Giro d'Italia 2018 stage 6: Caltanissetta - Etna 164 km

[Squire]

Re:

Nice rides today from the Wilier-Triestina team:

162 MARECZKO Jakub Wilier Triestina - Selle Italia 26:26
163 ZARDINI Edoardo Wilier Triestina - Selle Italia ,,
164 TURRIN Alex Wilier Triestina - Selle Italia ,,
165 ZHUPA Eugert Wilier Triestina - Selle Italia ,,
166 MOSCA Jacopo Wilier Triestina - Selle Italia ,,
167 COLEDAN Marco Wilier Triestina - Selle Italia ,,
168 BERTAZZO Liam Wilier Triestina - Selle Italia ,,
169 DRUCKER Jean-Pierre BMC Racing Team ,,
170 VILLELLA Davide Astana Pro Team ,,
171 FONZI Giuseppe Wilier Triestina - Selle Italia ,,

Taking turns pushing Kuba up the climb?

 

[hfer07]

Simon Yates setting the record straight

(How did you decide who would win?) I said to him as soon as I caught him that he could take the stage because if I had enough time then I would take the jersey. He'd been out on the road all day so I think he deserved it.

 

[YavorD]

MS looked really good today. It was clear to me even like 3 km. to the finish that Yates was probably the strongest and he put 26 seconds, which is actually a lot, considering the fact that it was flatish in the last meters. However there is a loong way to Rome and I dont't think neither Pozzo and Yates will hold this form, at the moment they look like the strongest. But MS with two cards and probably the strongest squad with Haig, Nieve and Kreuziger will be interesting to watch.

 

[staubsauger]

Chaves knows that Simon is in the shape of his career this season, currently the best climber in the race, a more decent tt'er and Esteban is a person of integrity. Not a snake like Fabio Aru!

That said, if Dumoulin gets Popovyched after the TT it's pure luck whether he lets go Yates or Chaves. No need for concurrency between teammates right now.

 

[movingtarget]

Re: Re:

Dennis lost less than a minute - I had expected him to lose much more.

Sensible ride for Dennis.

Brave ride by Dennis

but in fairness when you look at the competetion nowadays in a GT Dennis should maybe rethink his plans

He is a marvelous TTer ...a little more on this and he could clean up
Plus win week stage races

He is making his life so much harder by persuing GTs ...and I cant see it happening for him
At best a top 10 if that

First he has to finish. The third week is hard. Bennett looks like more of a GT rider than Dennis. I expected a top 15 at best for Dennis. A top 10 would be surprising.

I'm pretty sure that never trying is something you might regret regardless of if it would work.

Long way to go yet. Dennis went about as well as expected, he is still learning about GT racing. I thought his ride was quite good, he didn't crack completely.

 

[seldon71]

Looking like there could be a nice fight for Maglia Bianco too...

Carapaz took the lead, but O'Connor also looks good and will be probably the protected rider of Dimension Data from here on (Meintjes lost a lot today and doesn't seem to have legs at all). Then there is M.A.Lopez - if he can't contest the overall, at least he can fight for one shirt.

Schachmann can't match those guys at high mountains - Oomen could, but will work for Tom D.

 

[Sestriere]

Re:

Nice rides today from the Wilier-Triestina team:

162 MARECZKO Jakub Wilier Triestina - Selle Italia 26:26
163 ZARDINI Edoardo Wilier Triestina - Selle Italia ,,
164 TURRIN Alex Wilier Triestina - Selle Italia ,,
165 ZHUPA Eugert Wilier Triestina - Selle Italia ,,
166 MOSCA Jacopo Wilier Triestina - Selle Italia ,,
167 COLEDAN Marco Wilier Triestina - Selle Italia ,,
168 BERTAZZO Liam Wilier Triestina - Selle Italia ,,
169 DRUCKER Jean-Pierre BMC Racing Team ,,
170 VILLELLA Davide Astana Pro Team ,,
171 FONZI Giuseppe Wilier Triestina - Selle Italia ,,

I'm a bit disappointed by Fonzi that he didn't round up the formation, he probably wanted the honour of last on the stage for himself...

 

[yaco]

Re: Re:

So I'm looking at Chavez's results this year and trying to gauge his form. Apparently he had an HD from Paris Nice. Could someone tell me what this means?

Hors délai, outside the time limit.

Thanks. So I'm assuming he has been on terrible form this year?

Posted around 2 months ago that Chaves' form is fine but he's been held back in Europe - Holding his peak till and two give both Yates more leadership opportunities - Plus MS want to keep Yates x 2.

 

[carton]

I think Yates was the strongest rider today. But "gifting" the stage to Chaves was the right move by any means. You don't attack a teammate with a few hundred meters to go unless it's on team orders. And the team has no interest in allowing that yet. Chaves has a better track record and he was the one who took the risk today by going so early. So steady to the line is the right call. They work well together and keeping that going is the most important thing for the team if they want to win the Giro. Yates will be on the podium taking the jersey anyway, he proved his strength, and he will be the more protected rider the next few days by virtue of taking over the Maglia Rosa. So it's a good idea to give Chaves a reason to celebrate.

And as to the bigger picture, Dumoulin was the clear favorite coming into this stage and I suspect he still is. If he cracks or if Yates is truly on miracle form, then those four seconds probably won't matter. If Dumoulin and Froome are still a threat, then Yates and Chaves are still going to need find a way to get a few minutes on Dumoulin and likely Froome on the mountains to come, and the best way to do that is by working together.

 

[tobydawq]

Edited.

 

[DFA123]

Re: Re:

Then again, Froome aside, this is a really weak GC line up.

Are you trolling here? By definition a GC line up featuring the reigning champions of all three GTs is not “really weak”. By Giro standards this is a super strong GC line up.

Well Froome won most of them, hence the comment "Froome aside, this is a really weak GC line up".

I think this is a pretty weak GT era right now. Apart from Froome the entire field only has 2 GT wins and about 4 podiums between them.

 

[Krokro]

Re: Re:

So I'm looking at Chavez's results this year and trying to gauge his form. Apparently he had an HD from Paris Nice. Could someone tell me what this means?

Hors délai, outside the time limit.

Thanks. So I'm assuming he has been on terrible form this year?

Posted around 2 months ago that Chaves' form is fine but he's been held back in Europe - Holding his peak till and two give both Yates more leadership opportunities - Plus MS want to keep Yates x 2.

I just realized how hazardous it is to underestimate Chaves when I had a look at his 2016 pre-Giro results. We know how amazing this year was for him.

 

[Blanco]

Re:

Simon Yates setting the record straight

(How did you decide who would win?) I said to him as soon as I caught him that he could take the stage because if I had enough time then I would take the jersey. He'd been out on the road all day so I think he deserved it.

Class act! They will be huge threat for the overall this way (together).

 

[HelloDolly]

Re: Re:

Dennis lost less than a minute - I had expected him to lose much more.

Sensible ride for Dennis.

Brave ride by Dennis

but in fairness when you look at the competetion nowadays in a GT Dennis should maybe rethink his plans

He is a marvelous TTer ...a little more on this and he could clean up
Plus win week stage races

He is making his life so much harder by persuing GTs ...and I cant see it happening for him
At best a top 10 if that

First he has to finish. The third week is hard. Bennett looks like more of a GT rider than Dennis. I expected a top 15 at best for Dennis. A top 10 would be surprising.

I'm pretty sure that never trying is something you might regret regardless of if it would work.

Yes he trying now

I only say this to save him hardship and disappointment

Alo he can maybe win alot more if he doesnt try

 

[EroicaStradeBianche]

Re:

Looking like there could be a nice fight for Maglia Bianco too...

Carapaz took the lead, but O'Connor also looks good and will be probably the protected rider of Dimension Data from here on (Meintjes lost a lot today and doesn't seem to have legs at all). Then there is M.A.Lopez - if he can't contest the overall, at least he can fight for one shirt.

Schachmann can't match those guys at high mountains - Oomen could, but will work for Tom D.

I think that for Lopez will be hard not to win the Maglia Bianca even with these crashes

 

[Zinoviev Letter]

Re: Re:

Then again, Froome aside, this is a really weak GC line up.

Are you trolling here? By definition a GC line up featuring the reigning champions of all three GTs is not “really weak”. By Giro standards this is a super strong GC line up.

Well Froome won most of them, hence the comment "Froome aside, this is a really weak GC line up".

I think this is a pretty weak GT era right now. Apart from Froome the entire field only has 2 GT wins and about 4 podiums between them.

“This is a pretty weak GT era right now” is in my view an incorrect statement but it’s one you can make an argument for. “This is a pretty weak field by current standards” or “this is a pretty weak field by Giro standards” are not positions that any kind of reasonable argument can be made for.

 

[Mayo from Mayo]

Looks like the Basque cloak of invisibility has been passed from Haimar Zubeldia to Pello Bilbao. 13th on the stage, 7th overall. Where was he lurking today?

 

[yaco]

It's weird but I think this performance suddenly makes Adam a real contender for the Tour de France

Adam will have Ewan's sprint train working for him in the mountains - Anyway Adam is super keen to win a GT stage.

 

[yaco]

It's weird but I think this performance suddenly makes Adam a real contender for the Tour de France

Seems to be a media blackout on his recovery, would be nice to know he's still alive somewhere

Adam is training at altitude in California and will ride the TOC and Dauphine before the TDF.

 

[staubsauger]

Compared to last year Mount Etna fully delivered!

Strong breakaway group including Chaves, Ciccone, Hermans and Henao. Quite a lot of attacking in the front group early on. Especially between Ciccone and Chaves. Froome and Dumoulin temporary gapped on the climb. Pozzovivo who tried to shake off his opponents quite a few times. Yates who jumped away from everyone in the final.

That's a nice appetizer prior to the Zoncolan!

On Gran Sasso d'Italia probably a group gets away. But given how strong the breakaway was already today, even that likely brings us great entertainment.

 

[yaco]

Re: Re:

Yeah in the event that Yates proves demonstrably stronger than Chaves over 3 weeks, how incredibly valuable will it be to have Chaves in his corner? If he had chased won Chaves and kicked past him for the win, do you think Chaves would want to help him?

Having said that, putting 26s on the main GC field seemingly while breathing through his nose...wow.

I take the point, but equally, Chaves has spent his whole career as a protected rider, including lots of races where Yates has lowered his own chances to help him. I'm not sure what value he has as a team mate if he's really such a diva as to be upset about giving the bonus seconds to the stronger rider who already has a lead.

In reality, I expect both Chaves and team management to consider Chaves the leader, and Yates is going to have to hold the jersey for a while for that to change despite his results all year, so the logic above does not even come in to it

You need to understand the team dynamics - Chaves' treats one week stage races as training which allows the Yates brothers to be team leaders - When a Yates and Chaves both ride GC's together, Chaves was the leader up until 2017 because he was more developed and at that time a better rider - Come 2018 and it's joint leadership with the road making the ultimate decision on who will be team leader.

 

[shalgo]

There are 25 riders in the current peloton who finished in the top ten of at least one GT last year; 11 of them are riding here. That's a pretty good GT field.

 

[DFA123]

Re: Re:

Then again, Froome aside, this is a really weak GC line up.

Are you trolling here? By definition a GC line up featuring the reigning champions of all three GTs is not “really weak”. By Giro standards this is a super strong GC line up.

Well Froome won most of them, hence the comment "Froome aside, this is a really weak GC line up".

I think this is a pretty weak GT era right now. Apart from Froome the entire field only has 2 GT wins and about 4 podiums between them.

“This is a pretty weak GT era right now” is in my view an incorrect statement but it’s one you can make an argument for. “This is a pretty weak field by current standards” or “this is a pretty weak field by Giro standards” are not positions that any kind of reasonable argument can be made for.

Once again "Froome aside ,this is a really weak GC line up". Not sure why you keep trying to create a straw man by ignoring that caveat. The point is, that you don't have to be a GC superstar to end up on the podium in this field.

 

[yaco]

I really think giving Yates the stage win would have been a horrible mistake by MS. Imagine how pissed Chaves would be if he had been dropped by his own teammated almost in sight of the finish line. If Yates goes into the last week in pink, something unexpected happens and Chaves has to sacrifice himself to save the giro for Yates, you don't want that the two dislike each other. Those 4 seconds were absolutely worth it.

I just got told Chaves isn't a diva so I'm sure he'd have managed. Yates got over it when Chaves went awol in paris nice and they he lost the GC thanks to lack of team support on the final day.

I posted the reason why S.Yates lost PN on the day of the stage - Yates lost because Kreuziger who's had an excellent season had his first bad day of the season - Kreuziger has a normal day and he leads Yates up the final climb to chase down Soler and Yates wins P/N - Chaves was a non-factor because if you remember he crashed into a fallen rider in stage 4 and was suffering from injuries and also illness which affected half the peleton in PN.

 

[Craigee]

Re: Re:

Then again, Froome aside, this is a really weak GC line up.

Are you trolling here? By definition a GC line up featuring the reigning champions of all three GTs is not “really weak”. By Giro standards this is a super strong GC line up.

Well Froome won most of them, hence the comment "Froome aside, this is a really weak GC line up".

I think this is a pretty weak GT era right now. Apart from Froome the entire field only has 2 GT wins and about 4 podiums between them.

“This is a pretty weak GT era right now” is in my view an incorrect statement but it’s one you can make an argument for. “This is a pretty weak field by current standards” or “this is a pretty weak field by Giro standards” are not positions that any kind of reasonable argument can be made for.

Are the sprinters usually this weak?