Teams & Riders Froome Talk Only

[53*11]

I really don't understand this, does he not care that a lot of cycling fans think he shouldn't be racing till the case is resolved? This is not a GT that adds to his legacy, something he might feel is worth the risk of later having results stripped. It's only for training, why piss off people just for that? Either he is tone deaf, in major denial, or is very confident he's going to skate.

He's going to brazen it out. Career (stardom/riches at least) is likely over, and he knows it. That Giro start fee is the last big payday. Gotta act in public like everything is normal, and force his way into the Giro to collect the cash. I'd guess that behind closed doors they are threatening all kinds of lawsuits if anyone suspends him or doesn't let him start the Giro while the process is still ongoing. Drag the whole thing out so no official decision can be made and collect that appearance fee.

That Sky hasn't suspended him is telling on many levels. Brailsfraud could've just dumped the troublesome Dawg and moved on ahead with Geeeezus, Poels, etc. Except he can't - for many reasons.

The team has a new owner in the pipeline in Disney, after Armstrong if Froome isn't cleared then Brailsford has two options and suspending/sacking Froome isn't one of them.

1) Do everything in his power to help clear his name.

2) Have him and the rest of Sky win as much as possible to try and attract buyers.

Well that's the grubby unethical analysis, thanks for that

But if Froome remains banned after the CAS appeal the sacking option will be on the table and the clear his name option will be off the table. Sorry to be the one to break that bad news to you

And indeed suspect Brailsfraud might have drafted the Dawg Sacked press release already it's all about plausible deniability and keeping the knighthood for him the list of people he's thrown under the bus just keeps getting longer no reason why he wouldn't add Froome to the list

Btw it's hard to imagine anyone would buy the team with Brailsfraud still at the helm but you never know maybe the ever deluded fanboys will get a kickstarter campaign going better start saving your pennies

lol

 

[MatParker117]

I really don't understand this, does he not care that a lot of cycling fans think he shouldn't be racing till the case is resolved? This is not a GT that adds to his legacy, something he might feel is worth the risk of later having results stripped. It's only for training, why piss off people just for that? Either he is tone deaf, in major denial, or is very confident he's going to skate.

He's going to brazen it out. Career (stardom/riches at least) is likely over, and he knows it. That Giro start fee is the last big payday. Gotta act in public like everything is normal, and force his way into the Giro to collect the cash. I'd guess that behind closed doors they are threatening all kinds of lawsuits if anyone suspends him or doesn't let him start the Giro while the process is still ongoing. Drag the whole thing out so no official decision can be made and collect that appearance fee.

That Sky hasn't suspended him is telling on many levels. Brailsfraud could've just dumped the troublesome Dawg and moved on ahead with Geeeezus, Poels, etc. Except he can't - for many reasons.

The team has a new owner in the pipeline in Disney, after Armstrong if Froome isn't cleared then Brailsford has two options and suspending/sacking Froome isn't one of them.

1) Do everything in his power to help clear his name.

2) Have him and the rest of Sky win as much as possible to try and attract buyers.

Well that's the grubby unethical analysis, thanks for that

But if Froome remains banned after the CAS appeal the sacking option will be on the table and the clear his name option will be off the table. Sorry to be the one to break that bad news to you

And indeed suspect Brailsfraud might have drafted the Dawg Sacked press release already it's all about plausible deniability and keeping the knighthood for him the list of people he's thrown under the bus just keeps getting longer no reason why he wouldn't add Froome to the list

Btw it's hard to imagine anyone would buy the team with Brailsfraud still at the helm but you never know maybe the ever deluded fanboys will get a kickstarter campaign going better start saving your pennies

I was speaking in the hear and now, probably should have many that clearer. As for buyers, wouldn't rule out L Catterton with Sky becoming the Pinarello Factory team or HSBC. Disney wouldn't want much for it, probably £1 for the holding company with sufficient sponsorship guarantees.

 

[Parker]

I was speaking in the hear and now, probably should have many that clearer. As for buyers, wouldn't rule out L Catterton with Sky becoming the Pinarello Factory team or HSBC. Disney wouldn't want much for it, probably £1 for the holding company with sufficient sponsorship guarantees.

I doubt Disney give a toss about the team one way or another. They're probably unaware there is a team - it's a small drop in the marketing budget.

 

[yaco]

The rules allow Froome to ride, so there is little point in whinging.

 

[ScienceIsCool]

I was speaking in the hear and now, probably should have many that clearer. As for buyers, wouldn't rule out L Catterton with Sky becoming the Pinarello Factory team or HSBC. Disney wouldn't want much for it, probably £1 for the holding company with sufficient sponsorship guarantees.

I doubt Disney give a toss about the team one way or another. They're probably unaware there is a team - it's a small drop in the marketing budget.

My personal experiences with mergers has been a bit uglier. The first months are filed with jargon about capturing synergies and integrating cultures. What this really means is: how much can we throw overboard in the first quarter to show that this was a good idea? Cue the layoffs and budget cuts. And it makes partial sense. After a merger you don't need two full-blown accounting or marketing departments. My guess is that the cycling team would be an easy one to chuck in the bin to brighten up the ledgers a bit.

John Swanson

 

[Alexandre B.]

Re:

The rules allow Froome to ride, so there is little point in whinging.

His previous declarations regarding the topic of suspicion in cycling speak for themselves.

 

[hfer07]

Froome ready to smash ........ NOT

 

[Põhja Konn]

So Froome himself officially confirmes that those who said he was a fake self-serving hypocrite and blatant doper were right all along. Good to know.

 

[TourOfSardinia]

Refreshing that Team Sky on Twitter don't censor criticism.
Michelle not in control freak mode here:

https://twitter.com/TeamSky/status/960454743847038976

 

[MatParker117]

Re:

Refreshing that Team Sky on Twitter don't censor criticism.
Michelle not in control freak mode here:

https://twitter.com/TeamSky/status/960454743847038976

Difference between personal accounts and corporate.

 

[Wiggo's Package]

I really don't understand this, does he not care that a lot of cycling fans think he shouldn't be racing till the case is resolved? This is not a GT that adds to his legacy, something he might feel is worth the risk of later having results stripped. It's only for training, why piss off people just for that? Either he is tone deaf, in major denial, or is very confident he's going to skate.

He's going to brazen it out. Career (stardom/riches at least) is likely over, and he knows it. That Giro start fee is the last big payday. Gotta act in public like everything is normal, and force his way into the Giro to collect the cash. I'd guess that behind closed doors they are threatening all kinds of lawsuits if anyone suspends him or doesn't let him start the Giro while the process is still ongoing. Drag the whole thing out so no official decision can be made and collect that appearance fee.

That Sky hasn't suspended him is telling on many levels. Brailsfraud could've just dumped the troublesome Dawg and moved on ahead with Geeeezus, Poels, etc. Except he can't - for many reasons.

The team has a new owner in the pipeline in Disney, after Armstrong if Froome isn't cleared then Brailsford has two options and suspending/sacking Froome isn't one of them.

1) Do everything in his power to help clear his name.

2) Have him and the rest of Sky win as much as possible to try and attract buyers.

Well that's the grubby unethical analysis, thanks for that

But if Froome remains banned after the CAS appeal the sacking option will be on the table and the clear his name option will be off the table. Sorry to be the one to break that bad news to you

And indeed suspect Brailsfraud might have drafted the Dawg Sacked press release already it's all about plausible deniability and keeping the knighthood for him the list of people he's thrown under the bus just keeps getting longer no reason why he wouldn't add Froome to the list

Btw it's hard to imagine anyone would buy the team with Brailsfraud still at the helm but you never know maybe the ever deluded fanboys will get a kickstarter campaign going better start saving your pennies

I was speaking in the hear and now, probably should have many that clearer. As for buyers, wouldn't rule out L Catterton with Sky becoming the Pinarello Factory team or HSBC. Disney wouldn't want much for it, probably £1 for the holding company with sufficient sponsorship guarantees.

I watched the new Netflix documentary Dirty Money about HSBC today

For HSBC teaming up with an imploding Team Sky would probably improve their reputation Brailsfraud and Froome are amateurs compared to the Mexican cartels and those Islamist terrorists

 

[El Pistolero]

Looking forward to the crowd's reaction to Froome, especially in France.

 

[bigcog]

Re:

Looking forward to the crowd's reaction to Froome, especially in France.

If this is still undecided I think he will be ok in Spain and Italy. France who knows, I think the ASO will try to stop him riding if it is still ongoing in any case.

 

[yaco]

Re: Re:

Looking forward to the crowd's reaction to Froome, especially in France.

If this is still undecided I think he will be ok in Spain and Italy. France who knows, I think the ASO will try to stop him riding if it is still ongoing in any case.

Agree 100% - Froome will be fine in Italy and Spain, but France is a different question.

 

[El Pistolero]

Re: Re:

Looking forward to the crowd's reaction to Froome, especially in France.

If this is still undecided I think he will be ok in Spain and Italy. France who knows, I think the ASO will try to stop him riding if it is still ongoing in any case.

Spain calls in the national guard troops as security for the first stage
http://www.teleprensa.com/malaga/mas-de-145-efectivos-trabajaran-por-la-seguridad-de-la-vuelta-a-andalucia-en-su-primera-etapa.html

Actually I don't know if it's unusual to have 150 soldiers, officers, and traffic cops for a 200-kilometer Spanish race stage, have never thought about it.

Israel will be super-high security just for the protection of the riders, and Froome will be probably be banned before the Giro anyway, if the proceedings of the Anti-Doping Tribunal have already been opened.
One interpretation of the situation right now is: "a game of chicken" with Vegni, to try to stall the UCI proceedings long enough that Vegni would have to decide himself that Froome can't start the Giro.
UCI will probably defuse that head-on conflict, before May, by banning Froome outright

France will be moot subject for the same reason, it shouldn't be necessary for the GT organizers to have to disinvite Froome

Froome should pay for them if they're there for him.

 

[CTQ]

Re: Re:

Looking forward to the crowd's reaction to Froome, especially in France.

If this is still undecided I think he will be ok in Spain and Italy. France who knows, I think the ASO will try to stop him riding if it is still ongoing in any case.

Spain calls in the national guard troops as security for the first stage
http://www.teleprensa.com/malaga/mas-de-145-efectivos-trabajaran-por-la-seguridad-de-la-vuelta-a-andalucia-en-su-primera-etapa.html

Actually I don't know if it's unusual to have 150 soldiers, officers, and traffic cops for a 200-kilometer Spanish race stage, have never thought about it.



Israel will be super-high security just for the protection of the riders, and Froome will be probably be banned before the Giro anyway, if the proceedings of the Anti-Doping Tribunal have already been opened.
One interpretation of the situation right now is: "a game of chicken" with Vegni, to try to stall the UCI proceedings long enough that Vegni would have to decide himself that Froome can't start the Giro.
UCI will probably defuse that head-on conflict, before May, by banning Froome outright




France will be moot subject for the same reason, it shouldn't be necessary for the GT organizers to have to disinvite Froome

It may not have any connection with Froome. Look at the news about Spain. The weather conditions are extreme, even in Andalusia. And it will be again this week. Earlier in the year, they had to ask for help from the army after heavy snowfall. EDIT: and the most important: don't forget after Barcelona, Daesh threatens Spain: "Andalusia will return to the Caliphate"

 

[WheelofGear]

I've always wondered why the other riders aren't standing up to Sky. They could refuse to race against Froome or speak up loudly against him instead of getting their ass kicked all the time. They know they can't beat him on the bike.

But of course we know why. They are all on the juice too. Froome and Brailsford have a lot of *** on Nibali, Quintana, Aru and co. The entire cycling structure is a house of cards. If Froome goes down, they will all go down. The only survivors will be a couple of random lead-out men.

 

[Beech Mtn]

Re:

I've always wondered why the other riders aren't standing up to Sky. They could refuse to race against Froome or speak up loudly against him instead of getting their *** kicked all the time. They know they can't beat him on the bike.

But of course we know why. They are all on the juice too. Froome and Brailsford have a lot of **** on Nibali, Quintana, Aru and co. The entire cycling structure is a house of cards. If Froome goes down, they will all go down. The only survivors will be a couple of random lead-out men.

Plus Sky are a rich team, and riders may want a contract with them some day. I think in general a lot of riders tend not to want to burn bridges - you don't know when you might find yourself out of a job and looking for a team.

 

[ScienceIsCool]

Re:

I've always wondered why the other riders aren't standing up to Sky. They could refuse to race against Froome or speak up loudly against him instead of getting their *** kicked all the time. They know they can't beat him on the bike.

But of course we know why. They are all on the juice too. Froome and Brailsford have a lot of **** on Nibali, Quintana, Aru and co. The entire cycling structure is a house of cards. If Froome goes down, they will all go down. The only survivors will be a couple of random lead-out men.

The overwhelming majority of pro riders are young guys in their 20's fighting for a contract, barely making a decent wage. Just like Froome was pre-transformation. Lots of them don't have prospects outside the sport. Not sure getting political and going all Kaepernick is healthy, ya know? As in career killer.

And the guys at the top, why would they jeopardize a good thing? Didn't win the Tour? Sucks. But those millions sure are comforting on the cold winter nights. Especially since a cyclists career has a definite shelf life, unless you're Horner.

The clean/dirty question really doesn't factor into this calculus.

And if (ha ha) management is wise to how things work, they can manipulate everything to their advantage. That's why it took so long for "Friends don't let friends ride for Slipstream" t-shirts to appear. It's why characters like Sutton can thrive. Et cetera.

John Swanson

 

[Merckx index]

As has been discussed here and in the salbutamol thread, there doesn't seem to be any public evidence that Froome is really an asthmatic (other than the assurance provided by a doctor), or that he took salbutamol prior to 2014, when he was seen with an inhaler and freely admitted to using the drug. He never mentioned it in his book, and his former manager at Barloworld couldn't confirm it. Also, something I just realized, is that when confronted with TUEs for prednisolone in 2013 and 2014, as revealed by the Fancy Bears hack of the WADA database, he responded:

In nine years as a professional I’ve twice required a TUE for exacerbated asthma; the last time was in 2014.

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2016/sep/15/fancy-bears-chris-froome-bradley-wiggins-tues-cycling

This is significant because a TUE was required for salbutamol prior to 2010. So Froome seems to be denying that he took salbutamol back then, though I suppose a lawyer could quibble over the qualifier "exacerbated", that maybe he took salbutamol for asthma that was not exacerbated. But in that vein, it's also interesting that while Froome's two TUEs for 2014--dated around the time he first told the media he took salbutamol for asthma--were for treatment of, among other things, EIB, or exercise-induced bronchial exacerbation, which implies asthma, no such indications appear on his 2013 TUE. One interpretation of this is that when he applied for the TUEs in 2014, he emphasized that he suffered from asthma, whereas in 2013 he didn't.

In any case, Fancy Bears, while digging up those TUEs for Froome's use of prednisolone (three of them, not two, according to their website), have never mentioned finding any TUEs for salbutamol. The problem is that Froome moved from Barloworld to Sky in 2010, so it wasn't clear to me whether his records would be in the WADA database before then.

But now I've finally tracked down an article that makes it clear not only that Barloworld riders were indeed in WADA's database, but that FB's hacks included this information:

The 'Fancy Bears' hacking group released another round of medical information from the World Anti Doping Agency (WADA) databases on Friday, with Fabian Cancellara, Jacob Fuglsang, and Stephen Cummings the latest cyclists to become embroiled in the affair.

Stephen Cummings’ TUE is for the asthma drug Salbutamol and was issued on December 10 2008, when the British rider was at Barloworld. Salbutamol is currently permitted without a TUE up to a certain threshold, but in 2008 it was banned outright, hence Cummings’ TUE for 200 micrograms.

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/cancellara-cummings-fuglsang-featured-in-latest-fancy-bears-leak/

Cummings of course was Froome's teammate at Barloworld, and even moved to Sky with him in 2010. According to the document provided by FB, the 200 ug Cummings was allowed was "as needed", so apparently there was no limit on the amount he could inhale.

I don't know how thorough FB's hacks are, but I would think that if Froome had another TUE in the database that they hadn't already reported on, they would find it and publicize it. They've already commented on the abuse of salbutamol TUEs in general, and Wiggins, who also claims to be asthmatic, was revealed by FB to have several TUEs for salbutamol. I've also noted Froome's own words, which seem to specifically deny that he had any TUEs prior to 2013. They've certainly been interpreted that way by the media, and he hasn't made any effort to correct them.

All that being the case, I think there's enough evidence against Froome's use of inhaled salbutamol before the transformation in 2011, if indeed not before 2014, that he should be publicly challenged to refute that conclusion. Because if he didn't have a TUE for asthma in 2009 and before, he was either lying when he said he had used an inhaler for most of his life, or was publicly confessing to breaking the rules.

 

[MartinGT]

Re: Re:

I've always wondered why the other riders aren't standing up to Sky. They could refuse to race against Froome or speak up loudly against him instead of getting their *** kicked all the time. They know they can't beat him on the bike.

But of course we know why. They are all on the juice too. Froome and Brailsford have a lot of **** on Nibali, Quintana, Aru and co. The entire cycling structure is a house of cards. If Froome goes down, they will all go down. The only survivors will be a couple of random lead-out men.

The overwhelming majority of pro riders are young guys in their 20's fighting for a contract, barely making a decent wage. Just like Froome was pre-transformation. Lots of them don't have prospects outside the sport. Not sure getting political and going all Kaepernick is healthy, ya know? As in career killer.

And the guys at the top, why would they jeopardize a good thing? Didn't win the Tour? Sucks. But those millions sure are comforting on the cold winter nights. Especially since a cyclists career has a definite shelf life, unless you're Horner.

The clean/dirty question really doesn't factor into this calculus.

And if (ha ha) management is wise to how things work, they can manipulate everything to their advantage. That's why it took so long for "Friends don't let friends ride for Slipstream" t-shirts to appear. It's why characters like Sutton can thrive. Et cetera.

John Swanson

Summed it up one, nice one John. It's basically this 'simple'

 

[macbindle]

As long as you view pro cycling as a circus it all makes perfect sense.

 

[Parker]

Re:

As has been discussed here and in the salbutamol thread, there doesn't seem to be any public evidence that Froome is really an asthmatic (other than the assurance provided by a doctor), or that he took salbutamol prior to 2014, when he was seen with an inhaler and freely admitted to using the drug. He never mentioned it in his book, and his former manager at Barloworld couldn't confirm it. Also, something I just realized, is that when confronted with TUEs for prednisolone in 2013 and 2014, as revealed by the Fancy Bears hack of the WADA database, he responded:

<snip>

Here's an interview after the TT at the 2008 Tour: https://youtu.be/NttM0p8Q_yU?t=255

Froome's heavy coughing clearly shows he has some breathing issue. If he DS never noticed this he can't have been paying much attention.

 

[Merckx index]

Re: Re:

Here's an interview after the TT at the 2008 Tour: https://youtu.be/NttM0p8Q_yU?t=255

Froome's heavy coughing clearly shows he has some breathing issue. If he DS never noticed this he can't have been paying much attention.

Or maybe he did pay attention, but wasn't told it was asthma. From Lowe's article:

when Froome gave a rather chesty interview following his Tour de Romandie win in 2013, Michelle Cound assured her followers that her man was fit and healthy, claiming that “hard effort and cold air always makes him cough a bit.”

Cound never mentioned the asthma that, duh, might have been a better explanation.

In fact, hard effort and cold air could indeed exacerbate asthma symptoms, but if that was the case, why not say so? And while I can think of reasons why she, they, wouldn't want to own up to it, why did Froome change his mind about making the condition public a year later?

 

[CTQ]

Re: Re:

Here's an interview after the TT at the 2008 Tour: https://youtu.be/NttM0p8Q_yU?t=255

Froome's heavy coughing clearly shows he has some breathing issue. If he DS never noticed this he can't have been paying much attention.

Or maybe he did pay attention, but wasn't told it was asthma. From Lowe's article:

when Froome gave a rather chesty interview following his Tour de Romandie win in 2013, Michelle Cound assured her followers that her man was fit and healthy, claiming that “hard effort and cold air always makes him cough a bit.”




Cound never mentioned the asthma that, duh, might have been a better explanation.

In fact, hard effort and cold air could indeed exacerbate asthma symptoms, but if that was the case, why not say so? And while I can think of reasons why she, they, wouldn't want to own up to it, why did Froome change his mind about making the condition public a year later?

analogy with David Beckham ?
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-1230404/David-Beckhams-biggest-secret-revealed-star-admits-Asthma.html
'It's never came out [until now] because I've had no reason to talk about it, but that's just me.'