Giro d'Italia Giro D'Italia 2025 Stage 9: Gubbio – Siena (181km)

[Rackham]

McNulty looked like he'd been mauled by a bear at the end of the stage.

I think another problem that people watching the race might not appreciate is just how chaotic that stage was and it's quite probable a lot of what we saw happen did so because of two reasons: legs (or lack thereof for the riders involved) and DS's actually having no clue what the hell was going on or where everyone was.

We still don't know where or when Ayuso crashed, not entirely anyway.

 

[Pippo_San]

This stage is a dream come true.

I'd love to be in the UAE bus to hear Ayuso go crazy against Del Toro.
Man freaky times ahead.
Can't wait.

 

[SafeBet]

McNulty looked like he'd been mauled by a bear at the end of the stage.

I think another problem that people watching the race might not appreciate is just how chaotic that stage was and it's quite probable a lot of what we saw happen did so because of two reasons: legs (or lack thereof for the riders involved) and DS's actually having no clue what the hell was going on or where everyone was.

We still don't know where or when Ayuso crashed, not entirely anyway.

This is so true.
I re-watched the last 60 km on the multiscreen feed and I have yet to understand whether Ayuso injured himself in the Roglic crash or elsewhere.

A few other things that stood out to me: Gee, Roglic, Storer and Pidcock all had mechanicals, accidents, bad luck and all had to pull a lot in the final 50 km. Much more than the GC guys in group Ayuso. Rogla looked very insecure at first after the crash but later regained his confidence. Gee and Storer fared better than you'd guess by only looking at the results.
Gee, Storer and Pidcock had little to no support from their teams, which is understandable for PT teams. Red Bull surely had to do more but they kinda saved their Giro by having Denz pull like a madman to bring Pellizzari back to Roglic. Pellizzari was outstanding.

Yates and McNulty worked a lot more than I thought in the final 20 km before Siena. I gotta say Yates looked gassed in San Martino in Grania so I'm not sure he had more to give. McNulty had to come back from far back and was in pain.

I still can't understand when and how Vacek attacked from group Ayuso but it had to be somewhere during the San Martino in Grania sector. I feel like the team owed it to him after his terrific work in the first week but it really made no sense. He wasted so much energy in between San Martino and Monteaperti, with those legs he could have probably brought the group back on his own, or at least try an attack together with Ciccone.

 

[Keldergoat]

McNulty clearly gave his all, Yates is a protected leader so he didn't have to.

And Vacek was just super selfish but some tell me it was Trek DS's being smart because they have a degree in DS'ing and they have gotten good results so far despite their worst efforts.

I doubt that, McNulty ends the stage just behind all the GC competitors. If you are going full gass for 40 km as a Domestique you don't lose only 20 seconds on a steep beast of a climb like that.

All is setting up for a typical UAE popcorn Giro where apparently still 4 guys think that they can win the Giro.

 

[Red Rick]

I doubt that, McNulty ends the stage just behind all the GC competitors. If you are going full gass you don't lose only 20 seconds on a steep beast of a climb like that.

All is setting up for a typical UAE popcorn Giro where apparently still 4 guys think that they can win the Giro.

It's a really short climb though, it's not really Mur de Huy where you can lose a minute fairly easily. In addition, the guys sprinting away weren't as fresh as typically happens in Fleche either.

 

[Red Rick]

I still can't understand when and how Vacek attacked from group Ayuso but it had to be somewhere during the San Martino in Grania sector. I feel like the team owed it to him after his terrific work in the first week but it really made no sense. He wasted so much energy in between San Martino and Monteaperti, with those legs he could have probably brought the group back on his own, or at least try an attack together with Ciccone.

I think Vacek getting freedom is just something that happened cause the mood in the Trek team is really good, everyone is talking about how strong Vacek was on stage 5, how they wanted to keep pink within the team, and then suddenly nobody is telling Vacek to get back in line and do his job. I honestly think Ciccone has reason to be pissed about this even if he isn't.

 

[QueenStagiaire]

It's a really short climb though, it's not really Mur de Huy where you can lose a minute fairly easily. In addition, the guys sprinting away weren't as fresh as typically happens in Fleche either.

Yes, but on the other hand, if McNulty goes all-out to the bottom of the climb, he‘d still lose a minute because he‘d be cooked.

 

[Red Rick]

Yes, but on the other hand, if McNulty goes all-out to the bottom of the climb, he‘d still lose a minute because he‘d be cooked.

McNulty's power file on Strava, he couldn't even do 6.5 W/kg for 2 minutes. That's proper cooked.

 

[QueenStagiaire]

McNulty's power file on Strava, he couldn't even do 6.5 W/kg for 2 minutes. That's proper cooked.

Don‘t know if this is trolling, but that is the same pace he did pulling the group I assume so McNulty kept up the pace to the line instead of going all out before.

 

[Red Rick]

Don‘t know if this is trolling, but that is the same pace he did pulling the group I assume so McNulty kept up the pace to the line instead of going all out before.

He is awful for not doing the Van Aert special stop beside the road to showboat how deep you went before restarting and getting 3rd place.

 

[danielovichdk2]

What a stage.

Quite baffled by both UAE's and Lidl Trek's strategy, both didn't really seem to pan out a winning strategy. If UAE truly wants to put minutes into Roglic they would let Yates and McNulty ride their asses off until the last 1,5km but both were fresh enough to end in the top-12 on a steep climb like Sta Catharina, then you've been sandbagging all along.

And Lidl-Trek: what was Vacek's move all about, blowing yourself up to close a 1 minute gap to get dropped right after? If he would play the domestique role for Ciccone it would be end of story for Roglic, Gee and Storer's GC right now.

Kuddos to Ineos for their ballsy strategy, it's a bummer that Arensman got a mechanical cause he was crazy strong next to Rivera, they diserved more than what they got for. Apparently Arensman finished the last 40 km on Ben Turners bike btw.

Anyhow, I loved it.

Did we watch the same stage ?

"Quite baffled by both UAE's and Lidl Trek's strategy, both didn't really seem to pan out a winning strategy."

Pretty solid work from both teams. Mads drilling in the beginning of the gravel, blowing up the group. Del Toro taking matters in to own hands and planting the rest. Ciccone knows he cannot win the Giro, the team knows it too, but that doesn't mean he cannot try.

 

[Keldergoat]

Did we watch the same stage ?

"Quite baffled by both UAE's and Lidl Trek's strategy, both didn't really seem to pan out a winning strategy."

Pretty solid work from both teams. Mads drilling in the beginning of the gravel, blowing up the group. Del Toro taking matters in to own hands and planting the rest. Ciccone knows he cannot win the Giro, the team knows it too, but that doesn't mean he cannot try.

Trek's strategy was fine, until Vacek made his move with 40km to go. That felt like betting on two horses: stage win for Vacek (which was very unlikely given that he needed to gap a minute to very strong riders that could profit from Ineos work) and GC for Ciccone. I think Ciccone is a real contender for a podium spot btw and putting time in on several key contenders (Storer, Roglic, Gee) is very well a plausible tactic.

UAE kinda did the same with Yates and McNulty semi-pulling for Ayuso where this could have been a knock out for Roglic. In both cases the end result wasn't bad, but the tactics behind it were far from flawless.

 

[Boehmand]

I think Vacek getting freedom is just something that happened cause the mood in the Trek team is really good, everyone is talking about how strong Vacek was on stage 5, how they wanted to keep pink within the team, and then suddenly nobody is telling Vacek to get back in line and do his job. I honestly think Ciccone has reason to be pissed about this even if he isn't.

You just keep indicating, that you think DSs are emotional people ,who just let riders do what they want when they are in a good mood

Lidl let Vacek attack because they believed Vacek could win the stage - that's it, that's all.

You may disagree with that sentiment (that he could win) and that is fine, but to then jump to claiming it was not a sporting decision at all - but rather an emotional and unproffessional decision - seems to be based on nothing factual.

 

[Red Rick]

You just keep indicating, that you think DSs are emotional people ,who just let riders do what they want when they are in a good mood

Lidl let Vacek attack because they believed Vacek could win the stage - that's it, that's all.

You may disagree with that sentiment (that he could win) and that is fine, but to then jump to claiming it was not a sporting decision at all - but rather an emotional and unproffessional decision - seems to be based on nothing factual.

I base it on interviews givem the week before.


And the idea he could win the stage attacking from G2 was proven to be factually hilarious

 

[zlev11]

McNulty looked like he'd been mauled by a bear at the end of the stage.

I think another problem that people watching the race might not appreciate is just how chaotic that stage was and it's quite probable a lot of what we saw happen did so because of two reasons: legs (or lack thereof for the riders involved) and DS's actually having no clue what the hell was going on or where everyone was.

We still don't know where or when Ayuso crashed, not entirely anyway.

i think Ayuso must have crashed somewhere in San Martino in Grania. at one point the camera behind his group shows the whole group being shattered on an uphill with no Ayuso in the shot, I have a feeling he attacked off the front and then crashed on a downhill thereafter. the next time they showed Ayuso he was back in that (slightly smaller now) group.

 

[QueenStagiaire]

DS work hinges on the sentiment of the DS in a way that few other professions do. There is hardly a DS school or a distinguished field of cyclo-tactical analysis and DSes are very much emotionally involved in the question of whose ambitions to support. Many strategic decisions are not made looking solely at the maximum possible result on the day but based on what is perceived as fair and just. It can‘t be reasoned that the decision made in the Lidl-Trek car has to in necessity be reasonable and actually analysing the outcome and the effort made shows that there was a situation where either a miscalculation or an illogical decision was made. We can argue if the mistake was letting Vacek attack in the first place or if it was Vacek going solo but I believe I can say that the outcome was obviously suboptimal.

 

[Boehmand]

DS work hinges on the sentiment of the DS in a way that few other professions do. There is hardly a DS school or a distinguished field of cyclo-tactical analysis and DSes are very much emotionally involved in the question of whose ambitions to support. Many strategic decisions are not made looking solely at the maximum possible result on the day but based on what is perceived as fair and just. It can‘t be reasoned that the decision made in the Lidl-Trek car has to in necessity be reasonable and actually analysing the outcome and the effort made shows that there was a situation where either a miscalculation or an illogical decision was made. We can argue if the mistake was letting Vacek attack in the first place or if it was Vacek going solo but I believe I can say that the outcome was obviously suboptimal.

It was not a decision made at a whim in the car.

Vacek was designated to go for the stage already at the morning tactics meeting - Pedersen said so in his Danish pre-stage interview. Some rode in support of that aim, others to protect Ciccone (not for Ciccone to attack, he specifically said "protect").

Again, you may disagree with that chosen tactic, but it is bordering on conspiracy theory to claim it's just something they made up on the fly, because of "emotions" - with absolutely zero proof that is the case.

 

[AmRacer]

It was not a decision made at a whim in the car.

Vacek was designated to go for the stage already at the morning tactics meeting - Pedersen said so in his Danish pre-stage interview. Some rode in support of that aim, others to protect Ciccone (not for Ciccone to attack, he specifically said "protect").

Again, you may disagree with that chosen tactic, but it is bordering on conspiracy theory to claim it's just something they made up on the fly, because of "emotions" - with absolutely zero proof that is the case.

They probably should have made up something on the fly and changed tactics.

 

[CyclistAbi]

Agree.

An accidentes or punctures can be bad luck, but they're also due to the way you ride.

Van der Poel´s had less punctures than other riders in Paris-Roubaix these years. It's not because he's lucky, it's because he's better.
He hasn't had a puncture in Paris-Roubaix for a long time; this year yes. He didn't have one last year, when he won comfortably; this year someone was pushing him. Simple coincidence?

Many incidents can be bad luck, but when someone has them all the time, and another rider has them rarely, it's for a reason.

Rogic looked uncomfortable from the start. He had more chances of getting a puncture riding like this than Pidcock, and Pidcock crashed today, but after spending three years in this race without doing so, Roglic, 1/1. He only finished one Tour since 2020 due to accidents....

The importance of positioning. It's as obvious as if you go first you won't crash because someone has an accident in front of you.
I thought Pidcock would attack earlier for that reason. The smaller the group, the less risk of accidents.

FYI "comfortable" Pidcock crashed and punctured twice.

 

[CyclistAbi]

Congratulations to Wout van Aert for bouncing back and to Isaac del Toro Romero for becoming the first Mexican wearing maglia rosa.

The stage delivered, did was it was planted there for to do, taking out half of the GC riders. If that is good thing or not, for some other discussion. GC placings in the end got reshuffled and now lets go back to racing. Pellizzari did a marvellous job, Bernal deserves the praise and for sure a lot of stories and memories born. In terms of UAE i don't buy it, this supposed internal harmony, no way. Gennie is now out of the bottle and lets see on how that goes, Rogla can in the meanwhile quietly reduce the gap, before the big finale!

 

[stoempestoempestoempe]

The only person who is likely let down by anything today, is another Mexican!! The very very distant thunder he had as most accomplished Mexican bike racer has been completely blacked out by Del Toro.. So Raul Alcala can belly ache about nobody remembers him after Isaac is shining like an unassuming super nova!!!

Thank you for mentioning Alcala! Been a long time since I've heard his name and I always liked him as a rider.

 

[Boehmand]

They probably should have made up something on the fly and changed tactics.

You may think that - and again debating if tactics make sense or not is cool.

My issue is the claims that Lidl just made the decision willy-nilly in a fit of emotion.