Doping in XC skiing

[Libertine Seguros]

I am glad they don't get the same kind of domination in biathlon, although it's pretty funny how whenever their top woman retires, someone else has a big improvement to fill the gap.

What, Eckhoff? Her improvements are fairly gradual and not really shocking. She's from a family of biathletes (her brother is her coach, and her sister used to date Svendsen) and had been in and around the top 10 of a number of races in the second half of 2012-13 before doing so more consistently last season. I'd argue suspicion of her should focus more on tradition linking to the days of a decade ago than to any transformation. She was one of the best World Cup competitors without a win until yesterday...

Solemdal is a much bigger question mark. She went from 43rd and 44th (each with 1+1) in World Cup sprints in the last events of 2010-11 to 4th with the same shooting record outskiing Magdalena Neuner in Östersund in 2011-12. However she keeps getting ill, injured or otherwise losing the plot. She was the one supposed to take over as team leader when Tora retired. After her chronic start to the season, the image of Sveta Sleptsova hangs over her.

 

[the sceptic]

well, it seems like she is skiing much faster this year but I could be wrong of course.

 

[Bavarianrider]

My home country is doing quite well in cross country atm. For anybody outside the sport, does this sound legit: (world cup standings individual after 2 weeks of the season)
Women:1.NOR 2.NOR 3.NOR 4.NOR 6.NOR 9.NOR
Men: 1.NOR 2.NOR 3.NOR 4.NOR 6.NOR 8.NOR 9.NOR

The only question if this continues, is if the national championship will have more prestigue than the world cup.

As a Norwegian I find it hard to believe that all these nice athletes are doping, some of them surely, but all ??? However I'm starting to believe that Norwegian doctors have come up with stuff that works as well as doping, but is somehow legal, or just a little shady )..

To be fair, Norwegians have to be on top of their game at the beginning of the season due to the enormous pressure within the team. Things won`t look like this in February.

 

[Libertine Seguros]

Fastest skiers of 2013-14. Tiril was 10th.

If you look at the 9 ahead of her, there's good reason why she would be higher up the ski time charts too - Evi is banned/retired, Tora is retired, Kuzmina is absent, Solemdal and Soukalová are both on awful form. She has improved relative to the best, but it's not as huge as it looks.

 

[frenchfry]

Regardless of whether or not Norwegians are doping, there are apparently hordes of them that have been training furiously for some time already. According to accounts from the French team members who went to Beitostolen for training before the FIS races, the trails were packed with Norwegians of all ages. Meanwhile back in France there isn't any snow yet, and even if there was there wouldn't be nearly the same number of people x-country skiing. This could explain the slow start the French team is having.

I also agree that things will even out later in the season, at least for the men. Maybe not for the women who look like men (from the neck down at least).

 

[maltiv]

A noteworthy point is that the Norwegians with their budget (about 100x of any other country) are able to go go to organised training camps more or less the entire off-season, thus having access to snow all year.

Most others don't have this luxery, which e.g. Calle Halfvarsson pointed out yesterday, saying that he thinks he'd be much better with the same opportunities.

Normally this advantage is reduced further into the season, so I really doubt that this domination will continue (with the male skiers).

 

[neineinei]

http://www.sports.ru/tribuna/blogs/russiateam/710014.html (Russian)
http://www.vg.no/sport/skiskyting/e...isk-skiskyting-systematisk-doping/a/23351416/ (Norwegian)

Interview with former coach of the Russian biathlon team, Pavel Rostovtsev.

"When two from the team are caught at the same time, is it the system?"
Rostovtsev: "It is not an accident, it is the system"

"What do you thnk of Irina Starykhs story about cosmetics being the cause of her doping positive?"
Rostovtsev: "Write: Rostovtsev grins.".

- What did you think when you found out the team is close to the infamous doctor Dmitriev?

- In our team it was not. I did not know that he was working with someone.

- It is all seen on stages.

- I saw it too. And what he was doing - I do not know. I was not interested. Maybe working with men. Maybe with Korolkevich.

 

[python]

Kowalczyk: "The Norwegians kill skiing"
http://www.ski-nordique.net/

regarding that interview by rostovtsev...

not knowing much about him except being an interpreter for pichler and a head shooting coach, i looked him up...3 times worlds champ in the 90s, a loyal member of the new 'fiercely clean' german model, a very temperamental man (to put it mildly) embroiled into some loud public feuds with several journalists that doubted pichler (spit in the face of a famous tv commentator, roughed up another...)

i tend to take pichler (and his loyalists) at their word. but a russian multi world champion from the epo 90s elevating himself to a moral right to spit a skeptic in the face ?

but i will give him this. he sure can talk about 'system doping' b/c he undoubtedly was part of it. i just never feel comfortable about the overdone indignation from people like him.

 

[Pazuzu]

Kowalczyk: "The Norwegians kill skiing"
http://www.ski-nordique.net/

I don't read French. What did she say? I know that she's been critical of other skiers, and Bjoergen in particular, for using asthma medication. Is it criticism it along similar lines?

As far as I know, neither Bjoergen or any of the other Norwegians have ever been linked to doping in any way. There's been no 'Dr. Ferrari' lurking in the shadows. But Bjoergen's domination has been so total - from sprints to 30 km, and at her age - that it does make one wonder.

 

[python]

I don't read French. What did she say? I know that she's been critical of other skiers, and Bjoergen in particular, for using asthma medication. Is it criticism it along similar lines?

As far as I know, neither Bjoergen or any of the other Norwegians have ever been linked to doping in any way. There's been no 'Dr. Ferrari' lurking in the shadows. But Bjoergen's domination has been so total - from sprints to 30 km, and at her age - that it does make one wonder.

she did not talk about the dope specifically nor did she mention the old asthma story in particular...she was basically talking about the norwegian total domination in most areas, including the explicitly mentioned MEDICAL. did she mean doping ?

hard to say, but she explicitly refered to the superior medical support which she did not elaborate on (the french article was just a summary of her polish version which also did not elaborate on 'medical').

justyna basically cried that only rare 'davids' like herself, legkov, cologna... were able to occasionally interfere with the domination.

justyna is very emotional, passionate...she disdains bjoergen and she said so several times...not in this article, but she recently related her deep and lasting depressions. her personal problems including a miscarriage just before the olympics in sochi.

i dont know if justyna or the norwegians dope. but i am pretty sure that justyna knows how a doped vs a non-doped performance looks. what i interpreted from her article was how she feels but could not say it openly w/o the shyt storm...

 

[Libertine Seguros]

Speaking of Dr. Ferrari, now we are being told that the good Doctor was, a few years ago, a referral from Gottlieb Taschler, of the Italian biathlon fed and now, a high-up in the IBU, to his son Daniel.

 

[neineinei]

Speaking of Dr. Ferrari, now we are being told that the good Doctor was, a few years ago, a referral from Gottlieb Taschler, of the Italian biathlon fed and now, a high-up in the IBU, to his son Daniel.

Taschler is one of 8 vice presidents of IBU.

He is also Johannes Dürrs father in law.

 

[Libertine Seguros]

Ah yes, now I remember his name in connection with Dürr's ban, when there was some speculation he might change his nationality to compete for Italy to come back after the 2 years' EPO ban is up rather than his Austrian life ban, but that seems to have come to nothing, so I don't know if it was ever taken beyond the speculative level.

 

[neineinei]

Thankfully Dürr didn't have any help with the doping, bought the EPO from some person from the former Yugoslavia, and admitted everything as soon as the test was found positive. Or was that Schwazer?

 

[BullsFan22]

Thankfully Dürr didn't have any help with the doping, bought the EPO from some person from the former Yugoslavia, and admitted everything as soon as the test was found positive. Or was that Schwazer?

I wouldn't trust a word Duerr has said, is saying, or will say. Why would he go to a former Yugoslav country, where endurance sports are not that popular and doping isn't nearly as prevalent as most of the rest of Europe is and when he can get anything he wants in terms of PED's in Austria, a country that has a long history with drugs in sport? He doped during the Tour de Ski, didn't get caught, raced the pursuit in Sochi, went BACK to Austria to suck on some more PED's and then proceeded to get caught once back in Russia.

 

[python]

here's the original article about ferari and taschler father and son
(italian)

http://www.gazzetta.it/Sport-Invern...capo-mandava-dopare-figlio-100187512614.shtml

what jumped at me was that the epo procedure ferrari had been using on taschler in 2010 was virtually the same epo microdosing we learned from tyler and the usada affidavits.

the same still undetectable method if one does it right.

 

[melkemugg]

To be fair, Norwegians have to be on top of their game at the beginning of the season due to the enormous pressure within the team. Things won`t look like this in February.

I think so too, internal competition and pressure is getting too much and they are all overtraining.

 

[May0maniac]

Speaking of Dr. Ferrari, now we are being told that the good Doctor was, a few years ago, a referral from Gottlieb Taschler, of the Italian biathlon fed and now, a high-up in the IBU, to his son Daniel.

I'm not surprised, XC skiing and Biathlon in Südtirol is full of dopers, you don't hear many stories about the pros but the amateur scene is as dirty as it gets.

 

[neineinei]

IBU statement from yesterday
http://www2.biathlonworld.com/en/press_releases.html/do/detail?presse=2329

Subject: Media Reports Gottlieb and Daniel Taschler
The fight against doping and the protection of clean athletes is a top priority for the IBU. IBU is aware of the latest media reports regarding IBU Vice-President Gottlieb Taschler and his son. In the light of these reports, we will gather further facts to fully clarify the situation. At this stage we are not able to comment further, but will come back to you as soon as we have additional information

 

[Cloxxki]

IBU statement from yesterday
http://www2.biathlonworld.com/en/press_releases.html/do/detail?presse=2329

This should get interesting.
A- outright denial, sewer journalism
B- it was for his son's dog's walker's sister who's a bit under the weather
C- we sacked the president and all of IBU is now clean as a whistle

 

[BullsFan22]

This should get interesting.
A- outright denial, sewer journalism
B- it was for his son's dog's walker's sister who's a bit under the weather
C- we sacked the president and all of IBU is now clean as a whistle

LOL. Add D-An almost 41 year old that trains by himself in the Italian alps and is still winning Olympic medals is still clean as a whistle as well.

 

[Kokoso]

Eckhoff made a big jump since last season. Little bit suspect.

 

[neineinei]

IBU Press Release
13.12.2014, Hochfilzen / IBU Info/ JK
Subject: Statement by Gottlieb Taschler to the IBU Executive Board

"I have been shocked by the recent media reports alleging that I have been involved in doping and, even worse, that I have helped to organize performance enhancing substances for my son Daniel.

This is simply not true;

In order to protect the sport of biathlon and the good governance of the International Biathlon Union (IBU), I will temporarily suspend all my current roles within the IBU.

The whole statment is here:
http://www4.biathlonworld.com/en/press_releases.html/do/detail?presse=2334

 

[frenchfry]

IBU Press Release
13.12.2014, Hochfilzen / IBU Info/ JK
Subject: Statement by Gottlieb Taschler to the IBU Executive Board





The whole statment is here:
http://www4.biathlonworld.com/en/press_releases.html/do/detail?presse=2334

I am shocked, shocked I tell you!!!!

 

[markene2]

Eckhoff made a big jump since last season. Little bit suspect.

The one in Norways camp i would be worried about is Johaug. It's inhuman how fast she is now days!