Do you wish Bernard Kohl well with his new Business??

[luckyboy]

My question, meant with no snarkiness whatsoever, is does that feeling apply to all busted cheats? For clarifcation I'm quoting you but not necessarily trying to "target" you. I think there are quite a few that share this feeling so this is more of an open question...

Does he not deserve a second chance once he's served his suspension? Regardless of his endeavors? If he opts to jump back in, find a team (albeit unlikely given his candor), and compete again, will you hold him in such disrepute?

Given the likelihood that the number of busted cheats riding in the peloton today is lower than the number who cheat or have cheated on not been caught, how can we shun Kohl and not the others?

I didn't say that he I wouldn't want him racing because he had spoken out or anything (In case that was how it came across). I don't think anyone who has doped has any place in the sport, regardless of how they handle themselves after they have been caught.

Astarloza, Piti, Landaluze, Di Luca, Bosisio, Pollack, Lhotellerie, Dekker, Colom, Pfannberger, Kohl, Rebellin, Schumacher, Ricco, Piepoli, Mazzoleni, Fofonov, Duenas, Bossoni, Beltran, Vila, Vinokourov, Kashechkin, Mayo, Sinkewitz, Rasmussen, Moreni, Kessler, Landis, Basso, Scarponi, All the OP guys, Millar, all the little guys who doped, etc. etc.

I don't think any of these have any place in cycling (as much as I liked Mayo ). I would propose a life ban for everyone, but that does seem a bit over the top. 4 year bans for first time offenders (a year off for speaking out - though how likely will they be to get a team then?), then when they come back, they are targeted for testing, and are tested more rigorously. Life ban for second time offenders.

 

[Lifeshape]

I wish Bernie well, I really do. But I cannot resist wanting to visit the store and ask for a centrifuged/transfused/infused CERA-Limeade smoothie! Buy 5 and get a free power assessment! WOOHOO!

 

[Anonymous]

Why can't I remember..?

Isn't there another famous TdF rider who owns a bike shop?

 

[Hugh Januss]

I didn't say that he I wouldn't want him racing because he had spoken out or anything (In case that was how it came across). I don't think anyone who has doped has any place in the sport, regardless of how they handle themselves after they have been caught.

Astarloza, Piti, Landaluze, Di Luca, Bosisio, Pollack, Lhotellerie, Dekker, Colom, Pfannberger, Kohl, Rebellin, Schumacher, Ricco, Piepoli, Mazzoleni, Fofonov, Duenas, Bossoni, Beltran, Vila, Vinokourov, Kashechkin, Mayo, Sinkewitz, Rasmussen, Moreni, Kessler, Landis, Basso, Scarponi, All the OP guys, Millar, all the little guys who doped, etc. etc.

I don't think any of these have any place in cycling (as much as I liked Mayo ). I would propose a life ban for everyone, but that does seem a bit over the top. 4 year bans for first time offenders (a year off for speaking out - though how likely will they be to get a team then?), then when they come back, they are targeted for testing, and are tested more rigorously. Life ban for second time offenders.

If that were the case I might have my chance at finally riding the tour in 2011, I'll only be 20 years older than LA but they will all be watching, sweet, I win!

 

[craig1985]

The truth hurts. It would be much better if he did not get caught so we could all pretend all the winners in the peloton were clean.

I hope owning a bike shop is a lot more lucrative in Germany than it is in the U.S...

Actually, you should hope that owning a bike shop is a lot more lucrative in Austria than it is in the US.....

Susan

Doh!

......

Owned.

 

[Ferminal]

I hope his bike shop does a lot better than his centrifuge business.

But being less flippant, he's picking up the pieces of his life and getting on with things. I cannot wish him anything but the best.

Maybe he's operating the centrifuge out of the back room

 

[mitchman]

I wish him well......

 

[Bala Verde]

http://twitter.com/bernhardkohl

and

http://bernhardkohl.at/

and

http://www.flickr.com/groups/fitstore24-bikepalast-kohl/

»Leben heißt einmal öfter aufzustehen, als hinzufallen.«

Looks like a pretty cool store.

 

[tubularglue]

I believe he is a fu(ck)ing cheater, and I wish him well

 

[Ripper]

The Economist Intelligence Unit just published their list of the world's most livable cities (http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2009/06/09/2592740.htm). The top three were Vancouver, Vienna, and Melbourne. The top 10 cities were rounded out by Toronto, Perth, Calgary, Helsinki and Geneva, with Sydney and Zurich. Notice anything about these cities? They're all bloody expensive to live in. So I think Kohl should do very well. Plenty of money, beautiful city, easy access to the mountains.

I live in one of those cities! Wonderful, albeit a bit pricey at times. Keep in mind that this also means there are customers to feed bike businesses - bike racers are likely where they make the least money!

I wish Kohl the best. Really glad to see him moving forward and vernturing into new things!

 

[Alpe d'Huez]

I wish him well too and hope his business succeeds. As far as I'm concerned, he didn't do much more than vast majority of his friendly competitors, in a corrupt system facilitated by the sport's governing body. Speaking out, and testifying the way he did, took a lot of courage.

 

[Alpe d'Huez]

I live in one of those cities! Wonderful, albeit a bit pricey at times. Keep in mind that this also means there are customers to feed bike businesses - bike racers are likely where they make the least money!

Not sure what you mean by that. Bike racers, as in anyone below UCI level, make little money, that's true. But most average bike fanatics make pretty good money and good bike shops can cater to that if they are well run.

That list of livable cities is interesting, but there is no way I'd put Calgary below Vancouver.

 

[Ripper]

Not sure what you mean by that. Bike racers, as in anyone below UCI level, make little money, that's true. But most average bike fanatics make pretty good money and good bike shops can cater to that if they are well run.

That list of livable cities is interesting, but there is no way I'd put Calgary below Vancouver.

I sorta mean what you said. The fanatics will spend good money. A lot of racers I know can be pretty cheap. It makes sense, as many racers do not have the largest disposable income, and several are sponsored (so why buy retail?) But the bike fanatics, now they'll throw down some good money.

 

[richwagmn]

Bernard Kohl has opened a Bike shop in Vienna, ok so how do you all feel about it?? Do you wish him success with it & let bygones be bygones etc?? Ill go first & say i wasnt sure up till recently. Then i realised hes in business & is trying to make a new life for himself in order to keep in some contact with something he obviously loved. I loathed what he did in the Tour sure but i wont be too put out if his shop takes off for him. I cant see anything wrong with opening a business like that, doubtless some will disagree strongly but i thought this would be an interesting discussion & maybe we can keep The Texan out of this? Or i will give a prize to the person who can include him in the most bizarre way.

Sure, why not? He confessed and provided some useful information that can help clean up the sport.

I'm sure he can sleep well at night which is probably more than can be said for say those who continued to deny their drug use.

Good luck I say.

 

[sars1981]

He'd have to be pretty thrilled that were giving his bike shop all this free publicity.

 

[BroDeal]

I think is is funny how people are so p!ssed about Kohl because he was honest enough to say that riders have to dope to win a GT. All the people who are afraid or unwilling to admit to themselves that there favorite rider must be a doper are hopping mad, saying he does not have a place in the sport. Evidently those who are lucky enough not to get caught do belong in the sport.

 

[usedtobefast]

let him have his business. too bad he f---ed up.

 

[Colonel]

I wish him well, all he did is what all top GT GC riders are doing, except he just let the cat out the bag. To make it at the top of this sport you have to do what he did.

Simple.

I wish him well on his new venture.

 

[Carl0880]

I wish him well and hope that his new outlook on life helps him have a new found respect. I dont see why we think its wrong of him to move on. We are in a society that parole prisoners who have killed before. Kohl doping in the grand scheme of society is not really a major offense, especially since at this time he has shown no desire to return to his old profession

 

[= 7 1 4 =]

you guys are going to hate me, and i don't really care either, but here's my take:

is it too much to ****ing ask that one pro comes into the peloton today, and DOESN'T cheat and actually does good? of course, a lot of people dope, that's no secret, but is it too much to ask that one ****ing rider comes in and makes some kind of difference who's clean and doesn't cheat? just one, that's all i'm asking for. make a difference in their clean placing or make a difference with their voice & attitude.

yeah EPO/boosting will help a TT or a stage with a long break/solo break/small group break....but maybe a clean rider could come in and win some stage/classic sprints to start the clean ball rolling. anytime you have a sprint finish with more than one rider, anything is possible. i think a clean rider could win a pack finish road sprint in the tour or in classics. and that would be a good start.

look at lemond's '89 paris TT. sure, somebody could say lemond was on steroids or HGH or stimulants. nobody ever accused him though did they? he never came up positive did he? merckx came up positive 3 times, long before lemond ever came along - and the system that busted merckx never busted lemond. look at his watts/mph for that paris ride. was lemond clean for that ride 100%? i'm going to say he was clean, although that's just my guess - coupled with the fact nobody ever accused him and he never came up positive. kind of like obree and the hour. compare that to other record holders. i think obree was clean as a whistle.

funny how people today cast riders like lemond and obree aside as if they were nothing, so we can look at the trash we have today. pathetic. and merckx was a great rider, the best talent overall wise, but his explanations for his three dope busts are weak at best.

and then we have ****heads like kohl, who just plays the typical "victim" part of "everybody does it, i'm a victim." has anyone ever heard that one before?

here's how the program works: if you take banned substances, you're knowingly, part of the problem. cheaters never have any problem cheating until they get caught. then, BOOM - it's like a career criminal finding "jesus" in prison instantly, they're all serious about repenting for their sins, when the only thing they're really sorry about is getting busted in the first place. kohl would still be riding, doping, and polluting the peloton today if he wasn't' busted - and you're all happy to wish him luck or buy a bike from the mother****er.

maybe if his shop fails, that will send a message to other assholes in the peloton, that your prospects of a "new life" post doping in cycling will be a short-lived failure. that puts negative-reinforcement pressure on dopers. if you can dope, get busted, and have a great cycling career with a bike shop, what ramifications are there to not dope at all? there are none.

and most all of you wish him well. that's why this **** keeps going on, decade after decade. it's because of you, the weekend rider, the cat 4, the masters rider, the tour fan, etc., who is more concerned with some new set of ****ing aero wheels than what's really important in this great sport.

here's a clue - train hard on a set of 700x25 14g 36 spoke wheels if you want to go fast in races. throw a puncture-resistant heavy tube in for the climbs to make it harder. everybody today is looking for every way around a hard training program. i see people jacking off at 15 mph on $1,500 wheels, that's the norm today, the sport's all ****ed up.

it's time for some solid ethics across the board in cycling. and that starts with the fans demanding their heros/role models don't cheat. and if they do, the fans exact a toll for that breach of trust.

 

[= 7 1 4 =]

you guys are going to hate me, and i don't really care either, but here's my take:

is it too much to ****ing ask that one pro comes into the peloton today, and DOESN'T cheat and actually does good? of course, a lot of people dope, that's no secret, but is it too much to ask that one ****ing rider comes in and makes some kind of difference who's clean and doesn't cheat? just one, that's all i'm asking for. make a difference in their clean placing or make a difference with their voice & attitude.

yeah EPO/boosting will help a TT or a stage with a long break/solo break/small group break....but maybe a clean rider could come in and win some stage/classic sprints to start the clean ball rolling. anytime you have a sprint finish with more than one rider, anything is possible. i think a clean rider could win a pack finish road sprint in the tour or in classics. and that would be a good start.

look at lemond's '89 paris TT. sure, somebody could say lemond was on steroids or HGH or stimulants. nobody ever accused him though did they? he never came up positive did he? merckx came up positive 3 times, long before lemond ever came along - and the system that busted merckx never busted lemond. look at his watts/mph for that paris ride. was lemond clean for that ride 100%? i'm going to say he was clean, although that's just my guess - coupled with the fact nobody ever accused him and he never came up positive. kind of like obree and the hour. compare that to other record holders. i think obree was clean as a whistle.

funny how people today cast riders like lemond and obree aside as if they were nothing, so we can look at the trash we have today. pathetic. and merckx was a great rider, the best talent overall wise, but his explanations for his three dope busts are weak at best.

and then we have ****heads like kohl, who just plays the typical "victim" part of "everybody does it, i'm a victim." has anyone ever heard that one before?

here's how the program works: if you take banned substances, you're knowingly, part of the problem. cheaters never have any problem cheating until they get caught. then, BOOM - it's like a career criminal finding "jesus" in prison instantly, they're all serious about repenting for their sins, when the only thing they're really sorry about is getting busted in the first place. kohl would still be riding, doping, and polluting the peloton today if he wasn't' busted - and you're all happy to wish him luck or buy a bike from the mother****er.

maybe if his shop fails, that will send a message to other assholes in the peloton, that your prospects of a "new life" post doping in cycling will be a short-lived failure. that puts negative-reinforcement pressure on dopers. if you can dope, get busted, and have a great cycling career with a bike shop, what ramifications are there to not dope at all? there are none.

and most all of you wish him well. that's why this **** keeps going on, decade after decade. it's because of you, the weekend rider, the cat 4, the masters rider, the tour fan, etc., who is more concerned with some new set of ****ing aero wheels than what's really important in this great sport.

here's a clue - train hard on a set of 700x25 14g 36 spoke wheels if you want to go fast in races. throw a puncture-resistant heavy tube in for the climbs to make it harder. everybody today is looking for every way around a hard training program. i see people jacking off at 15 mph on $1,500 wheels, that's the norm today, the sport's all ****ed up.

it's time for some solid ethics across the board in cycling. and that starts with the fans demanding their heros/role models don't cheat. and if they do, the fans exact a toll for that breach of trust.

 

[flicker]

I don't like that he cheated. Other then that if what he says does good for cycling I am all for Kohl. Whatever good luck on a sucessful business to Kohl.

 

[sars1981]

@= 7 1 4 =, Everyboys seems to believe Cadel Evans is a clean rider, or if not totally clean, then then cleanish. He's been fighting the fight for a clean sport for a long time.

Does he get any special support or acknowledgement on this forum? No.

What conclusions can you draw from this? Hmmmm..

 

[flicker]

Chucky, I beleive in Cadel. Please do not stalk me!

 

[karlboss]

Problem is, you can't prove a negative. Lets assume Cadel or obree or lemond were/are clean, how do we know? How can he champion clean cycling without us knowing he is clean. You win in a field with dopers you are under suspicion.