Teams & Riders Froome Talk Only

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Jul 5, 2009
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rick james said:
Again it doesn't make sense, it wouldn't be sir Dave's problem where froome went, he was out of contract so not sky's problem anymore....it's a weird one
Not really. Get Bruyneel to buy his contract early and you've got budget and headcount to chase after riders before contract season heats up. Get in early with a decent offer for someone with a skill set you need and you don't need to spend the off season chasing after it.

John Swanson
 
Re: Re:

ScienceIsCool said:
rick james said:
Again it doesn't make sense, it wouldn't be sir Dave's problem where froome went, he was out of contract so not sky's problem anymore....it's a weird one
Not really. Get Bruyneel to buy his contract early and you've got budget and headcount to chase after riders before contract season heats up. Get in early with a decent offer for someone with a skill set you need and you don't need to spend the off season chasing after it.

John Swanson

wasn't he at the end of his contract anyway?
 
Re: Re:

rick james said:
Bronstein said:
From Froome's autobiography:



yes it shows that sky didn't want to keep him, all I'm saying he was out of contract so it wasn't really up to Sir Dave to offer him to other teams, it wasn't sky's problem where Froome went.

Shows how little you know about cycling and the transfer of cyclists. Often team managers will talk to each other and arrange a swap deal. Often you'll offer rider x who is on €90,000 in your team for rider y on €90,000 in another team. Mangers are trying to make budget line up, so agents and managers go around the teams trying to swap one rider out of one team for a younger, more promising one on another team at the same price. Or they may swap out two to get a higher priced rider on another team. Or say "I need a one day guy for next year, I have two doms which might be interesting for you".

It's all a part of cyclings poker tournament which occurs at the Tour and later season at the Vuelta. If Brailsford was eyeing up a rider at Trek of course he'd call Bruyneel and offer him up a Froome or someone else.
 
Re: Re:

thehog said:
rick james said:
Bronstein said:
From Froome's autobiography:



yes it shows that sky didn't want to keep him, all I'm saying he was out of contract so it wasn't really up to Sir Dave to offer him to other teams, it wasn't sky's problem where Froome went.

Shows how little you know about cycling and the transfer of cyclists. Often team managers will talk to each other and arrange a swap deal. Often you'll offer rider x who is on €90,000 in your team for rider y on €90,000 in another team. Mangers are trying to make budget line up, so agents and managers go around the teams trying to swap one rider out of one team for a younger, more promising one on another team at the same price. Or they may swap out two to get a higher priced rider on another team. Or say "I need a one day guy for next year, I have two doms which might be interesting for you".

It's all a part of cyclings poker tournament which occurs at the Tour and later season at the Vuelta. If Brailsford was eyeing up a rider at Trek of course he'd call Bruyneel and offer him up a Froome or someone else.
guess work on your part


and how could he offer Froome to Trek when he isn't under contract with sky next year....Christ on a bike you lot just don't get it
 
Re: Re:

Bronstein said:
PremierAndrew said:
Valv.Piti said:
Wait, Sky basically rated him as their worst rider? :D
Fwiw, when Sky were starting up with their aim of producing a British Tour winner within 5 years, they were looking at two riders: Froome and Thomas. Then Wiggins had his Tour in 09 and all the plans changed. It's a shame that Froome's become too common to search the forum history on here, because until recently, you could see posts before the 2011 Vuelta from multiple forumers who seemed very excited about Froome. Ok, not as a potential 4 time Tour winner and the dominant stage racer of his era, but it definitely looked like people expected him to be a challenger for top 5s in major stage races.

Not denying that he's 99% likely to have doped to get where he is right now, but the image of Froome as a talentless kid who cheated his way to the top is also ridiculous
Do you have a source for this?

Kennaugh was the one normally thought of with the comment IIRC
 
Re: Re:

rick james said:
thehog said:
rick james said:
Bronstein said:
From Froome's autobiography:



yes it shows that sky didn't want to keep him, all I'm saying he was out of contract so it wasn't really up to Sir Dave to offer him to other teams, it wasn't sky's problem where Froome went.

Shows how little you know about cycling and the transfer of cyclists. Often team managers will talk to each other and arrange a swap deal. Often you'll offer rider x who is on €90,000 in your team for rider y on €90,000 in another team. Mangers are trying to make budget line up, so agents and managers go around the teams trying to swap one rider out of one team for a younger, more promising one on another team at the same price. Or they may swap out two to get a higher priced rider on another team. Or say "I need a one day guy for next year, I have two doms which might be interesting for you".

It's all a part of cyclings poker tournament which occurs at the Tour and later season at the Vuelta. If Brailsford was eyeing up a rider at Trek of course he'd call Bruyneel and offer him up a Froome or someone else.
guess work on your part


and how could he offer Froome to Trek when he isn't under contract with sky next year....Christ on a bike you lot just don't get it
Because they are making budgets line up, similar riders on similar salaries and or new sponsors. It happens every year and is reported in the press. It's very simple.


"Since I've been in cycling I've not experienced such an intense rest-day. It's transfer D-Day," one agent told Cyclingnews as he presumably backed his best suit on Sunday evening.

In the end, Cyclingnews can report very few high-profile deals were actually finalised with the market held up by Kittel's decision to wait until after the Tour and Aru's agent still shopping around for the best deal. Those two riders, it seems, determine a number of subsequent moves. For example, if Kittel leaves Quick-Step Floors, it will free up a sprint spot for Bryan Coquard, whose preferred move would be to the Belgian outfit.

Aru is still negotiating with both Astana and UAE – a team seemingly after every rider with a reasonable amount of UCI points – with one manager confirming that as late as last Sunday he was receiving calls from the Italian's agent. If Aru does move to UAE, as most predict, it would likely ensure that Dan Martin remains at Quick-Step. The Irish climber has an offer on the table from another team but is waiting for Patrick Lefevere.

Quintana's position became the biggest story during the rest day. Movistar team boss, Eusebio Unzue, gave a less than flattering interview in Spain which seemed to irritate the Colombian climber. There have been whispers since the Giro d'Italia that Quintana has been looking to end his current deal early but his agent has told Cyclingnews, that while Unzue's interview needs explaining, the rider is willing to honour his existing deal.

"He has a contract for two years. After the Tour we'll speak with Eusebio but normally we'll continue there," Giuseppe Acquadro told Cyclingnews.

"It's normal though that teams are interested in riders like him. There are not that many teams that can afford a rider like him, so it's natural that he's linked to teams like Astana and Sky. That's where the speculation comes from."

While that saga is set to run for the next few weeks Patrick Lefevere is holding out before re-signing a number of his riders at Quick-Step.

"I'm the guy who blocks the market for the moment because everyone is waiting to see if we go on and with which riders," Lefevere told Cyclingnews the evening before the rest day.

"You don't need an economics degree to understand that when I took young riders like Alaphilippe, Gaviria, and Jungels, they were much younger and not as good as they are today. They cost more now."


The Belgian team boss has yet to announce his sponsorship plans for 2018 but the team are expected to carry on. They've already re-signed Julian Alaphilippe and Fernando Gaviria, while Bob Jungels will re-sign soon. A question remains over Kittel's future.
http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/latest-transfer-deals-from-the-tour-de-france/
 
Jul 11, 2013
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Re: Re:

Catwhoorg said:
Bronstein said:
PremierAndrew said:
Valv.Piti said:
Wait, Sky basically rated him as their worst rider? :D
Fwiw, when Sky were starting up with their aim of producing a British Tour winner within 5 years, they were looking at two riders: Froome and Thomas. Then Wiggins had his Tour in 09 and all the plans changed. It's a shame that Froome's become too common to search the forum history on here, because until recently, you could see posts before the 2011 Vuelta from multiple forumers who seemed very excited about Froome. Ok, not as a potential 4 time Tour winner and the dominant stage racer of his era, but it definitely looked like people expected him to be a challenger for top 5s in major stage races.

Not denying that he's 99% likely to have doped to get where he is right now, but the image of Froome as a talentless kid who cheated his way to the top is also ridiculous
Do you have a source for this?

Kennaugh was the one normally thought of with the comment IIRC
Yes,

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/other_sports/cycling/8451502.stm

This is a British team," said Brailsford. "We are going out there to represent Britain and we needed a British leader. Bradley was the obvious candidate.

TEAM SKY'S BRITISH RIDERS
Bradley Wiggins
Geraint Thomas
Peter Kennaugh
Steve Cummings
Russell Downing
Chris Froome
Ian Stannard
Ben Swift

"Getting him in was a great achievement and, like him, we feel this is where he belongs."
Aside from Wiggins, Geraint Thomas and Peter Kennaugh are both bright British hopes for the future,
 
Jul 5, 2009
2,440
3
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Re: Re:

rick james said:
guess work on your part


and how could he offer Froome to Trek when he isn't under contract with sky next year....Christ on a bike you lot just don't get it
Unless you're at the top of the sport, you're not sorting through contract offers...

You get shopped to a team? You rejoice that you don't have to spend months wondering if you're still going to be a pro cyclist next year. If they bought your contract, they obviously want to extend.

And it doesn't have to be a straight up swap of riders. Clearing space on your roster early means you can have a bit extra in the bank to snag a rider that you need before someone else does. Let's say ike a new leadout specialist or something. Having a big budget sprinter on your team is worthless unless you can get rider X who is young, fast, and undervalued at the moment.

John Swanson
 
Re: Re:

ScienceIsCool said:
rick james said:
guess work on your part


and how could he offer Froome to Trek when he isn't under contract with sky next year....Christ on a bike you lot just don't get it
Unless you're at the top of the sport, you're not sorting through contract offers...

You get shopped to a team? You rejoice that you don't have to spend months wondering if you're still going to be a pro cyclist next year. If they bought your contract, they obviously want to extend.

And it doesn't have to be a straight up swap of riders. Clearing space on your roster early means you can have a bit extra in the bank to snag a rider that you need before someone else does. Let's say ike a new leadout specialist or something. Having a big budget sprinter on your team is worthless unless you can get rider X who is young, fast, and undervalued at the moment.

John Swanson
And Bruyneel confirmed it on Twitter;

 
Re: Re:

Catwhoorg said:
Bronstein said:
PremierAndrew said:
Valv.Piti said:
Wait, Sky basically rated him as their worst rider? :D
Fwiw, when Sky were starting up with their aim of producing a British Tour winner within 5 years, they were looking at two riders: Froome and Thomas. Then Wiggins had his Tour in 09 and all the plans changed. It's a shame that Froome's become too common to search the forum history on here, because until recently, you could see posts before the 2011 Vuelta from multiple forumers who seemed very excited about Froome. Ok, not as a potential 4 time Tour winner and the dominant stage racer of his era, but it definitely looked like people expected him to be a challenger for top 5s in major stage races.

Not denying that he's 99% likely to have doped to get where he is right now, but the image of Froome as a talentless kid who cheated his way to the top is also ridiculous
Do you have a source for this?

Kennaugh was the one normally thought of with the comment IIRC
And even that was a joke. Kennaughs one claim to being a potential gt contender (let alone TDF winner which is a completely different ball game) was that he finished on the podium of the baby giro. Historically ppl who finish on the podium of the baby giro end up as mid level mountain domestiques most of the time. So Kennaughs chances of being a Gt superstar were already extremely low.

Then you consider the fact he with those tiny odds was still far more likely to become a gt contender than any other Brit. And yet 1 year later Wiggins and Froome are on their way to becoming the greatest non doped riders ever and Thomas is not long after that a climbing and tt superstar.

What a coincidence.
 
Re: Re:

thehog said:
ScienceIsCool said:
rick james said:
guess work on your part


and how could he offer Froome to Trek when he isn't under contract with sky next year....Christ on a bike you lot just don't get it
Unless you're at the top of the sport, you're not sorting through contract offers...

You get shopped to a team? You rejoice that you don't have to spend months wondering if you're still going to be a pro cyclist next year. If they bought your contract, they obviously want to extend.

And it doesn't have to be a straight up swap of riders. Clearing space on your roster early means you can have a bit extra in the bank to snag a rider that you need before someone else does. Let's say ike a new leadout specialist or something. Having a big budget sprinter on your team is worthless unless you can get rider X who is young, fast, and undervalued at the moment.

John Swanson
And Bruyneel confirmed it on Twitter;


Cheque mate
 
This is a British team," said Brailsford. "We are going out there to represent Britain and we needed a British leader. Bradley was the obvious candidate.

TEAM SKY'S BRITISH RIDERS
Bradley Wiggins
Geraint Thomas
Peter Kennaugh
Steve Cummings
Russell Downing
Chris Froome
Ian Stannard
Ben Swift

"Getting him in was a great achievement and, like him, we feel this is where he belongs."
Aside from Wiggins, Geraint Thomas and Peter Kennaugh are both bright British hopes for the future,

Oh this is good. Reeaaaal good. :D
 
Re:

Bronstein said:
From Froome's autobiography:
I love these sentences where he attempts to rewrite history to try to convince us that the engine was there all along:

"On my good days I was doing what barely anybody else in the team could do. On my bad days, unfortunately, the same could be said."

Those good days must have only come in training, because nothing he did during actual races indicated that he was anything other than a below average member of the team. Also, fact of the matter is, after his transformation even his worst days are better than anything he showed during races in his pre-transformation days.

Nice try there, Chris, but you're not fooling anyone.
 
Re: Re:

The Hitch said:
thehog said:
ScienceIsCool said:
rick james said:
guess work on your part


and how could he offer Froome to Trek when he isn't under contract with sky next year....Christ on a bike you lot just don't get it
Unless you're at the top of the sport, you're not sorting through contract offers...

You get shopped to a team? You rejoice that you don't have to spend months wondering if you're still going to be a pro cyclist next year. If they bought your contract, they obviously want to extend.

And it doesn't have to be a straight up swap of riders. Clearing space on your roster early means you can have a bit extra in the bank to snag a rider that you need before someone else does. Let's say ike a new leadout specialist or something. Having a big budget sprinter on your team is worthless unless you can get rider X who is young, fast, and undervalued at the moment.

John Swanson
And Bruyneel confirmed it on Twitter;


Cheque mate
what the hell are you talking about? I never said it wasn't true, I said it was stupid on sky part to try and offload a rider to another team when he was out of contact anyway and the riders future wasn't sky's problem ...what is hard to understand about that?
 
May 26, 2010
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Re: Re:

rick james said:
red_flanders said:
Oh he's fooled plenty of people.
yip if only the world of sport had their eyes open, the sense of superiority is strong
the sense of superiority is strong, yeah from the likes of Sky and Froome thinking people are stupid.

But as Red says, some are fooled, ey rick?
 
Re: Re:

Benotti69 said:
rick james said:
red_flanders said:
Oh he's fooled plenty of people.
yip if only the world of sport had their eyes open, the sense of superiority is strong
the sense of superiority is strong, yeah from the likes of Sky and Froome thinking people are stupid.

But as Red says, some are fooled, ey rick?
if said before for all I know froome and sky are doping,we don't know one way or the other but I know that you know as much as me..and that must really get to you
 
Re: Re:

rick james said:
Benotti69 said:
rick james said:
red_flanders said:
Oh he's fooled plenty of people.
yip if only the world of sport had their eyes open, the sense of superiority is strong
the sense of superiority is strong, yeah from the likes of Sky and Froome thinking people are stupid.

But as Red says, some are fooled, ey rick?
if said before for all I know froome and sky are doping,we don't know one way or the other but I know that you know as much as me..and that must really get to you
c'mon rick...don't give scotland a bad name...the scottish enlightenment was a while ago...be enlightened....
 

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