Teams & Riders Froome Talk Only

[yaco]

Re: Re:

Going to be awkward come july - Froome puffing his way up a big climb, leaving the rest in the dust.

I like how they call it (inhalor) the transporter. The double meaning is perfect for the moment.

He won't be there in july, this is a given. Aso can't afford to have him on the race, hearing endless boos along the road, being thrown piss at and basically putting all the other riders in danger because there is the potential for "fans" to throw harder stuff at him or even assault him. Just a god awful mess ASO will want to avoid at all costs.

I think that depends how much Froom, Sky and the lawyers can muddy the waters.
Make the case super complicated, long dragging and about his human right to protect his health.

The french might throw piss, but the reaction so far hasnt been fury. No one is surprised.

Reckon VEIJ is on the money with his post - Froome will be accepted fine in the Giro or the Vuelta as there is a different mentality, compared to the French - The TDF will be perilous for Froome.

 

[mrhender]

Re: Re:

Going to be awkward come july - Froome puffing his way up a big climb, leaving the rest in the dust.

I like how they call it (inhalor) the transporter. The double meaning is perfect for the moment.

He won't be there in july, this is a given. Aso can't afford to have him on the race, hearing endless boos along the road, being thrown piss at and basically putting all the other riders in danger because there is the potential for "fans" to throw harder stuff at him or even assault him. Just a god awful mess ASO will want to avoid at all costs.

I think that depends how much Froom, Sky and the lawyers can muddy the waters.
Make the case super complicated, long dragging and about his human right to protect his health.

The french might throw piss, but the reaction so far hasnt been fury. No one is surprised.

Reckon VEIJ is on the money with his post - Froome will be accepted fine in the Giro or the Vuelta as there is a different mentality, compared to the French - The TDF will be perilous for Froome.

Perhaps. We shall see.

At this rate, the skeletons are sprinting out the closet for Sky, so who knows what next year will bring.

 

[Pantani Attacks]

Re:

I have a serious dilemma.

I picked Froome in my fantasy Vuelta team, I am not proud of this but I needed the points . I ended up finishing 2nd in my club's Vuelta fantasy league and got a small prize for that. I have a few questions I would like your opinions on:

1. Do I have to give that prize back?
2. Are the points I got from Froome before Stage 18 valid or should I have got no points for him for the entire race?
3. After answering question number 2, would anyone be willing to recalculate the points for the entire league to see who rightfully finished 1st, 2nd & 3rd.
4. If I sent the small prize to Nibali, would that absolve me of my guilt? Nibali could always send me back the prize if it was found out he was also doping.

You're fine. All bets have been settled regards to the Vuelta, as will a fantasy league which means much much less in the grand scheme of things.

 

[Saint Unix]

Just seeing the BBC website and a reminder about SPOTY. It struck me that the British public have a mischievous sense of humour and an unpredictable track record when it comes to public votes in recent times.

What do the BBC do if he goes and wins this thing :lol:

Froome should be disqualified from Sports Personality of the Year on the basis that he doesn't have one.

 

[veji11]

Re: Re:

Going to be awkward come july - Froome puffing his way up a big climb, leaving the rest in the dust.

I like how they call it (inhalor) the transporter. The double meaning is perfect for the moment.

He won't be there in july, this is a given. Aso can't afford to have him on the race, hearing endless boos along the road, being thrown piss at and basically putting all the other riders in danger because there is the potential for "fans" to throw harder stuff at him or even assault him. Just a god awful mess ASO will want to avoid at all costs.

I think that depends how much Froom, Sky and the lawyers can muddy the waters.
Make the case super complicated, long dragging and about his human right to protect his health.

The french might throw piss, but the reaction so far hasnt been fury. No one is surprised.

Reckon VEIJ is on the money with his post - Froome will be accepted fine in the Giro or the Vuelta as there is a different mentality, compared to the French - The TDF will be perilous for Froome.

The Vuelta nor the Giro have had to contend with the Armstron trauma, nor have had to contend with the full obliteration unleashed by a fully stacked Sky team. No really on the Tour de France this would not fly at all. Can you imagine the guy going for a 5th win in that context ? ASO would rather go to war with the UCI and others rather than let it happen. It won't happen.

 

[ruamruam]

Re: Re:

I have a serious dilemma.

I picked Froome in my fantasy Vuelta team, I am not proud of this but I needed the points . I ended up finishing 2nd in my club's Vuelta fantasy league and got a small prize for that. I have a few questions I would like your opinions on:

1. Do I have to give that prize back?
2. Are the points I got from Froome before Stage 18 valid or should I have got no points for him for the entire race?
3. After answering question number 2, would anyone be willing to recalculate the points for the entire league to see who rightfully finished 1st, 2nd & 3rd.
4. If I sent the small prize to Nibali, would that absolve me of my guilt? Nibali could always send me back the prize if it was found out he was also doping.

You're fine. All bets have been settled regards to the Vuelta, as will a fantasy league which means much much less in the grand scheme of things.

So I will just have to live with this stain on my character for the rest of my life?

 

[red_flanders]

...post which was reported as offensive by a non-French member, earning its author a warning.

Not surprising since the sarcasm was aimed at the brits.

 

[LaFlorecita]

Re:

If Froome is smart he will negotiate for a retroactive 2016-2017 ban, which means losing the double and the runner-up finish in the 2016 Vuelta. Painful, but better to cut the losses short instead of being Armstronged.

He then misses the Giro and the Tour, and makes a comeback in the Vuelta. He will gain a lot of sympathy and public support while keeping 3 Tour titles.

Let's not forget that Contador was considered to be a heel before missing time due to a ban.

Wait what why would he ever lose any results from before the Vuelta? That's not how backdated bans work.
And I don't think Contador was nearly as disliked at that point as Froome is right now.

 

[brownbobby]

Re:

You have to look at the bigger picture too. Losing a case is bad but the bigger goal is to protect the client's public brand. Contador's brand and public image improved because he was actually stripped of two Grand Tours. Sharapova received mostly sympathy for her ban and was welcomed back to the sport with open arms. Their long-term legacy is secure and they will continue to be loved by fans and generate tons of income through their branding.

For this reason I think Froome will accept a retroactive ban that includes the loss of two Grand Tours. Anything less than that will damage his legacy in my opinion.

I think Sharapova has a few things going for her aesthetically that made people a bit more sympathetic towards her than they might be for our man

 

[jmdirt]

Re:

You have to look at the bigger picture too. Losing a case is bad but the bigger goal is to protect the client's public brand. Contador's brand and public image improved because he was actually stripped of two Grand Tours. Sharapova received mostly sympathy for her ban and was welcomed back to the sport with open arms. Their long-term legacy is secure and they will continue to be loved by fans and generate tons of income through their branding.

For this reason I think Froome will accept a retroactive ban that includes the loss of two Grand Tours. Anything less than that will damage his legacy in my opinion.

HUH? His jacked test result is from the Vuelta, how does that affect previous races? While we can suspect that he was doing the same at TdF, there is no evidence.

 

[Ironhead Slim]

Re: Re:

Going to be awkward come july - Froome puffing his way up a big climb, leaving the rest in the dust.

I like how they call it (inhalor) the transporter. The double meaning is perfect for the moment.

He won't be there in july, this is a given. Aso can't afford to have him on the race, hearing endless boos along the road, being thrown piss at and basically putting all the other riders in danger because there is the potential for "fans" to throw harder stuff at him or even assault him. Just a god awful mess ASO will want to avoid at all costs.

I think that depends how much Froom, Sky and the lawyers can muddy the waters.
Make the case super complicated, long dragging and about his human right to protect his health.

The french might throw piss, but the reaction so far hasnt been fury. No one is surprised.

Of course the reaction now is not fury. But if he is given a complete pass...

 

[brownbobby]

Re: Re:

[
Hope that lawyers cheap. From what I can see there that guys success rate is less than 50%.

Considering the cases any success at all would be noteworthy. Scoff about it all we might (it's delicously funny for sure), the guy is a very good lawyer who had some landmark cases.

And considering, I have no problems whatsoever with a lawyer like him. It's a necessary thing and however I might think/feel about it, in any case on whatever grounds, a defendant should be able to be defended by the best lawyers.

You're right, I was just being facetious, carried away in the moment.

I'm fully au fait with this guys rep.

You're correct, everyone has the right to be defended by the best lawyers, unfortunately only a privileged few can actually afford to pay for those best lawyers to defend them

 

[bigcog]

As it turns out, Swart measured Froome’s hydration, “sweat rate” during his GSK testing. It indicates that Froome doesn’t suffer from dehydration, even in humid conditions. Thus any claims of dehydration at the Vuelta in 20c heat is most likely BS.

Apparently, they will be able to tell from his urine sample whether he was dehydrated or not so that argument should be clear cut one way or the other.

 

[thehog]

As it turns out, Swart measured Froome’s hydration, “sweat rate” during his GSK testing. It indicates that Froome doesn’t suffer from dehydration, even in humid conditions. Thus any claims of dehydration at the Vuelta in 20c heat is most likely BS.

Apparently, they will be able to tell from his urine sample whether he was dehydrated or not so that argument should be clear cut one way or the other.

A blood test is more common but in theory, yes.

 

[staubsauger]

If Froome gets a free walk for the same offense that Ulissi and Petacchi served a 9 month respectively 6 months ban for, some angry Frenchman or Italian is gonna kick that *********** [edited by mod] of his bike come May or July. No doubt about that. He should better realize that himself and get some sort of Alex Zülle deal as soon as possible and target the 2018 Vuelta!

 

[bigcog]

Re: Re:

If Froome is smart he will negotiate for a retroactive 2016-2017 ban, which means losing the double and the runner-up finish in the 2016 Vuelta. Painful, but better to cut the losses short instead of being Armstronged.

He then misses the Giro and the Tour, and makes a comeback in the Vuelta. He will gain a lot of sympathy and public support while keeping 3 Tour titles.

Let's not forget that Contador was considered to be a heel before missing time due to a ban.

Wait what why would he ever lose any results from before the Vuelta? That's not how backdated bans work.
And I don't think Contador was nearly as disliked at that point as Froome is right now.

He won't take a retrospective ban or be offered one that covers the tdf, he's had no dodgy test results for it and why would he take it, why lose a tdf when it's open to debate whether he could win another in any case, he's getting older and it would make him look even more suspect.

 

[Tonton]

Re: Re:

Going to be awkward come july - Froome puffing his way up a big climb, leaving the rest in the dust.

I like how they call it (inhalor) the transporter. The double meaning is perfect for the moment.

He won't be there in july, this is a given. Aso can't afford to have him on the race, hearing endless boos along the road, being thrown piss at and basically putting all the other riders in danger because there is the potential for "fans" to throw harder stuff at him or even assault him. Just a god awful mess ASO will want to avoid at all costs.

I think that depends how much Froom, Sky and the lawyers can muddy the waters.
Make the case super complicated, long dragging and about his human right to protect his health.

The french might throw piss, but the reaction so far hasnt been fury. No one is surprised.

That's because the French people are still mourning the passing of (RIP) Johnny Hallyday. They're not ready to mourn the passing of the Tour de France just yet. What I mean by that is that the July "fans", the ones to worry about, aren't too active at this time of the year (although the number of comments in l'Equipe is huge right now). I don't see Froome at Le Tour...not safe. Forget about the team presentation. On the road, all it takes is one very upset spectator.

 

[hrotha]

Re: Re:

If Froome is smart he will negotiate for a retroactive 2016-2017 ban, which means losing the double and the runner-up finish in the 2016 Vuelta. Painful, but better to cut the losses short instead of being Armstronged.

He then misses the Giro and the Tour, and makes a comeback in the Vuelta. He will gain a lot of sympathy and public support while keeping 3 Tour titles.

Let's not forget that Contador was considered to be a heel before missing time due to a ban.

Wait what why would he ever lose any results from before the Vuelta? That's not how backdated bans work.

Best course of action for Froome would be to go for a retroactive 1993-1994 ban.

 

[deValtos]

Re:

If Froome gets a free walk for the same offense that Ulissi and Petacchi served a 9 month respectively 6 months ban for, some angry Frenchman or Italian is gonna kick that whoremonger of his bike come May or July. No doubt about that. He should better realize that himself and get some sort of Alex Zülle deal as soon as possible and target the 2018 Vuelta!

Interestingly in both cases the verdict was that both riders were thought not to be cheating but sanctioned regardless.

 

[brownbobby]

Re: Re:

If Froome is smart he will negotiate for a retroactive 2016-2017 ban, which means losing the double and the runner-up finish in the 2016 Vuelta. Painful, but better to cut the losses short instead of being Armstronged.

He then misses the Giro and the Tour, and makes a comeback in the Vuelta. He will gain a lot of sympathy and public support while keeping 3 Tour titles.

Let's not forget that Contador was considered to be a heel before missing time due to a ban.

Wait what why would he ever lose any results from before the Vuelta? That's not how backdated bans work.

Best course of action for Froome would be to go for a retroactive 1993-1994 ban.

:lol: :lol: :lol:

 

[mrhender]

Re: Re:

Going to be awkward come july - Froome puffing his way up a big climb, leaving the rest in the dust.

I like how they call it (inhalor) the transporter. The double meaning is perfect for the moment.

He won't be there in july, this is a given. Aso can't afford to have him on the race, hearing endless boos along the road, being thrown piss at and basically putting all the other riders in danger because there is the potential for "fans" to throw harder stuff at him or even assault him. Just a god awful mess ASO will want to avoid at all costs.

I think that depends how much Froom, Sky and the lawyers can muddy the waters.
Make the case super complicated, long dragging and about his human right to protect his health.

The french might throw piss, but the reaction so far hasnt been fury. No one is surprised.

That's because the French people are still mourning the passing of (RIP) Johnny Hallyday. They're not ready to mourn the passing of the Tour de France just yet. What I mean by that is that the July "fans", the ones to worry about, aren't too active at this time of the year (although the number of comments in l'Equipe is huge right now). I don't see Froome at Le Tour...not safe. Forget about the team presentation. On the road, all it takes is one very upset spectator.

I get what your saying. Just not so sure about it.

Le Tour is over 6 months away. If the case is still not closed, and/or the whole thing has resemblance of the kreuziger proceedings then i wouldn't put it past Froome to risk a martyrdom for asthma at Le Tour.

As for ASO exclusion, if that happens i belive it wont be above board (official).

And perhaps Teamsky is running low on leverage at that time to counter such action.

Edit: i guess my belief is, that unless ASO can be sure Froome isnt going to walk, then can they risk exclusion of the most winning rider since indurain. With the risk of him being cleared?

Froome has the ressources the fight this tooth and nails for a long time, before making any potential deals.

 

[pastronef]

Re:

You have to look at the bigger picture too. Losing a case is bad but the bigger goal is to protect the client's public brand. Contador's brand and public image improved because he was actually stripped of two Grand Tours. Sharapova received mostly sympathy for her ban and was welcomed back to the sport with open arms. Their long-term legacy is secure and they will continue to be loved by fans and generate tons of income through their branding.

For this reason I think Froome will accept a retroactive ban that includes the loss of two Grand Tours. Anything less than that will damage his legacy in my opinion.

why should he lose the 2017 Tour? the test was at the Vuelta.

 

[brownbobby]

Re: Re:

Going to be awkward come july - Froome puffing his way up a big climb, leaving the rest in the dust.

I like how they call it (inhalor) the transporter. The double meaning is perfect for the moment.

He won't be there in july, this is a given. Aso can't afford to have him on the race, hearing endless boos along the road, being thrown piss at and basically putting all the other riders in danger because there is the potential for "fans" to throw harder stuff at him or even assault him. Just a god awful mess ASO will want to avoid at all costs.

I think that depends how much Froom, Sky and the lawyers can muddy the waters.
Make the case super complicated, long dragging and about his human right to protect his health.

The french might throw piss, but the reaction so far hasnt been fury. No one is surprised.

That's because the French people are still mourning the passing of (RIP) Johnny Hallyday. They're not ready to mourn the passing of the Tour de France just yet. What I mean by that is that the July "fans", the ones to worry about, aren't too active at this time of the year (although the number of comments in l'Equipe is huge right now). I don't see Froome at Le Tour...not safe. Forget about the team presentation. On the road, all it takes is one very upset spectator.

I get what your saying. Just not so sure about it.

Le Tour is over 6 months away. If the case is still not closed, and/or the whole thing has resemblance of the kreuziger proceedings then i wouldn't put it past Froome to risk a martyrdom for asthma at Le Tour.

As for ASO exclusion, if that happens i belive it wont be above board (official).

And perhaps Teamsky is running low on leverage at that time to counter such action.

Edit: i guess my belief is, that unless ASO can be sure Froome isnt going to walk, then can they risk exclusion of the most winning rider since indurain. With the risk of him being cleared?

Froome has the ressources the fight this tooth and nails for a long time, before making any potential deals.

I don't think Aso have the power to ban anyone do they?

Behind the scenes deals maybe, but officially only UCI/Wada have this power I would think?

Plus, I think you overestimate the anger and danger posed by 'the French. Some spectators booed him last year because they were sure he was doping. Some will boo him this year because they are sure he is doping. Nothing much has changed in this regard.

It's still only sport and he's the pantomime villain.

 

[DanielSong39]

The difference is that this year he has been caught doping.

At this point I'm trying think of the best ways to protect his legacy, reputation, and wealth. He'll go from villain to sympathetic hero if he accepts some kind of ban that also includes the loss of a Grand Tour or two. It certainly did wonders for Contador.

 

[brownbobby]

Re:

The difference is that this year he has been caught doping.

At this point I'm trying think of the best ways to protect his legacy, reputation, and wealth. He'll go from villain to sympathetic hero if he accepts some kind of ban that also includes the loss of a Grand Tour or two. It certainly did wonders for Contador.

I can see where yours coming from on the reputation but there seems to be some suggestion that he needs to miss the tour for his own protection from those beastly French. That's just nonsense, don't believe everything you read in the media.

I don't think the positive test makes one bit of difference in this regard. Those who disliked him before will continue to do so, they thought they knew he was doping already. Those who support him will continue to do so along the lines of 'it's only asthma meds, a mistake, not real doping'

Oh, and just to repeat what others have said. He loses one grand tour. He's only ever failed a test at one GT. No legal means by which he could possibly lose another. You don't just offer to give GT results away!