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I think it's good they run it in parallel. Reduces the cost of hosting multiple races at different times, and they can sell the television rights as a package.

I'm just worried that the women's race will be demoted to be thought of as a "warm-up", rather than an event in its own right.
Also, why can't they sell the TV rights as a package if the two races run in succesion of each other?
 
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I'm just worried that the women's race will be demoted to be thought of as a "warm-up", rather than an event in its own right.
Also, why can't they sell the TV rights as a package if the two races run in succesion of each other?
I meant more that it's easier for TV to have it as a packaged schedule for their viewers if they are after each other. Since it's Flanders Classics behind it, maybe they put the women after the men like they do for the races in Belgium.
 
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You are assigning an opinion to me that I do not hold. At all.

Well, the only proposals we ever read are: Teams want part of the TV money in some form or other. So what is your solution? In the stuff you wrote below you never address the problem organizers have. You address team problems, can even agree with UAE, Bahrain etc that shouldn't be there. But.... teams go and new ones come, big sponsors leave, no successor found, yes, a big problem, at the moment, but 15 years or so later, who misses Telekom/T-Mobile/Columbia? New sponsors came, all ended well. Sponsoring cycling is still extremely good value.

What is problematic for smaller sponsors is the World Tour, that nowadays is just there because it's there, there's no concept, no thought behind it anymore, at least Hein V. had that (you could disagree with lots of his plans, but at least he had them). Leaving only 2 WCs to the organizers of the GTs... possibly 3 if one of the non WT teams with automatic invitation declines... that's what would keep me away from sponsoring a team if I was the owner of a small or middle italian company. That Kern had to be left out of the Vuelta 25 because the Vuelta simply has decided to do a rotation of the 4 small spanish teams... that's a much bigger problem than the super teams (that are indeed a problem too, but IMO a smaller one)
Do you know the financials of organisers? Maybe there is a lot of room for improvement
No I don't.
But since the swiss are famous for how badly they manage money I'm sure it's just mismanagement on their part.
Probably the same for Paris-Nice, the Flèche, Liège and Dauphiné. Must be bad management that made ASO take over.
No idea why Coppa Placci, Giro del Lazio are not ridden anymore. Why Giro del Veneto and Giro della Romagna just came back after long breaks. No idea why Milano-Torino and the Giro del Piemonte weren't ridden some years. No idea, after all I don't know their financials. Maybe they just stopped organizing the races for fun? Or took some breaks to pursue a career in organizing pottery-competitions?
Also no idea why Flanders classic is now organizing a bunch of races, including the historic ennemies Omloop and Ronde.
And of course I haven't the slightest clue why the GP Cerami, that used to have a very decent (that's even an understatement) winners list nowadays is just a 1.2 race.

So there indeed seems to be lot of improvement possible for all these inept organizers. All they have to do is pay parts of their TV money to teams! A proposal you have endorsed repeatedly if I remember correctly.

Or maybe the change from lots of different organizers to basically 3 big organziers, ASO (ok, 1 superbig) RCS and Flanders classic, with the rest holdouts, indicates that organizing a cycling race is not really profitable. You need a big race like the Tour, maybe partially Paris-Roubaix to subsidize the rest, Giro already not enough to subsidize the "minor" RCS races, Piemonte, Milano-Torino. With Strade Bianche though they might have found another winner...Without that "hit", you're a "small independent" organizer, you need local support, I guess. Government money, donation by local clubs, whatever. Switzerland doesn't seem to have that, so the TdS surely looks to be the next to fall and be absorbed by ASO at this point. As much as I dislike ASO too much power, but hopefully absorbed by ASO at this point. Because if you dismiss all the buzzwords about concepts, vision and bla bla what remains in that communiqué is: We don't have the money to continue like this.

So team sponsors PAYING organizers would certainly make more sense than teams getting a share of the TV money... But of course neither is going to happen, if you want to have another business model the Velon-One Cycling, whatever it's called nowadays certainly isn't the answer.
 
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Well, the only proposals we ever read are: Teams want part of the TV money in some form or other. So what is your solution? In the stuff you wrote below you never address the problem organizers have. You address team problems, can even agree with UAE, Bahrain etc that shouldn't be there. But.... teams go and new ones come, big sponsors leave, no successor found, yes, a big problem, at the moment, but 15 years or so later, who misses Telekom/T-Mobile/Columbia? New sponsors came, all ended well. Sponsoring cycling is still extremely good value.

What is problematic for smaller sponsors is the World Tour, that nowadays is just there because it's there, there's no concept, no thought behind it anymore, at least Hein V. had that (you could disagree with lots of his plans, but at least he had them). Leaving only 2 WCs to the organizers of the GTs... possibly 3 if one of the non WT teams with automatic invitation declines... that's what would keep me away from sponsoring a team if I was the owner of a small or middle italian company. That Kern had to be left out of the Vuelta 25 because the Vuelta simply has decided to do a rotation of the 4 small spanish teams... that's a much bigger problem than the super teams (that are indeed a problem too, but IMO a smaller one)

No I don't.
But since the swiss are famous for how badly they manage money I'm sure it's just mismanagement on their part.
Probably the same for Paris-Nice, the Flèche, Liège and Dauphiné. Must be bad management that made ASO take over.
No idea why Coppa Placci, Giro del Lazio are not ridden anymore. Why Giro del Veneto and Giro della Romagna just came back after long breaks. No idea why Milano-Torino and the Giro del Piemonte weren't ridden some years. No idea, after all I don't know their financials. Maybe they just stopped organizing the races for fun? Or took some breaks to pursue a career in organizing pottery-competitions?
Also no idea why Flanders classic is now organizing a bunch of races, including the historic ennemies Omloop and Ronde.
And of course I haven't the slightest clue why the GP Cerami, that used to have a very decent (that's even an understatement) winners list nowadays is just a 1.2 race.

So there indeed seems to be lot of improvement possible for all these inept organizers. All they have to do is pay parts of their TV money to teams! A proposal you have endorsed repeatedly if I remember correctly.

Or maybe the change from lots of different organizers to basically 3 big organziers, ASO (ok, 1 superbig) RCS and Flanders classic, with the rest holdouts, indicates that organizing a cycling race is not really profitable. You need a big race like the Tour, maybe partially Paris-Roubaix to subsidize the rest, Giro already not enough to subsidize the "minor" RCS races, Piemonte, Milano-Torino. With Strade Bianche though they might have found another winner...Without that "hit", you're a "small independent" organizer, you need local support, I guess. Government money, donation by local clubs, whatever. Switzerland doesn't seem to have that, so the TdS surely looks to be the next to fall and be absorbed by ASO at this point. As much as I dislike ASO too much power, but hopefully absorbed by ASO at this point. Because if you dismiss all the buzzwords about concepts, vision and bla bla what remains in that communiqué is: We don't have the money to continue like this.

So team sponsors PAYING organizers would certainly make more sense than teams getting a share of the TV money... But of course neither is going to happen, if you want to have another business model the Velon-One Cycling, whatever it's called nowadays certainly isn't the answer.
If you keep doing everything like they used to, and don’t change, then it makes sense the business model doesn’t work anymore in these changing times. Flanders Classics is a good example of an organisation that tried to improve the margins. Luckily they are going to do the same with TdS now. Maybe when it’s more sustainable they increase the length of the race again.
 
Total Energies pull the plug on the team. At least they have about a year but now begins a chase for a sponsor or the ship will sink and guys will be left looking for a team.
https://cyclinguptodate.com/cycling/totalenergies-will-end-sponsorship-with-team-after-2026-season
Team TotalEnergies and its title sponsor have announced that their partnership will conclude at the end of the 2026 season. The collaboration, which began in 2019 after the team had previously raced under the Direct Energie name, will have lasted seven seasons.
 
I assume that's what they did already. The women's race has gained another stage so I don't think you should see this as a demotion.
My concern would be the womens race coverage & winner would get buried under the news focussed on the men's race.

I get it might secure the race for the future and its always been a bit confusing we had two Tour de Suisses.

But at least we got coverage and press reporting on it. When they're combined like this, the womens race ends up feeling like its not really its own thing anymore. Plus the womens stages will always be shorter than the men's so if the they start and end in the same places, inevitably we're going to miss out on some of the good bits of parcours to make it work
 
I don't think anything is known yet over the routes those years. About Brussels 2030:

https://sporza.be/nl/2024/09/27/aan...hoogtemeters-in-onze-hoofdstad~1727430927127/
In Brussel kan je opteren voor klimmetjes of vlakke wegen. Denkt Flanders Classics misschien aan een WK voor sprinters, die toch wat in de vergeethoek zijn beland? In 2028 krijgen ze weliswaar nog een kans in Abu Dhabi.
Van Den Spiegel: "We zijn flandriens in hart en nieren en het Belgische wielrennen staat voor selectieve parcours. Ik denk dat het de bedoeling moet zijn om de schoonheid van ons land te tonen en om er een selectief parcours van te maken."
"Ik denk ook aan een Brusselaar die onlangs 2 keer olympisch kampioen is geworden en die in Zürich vorige week al een wereldtitel heeft gepakt. Ik denk dat hij ook fan is van een selectieve omloop en dat hij een logische ambassadeur kan zijn", lonkt Van Den Spiegel naar Remco Evenepoel.
"We kijken dus toch naar de hoogtemeters in onze hoofdstad. En tegenwoordig overleven ook veel sprinters op de klimmetjes en de kasseien. We willen er vooral een sportief aantrekkelijk parcours van maken."


It's organized by Flanders Classics (yes, the Flanders Classics that is organising Ronde van Vlaanderen). They are saying that they are "Flandriens" and that there intention is to make it a selective route. He's also talking in the article that the city circuit is almost know, and just need some validation.

The comment city circuit, makes me wonder if they go for more or less the same structure as in Leuven, with also a bigger Flandrien circuit. A bit copied this year in Rwanda to do one bigger lap. In Leuven they did the bigger lap twice. If they do that, there a 2 options, they go west and do 1 or more laps with the Muur van Geraardsbergen. Or they go south and do more the hills like in the Brabantse Pijl (Bruine Put, Alsemberg or the hills around Overijse again). Brussel itselfs is very hilly, but mostly big false flat avenues, rather than steep hills. But in the surroundings of Brussels there are quite some (very) short steeper hills and cobbles are everywhere. Most of them quite unknown in bigger races.

Considering that in the bid was mentioned it also will be used as celebrating 200 years of Belgium, I guess the route will (read: must) go through Flanders, Wallonie as well Brussels itself.

Besides a Brussels World Championship will honour probably both Merckx as well as Remco Evenepoel.
 
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Actually, it's a bit weird that that 4 world championships in a row are extremely climbers friendly (Zurich, Rwanda, Montreal and Salanche). And than 2 sprint World Championships in a row (Abu Dhabi and Kopenhagen). A bit more variation would have been nice. Any news from the Kopenhagen organistation if they are going to try to make it harder than last time?
 
Actually, it's a bit weird that that 4 world championships in a row are extremely climbers friendly (Zurich, Rwanda, Montreal and Salanche). And than 2 sprint World Championships in a row (Abu Dhabi and Kopenhagen). A bit more variation would have been nice. Any news from the Kopenhagen organistation if they are going to try to make it harder than last time?

I think a much more negative word than 'weird' would be appropriate.

It's so odd when we see three magnificent races in Harrogate, Leuven and Glasgow and then they just think, 'nah, let's not do that again for at least seven years'. And two consecutive sprinter races is unforgivable.

It cannot be harder than last time in Copenhagen. That part of Zealand has no terrain to play with at all, I'm afraid.
 
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I think a much more negative word than 'weird' would be appropriate.

It's so odd when we see three magnificent races in Harrogate, Leuven and Glasgow and then they just think, 'nah, let's not do that again for at least seven years'. And two consecutive sprinter races is unforgivable.

It cannot be harder than last time in Copenhagen. That part of Zealand has no terrain to play with at all, I'm afraid.

Especially in this area, with one domination rider, giving him this ultra hard courses is making it even 'easier' to win. Less tactics and less need of a strong team. Automatically a very selective race which favors him. An easier course would make it more exciting. Earlier this centary I would have loved seeing these routes.

Last time finish was on Geels Bakke, wasn't it? And there was another super short hill somewhere halfway the circuit (can't remember which 'hill' that was). Is it not possible to make the circuit a bit more twisty, to get a few more of those super small hills (and besides more attration because of the start / stop of the extra corners)?
 
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My concern would be the womens race coverage & winner would get buried under the news focussed on the men's race.

I get it might secure the race for the future and its always been a bit confusing we had two Tour de Suisses.

But at least we got coverage and press reporting on it. When they're combined like this, the womens race ends up feeling like its not really its own thing anymore. Plus the womens stages will always be shorter than the men's so if the they start and end in the same places, inevitably we're going to miss out on some of the good bits of parcours to make it work

I think it is a win. The stages have increased from four to five.
 
Actually, it's a bit weird that that 4 world championships in a row are extremely climbers friendly (Zurich, Rwanda, Montreal and Salanche). And than 2 sprint World Championships in a row (Abu Dhabi and Kopenhagen). A bit more variation would have been nice. Any news from the Kopenhagen organistation if they are going to try to make it harder than last time?
I assume the order (climber vs flatter races) also depends on which cities bid for specific years. It’s not just up to the UCI to decide which cities bid for which years?
 
I assume the order (climber vs flatter races) also depends on which cities bid for specific years. It’s not just up to the UCI to decide which cities bid for which years?
Sure, but in most cases, you can tweak the difficulty of the route. I mean, if swiss and Rwanda are difficult, Sallanche will have a very hard climber course, they at least could have asked to be a bit more creative with the Montreal circuit for example.
 
Actually, it's a bit weird that that 4 world championships in a row are extremely climbers friendly (Zurich, Rwanda, Montreal and Salanche). And than 2 sprint World Championships in a row (Abu Dhabi and Kopenhagen). A bit more variation would have been nice. Any news from the Kopenhagen organistation if they are going to try to make it harder than last time?

I don't think Zurich was so much climbers friendly. Similar thing applies to Monreal. We've had a nice mix of riders that fought for medals.
100kg Behrens won the U23's. MVDP and Skujins fought for medal in the elites. Montreal itself is won by a big mix of riders, and I would say the Worlds is a bit easier, so without Pogacar both of this races could've been nice and open.
So you would have Rwanda and 2028 as climbers friendly races. But climbers were robbed in 2020 (I found Imola a bit more towards the classics riders), so I think it's fair.
 
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I don't think Zurich was so much climbers friendly. Similar thing applies to Monreal. We've had a nice mix of riders that fought for medals.
100kg Behrens won the U23's. MVDP and Skujins fought for medal in the elites. Montreal itself is won by a big mix of riders, and I would say the Worlds is a bit easier, so without Pogacar both of this races could've been nice and open.
So you would have Rwanda and 2028 as climbers friendly races. But climbers were robbed in 2020 (I found Imola a bit more towards the classics riders), so I think it's fair.
ok, very fair comment. Maybe I judged the course indeed by the presence of Pogacar. I mean pre <2020 I would say, Montreal is a difficult course but not specifically for climbers. You would get your typical course, 150 k nothing, than a bigger attempt 100 to go from some countries who need to make the course hard with their outsiders and only the favorites 2 laps before the end, discovering that they started racing to late and that it's not hard enough to go solo. Slightly to hard for MvdP maybe, but within reach of van Aert for example. But nowadays it's different. Under current circumstances I think 1.5km on average 8.5%, quickly followed by some other climbs on a short circuit, making that the next time 1.5k at 8.5% is already very quickly there is just to hard for most riders to follow Pog and a less predictable race. I mean the same main climb + the 2 short ones on a circuit of around 20k would have worked better in this case. Or just the same circuit lenght, but the main climb replaced by 1 or 2 smaller ones.
 
ok, very fair comment. Maybe I judged the course indeed by the presence of Pogacar. I mean pre <2020 I would say, Montreal is a difficult course but not specifically for climbers. You would get your typical course, 150 k nothing, than a bigger attempt 100 to go from some countries who need to make the course hard with their outsiders and only the favorites 2 laps before the end, discovering it's not hard enough to go solo. Slightly to hard for MvdP maybe, but within reach of van Aert for example. But nowadays it's different. Under current circumstances I think 1.5km on average 8.5%, quickly followed by some other climbs on a short circuit, making that the next time 1.5k at 8.5% is already very quickly there is just to hard for most riders to follow Pog and a less predictable race.

Yes, I agree with you on your Pogacar points.
But on the other hand, I don't think it's also fair to design courses so that specifically Pogacar can't win on them. And to be honest, that's a very hard thing to do as well.
 
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