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Did Armstrong try to silence Landis?

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Oct 29, 2009
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Oldman said:
It'll be interesting to see how Johnson fares if he is found to be actually supressing an investigation. He's supposed to be paid with public dollars, not defending a private interest and could be a pressure point to get at Weisel. It's long been suspected but not brought up in mainstream press that he may as well be a direct employee of Tailwind.

Johnson has been paid by both USAC and the USAC Development Foundation, the latter of which Tom Weisel is the president of. A quick look at the 2006 IRS Form 990's show that Johnson was being paid $143,000 from USAC as the CEO and an additional $143,000 from the Development Foundation as it's executive director. It's surprising his connections with Lance and Weisel and Ochowicz hasn't gotten more press, especially considering how Johnson actually became the CEO of USAC, which is also a story that hasn't been told at all yet...
 

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jmax22 said:
Johnson has been paid by both USAC and the USAC Development Foundation, the latter of which Tom Weisel is the president of. A quick look at the 2006 IRS Form 990's show that Johnson was being paid $143,000 from USAC as the CEO and an additional $143,000 from the Development Foundation as it's executive director. It's surprising his connections with Lance and Weisel and Ochowicz hasn't gotten more press, especially considering how Johnson actually became the CEO of USAC, which is also a story that hasn't been told at all yet...
;)

Les Earnest - Sand Creek Sports.

Meanwhile Voight, Milburn and Johnston continued to mismanage USAC, driving it to the brink of bankruptcy.
In June 2000 Weisel's group (USACDF) agreed to bail them out provided that Phil Milburn was fired and replaced by Steve Johnston who would continue to serve as Executive Director of USACDF reporting to Weisel. While Voight continued as the nominal CEO of USAC, Johnson was actually running it inasmuch as Weisel had financial control of the organization and Lisa Voight had negligible leadership ability -- a nice lady who never should have been put in that position. Johnson then proceeded to effectively merge USAC and USACDF though they pretended to still be separate organizations.
 
Landis was convinced that Armstrong and his entourage were being briefed on the content of his conversations with USA Cycling

That's a no-brainer. Anything he said to Johnson would definitely get back to LA, and in fact there probably isn't anyone with any power or say in US cycling who wouldn't tell LA about any Landis emails. A reporter I think for some Bay Area publication interviewed Johnson a few years ago, and basically asked him if he wasn't guilty of conflict of interest, working for Armstrong and UCI at the same time. I would love to see that relationship brought up in the investigation. It probably wouldn't lead to any charges, but it could make people realize just how much power LA has had over the years to squash any of his critics.

Sometimes it takes a crazy person to initiate change, and I think Landis
 
Jun 19, 2009
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Dr. Maserati said:

And this from Earnest's history:

We noticed also that USACDF's expenditure of their "charitable" nonprofit funds, which were acquired as tax deductible donations, were being used to support the political campaign to restore Weisel and his associates to the USAC board, which would allow him to oversee his financial interests in the sport. This appeared to contravene Federal tax law, but we left that on the table, at least for a time. This dirty campaign, which as usual was ignored by most of the membership, resulted in another apparent victory by the crooks. Weisel was restored to the board and took control of the organization by installing one of his employees, Jim Ochowicz, as President, replacing Mike Plant.

When Lance's attorneys ask "what Federal laws have been broken?" they are, of course talking about his use of PEDs and so begin the soft sell of what will be characterized as typical sporting behaviour. In the end, however; LA and his spectacular problems may be passed by for less press-worthy but more legally rich targets like these use of funds.

If that's where Novitsky's headed we are in for a long but hopefully cleansing investigation. Do I hear "witch hunt" out there? Fraud is fraud.
 
Oldman said:
And this from Earnest's history:

We noticed also that USACDF's expenditure of their "charitable" nonprofit funds, which were acquired as tax deductible donations, were being used to support the political campaign to restore Weisel and his associates to the USAC board, which would allow him to oversee his financial interests in the sport. This appeared to contravene Federal tax law, but we left that on the table, at least for a time. This dirty campaign, which as usual was ignored by most of the membership, resulted in another apparent victory by the crooks. Weisel was restored to the board and took control of the organization by installing one of his employees, Jim Ochowicz, as President, replacing Mike Plant.

When Lance's attorneys ask "what Federal laws have been broken?" they are, of course talking about his use of PEDs and so begin the soft sell of what will be characterized as typical sporting behaviour. In the end, however; LA and his spectacular problems may be passed by for less press-worthy but more legally rich targets like these use of funds.

If that's where Novitsky's headed we are in for a long but hopefully cleansing investigation. Do I hear "witch hunt" out there? Fraud is fraud.

Good post. This is why this investigation has so little to do with did Armstrong dope or not. That's a given. There's so much more under the surface that will blow peoples socks off. Daly wants it to be about Landis accusing Armstrong of doping so they can run the "credibility" line but when the rest comes out it won't be a yellow wristband Armstrong will be wearing but yellow handcuffs.
 
Jul 22, 2009
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Tubeless said:
Landis' accusations were particularly hurtful to Armstrong. First hand knowledge from a close former teammate. Doping, bribery, shady financial dealings. It's possible to push someone over the edge and cause them to do something irrational or illegal - certainly anything to hit Landis back with either figuratively or literally. And if there was any direct or indirect communication between Armstrong and Landis after the emails were shared privately, that could have been the message - or more likely implied. Can't blame Landis for being paranoid in that situation.

it'd been interesting to hear them in the peloton during gila last spring
 
scribe said:
it'd been interesting to hear them in the peloton during gila last spring

The Armstrong spin machine told us the French public warmed to Armstrong finishing 23rd this year.

Tommy Volkler was quoted saying something very different. On the roads he was heckled about Landis and the drug use. Yes I do have a link.
 
Oct 29, 2009
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It makes perfect sense, Lance is everything to USA Cycling. Johnson would do anything to protect Lance because he knows that without him, cycling is irrelevant in this country. It would be nice for all of that to be exposed, but honestly, cycling is such an afterthought in the U.S., nobody really cares.
 
Jul 2, 2009
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Dr. Maserati said:

love reading that piece. It's like a slow motion train wreck for everyone to witness

It doesn't take much digging, a spiderweb effect

images
 

Polish

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Lance tried to "Gift a Win to Floyd" in the TdF once.
That might be viewed as evidence of Lance trying to silence Floyd?

Lance has had six plus years to try to silence Floyd.
He had plenty of chances to silence Floyd.
Hire him.
Bribe him.
So far, no real evidence of that ever happening. Is there?

And seriously, c'mon, what was Floyd worried about after sending the e-mails?

Lance would chase him down and "give him the Look" on a neighborhood ride?
Lance might try to bribe him....scary temptation?

Do any of you guys seriously think Floyd was in actual danger?
 

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Polish said:
Lance tried to "Gift a Win to Floyd" in the TdF once.
That might be viewed as evidence of Lance trying to silence Floyd?

Lance has had six plus years to try to silence Floyd.
He had plenty of chances to silence Floyd.
Hire him.
Bribe him.
So far, no real evidence of that ever happening. Is there?

And seriously, c'mon, what was Floyd worried about after sending the e-mails?

Lance would chase him down and "give him the Look" on a neighborhood ride?
Lance might try to bribe him....scary temptation?

Do any of you guys seriously think Floyd was in actual danger?
No-one is scared of Lance.

Its the crazy 'fans' that you have to watch out for.
 
May 23, 2010
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Polish said:
Lance tried to "Gift a Win to Floyd" in the TdF once.
That might be viewed as evidence of Lance trying to silence Floyd?

Lance has had six plus years to try to silence Floyd.
He had plenty of chances to silence Floyd.
Hire him.
Bribe him.
So far, no real evidence of that ever happening. Is there?

And seriously, c'mon, what was Floyd worried about after sending the e-mails?

Lance would chase him down and "give him the Look" on a neighborhood ride?
Lance might try to bribe him....scary temptation?

Do any of you guys seriously think Floyd was in actual danger?

Try to put yourself in Landis' position. You're all alone and about to do something that may end up affecting someone else financially, legally, professionally - in a potentially major way. The target of your accusations is known to react aggressively to anyone attacking him, calling them names, threatening them with various types of retaliation. Also, he's wealthy, well-connected and may have the ability to affect your future employment - and perhaps fabricate stories that make your own life equally miserable. He's bragged to you about bribing foreign officials to get off the hook for various violations. He has an army of loyal minions whose livelihood depend on his continued well being - who could act to eliminate threats towards their master for their own selfish reasons. Worse, you don't know what the reaction will be, if any. You fear for your own-well being and that of your family and friends.

Would you not be worried? It's hard for outsiders to put oneself in that position, but if you try, it's not difficult to imagine being totally paranoid in that situation. It's s scary moment to go forward - and likely Landis was given all kinds of veiled threats what would happen if he did indeed proceed. Yet he did and that's a brave move indeed - the easy path would have been for Landis to just stay quiet.
 

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thehog said:
The Armstrong spin machine told us the French public warmed to Armstrong finishing 23rd this year.

Tommy Volkler was quoted saying something very different. On the roads he was heckled about Landis and the drug use. Yes I do have a link.

Dim and Race Radio were there heckling.
And the BooBooBooBooBoo Ghost was stalking the Team Bus.
Probably a few others...SyringeMan?

But hardly the cacaphony of booing that was predicted by some in the clinic if Lance managed to even start.

Heck, he most likely will not even Start the Tour they said.
Ok, he will not make it into France....
Surely he will not finish.
Oh well, he will be in jail soon enough.
 
May 23, 2010
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Polish said:
Dim and Race Radio were there heckling.
And the BooBooBooBooBoo Ghost was stalking the Team Bus.
Probably a few others...SyringeMan?

But hardly the cacaphony of booing that was predicted by some in the clinic if Lance managed to even start.

Heck, he most likely will not even Start the Tour they said.
Ok, he will not make it into France....
Surely he will not finish.
Oh well, he will be in jail soon enough.

You're calling it a personal victory that the most aggressive predictions did not come true? Here's what did happen, thanks (in part) to Landis:

1. Lance's tour plan was disrupted - UCI protection was gone. He looked like a (clean) old man instead of the doped superman of his 8 previous TdF appearances.

2. The public opinion and awareness of Lance's doping has shifted in a major way. WSJ, NYT, ABC, ESPN etc. have published significant stories on the doping allegations.

3. Lance is under legal scrutiny. He's had to hire a criminal defense attorney and a major PR pro to try to deflect the trajectory of the federal investigation.

4. "Several" former teammates (besides Landis) have come forward to confirm the doping in Lance's teams - to the extent that his defense attorney's latest statement was "Even if the doping allegations are proven true, what federal laws were broken?" An admission of sorts?

It may well be that Lance never serves jail time. You'll find many people here on the clinic who just want the truth to come out after all these years of lying and greating the myth of "greatest cyclist of all times". Our objective is to help the sport to clean itself up - this story will help, at least a little bit. Landis' actions were a small part of the process, but it seems that his bravery may have been the straw that FINALLY broke the camel's back.
 
Sep 25, 2009
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what' the big deal ?

i don’t view the linked daily news article as anything other than a response to del moral carp from the other day.

the article seems to shed little new light except stating the obvious - it is perfectly possible that armstrong learnt about the coming landis bomb from his ‘friends’ and tried to deflect or influence the source.

even if flandis acted to ‘set up’ armstrong’s friends hoping for him to ‘get the message’ it changes nothing re. substantive and relevant evidence armstrong is likely to be indicted with.

may be i’m too simplistic, but I cant help but state the obvious - this story has no downside for flamdis, none as all his accusations will have to be double corroborated before being tried. he'll never be the only witness no matter how the texas machine spins his credibility.

otoh, the article has a ton of bad implications for armstrong and his corrupted friends. what did i get wrong ?

in a way i’m glad someone is deflecting the fabiani-cation of texas spin machine. good job.
 
Mar 8, 2010
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Tubeless said:
You're calling it a personal victory that the most aggressive predictions did not come true? Here's what did happen, thanks (in part) to Landis:

1. Lance's tour plan was disrupted - UCI protection was gone. He looked like a (clean) old man instead of the doped superman of his 8 previous TdF appearances.

2. The public opinion and awareness of Lance's doping has shifted in a major way. WSJ, NYT, ABC, ESPN etc. have published significant stories on the doping allegations.

3. Lance is under legal scrutiny. He's had to hire a criminal defense attorney and a major PR pro to try to deflect the trajectory of the federal investigation.

4. "Several" former teammates (besides Landis) have come forward to confirm the doping in Lance's teams - to the extent that his defense attorney's latest statement was "Even if the doping allegations are proven true, what federal laws were broken?" An admission of sorts?

It may well be that Lance never serves jail time. You'll find many people here on the clinic who just want the truth to come out after all these years of lying and greating the myth of "greatest cyclist of all times". Our objective is to help the sport to clean itself up - this story will help, at least a little bit. Landis' actions were a small part of the process, but it seems that his bravery may have been the straw that FINALLY broke the camel's back.

1. Did you follow the Tour with a vodoo puppet in your hands and hatersglasses on, or did you follow the Tour with knowledge of Results and cycling ? I think first one, because otherwise you wouldn´t write such bs.

2. signifacant stories, but no significant facts

3. not forbidden and clever

4. there were several who didn´t (have you got a link for that "confirmations" ?)

other bla bla:

Yes the BRAVE FLoyd.
These people who get caught FIRST and THEN talk are the biggest heros of all. Even very heroic the attemp to blackmail the way back to the peleton.
Bravery ist to step up and talk, when you were not caught.
But yes, go on with praising the brave Floyd. lol
 
Jan 27, 2010
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Cobblestoned said:
1. Did you follow the Tour with a vodoo puppet in your hands and hatersglasses on, or did you follow the Tour with knowledge of Results and cycling ? I think first one, because otherwise you wouldn´t write such bs.

Lance and RS were brutal, we all followed the race and its results. LA couldn't even win a single stage after having Horner block wind for the final 40Kms; and then Horner even beat him...brutal. And, that was after LA flaoted along like pack-fill for many stages before that trying to save energy. I guess its hard to race without being charged!

2. signifacant stories, but no significant facts
3. not forbidden and clever
4. there were several who didn´t (have you got a link for that "confirmations" ?)

Just wait my friend, the facts, confirmation of who from Postal has 'turned' etc... is coming. Just wait.

Yes the BRAVE FLoyd.

I think Floyd is only brave for what he has done to expose the massive lies of his past and others. Overall he knows what he is and it appears he doesn't like it or wants to live like that. Good for him.

NW
 
Oct 26, 2009
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Berzin said:
Sources close to the investigation have stated that after Bahati was contacted by Armstrong, he decided to hire legal representation. When word got back to Armstrong as to who would represent Bahati in any future legal proceedings, the phone calls mysteriously stopped...

of3qfs.jpg


"The Law Office of Brother Mouzone...when mere intimidation is not enough".

Gotta love the greatest TV show of all time...
 

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Cobblestoned said:
1. Did you follow the Tour with a vodoo puppet in your hands and hatersglasses on, or did you follow the Tour with knowledge of Results and cycling ? I think first one, because otherwise you wouldn´t write such bs.

2. signifacant stories, but no significant facts

3. not forbidden and clever

4. there were several who didn´t (have you got a link for that "confirmations" ?)

other bla bla:

Yes the BRAVE FLoyd.
These people who get caught FIRST and THEN talk are the biggest heros of all. Even very heroic the attemp to blackmail the way back to the peleton.
Bravery ist to step up and talk, when you were not caught.
But yes, go on with praising the brave Floyd. lol

Considering the first: you cannot deny that Lance appeared pre-occupied with something else than cycling.
The second: Nobody knows what the true facts are, it might well be that these papers posted facts. On the other hand it is also true that in the court, which might well prove most important for Lance, that of the public opinion, facts are largely irrelevant.
The fourth point, there is obviously the fact that it is more damning that certain riders and teammates have come out to the investigation, than it is good for Lance that most riders have refrained from commenting or that a single rider and a single (unreliable) doctor has come out to say that they themselve did not witness doping. In all reality the fact that the majority are silent can be seen as quite damning.

Also, do you have any evidence of this proposed blackmail, I see several posters mentioning it, and quite frankly I would find it something that Landis logically would have done, but I have not seen a shred of evidence, or even any indication that it might have happened, outside of statements by Lance and Bruyneel, both of which were countered by the e-mails they themselves brought to public.
 
Jun 15, 2009
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Liestrong FAIL

"Assuming you were able to prove these allegations, what federal law has been broken?" asks Daly,

I'll bet he'd like to know. But the feds aren't telling him until they've followed the money trail far enough that they themselves know what exactly it is they're unwrapping here.

Daly and his team seem to be laying the groundwork for a potential prosecutorial misconduct claim. And they're using words like "extortionate" and "shakedown" to characterize the indirect way Landis aired his accusations in the spring.

See quote number one above. It's kind of hard to lay the groundwork for prosecutorial misconduct when:
a) your client isn't currently facing charges
b) you have no idea what those might be or when they might come
As for the second sentence - maybe they think it's good for PR but at the end of the day what Landis himself said and how it came out likely won't count for guano. If (a big if IMO) anything the Feds try to prove in court is based largely on the Landis accusations, they'll bring sufficient corroborating testimony that Floyd as a witness is barely (if at all) necessary.

"Floyd Landis has disgraced himself with his admitted lies, and it is incredible that FDA agents are wasting taxpayer dollars in a fruitless attempt to bolster Landis' falsehoods," Fabiani told the Daily News. "The idea that Lance's team wanted to speak with Landis is simply the latest of Landis' Floyd-brications."

Same BS, different article. At least he didn't mention the eggs this time :D

As for his Floyd-session (sorry :eek:), Floyd is a great public punching bag but his emails are neither the source nor the point of the investigation. Anyone with an Internet connection can easily find out that:
"...dozens of interviews by the AP with people involved in the case reveal a broad investigation that began with cyclists who had records of doping. It then turned toward Armstrong..."
and that:
"People familiar with the investigation said Novitzky's probe into cycling began after he was notified about a cache of performance-enhancing drugs that a landlord found in the vacated apartment of Kayle Leogrande, a little-known cyclist with a doping ban who rode for Rock Racing. Then, Floyd Landis created a stir in April when he sent e-mails to cycling officials that accused ex-teammate Armstrong, along with his longtime doctor and trainer, and numerous other U.S. cyclists, of running an organized doping program earlier this decade."
(AP article picked up by Forbes Magazine)

EDIT: Anyone reading the Daily News article from the 29th could just click this link on the page and read all about the investigation into Rock and Ball long before Landis went public.

And for shiyte's sake, anyone with half a brain knows that investigators don't bolster an accuser's accusations - they investigate. If they uncover sufficient reliable evidence, they hand it over to prosecutors, who prosecute. The more this guy says, the stupider he shows himself to be.

Finally, the main thing I take away from all this spew is increasing respect for Novitsky. He's plugging away, apparently following the money, keeping his cards close to his chest, and most importantly STFU-ing very nicely. People on the various forums (um, self, anyone?) get up in arms and point out how the point is missed, context ignored, truth twisted, etc every time someone from the good ship Liestrong opens his mouth, but not Dirk. He's investigating this thing knowing it may well end up in a courtroom and sensibly ignoring Liestrong as they keep spewing whatever they feel like. When the real drama finally begins, they'll only look stupider for having spent so much energy focusing on the pieces that barely matter.