
So have you already added the yellow card system (threat of suspension for dangerous riding incidents, even though they may fall short of what would get a relegation/disqualification) to your list?
Negligence implies that there were steps to be taken: have you got any suggestions? If they are novel, have you submitted them to the UCI?
Negligence implies that there were steps to be taken: have you got any suggestions? If they are novel, have you submitted them to the UCI?
@Armchair Cyclist
As for your suggestion to include yellow card system on the list. We for sure could extend the list to prior to the 2024/2025 off season if that is desired. I don't object to that. Especially considering this is the first edition and we can start focusing on measures taken during the off season starting in 2025/2026 off season. Or better i can check all measures that will be listed in this thread and categorize them if some measure to prevent severe injuries and deaths was implemented prior or in between 2024/2025 off season. So in the end we can have it both ways. Some prior work done mentioned and then a separate list for the 2024/2025 off season work done. Indicating if UCI was doing something in the off season or has done nothing at all. On top of that if yellow card system will mainly be used to prevent things like littering, then likely it would make sense to try to categorize this things in the list based on the predicted impact in terms of preventing severe injuries and deaths. But for now i am OK if we don't do that, i am OK with anything at all. Just as long as it gets done and it bears some remote resemblance it could help then it's legible for the list inclusion.
As for negligence and governing bodies. I feel that if UCI will do nothing, consistently, then when confronted with severe injuries or even deaths, then IMHO they are automatically liable for being negligent and are automatically subjected to taking objective responsibility. Obviously first in court of public opinion, on the long term for sure in official courts, if needed.
As for proposals and suggestions. Please read this thread, for sure we had lengthy discussions and a lot of people suggested a lot of things. So a whole lot of things can be done and i am sure that UCI officials were at some point already confronted with most if not all of them. Current climate and especially the level of severe injuries and even deaths involved keeps this topic alive as one of the most pressing topics in need of immediate attention. Higher on the list compared to for example doping allegations and similar.
As for me personally and for what i stand for. On the long run i feel it's important to introduce more safety oriented apparel in the pro peloton and by doing that in all aspects of cycling. More specifically i support introduction of air bag equipped wearables. This would be my top priority, as this measure taken actually prevents severe injuries and even deaths. So the impact would be high in regards to lowering the statistics. On top of that it works when needed and is relatively cheap and AFAIK no other proposed solution does that. Said that i am not demanding for UCI to start with this specific measure, although it would be great if they would, the demand for now is to do anything. Tipping point for me being when another young cyclist died in the 2024 season they went silent, to protect the championship, then after the championship they remained silent.
As for your suggestion to include yellow card system on the list. We for sure could extend the list to prior to the 2024/2025 off season if that is desired. I don't object to that. Especially considering this is the first edition and we can start focusing on measures taken during the off season starting in 2025/2026 off season. Or better i can check all measures that will be listed in this thread and categorize them if some measure to prevent severe injuries and deaths was implemented prior or in between 2024/2025 off season. So in the end we can have it both ways. Some prior work done mentioned and then a separate list for the 2024/2025 off season work done. Indicating if UCI was doing something in the off season or has done nothing at all. On top of that if yellow card system will mainly be used to prevent things like littering, then likely it would make sense to try to categorize this things in the list based on the predicted impact in terms of preventing severe injuries and deaths. But for now i am OK if we don't do that, i am OK with anything at all. Just as long as it gets done and it bears some remote resemblance it could help then it's legible for the list inclusion.
As for negligence and governing bodies. I feel that if UCI will do nothing, consistently, then when confronted with severe injuries or even deaths, then IMHO they are automatically liable for being negligent and are automatically subjected to taking objective responsibility. Obviously first in court of public opinion, on the long term for sure in official courts, if needed.
As for proposals and suggestions. Please read this thread, for sure we had lengthy discussions and a lot of people suggested a lot of things. So a whole lot of things can be done and i am sure that UCI officials were at some point already confronted with most if not all of them. Current climate and especially the level of severe injuries and even deaths involved keeps this topic alive as one of the most pressing topics in need of immediate attention. Higher on the list compared to for example doping allegations and similar.
As for me personally and for what i stand for. On the long run i feel it's important to introduce more safety oriented apparel in the pro peloton and by doing that in all aspects of cycling. More specifically i support introduction of air bag equipped wearables. This would be my top priority, as this measure taken actually prevents severe injuries and even deaths. So the impact would be high in regards to lowering the statistics. On top of that it works when needed and is relatively cheap and AFAIK no other proposed solution does that. Said that i am not demanding for UCI to start with this specific measure, although it would be great if they would, the demand for now is to do anything. Tipping point for me being when another young cyclist died in the 2024 season they went silent, to protect the championship, then after the championship they remained silent.
Armchair Cyclist
Moderator
Given that there was no possibility of any suspension before the 2025 season, they are effectively new as of then.
There are 21 offences for which a card can be issued, littering is one of them, but given that the rules specify that
" Commissaires shall issue yellow cards in situations provided for in article 2.12.007 whenever the behaviour concerned is susceptible of causing a risk for safety" it seems most unlikely that it will be used "mainly" for this purpose. I really would recommend familiarising yourself with what the rules are before this endeavour to monitor how they might change.
Given that the main annual UCI Management Committee made its presentations on June, and that it is rather late by now to start publishing new rules for a season that starts in nine weeks time, and as far as any of us are aware no body with authority to alter the rules is due to sit during those nine weeks, I really don't get where your timetable is coming from.
I'm really not quite sure what this list is that you seem to be laying all sorts of rules down for, but we'll see where it goes...
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@Armchair Cyclist
When i first heard of the yellow card system i thought it was safety oriented measure but then in practice i seen it's anything but, at least for now. Said that i have no issues including it on the list as at this point just about anything resembling safety oriented measure will be accepted. Yes, lets see on where it goes. Personally i will check
Under the news tab. And then in general on daily/weekly basis:
www.cyclingnews.com
www.rtvslo.si
If anything will emerge i will link it into this thread and then once season 2025 start i will create a list from it. Hopefully i don't miss something and if anybody gathers info from mentioned sources or from somewhere else just drop a link in this thread and i will include it in the list once the Tour Down Under starts.
When i first heard of the yellow card system i thought it was safety oriented measure but then in practice i seen it's anything but, at least for now. Said that i have no issues including it on the list as at this point just about anything resembling safety oriented measure will be accepted. Yes, lets see on where it goes. Personally i will check
Under the news tab. And then in general on daily/weekly basis:
Cyclingnews | Cycling News, Race Results and Bike Reviews
Breaking news, the latest headlines and exclusive features from the world of pro cycling, as well as expert reviews, buying advice, the best deals and more
www.cyclingnews.com
Kolesarstvo
Od prestižnih klasičnih enodnevnih dirk do velikih treh dirk po Franciji, Italiji in Španiji ter Dirke po Sloveniji.
www.rtvslo.si
If anything will emerge i will link it into this thread and then once season 2025 start i will create a list from it. Hopefully i don't miss something and if anybody gathers info from mentioned sources or from somewhere else just drop a link in this thread and i will include it in the list once the Tour Down Under starts.
Armchair Cyclist
Moderator
From assaulting fans to littering – cycling brings in yellow cards
Riders and team staff could receive new penalty for number of offences as sport aims to improve safety standards, with trials to take place at the Tour de France
www.thetimes.com
Why things like littering fall under improved safety ... that is just beyond me, but OK. As said anything at all will be added to the list, resembling in any way a safety related measure and regardless of it's effectiveness. So in the end and from this list point of view no further in depth discussion are needed. Obviously feel free to discuss some measure further it's just that for now it doesn't matter, as anything at all, when done, is eligible to be included in the list.
So status update for 16 November 2024 looks like.
Preliminary list (November 2024):
- yellow card system
Cyclingnews | Cycling News, Race Results and Bike Reviews
Breaking news, the latest headlines and exclusive features from the world of pro cycling, as well as expert reviews, buying advice, the best deals and more
www.cyclingnews.com
Kolesarstvo
Od prestižnih klasičnih enodnevnih dirk do velikih treh dirk po Franciji, Italiji in Španiji ter Dirke po Sloveniji.
www.rtvslo.si
P.S. I assume UCI is hard at work and new measures to prevent severe injuries and deaths to be presented when nearing the start of the 2025 season.
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Armchair Cyclist
Moderator
Armchair Cyclist
Moderator
I'm quite sure they are not, for reasons already explained. Quite why you think they are to be held duty bound to make decisions within a timescale that you have set is beyond me.
I don't have a subscription to the Times online: I'm still waiting for your evidence that the suspensions system, which hasn't started being used, is, in practice "anything but" directed at safety.
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@Armchair Cyclist
I am quite sure that they are as what else would they be doing instead. Riders are getting servery injured and are dying.
Anyway, for now i will end the debate from my side and anybody interested feel free to help out, people not interested in it, well, you will still get the list at the start of Tour Down Under as a bonus. In addition it will likely make sense to cross reference the list, to check items on it, on severe injury occurrences in the 2025 season. To see if UCI has done anything to prevent it or if UCI has done nothing at all. Over time this should enable us to get more understanding on where the real issues are. Hopefully. We'll see.
I am quite sure that they are as what else would they be doing instead. Riders are getting servery injured and are dying.
Anyway, for now i will end the debate from my side and anybody interested feel free to help out, people not interested in it, well, you will still get the list at the start of Tour Down Under as a bonus. In addition it will likely make sense to cross reference the list, to check items on it, on severe injury occurrences in the 2025 season. To see if UCI has done anything to prevent it or if UCI has done nothing at all. Over time this should enable us to get more understanding on where the real issues are. Hopefully. We'll see.
Armchair Cyclist
Moderator
How do you intend enumerating the number of accidents that do not happen because of rule changes that have already occurred (given that none are to be presented over the next few weeks)? Or is this an entirely one-sided process to be able to accuse them of not having done anything within the particular constraints that you have selected?
@Armchair Cyclist
Fair point, hence lets just focus on the list for now, no need to use it for cross referencing in near future and let the list speak for itself.
Fair point, hence lets just focus on the list for now, no need to use it for cross referencing in near future and let the list speak for itself.
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