Endura Racing

[stefrees]

the british talents always go out with u23 squads especially to italy where they get squashed big time on every hill and mountain, pls look up giro bio and avenir it was downright pathetic, so any guys less than that will be dropped even harder, the endura brits last year sucked so hard they didn't deserve to be racing the pro peloton except for some exceptions who have stayed for this year mostly. britain have little to no roadtalent of any significance except maybe peter kennaugh but he had a bad first year as a pro.

This is perhaps the most narrow minded post I've seen this year.

 

[Ryo Hazuki]

This is perhaps the most narrow minded post I've seen this year.

where are your arguments?

 

[stefrees]

where are your arguments?

I'm not going to get into any petty arguments that's why, was just commenting. Cav, Thomas, swift and kennaugh have all come through and aren't all that bad and they came through Italy, Luke Rowe is pretty decent young talent and I think tim kennaugh has signed for an amateur Italian team

 

[hatcher]

British people come out of the womb time trialling. External influences play no role in the sort of riders they produce.

 

[Ryo Hazuki]

I'm not going to get into any petty arguments that's why, was just commenting. Cav, Thomas, swift and kennaugh have all come through and aren't all that bad and they came through Italy, Luke Rowe is pretty decent young talent and I think tim kennaugh has signed for an amateur Italian team

cavendish, thomas and swift are no climbers. luke rowe. Pls, I remember the hype here last year for him before avenir. he finished 40th and got crushed by everyone that could climb in the peloton. and tim kennaugh?? what italian team exatcly he sucked really hard in avenir last year as wel..

 

[stefrees]

cavendish, thomas and swift are no climbers. luke rowe. Pls, I remember the hype here last year for him before avenir. he finished 40th and got crushed by everyone that could climb in the peloton. and tim kennaugh?? what italian team exatcly he sucked really hard in avenir last year as wel..

You didn't specifically say climbers. And I think there's more to cycling than what riders achieve in their youth. And Thomas 19th in dauphine isn't exactly showing rubbishness at climbing

 

[Reverend_T_Preedy]

the british talents always go out with u23 squads especially to italy where they get squashed big time on every hill and mountain, pls look up giro bio and avenir it was downright pathetic, so any guys less than that will be dropped even harder, the endura brits last year sucked so hard they didn't deserve to be racing the pro peloton except for some exceptions who have stayed for this year mostly. britain have little to no roadtalent of any significance except maybe peter kennaugh but he had a bad first year as a pro.

Check out the Baby Giro 2009 and 2009 U23 road race.

By in large the UK doesn't produce climbers due to the lack of races in the UK. However, the Academy system has moved British cycling on by light years, it just takes a long time to develop the right riders.

There's still a track emphasis with many of the riders but things are changing. I think G Thomas can develop his climbing with more experience and more focus on the road. However, don't expect anything from most of the GB rider who do the track till after 2012.

Regarding Pete Kennaugh's first year, it wasn't spectacular, however, an injury in Eroica didn't help and his role is as a domestique at the moment. I hope he gets more chance this year.

 

[euanli]

British people come out of the womb time trialling. External influences play no role in the sort of riders they produce.

truth. I beat my brothers time for gestations by three weeks.

 

[euanli]

people expect too much from Geraint. I'd like to see him become a decent classics rider.

 

[Libertine Seguros]

the british talents always go out with u23 squads especially to italy where they get squashed big time on every hill and mountain, pls look up giro bio and avenir it was downright pathetic, so any guys less than that will be dropped even harder, the endura brits last year sucked so hard they didn't deserve to be racing the pro peloton except for some exceptions who have stayed for this year mostly. britain have little to no roadtalent of any significance except maybe peter kennaugh but he had a bad first year as a pro.

But this is the point - for most of the British talents, that's the first time they come across hills and stage races of any real length. It's no wonder they get crushed by people who are used to it. Sure, Robert Gesink comes from a flat country too, Britain just doesn't have anybody who can climb like him.

There are a few people out there who may be garbage at present, but if they're given the opportunity may show something - they may be good recoverers, but because they only do one day races that's been hidden.

Certainly doing more stage races and mingling with the Euro Pro péloton more often can't hurt them, it will give them more of an idea of what kind of level is needed to succeed.

Sky came into the sport saying "British Tour de France winner in five years". We shot them down, and rightly so. Where is a British Tour de France winner going to come from? Not from a domestic scene of nothing but time trials and crits. I don't think Britain has a TDF-winning talent right now, but how are they meant to find a climber if the riders never get to climb? You've got to give them the chance to sink or swim. If they sink? Well, that's part of the risk. At least they had the chance.

 

[ingsve]

Sky came into the sport saying "British Tour de France winner in five years". We shot them down, and rightly so. Where is a British Tour de France winner going to come from? Not from a domestic scene of nothing but time trials and crits. I don't think Britain has a TDF-winning talent right now, but how are they meant to find a climber if the riders never get to climb? You've got to give them the chance to sink or swim. If they sink? Well, that's part of the risk. At least they had the chance.

The only chance I think they have is with Wiggins if there is another Tour like 2009 but with a little more ITT and a TTT where Sky manages to get a good lead. Other than that I have a hard time seeing someone going it at least within that time margin. I wonder if we'll ever see Tour like in the early 90s ever again with like 110 km ITT along with 60-70km TTT.

 

[euanli]

Somewhat unlikely I bet.

Anyway there is a British kid that I'm keeping an eye on who we might be hearing about in a few years who might not be going through the established BC system and all the advantages that brings him.

 

[stefrees]

Somewhat unlikely I bet.

Anyway there is a British kid that I'm keeping an eye on who we might be hearing about in a few years who might not be going through the established BC system and all the advantages that brings him.

Who's that?

 

[online-rider]

they have some good names but average team. none are exceptional climbers, itt guys or sprinters. don't see them win a thing unless it's from breakways or mandri finally breaks through

I really like the way endura have been doing things, slowly improving the team, slowly attending bigger races. Good balance of experience and younger riders.

Really down to them to make an impact in some of the races they are attending this year. If they can get guys in breaks in murcia, med etc then they could get a lot more invites next year.

Brian Smith i believe has a fair few contacts in europe. He is invaluable to them.

To be fair, there are four or five climbs that are of a decent gradient and 3-5miles long here that I've heard that Millar would spend hours on as a teenager just doing hill repeat after hill repeat. It was something he worked on hard.

the british talents always go out with u23 squads especially to italy where they get squashed big time on every hill and mountain, pls look up giro bio and avenir it was downright pathetic, so any guys less than that will be dropped even harder, the endura brits last year sucked so hard they didn't deserve to be racing the pro peloton except for some exceptions who have stayed for this year mostly. britain have little to no roadtalent of any significance except maybe peter kennaugh but he had a bad first year as a pro.

Check out the Baby Giro 2009 and 2009 U23 road race.

By in large the UK doesn't produce climbers due to the lack of races in the UK. However, the Academy system has moved British cycling on by light years, it just takes a long time to develop the right riders.

There's still a track emphasis with many of the riders but things are changing. I think G Thomas can develop his climbing with more experience and more focus on the road. However, don't expect anything from most of the GB rider who do the track till after 2012.

Regarding Pete Kennaugh's first year, it wasn't spectacular, however, an injury in Eroica didn't help and his role is as a domestique at the moment. I hope he gets more chance this year.

But this is the point - for most of the British talents, that's the first time they come across hills and stage races of any real length. It's no wonder they get crushed by people who are used to it. Sure, Robert Gesink comes from a flat country too, Britain just doesn't have anybody who can climb like him.

There are a few people out there who may be garbage at present, but if they're given the opportunity may show something - they may be good recoverers, but because they only do one day races that's been hidden.

Certainly doing more stage races and mingling with the Euro Pro péloton more often can't hurt them, it will give them more of an idea of what kind of level is needed to succeed.

Sky came into the sport saying "British Tour de France winner in five years". We shot them down, and rightly so. Where is a British Tour de France winner going to come from? Not from a domestic scene of nothing but time trials and crits. I don't think Britain has a TDF-winning talent right now, but how are they meant to find a climber if the riders never get to climb? You've got to give them the chance to sink or swim. If they sink? Well, that's part of the risk. At least they had the chance.

When I saw Enduras programme last January, I thought hmm Murcia, Haut var, Med etc.. - that sounds like a good proagramme. And it occured to me that they would base themselves in Belgium for some of the year. But unfortunately, as the season went on, I realized they were basing themselves firmly in Manchester.
Although I can see the upsides in that for promoting cycling in England. And I really respect it for supporting the racing scene over there. I think its quite obvious, to have the team living in Belgium, their results would steadily improve, and it would probably be cheaper.

 

[ingsve]

When I saw Enduras programme last January, I thought hmm Murcia, Haut var, Med etc.. - that sounds like a good proagramme. And it occured to me that they would base themselves in Belgium for some of the year. But unfortunately, as the season went on, I realized they were basing themselves firmly in Manchester.
Although I can see the upsides in that for promoting cycling in England. And I really respect it for supporting the racing scene over there. I think its quite obvious, to have the team living in Belgium, their results would steadily improve, and it would probably be cheaper.

Does it really matter where the team is based? As long as they can get good training done then I don't see hte point of staying in belgium over england. In the top teams everyone is always scattered all over europe anyway with riders training with whoever happens to live nearby.

 

[Mambo95]

Somewhat unlikely I bet.

Anyway there is a British kid that I'm keeping an eye on who we might be hearing about in a few years who might not be going through the established BC system and all the advantages that brings him.

Does he have the initials GB?

If not, then I'm keeping my eye on a different talent who could be huge. (not that I know him or anything)

 

[online-rider]

Does it really matter where the team is based? As long as they can get good training done then I don't see hte point of staying in belgium over england. In the top teams everyone is always scattered all over europe anyway with riders training with whoever happens to live nearby.

Thats a good point but still last year Endura didn't really race in Europe after March. Sure they went over to France for Tro Bro Leon and Tour de whatever but Seriously base the team in Flanders, have the guys racing every other day in Kermesses and U23/Amateur Rondes and Gent Wevelgems and such races as they have in Belgium. Or would you rather have them doing a criterium once a week in Lancashire amongst, Lets face it, vastly inferior competition.

 

[LugHugger]

Perhaps it's HR? A massive talent who's not going to get burned out racing the way he does at the moment but is slowly gaining experience where it counts

 

[Mambo95]

Perhaps it's HR? A massive talent who's not going to get burned out racing the way he does at the moment but is slowly gaining experience where it counts

I don't know of an HR, but there is a 15 year old GB who recently beat the likes of Dan Fleeman, Dean Downing and Kristian House on a two minute hill climb.

 

[euanli]

Endura Racing's service course is actually based in South Wales and not Manchester. With other elements also based at the HQ in Livingstone.

But hey at least they are trying which is something more than other British based teams are doing (if you exclude the Italian teams that are British registered for tax reasons).

 

[ingsve]

Thats a good point but still last year Endura didn't really race in Europe after March. Sure they went over to France for Tro Bro Leon and Tour de whatever but Seriously base the team in Flanders, have the guys racing every other day in Kermesses and U23/Amateur Rondes and Gent Wevelgems and such races as they have in Belgium. Or would you rather have them doing a criterium once a week in Lancashire amongst, Lets face it, vastly inferior competition.

No, they should definately race a complete program on the continent. If beiong based on Manchester means they will get stuck riding domestic races then that's not good of course.

 

[euanli]

I think the Tour series is part of the problem. Its important to them in terms of exposure, but it really holds them back.

Its worth noting that they have also set up a youth team. Not sure what their schedule is likely to be though.

 

[Reverend_T_Preedy]

No, they should definately race a complete program on the continent. If beiong based on Manchester means they will get stuck riding domestic races then that's not good of course.

The domestic races are extremeley important to Endura, particularly the Tour Series which is covered on terrestrial television. Therefore, they willm mix up continental races with the domestic calender (Premier Calender, circuit race series, tour series, cicle classic etc). I imagine that with the riders they have, they will split the team up to compete in the crit racers and stage races.

As for riding against inferior competion (see comment from online-rider), they had one of the larger budgets last season, plus experience riding on the continent, but still didn't win the Premier Calender (Chris Newton-Rapha Condor Sharp), Tour Series (Motorpoint Marshalls Pasta) or East Midlands Cicle Classic (Michael Berling-Glud & Marstrand).

I don't think people should be so condescending to other domestic teams who have some very good riders. I expect big things from them this season but other teams have riders who can win the premier calender and other teams look strong for the tour series too.

 

[Libertine Seguros]

I think the problem last year was that they tried to focus both on expansion into Europe and the domestic calendar; Rapha focus nearly everything on the domestic calendar, while Endura were splitting their focus between the domestic and European races they do; this meant that there was always a stronger team than them.

Now, this problem (also known as the Team Sky conundrum, considering they can never decide whether to focus on sprints or GC and ended up being mediocre at both at too many races) may continue - but with the strengthening of the roster and internationalising of it too they've got better chances of competing in both than they had in 2010.

 

[online-rider]

The domestic races are extremeley important to Endura, particularly the Tour Series which is covered on terrestrial television. Therefore, they willm mix up continental races with the domestic calender (Premier Calender, circuit race series, tour series, cicle classic etc). I imagine that with the riders they have, they will split the team up to compete in the crit racers and stage races.

As for riding against inferior competion (see comment from online-rider), they had one of the larger budgets last season, plus experience riding on the continent, but still didn't win the Premier Calender (Chris Newton-Rapha Condor Sharp), Tour Series (Motorpoint Marshalls Pasta) or East Midlands Cicle Classic (Michael Berling-Glud & Marstrand).

I don't think people should be so condescending to other domestic teams who have some very good riders. I expect big things from them this season but other teams have riders who can win the premier calender and other teams look strong for the tour series too.

I'm not being condescending. If you really believe the standard of racing in UK is comparable to Belgium, then good for you.