GB Track Team

[Benotti69]

A quote from Brailsford himself re visits to Beijing.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/p...h-reveals-secrets-to-gbs-success-8005870.html

I'll try to get a scan of his flight tickets, hotel reference and a photos of him standing in front of the great wall with a dated newspaper each time he went.

Standing on the great wall.

It means as much as Armstrong's visit to the alp stages of the TdF in the spring.

 

[King Boonen]

David Cameron on BBC Radio:



http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2012/aug/09/david-cameron-british-cycling-france

David Cameron is a massive w****r.

 

[AcademyCC]

Standing on the great wall.

It means as much as Armstrong's visit to the alp stages of the TdF in the spring.

In front of Try the shanhaiguan entrance, it was lovely.

Was purely trying to point out the unbelievable detail he goes into. This cant be denied even if you think they are doping as well.

Difference with Armstrong is he tried to say Im out in the Alpes in spring and no-one else is which is complete crap.

 

[Markyboyzx6r]

Standing on the great wall.

It means as much as Armstrong's visit to the alp stages of the TdF in the spring.

"Beep beep beep beep"

- (c) the inbetweeners.

 

[bobbins]

In front of Try the shanhaiguan entrance, it was lovely.

Was purely trying to point out the unbelievable detail he goes into. This cant be denied even if you think they are doping as well.

Difference with Armstrong is he tried to say Im out in the Alpes in spring and no-one else is which is complete crap.

Spin, spin, spin, spin. Their wheels are UKSI with Mavic badges. I doubt that he took that many trips to china, the people who work for him may have taken that many in total but they would have known what they were looking for. Dave B isn't a coach, he's a good manager of people with a good team around him.

Have all of the previous track team pursuit teams got jobs at BC now? Rob Hayles excepted they are looking after their own well aren't they!

 

[Fearless Greg Lemond]

Was purely trying to point out the unbelievable detail he goes into. This cant be denied even if you think they are doping as well.

Why didn't those details work from 1996 onwards when he was in charge at BC? Or did he suddenly work it out just in time for Beijing?

 

[King Boonen]

Why didn't those details work from 1996 onwards when he was in charge at BC? Or did he suddenly work it out just in time for Beijing?

Maybe it took time to get the right athletes in and ready for a games?

 

[AcademyCC]

Why didn't those details work from 1996 onwards when he was in charge at BC? Or did he suddenly work it out just in time for Beijing?

Well Rome wasn't built in a day. As you said his reign and the lottery funding only began in 1996 so his first target would have been Sydney - 1 gold, 2 silver and 2 bronze. Then Athens - 2 gold, 1 silver, 1 bronze.

That a pretty good return in his first 2 Olympics IMO.

That's going from 2 bronze in Atlanta - so his methods definitely had an impact.

 

[Wallace and Gromit]

Why didn't those details work from 1996 onwards when he was in charge at BC? Or did he suddenly work it out just in time for Beijing?

If you track progress from 1996 in the OGs, there's an obvious trend:

- Sydney: Gold in the kilo; silver in the Team Sprint; bronze in the TP, 4th in the IP, contenders in the Madison

- Athens: Gold and 4th in the IP, gold in the kilo; silver in the TP; bronze in the madison

- Beijing: No need to restate what happened there on the track. There was also a massive increase in funding for "medal" sports once London was awarded the Games in 2005, to maximise the chances of some national ego-massaging foreigner-bashing in the 2012 medal table.

It takes a few years for the increased funding from the lottery to take effect, as systems and structures are developed.

 

[Fearless Greg Lemond]

Maybe it took time to get the right athletes in and ready for a games?

So you now understand 'those marginal gains' are just a smoke screen?

 

[Darryl Webster]

The transition of BC to were it is now began 91/92 when Chris Boardman went from failing to qualify at the worlds pursuit in Stuttgart to Olympic winner in 92..a jump of around 12 seconds IIRC. A jump that seems to have slipped largely under the radar. At the time it was "explained away" by his "Lotus Super Bike"...and most people fell for that , hook ,line and sinker.
They remained still relatively poorly funded until the massive increasing in funding caused by the acceptance of Peter Keens Word Class Perforfance plan proposals.

 

[King Boonen]

So you now understand 'those marginal gains' are just a smoke screen?

No. He finally had time to get things in place with a group of athletes who had gone through his program, including the marginal gains, and it paid off. They then continue to look for other areas where marginal gains can be made.

Marginal gains doesn't mean you do it and instantly get results. It can mean something that is done over a long period of time that results in a marginal game, i.e. improving athletes mental health, diet, slight changes to training etc.

There really is no evidence of doping. I'm happy to discuss it but you need more than "wink, wink, nudge, nudge" to back up your claims.

 

[Darryl Webster]

This is the period of Chris,s transition:
1990 Commonwealth Games
Bronze, 4000m Team Pursuit (with Simon Lillistone, Bryan Steel and Glen Sword)
Bronze, Team Time Trial (100km) (with Peter Longbottom, Ben Luckwell and Wayne Randle)
1991
United Kingdom British National Hill Climb Championships
United Kingdom National Amateur Track Pursuit Championship
1992
United Kingdom National Amateur Track Pursuit Championship
Olympic Games, Track Pursuit


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chris_Boardman

 

[Wallace and Gromit]

This is the period of Chris,s transition:
1990 Commonwealth Games
Bronze, 4000m Team Pursuit (with Simon Lillistone, Bryan Steel and Glen Sword)
Bronze, Team Time Trial (100km) (with Peter Longbottom, Ben Luckwell and Wayne Randle)
1991
United Kingdom British National Hill Climb Championships
United Kingdom National Amateur Track Pursuit Championship
1992
United Kingdom National Amateur Track Pursuit Championship
Olympic Games, Track Pursuit


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chris_Boardman

Out of interest, what's your view on Graeme Obree? Was it really washing machine parts that made him go quickly or something else?

 

[DirtyWorks]

Marginal gains doesn't mean you do it and instantly get results. It can mean something that is done over a long period of time that results in a marginal game, i.e. improving athletes mental health, diet, slight changes to training etc.

Or, the time it takes to work out a PED combination that two which the athlete responds. Do you see what I did there?

There really is no evidence of doping. I'm happy to discuss it but you need more than "wink, wink, nudge, nudge" to back up your claims.

There isn't material evidence of a clean team on the Men's side either. As I said earlier, the Women's case is pretty clear there isn't doping.

I think in time we'll know one way or the other because, let's face it, this is pro cycling.

 

[Darryl Webster]

Out of interest, what's your view on Graeme Obree? Was it really washing machine parts that made him go quickly or something else?

Obree is/ was the real deal..a total one of. His radical departure from conventional positions explains very clearly how his speed was achieved while his wattage remained the lowest of all hour records.
Obree on a conventional machine would never have been heard of.

I take nothing away from Obree in saying this his achievements were remarkably in the face of a great deal of ridicule .

 

[the big ring]

The transition of BC to were it is now began 91/92 when Chris Boardman went from failing to qualify at the worlds pursuit in Stuttgart to Olympic winner in 92..a jump of around 12 seconds IIRC. A jump that seems to have slipped largely under the radar. At the time it was "explained away" by his "Lotus Super Bike"...and most people fell for that , hook ,line and sinker.
They remained still relatively poorly funded until the massive increasing in funding caused by the acceptance of Peter Keens Word Class Perforfance plan proposals.

1986 Comm games IP winner: 4:44
TP: 4:27

1990 Comm games IP winner: 4:45
TP: 4:23

(ETA: Darryl - please dig out some old Cycling mags and let me know what Chris' IP time was for 1991, I cannot find any times?)

1992: Boardman rode IP @ 4:24 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cycling_at_the_1992_Summer_Olympics_–_Men's_individual_pursuit#Group_A

Looks like most of the contenders were under 4:30.

1997 Brad McGee does a 4:22...

I am trying to reconcile my fanboism with what I am reading here, but that's some significant marginal gains from 1990 to 1992.

 

[Fearless Greg Lemond]

I take nothing away from Obree in saying this his achievements were remarkably in the face of a great deal of ridicule .

Perhaps one of the last Mohicans.

Nice peace:
http://blogs.technet.com/b/ewan/archive/2007/06/19/graeme-obree-the-flying-scotsman.aspx

And beat Boardman in 1993.

He didn't even had to use marginal gains. Rejected PED's, in all a hero in my book.

 

[Darryl Webster]

1986 Comm games IP winner: 4:44
TP: 4:27



(ETA: Darryl - please dig out some old Cycling mags and let me know what Chris' IP time was for 1991, I cannot find any times?)
:

Blimy , that,l take some trawling to find. What I can tell you of hand is that in 87 aged 18 almost 19 he got his first Bronze medal in the National Champs riding against myself , his time being somewhere just inside 5 minutes. I,d won the Nat pursuit in 84 and 85, finished 2nd in 86 and in 97 decided to concentrate my efforts in the 50km points race finishing 2nd on the same ponts as the winner but losing out on first in the final sprint positions.
Chris was also a member of our winning team pursuit that year and while solid was not the strongest.
There was nothing to indicate that Chris would go on to be the rider he became though, like myself, he did win both the schoolboy 10 miles time trial championship and the Junior 25 championship.
87 TP Champs, Chris on the right .

 

[roundabout]

I think a fair few of you should read this:

http://inrng.com/2012/08/british-cycling-funding/#more-10312

France doesn't even have a heated indoor track, while GB will soon have four.

This seems a lot like hand-waving to me.

There's one in Bordeaux, but the comment by the blog guy himself hand-waves it by saying that it's not used for training.

Point is, it's there.

And then there should be another one in Grenoble. Doubt that they race 6 days there in late autumn outdoors.

So that should be at least 2.

 

[the big ring]

Blimy , that,l take some trawling to find. What I can tell you of hand is that in 87 aged 18 almost 19 he got his first Bronze medal in the National Champs riding against myself , his time being somewhere just inside 5 minutes. I,d won the Nat pursuit in 84 and 85, finished 2nd in 86 and in 97 decided to concentrate my efforts in the 50km points race finishing 2nd on the same ponts as the winner but losing out on first in the final sprint positions.
Chris was also a member of our winning team pursuit that year and while solid was not the strongest.
There was nothing to indicate that Chris would go on to be the rider he became though, like myself, he did win both the schoolboy 10 miles time trial championship and the Junior 25 championship.
87 TP Champs, Chris on the right .

Man track cycling used to be popular what the heck happened

 

[Darryl Webster]

Man track cycling used to be popular what the heck happened

This was the final televised day of the championships, hence the big crowd. Most days were far less.
Final race of the day was a points race featuring Francesco Moser, Tony Doyle and various others. I finished 3rd in that event.
A funny little aside..the very next morning I rode , as a favour to my sponsors, a 12 hour time trial , the only one I ever did, covering 274 miles and winning by a couple.
12 hour time trials are part of a peculiarly British time trial championship called The British Best All Rounder , an aggregate speed competition based on a riders best 50 mile, 100 mile and 12 hour times/ distance in any season.
Its an old championship going back to the 1920,s. Mass start ( road) racing wasn't allowed on British roads until the 1950,s.
The record for a 12 hour was broken last weekend when Andy Wilkinson covered an incredible 317.8 miles , covering the first 100 miles in 3hours 32 min over 26mph for the whole 12 hours!. Unpaced before anyone asks.
Irrelevant to thread but thought peeps might find it interesting.

 

[Wallace and Gromit]

Unpaced before anyone asks.

Downhill and with a following wind though, surely!

 

[ultimobici]

Blimy , that,l take some trawling to find. What I can tell you of hand is that in 87 aged 18 almost 19 he got his first Bronze medal in the National Champs riding against myself , his time being somewhere just inside 5 minutes. I,d won the Nat pursuit in 84 and 85, finished 2nd in 86 and in 97 decided to concentrate my efforts in the 50km points race finishing 2nd on the same ponts as the winner but losing out on first in the final sprint positions.
Chris was also a member of our winning team pursuit that year and while solid was not the strongest.
There was nothing to indicate that Chris would go on to be the rider he became though, like myself, he did win both the schoolboy 10 miles time trial championship and the Junior 25 championship.
87 TP Champs, Chris on the right .

So you are saying what exactly about Boardman with that statement?

 

[Darryl Webster]

So you are saying what exactly about Boardman with that statement?

Exactly what's said on the tin.

The results spell it out, there was huge leap from good to world beater , mostly between 91/92 .