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Doping in Soccer/Football

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Sep 8, 2015
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I wouldn't quite rank Wenger as Bassons, but it is significant that someone so high profile in the game is speaking like this. IMO people are slagging him off because 1) they think all football teams do it anyway so, so what, or 2) traditional football tribalism.

Call me a cynic, but I doubt there will be much investigation of Wenger's comments by the footballing authorities. If you take the example of UEFA's supine investigation into allegations of referee fixing in the 70s (Google "Brian Glanville + golden fix" if you want to know more on that) it'll be a case of "erm insufficient evidence case closed"
 
gooner said:
Archibald said:
slowspoke said:
The plot thickens

Arsène Wenger has claimed his criticism of Uefa over doping resulted in 10 anti-doping officers turning up at Arsenal’s training ground last Friday to carry out random checks on his players.
http://www.theguardian.com/football/2015/nov/23/arsene-wenger-accuses-uefa-accepting-doping-arsenal-dynamo-zagreb
Gold!
He wants more testing, then gets sh*tty because he gets what he's called for - did he seriously think his side was above suspicion after saying that he's had players arrive with dodgy blood counts?? :rolleyes:
He didn't get rattled over it. He welcomed that his comments may have influenced it.

I came out on that and as a result we had a doping control from Uefa on Friday. We had 10 people on Friday to control us. I said that before I want better controls. And we got better controls straight away. I don’t remember we have been controlled before, we have nothing against it. I called for more blood checks. That’s a major issue.”
The very reason he said it, is that he hadn't seen this to that level done before. He was responding to a question on it. But hey, don't let get facts get in the way. Just like Wenger only speaking about doping during the lean years of his reign when in fact he also did so at the height of the successful years.

I happen to agree with him, if teams get deducted points for playing an illegal player, then a a player testing positive should result in the same.
I was only responding to the info on the page above... and the quote by slowpoke suggests he believed it was a payback for his comments.

As for the change the result for their loss to Zagreb because they had one "doped" player nonsense he's on about, what was it about 'facts'??
a) the player had little to do with the result. Hell, oxlade-chamberlain scored for zagreb ffs, in a game that was 4-5 shots on target that culminated in a 2-1 scoreline after his own team were down to 10men...
b) possible to be more sour grapes after Mamic was quoted as saying ""A four-year suspension is a stupidity. How would Uefa punish Arsenal, Bayern, Manchester or some other big club?"
c) There are no rules to disqualify teams from the Champions League unless at least two players fail drugs tests. Whether he likes it or not

No one to blame for the loss but themselves :rolleyes:
So Wenger can pipe down until they have a second positive. He's not going to be able to weasel his way out of the loss...

Cake said:
I wouldn't quite rank Wenger as Bassons
Ditto, I highly doubt his players are as squeaky clean as he may suggest
 
Mar 25, 2013
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beatthatrat said:
Yup, for whatever reason Wenger is stirring the pot in a big way in European football. I don't remember anyone of similar status currently involved in the game raising these questions before. He's forcing people to take notice and acknowledge there's a problem in the worlds biggest sport.
It's a bit strange that people here apart from gooner think this isn't noteworthy. Here's your Bassons, your doping jesus getting stamped on by the authorities for breaking omerta. All he's getting here is scorn.
Agree.

I watch the Sunday Supplement with football journos most weeks on Sky and never have I heard them touch the topic of doping. That was until last week when a significant section of the show was dedicated to discussing what Wenger said.

Yesterday I had a brief interaction on twitter with Ian Prior of the Guardian and responded to what he said by querying whether other clubs were subjected to the same level of testing and if it was just Arsenal, it smacks of attacking the messenger. He said they were already going to pose that question to UEFA about this.

People can dress it up all they like, but Wenger's comments highlighting this issue has got even some journos finally asking some questions. While it's nowhere near still the desired level and I wouldn't hold out much hope of it being a prolonged one, Wenger should be praised for doing so and at least impacting it some bit. Instead in here, it should be deemed as some basis for criticism with the bizarre notion that he's the next coming of Paula Radcliffe. Having your tummies tickled by one too many doping scandals doesn't mean you paint everyone with the same brush.

The game gets criticism when there is silence on it, and yet it's the same when someone raises his head and addresses it. I just don't get it.

I agree tribalism may play a small part but on the part of some cycling fans, I think it's nothing more than a real desire to want football to be painted as dirty if not dirtier than cycling. I don't know if that's the case, but in tacking this topic, I'm interested in the substance, not the hyperbole and innuendo.
 
Mar 25, 2013
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Archibald said:
I was only responding to the info on the page above... and the quote by slowpoke suggests he believed it was a payback for his comments.

As for the change the result for their loss to Zagreb because they had one "doped" player nonsense he's on about, what was it about 'facts'??
a) the player had little to do with the result. Hell, oxlade-chamberlain scored for zagreb ffs, in a game that was 4-5 shots on target that culminated in a 2-1 scoreline after his own team were down to 10men...
b) possible to be more sour grapes after Mamic was quoted as saying ""A four-year suspension is a stupidity. How would Uefa punish Arsenal, Bayern, Manchester or some other big club?"
c) There are no rules to disqualify teams from the Champions League unless at least two players fail drugs tests. Whether he likes it or not

No one to blame for the loss but themselves :rolleyes:
So Wenger can pipe down until they have a second positive. He's not going to be able to weasel his way out of the loss...
We're talking about the ethics of sport where Wenger rightly wants a change in the rule. As for the result, Wenger and Arsenal deserved the criticism they got afterwards. I have never deflected from that. Wenger criticised the team's performance that night. I have expressed my opinion enough on Wenger, he's past his best at the elite level of the game. Arsenal would be better off with a change. That still doesn't mean what he's saying now is wrong or should be dismissed of.

Mamic can play the victimization all he likes, Wenger wasn't talking about the issue of doping with selective judgment to certain teams. He was talking in a general sense.

You might also want to check your two players getting busted when taking this into account:



Half-time notice. The rules are embarrassing. As if that will happen anytime soon. With the premise of your absurd point, Wenger should stay quiet because it's "the rule". Rules are also there to be disagreed with and challenged to point out the obvious flaws.

Ditto, I highly doubt his players are as squeaky clean as he may suggest
Wenger has been a coach for over 30 years. I said it before and it goes for cycling teams as well. I don't care how much against doping an owner or manager is, someone can still always cross the line. I say the same for someone like Zeman as a manager.

Wenger can speak up and vouch for himself though.
 
Nov 20, 2015
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gooner said:
beatthatrat said:
Yup, for whatever reason Wenger is stirring the pot in a big way in European football. I don't remember anyone of similar status currently involved in the game raising these questions before. He's forcing people to take notice and acknowledge there's a problem in the worlds biggest sport.
It's a bit strange that people here apart from gooner think this isn't noteworthy. Here's your Bassons, your doping jesus getting stamped on by the authorities for breaking omerta. All he's getting here is scorn.
Agree.

I watch the Sunday Supplement with football journos most weeks on Sky and never have I heard them touch the topic of doping. That was until last week when a significant section of the show was dedicated to discussing what Wenger said.

Yesterday I had a brief interaction on twitter with Ian Prior of the Guardian and responded to what he said by querying whether other clubs were subjected to the same level of testing and if it was just Arsenal, it smacks of attacking the messenger. He said they were already going to pose that question to UEFA about this.

People can dress it up all they like, but Wenger's comments highlighting this issue has got even some journos finally asking some questions. While it's nowhere near still the desired level and I wouldn't hold out much hope of it being a prolonged one, Wenger should be praised for doing so and at least impacting it some bit. Instead in here, it should be deemed as some basis for criticism with the bizarre notion that he's the next coming of Paula Radcliffe. Having your tummies tickled by one too many doping scandals doesn't mean you paint everyone with the same brush.

The game gets criticism when there is silence on it, and yet it's the same when someone raises his head and addresses it. I just don't get it.

I agree tribalism may play a small part but on the part of some cycling fans, I think it's nothing more than a real desire to want football to be painted as dirty if not dirtier than cycling. I don't know if that's the case, but in tacking this topic, I'm interested in the substance, not the hyperbole and innuendo.
The Paula Radcliffe comparison was strange allright.
Wenger has raised the topic three times now when everyone else preferred to let that sleeping dog lie. He hasn't gained anything through doing it except criticism from within the sport - I presume we can only see the tip of the iceberg in that regard.
Journalists are using this as an opening to finally ask some basic questions. With any luck someone'll join it to the corruption scandals in UEFA/FIFA and the big Athletics scandals and it'll open a bit of a floodgate.
 
gooner said:
Archibald said:
I was only responding to the info on the page above... and the quote by slowpoke suggests he believed it was a payback for his comments.

As for the change the result for their loss to Zagreb because they had one "doped" player nonsense he's on about, what was it about 'facts'??
a) the player had little to do with the result. Hell, oxlade-chamberlain scored for zagreb ffs, in a game that was 4-5 shots on target that culminated in a 2-1 scoreline after his own team were down to 10men...
b) possible to be more sour grapes after Mamic was quoted as saying ""A four-year suspension is a stupidity. How would Uefa punish Arsenal, Bayern, Manchester or some other big club?"
c) There are no rules to disqualify teams from the Champions League unless at least two players fail drugs tests. Whether he likes it or not

No one to blame for the loss but themselves :rolleyes:
So Wenger can pipe down until they have a second positive. He's not going to be able to weasel his way out of the loss...
We're talking about the ethics of sport where Wenger rightly wants a change in the rule. As for the result, Wenger and Arsenal deserved the criticism they got afterwards. I have never deflected from that. Wenger criticised the team's performance that night. I have expressed my opinion enough on Wenger, he's past his best at the elite level of the game. Arsenal would be better off with a change. That still doesn't mean what he's saying now is wrong or should be dismissed of.

Mamic can play the victimization all he likes, Wenger wasn't talking about the issue of doping with selective judgment to certain teams. He was talking in a general sense.

You might also want to check your two players getting busted when taking this into account:



Half-time notice. The rules are embarrassing. As if that will happen anytime soon. With the premise of your absurd point, Wenger should stay quiet because it's "the rule". Rules are also there to be disagreed with and challenged to point out the obvious flaws.

Ditto, I highly doubt his players are as squeaky clean as he may suggest
Wenger has been a coach for over 30 years. I said it before and it goes for cycling teams as well. I don't care how much against doping an owner or manager is, someone can still always cross the line. I say the same for someone like Zeman as a manager.

Wenger can speak up and vouch for himself though.
comment on number of players needing to be busted was from here: http://www.bbc.com/sport/0/football/34886462
but that said, your reference is for in competition testing which in your quote talks of "as all matches where doping controls are to take place"... Wenger's visit from the 10 vampires wasn't during a match (that I'm aware), nor does the Beeb's statement refer to only in competition testing, does it?
The rules may be lame and embarrassing, but that wasn't my point

Wenger calling for results to be changed if players test positive is fine - however, his timing of it being after a loss with an opposing player getting busted shortly thereafter suggests a link... especially after the opposing manager mentions (takes a veiled jibe at) Wenger's own team?
And that's on top of previously suggesting that he's been cheated by dopers in european competition before...
It sounded like he wanted that match result overturned - and that's what my "pipe down" comment was aimed at, and not that he was pushing for better testing. "The result is in and won't be changed regardless, so no point even going there" was my premise.
Be general all he wants - it just didn't come across that way

And let's face it, he can make these statements knowing full well that it's highly unlikely anyone on his team will get busted.
Should that happen - just after those pigs fly by the FIFA office windows - I'd be interested to see his reaction if it did, especially if it resulted in his side having a match result turned over.
Who knows, maybe it'd be one of those players that come to him with dodgy red blood cell counts ??
He may well not be involved in any team program, but a rogue player will make him look pretty silly after all these comments

that said, I reckon the most likely popping of an arsenal player would be wilshire and that's more for a Boonen-esque substance
 
Jul 15, 2010
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Wenger calling for results to be changed if players test positive is fine - however, his timing of it being after a loss with an opposing player getting busted shortly thereafter suggests a link... especially after the opposing manager mentions (takes a veiled jibe at) Wenger's own team?
And that's on top of previously suggesting that he's been cheated by dopers in european competition before...
It sounded like he wanted that match result overturned - and that's what my "pipe down" comment was aimed at, and not that he was pushing for better testing. "The result is in and won't be changed regardless, so no point even going there" was my premise.
Be general all he wants - it just didn't come across that way

And let's face it, he can make these statements knowing full well that it's highly unlikely anyone on his team will get busted.
Should that happen - just after those pigs fly by the FIFA office windows - I'd be interested to see his reaction if it did, especially if it resulted in his side having a match result turned over.
Who knows, maybe it'd be one of those players that come to him with dodgy red blood cell counts ??
He may well not be involved in any team program, but a rogue player will make him look pretty silly after all these comments

that said, I reckon the most likely popping of an arsenal player would be wilshire and that's more for a Boonen-esque substance[/quote]

Sanchez, all day long..

Arsène Wenger says that Alexis Sánchez’s style reminds him of a lion hunting its prey and he continues to be amazed at the forward’s durability.
http://www.theguardian.com/football/2015/nov/26/alexis-sanchez-arsenal-lion-arsene-wenger
 
Nov 20, 2015
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Archibald said:
Wenger calling for results to be changed if players test positive is fine - however, his timing of it being after a loss with an opposing player getting busted shortly thereafter suggests a link... especially after the opposing manager mentions (takes a veiled jibe at) Wenger's own team?
And that's on top of previously suggesting that he's been cheated by dopers in european competition before...
It sounded like he wanted that match result overturned - and that's what my "pipe down" comment was aimed at, and not that he was pushing for better testing. "The result is in and won't be changed regardless, so no point even going there" was my premise.
Be general all he wants - it just didn't come across that way
One of the signs of cleanliness often pointed out on this forum is that a clean athlete should be hopping mad that a dirty stinkin cheat robbed them of wealth and glory.
 
Oct 22, 2009
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Arsène Wenger says that Alexis Sánchez’s style reminds him of a lion hunting its prey and he continues to be amazed at the forward’s durability.
Is Wenger trolling himself? The quotes in that Guardian article sound like he's talking about an obviously doped player he wants to see banned.

“When he does something, he does it 100%,” Wenger said. “He finishes and you think: ‘He’s dead now.’ But then he recovers and gives 100% again. You always see signs of exhaustion but it’s not [that] because two days later, he’s fine."
“His style is very explosive... his resistance is remarkable... I take information, especially from the medical people who know him and treat him every day"
I almost feel sorry for Sanchez. He already looks like the doperiest doper in the Premier League and now his own manager is more or less hanging a sign round his neck.
 
beatthatrat said:
Archibald said:
Wenger calling for results to be changed if players test positive is fine - however, his timing of it being after a loss with an opposing player getting busted shortly thereafter suggests a link... especially after the opposing manager mentions (takes a veiled jibe at) Wenger's own team?
And that's on top of previously suggesting that he's been cheated by dopers in european competition before...
It sounded like he wanted that match result overturned - and that's what my "pipe down" comment was aimed at, and not that he was pushing for better testing. "The result is in and won't be changed regardless, so no point even going there" was my premise.
Be general all he wants - it just didn't come across that way
One of the signs of cleanliness often pointed out on this forum is that a clean athlete should be hopping mad that a dirty stinkin cheat robbed them of wealth and glory.
You've learnt a lot about the forum in 1 week.

And btw, no that's not a sign of cleanliness. Otherwise everyone who said "wah, kick Ricco out of the sport"/ "wah, kick Gatlin out of the sport" would have been clean.

What people actually say is that its a sign of doping if an athlete isn't hopping mad that a .... robbed them. Eg Andy Schleck.

But that doesn't mean the reverse is true because anyone can fabricate emotion to score brownie points.
 
Apr 20, 2012
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beatthatrat said:
Yup, for whatever reason Wenger is stirring the pot in a big way in European football. I don't remember anyone of similar status currently involved in the game raising these questions before. He's forcing people to take notice and acknowledge there's a problem in the worlds biggest sport.
It's a bit strange that people here apart from gooner think this isn't noteworthy. Here's your Bassons, your doping jesus getting stamped on by the authorities for breaking omerta. All he's getting here is scorn.
Ever heard of Zdenek Zeman?



After a good fourth place with some sparkling play, Zeman launched allegations about the abuse of pharmaceutical products in Italian football, citing former Juventus players Gianluca Vialli and Alessandro Del Piero (of using creatine) in July 1998. As a consequence, Courts begun a round of trials, until Juventus sport doctor Riccardo Agricola was found guilty of administering excessive pharmaceuticals to players between 1994 and 1998 and condemned to a 1 year and ten months jail term in 2004, even though he was absolved the next year by a Court of Appeal.[1] In the following 1998–1999 season Zeman reached a fifth place finish with AS Roma, but was replaced by Fabio Capello during the summer of 1999.
But hats off nevertheless, again, for Wanker.
 
Nov 20, 2015
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The Hitch said:
beatthatrat said:
Archibald said:
Wenger calling for results to be changed if players test positive is fine - however, his timing of it being after a loss with an opposing player getting busted shortly thereafter suggests a link... especially after the opposing manager mentions (takes a veiled jibe at) Wenger's own team?
And that's on top of previously suggesting that he's been cheated by dopers in european competition before...
It sounded like he wanted that match result overturned - and that's what my "pipe down" comment was aimed at, and not that he was pushing for better testing. "The result is in and won't be changed regardless, so no point even going there" was my premise.
Be general all he wants - it just didn't come across that way
One of the signs of cleanliness often pointed out on this forum is that a clean athlete should be hopping mad that a dirty stinkin cheat robbed them of wealth and glory.
You've learnt a lot about the forum in 1 week.

And btw, no that's not a sign of cleanliness. Otherwise everyone who said "wah, kick Ricco out of the sport"/ "wah, kick Gatlin out of the sport" would have been clean.

What people actually say is that its a sign of doping if an athlete isn't hopping mad that a .... robbed them. Eg Andy Schleck.

But that doesn't mean the reverse is true because anyone can fabricate emotion to score brownie points.
Thanks Hitch, it means a lot for you to reply to a humble sort like me.

People actually say both things and both things are true. No-one would bother fabricating emotion if real clean athletes weren't behaving like that. Also we're not talking about Wenger defending his sport here - he's speaking out, calling people to task time after time. He's totally out of tune with omerta, as opposed to those examples you give of throwing the fools that get caught under the bus.

As has been pointed out by FGL above Zeman broke the Juve doping scandal in Italy and it did him no good whatsoever.
 
Nov 20, 2015
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Fearless Greg Lemond said:
beatthatrat said:
Yup, for whatever reason Wenger is stirring the pot in a big way in European football. I don't remember anyone of similar status currently involved in the game raising these questions before. He's forcing people to take notice and acknowledge there's a problem in the worlds biggest sport.
It's a bit strange that people here apart from gooner think this isn't noteworthy. Here's your Bassons, your doping jesus getting stamped on by the authorities for breaking omerta. All he's getting here is scorn.
Ever heard of Zdenek Zeman?



After a good fourth place with some sparkling play, Zeman launched allegations about the abuse of pharmaceutical products in Italian football, citing former Juventus players Gianluca Vialli and Alessandro Del Piero (of using creatine) in July 1998. As a consequence, Courts begun a round of trials, until Juventus sport doctor Riccardo Agricola was found guilty of administering excessive pharmaceuticals to players between 1994 and 1998 and condemned to a 1 year and ten months jail term in 2004, even though he was absolved the next year by a Court of Appeal.[1] In the following 1998–1999 season Zeman reached a fifth place finish with AS Roma, but was replaced by Fabio Capello during the summer of 1999.
But hats off nevertheless, again, for 'custard'.
I don't understand what you mean by 'custard', sorry. Do you mean I'm 'over-egging the pudding'?
Yes of course Zeman was a huge story but he had nothing like the standing Wenger does in the game. He could be dismissed as journeyman manager whereas when Wenger speaks his vast reputation forces everyone to listen.
 
Forces everyone to listen? The last time Wenger made doping comments in football (about 3-4 years ago) I went around the websites of every major newspaper in the country and not a single one had it as a main story.
 
Nov 20, 2015
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It wasn't a main story - obviously the journos have a vested interest in keeping a lid on it - but it was very widely reported nevertheless.
 
Apr 20, 2012
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Sorry, I bet you are too young to realize that back in the 1990's Zeman actually was a very big name in football, but, in Italy you dont mess with the Agnelli's.

And again missing the point, it was over 10 years ago...

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/2388078/Arsenal-players-used-EPO-says-Wenger.html

EPO is a banned drug which increases the oxygen-carrying capability of blood.
"We have had some players come to us at Arsenal from other clubs abroad and their red blood cell count has been abnormally high," Wenger told the Independent. "That kind of thing makes you wonder.
"There are clubs who dope their players without the players knowing.
"The club might say that they were being injected with vitamins and the player would not necessarily know that it was something different."
Wenger was speaking at a debate in Brussels on the contribution of football to European integration.
 
Mar 25, 2013
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Yes, Zeman deserves recognition as well. I said it myself but the list is not exactly the length of your arm, which is why beatthatrat is saying Wenger's comments are newsworthy. Zeman's comments were how long ago? We're talking in the now with Wenger.

And again to the point of people speaking out. Cycling and athletics contrast with the level of scrutiny in football.

gooner said:
We're talking about a sport where the media and fans show little or no interest on the topic of doping and has nowhere near the same scrutiny as other sports like cycling and athletics. Under that scrutiny in those sports, many would play the clean card to deflect questions away. That same level of questioning and accountability is nowhere to be seen in football. If a manager is doping his players, the easiest thing would be the stay quiet and keep the status quo going, particularly when there are never big bust nowadays in football. It's actually nonsensical to keep talking about the issue.
Criticising the silence on the issue and then doing the exact same when the opposite occurs by referencing Radcliffe is having your cake and eating it.

I don't know where the legitimacy of the Radcliffe comparison comes from.

All I will say, I want the issue tackled but I never want something to exist to have my point proven. That's what I see here with Wenger, they want and hope that he's actually doping his players. Clear as day and shows them up for the scandal lovers they are.
 
Apr 20, 2012
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Dont get me wrong, it is one of the main reasons I have respect for Wenger, his nickname Arsene W a n k e r - very juvenile I know - is spelled on this board as Wanker.

It seems ;)
 
Nov 20, 2015
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Re:

Fearless Greg Lemond said:
Sorry, I bet you are too young to realize that back in the 1990's Zeman actually was a very big name in football, but, in Italy you dont mess with the Agnelli's.

And again missing the point, it was over 10 years ago...

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/2388078/Arsenal-players-used-EPO-says-Wenger.html

EPO is a banned drug which increases the oxygen-carrying capability of blood.
"We have had some players come to us at Arsenal from other clubs abroad and their red blood cell count has been abnormally high," Wenger told the Independent. "That kind of thing makes you wonder.
"There are clubs who dope their players without the players knowing.
"The club might say that they were being injected with vitamins and the player would not necessarily know that it was something different."
Wenger was speaking at a debate in Brussels on the contribution of football to European integration.
Ha ha, right I get you now.
It's a moot point but I think Wenger is that bit more of a 'name' in football. I remember the glory days of Seria A fairly well I'm afraid! Good times.
I was looking over Zeman's record on wiki there and it's nice to see he got another shot at Roma in the 2000s, interesting character.
 
Re:

Fearless Greg Lemond said:
Sorry, I bet you are too young to realize that back in the 1990's Zeman actually was a very big name in football, but, in Italy you dont mess with the Agnelli's.

And again missing the point, it was over 10 years ago...

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/2388078/Arsenal-players-used-EPO-says-Wenger.html

EPO is a banned drug which increases the oxygen-carrying capability of blood.
"We have had some players come to us at Arsenal from other clubs abroad and their red blood cell count has been abnormally high," Wenger told the Independent. "That kind of thing makes you wonder.
"There are clubs who dope their players without the players knowing.
"The club might say that they were being injected with vitamins and the player would not necessarily know that it was something different."
Wenger was speaking at a debate in Brussels on the contribution of football to European integration.
And here's the thing... during the standard pre-transfer medical, he finds out they have an abnormally high red blood cell count, but doesn't reject the transfer/player when he discovers the reason for why said player appeared to be so good and was worth signing the first place??
He wonders, "hmmm.. this guy was so good because he was doped, but we'll still sign him because he'll be just as good for us once he's clean"...

something that still hasn't been explained yet.
And then someone is suspicious of Sanchez, which is ruled out as 'nothing to see here', he's just praising a player...
 
Mar 25, 2013
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Re: Re:

Archibald said:
Fearless Greg Lemond said:
Sorry, I bet you are too young to realize that back in the 1990's Zeman actually was a very big name in football, but, in Italy you dont mess with the Agnelli's.

And again missing the point, it was over 10 years ago...

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/2388078/Arsenal-players-used-EPO-says-Wenger.html

EPO is a banned drug which increases the oxygen-carrying capability of blood.
"We have had some players come to us at Arsenal from other clubs abroad and their red blood cell count has been abnormally high," Wenger told the Independent. "That kind of thing makes you wonder.
"There are clubs who dope their players without the players knowing.
"The club might say that they were being injected with vitamins and the player would not necessarily know that it was something different."
Wenger was speaking at a debate in Brussels on the contribution of football to European integration.
And here's the thing... during the standard pre-transfer medical, he finds out they have an abnormally high red blood cell count, but doesn't reject the transfer/player when he discovers the reason for why said player appeared to be so good and was worth signing the first place??
He wonders, "hmmm.. this guy was so good because he was doped, but we'll still sign him because he'll be just as good for us once he's clean"...

something that still hasn't been explained yet.
And then someone is suspicious of Sanchez, which is ruled out as 'nothing to see here', he's just praising a player...
You probably missed this part:

"There are clubs who dope their players without the players knowing."
This has been addressed up thread. People like Henry and Sanchez coming from Juve and Barca are main players at Arsenal, whereas they were more supplementary players at those clubs beforehand. Sanchez was a far better player for Chile than he was for Barca during his stint there(eg: WC '14, v England in Wembley). In the case of Henry, a positional change also helped. Not everything can simply be put down to doping. Petit, Overmars and Hleb went to Barca and were shadows of their former selves. There's differing reasons for players succeeding and failing at the various clubs they play for.

Claudio Ranieri once called Carlton Cole his lion. Probably meant code for calling for him a doper.

Only around here would you see logic like that.
 

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