Critérium du Dauphiné 2025, June 8 - 15

[moljoh]

Pogi, well, around 5-10 secs loss to Jonas would be acceptable, but this doesn't look good

 

[AnotherArmChair]

dont he look slim in yellow

 

[dobrien]

I mean 28 secs from Vingegaard.
This is 15 secs away of being within normal range.
This is bad but not a catastrophe yet.

Bad as it was, I'd agree it's not a catastrophe yet, but if he can't follow Vingegaard Saturday**,... I realize it's not the Tour, but mind games are a big part of cycling as well; if Jonas senses weakness in Tadej at any point between now and Sunday, I doubt he'll hesitate to stick the knife in hard and give Tadej some nightmares between now and July, and Tadej's response will tell us much.

This race just got a lot more interesting and it was already an intriguing setup to begin with!


**or Pog could bounce bag and blow everyone away too; not making predictions yet!

 

[AlpRaid]

Remember today 10 % of the route was a climb, which should suit Pogacar - so 33K flat ITT on stage 5 of the Tour would cost him 2 minutes to Evenepoel and 1.20 minute to Vingegaard, if it was ridden today.

fair.

but today there was headwind on the flat (and tailwind on the climb). both of these things advantage remco because of his cda compared particularly to pog.

 

[nightowl]

But the first part of the climb was the steepest part, so he Pogacar did lose time there to Remco, who then dominated him on the flat.

Well unless he lost most of that time on the flat before the climb, which would fit the pattern of the rest of the TT.

 

[Froome]

I'm curious to see where the big three are on the HC climbs over the weekend.

It will be the most important test.

I would like to know the times those three did today on the climb.

 

[Red Rick]

Evenepoel took 1 s/min to Vingegaard and 1.8 s/min to Jorgenson

Last year he took 1s/min to Roglic and 1.6 s/min to Jorgenson in the ITT.

Overall gaps are bigger than last year, but this TT is made for big gaps per minute being short, having a steep climb and being completely untechnical without recovery section.

 

[Froome]

Bad as it was, I'd agree it's not a catastrophe yet, but if he can't follow Vingegaard Saturday**,... I realize it's not the Tour, but mind games are a big part of cycling as well; if Jonas senses weakness in Tadej at any point between now and Sunday, I doubt he'll hesitate to stick the knife in hard and give Tadej some nightmares between now and July, and Tadej's response will tell us much.

This race just got a lot more interesting and it was already an intriguing setup to begin with!


**or Pog could bounce bag and blow everyone away too; not making predictions yet!

Vingegaard will attack anyways on the stage of Valmenier. It doesn't matter he is 25 seconds front or behind pogacar.

He wants to test his legs.

 

[Extinction]

Well unless he lost most of that time on the flat before the climb, which would fit the pattern of the rest of the TT.

We need to see the stats. A 1.9 km climb is nothing, but it was steep and they were going full gas, so if Remco was as fast or faster than Pog and Ving there, he has improved uphill.

 

[Monsi]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1932820677985272004

View: https://x.com/maticklaric/status/1932820677985272004?s=61&t=ZKEjWhZs_lhx6xYjfM44ig

From this pic, Pogacar was already around 30 seconds behind Remco and this was around the start of the climb. So he pretty much went at the same pace or was slightly faster than Remco on the climb (Pog probably lost time to Remco on the flat part before the time check). Quite surprising to me because I thought he was suffering on the climb.

 

[Didinho]

Pogi looked uncomfortable on the bike. He did change his position a couple years ago and it was exactly like today. Why change something when it’s working, and it didn’t work when he tried to change before.

Strong win from Remco. Solid from Vingo. Curious how long he can hold his yellow jersey in the mountains, will be tough.

 

[Froome]

Pogacar have time to be in top shape for the Tour. We are in june.

Nevertheless, Vingegaard and Remco also are not in top shape yet, obviously.

 

[dobrien]

Vingegaard will attack anyways on the stage of Valmenier. It doesn't matter he is 25 seconds front or behind pogacar.

He wants to test his legs.

Agree.

 

[Logic-is-your-friend]

Yup his stroke looked pretty bad. Neither fast or powerful

He had a stroke? John Candy John Candy John Candy!!!

 

[Red Rick]

I would say maybe Pogacar had a mechanical they just didn't show but then I remembered this isn't an RCS breakaway stage.

 

[Unchained]

I don't know about you all, but this gives me optimism for a great battle at the Tour, which is ultimately what I care about as a fan.

Absolutely, lots of guys showing great form!! And all seem to be in some motivational feeding frenzy. All saying positive things about conditioning..

 

[AlpRaid]

Half-way up the climb Pogacar was already 30 seconds behind Remco. Then he lost nothing the rest of the climb and the descent, and then lost tons more on the flat to the end.

I wonder if he was struggling to put out power in the new position he’s apparently been trying, because that would explain losing all that on the flat but nothing on the climb or descent.

headwind.

cda.

big advantage today for remco.

 

[Hugh Januss]

How do you know it's been an important stage?
PCS is crashing.

It does that every day. They are getting more and more aggressive with the ads maybe they'll be able to move up from the Commodore 64 that they are currently running on soon.

 

[Tim Cahill]

Vingegaard humblebrag saying he needs a bigger gear

 

[nightowl]

Pogi looked uncomfortable on the bike. He did change his position a couple years ago and it was exactly like today. Why change something when it’s working, and it didn’t work when he tried to change before.

Strong win from Remco. Solid from Vingo. Curious how long he can hold his yellow jersey in the mountains, will be tough.

This is the vibe I got too - it would also track with him being as fast as or even a little faster then Remco on the 2nd part of the climb + descent but losing a ton of time before and after.

I guess we’ll find out in the mountains. If he’s bad there then he’s just bad but if he’s flying again then maybe it was the position today.

 

[Potomac]

Why are there still people on here paying any attention to what Mou has to say? I thought we were collectively better than that...

They really should just keep it the Mou thread.

 

[Extinction]

Don't we have climbing times? Have they not been published?

 

[Netserk]

Rewatching it, Vingegaard was on the big ring at the intermediate and on the inner ring for the last 1.3 km when we see him again. Hard to say for how long he couldn't shift.

 

[Krzysztof_O]

I guess we’ll find out in the mountains. If he’s bad there then he’s just bad but if he’s flying again then maybe it was the position today.

Yeah, the mountains will give us a definite answer if his bad form is prolonged or if it was just one day. Maybe experimenting with his position was some factor today.

 

[dobrien]

Pogacar have time to be in top shape for the Tour. We are in june.

Nevertheless, Vingegaard and Remco also are not in top shape yet, obviously.

I definitely don't see myself as part of the 'sky is falling' crowd, but he looked sluggish and uncomfortable on his bike today, perhaps just an off day? But if he is indeed struggling with his position, that's not just an explanation for today, it's a whole new variable for the Tour as well. I don't think there is any universe in which a rider wants to be struggling with TT position 3+ weeks out; I understand there are pretty minimal TT k's but it's just another thing he can't afford if Jonas is at 100%.

For me the fitness thing boils down to: is this planned by the team, part of his training cycle being heavy, or is part of this feeling (understandable) fatigue from a crazy spring? He's amazing, he's Tadej Pogacar, but he's also human and if it's the latter, he will be forced to rest more to bounce back from it right at a very critical time. In any event, not the end of the world; he doesn't have to look incredible this weekend, but he also shouldn't look awful either, because Jonas looks to be very on track. YMMV as always.