180mmCrank said:
What we saw today was a group of cyclists grinding it out on a tough climb. This is completely different from the doped/EPO fuelled fireworks we regularly saw a few years ago. There is no one blowing the field apart in a way that looks super human.
I am not saying this means that doping has been eliminated but I don't think we are seeing the excesses of the past.
It gives me confidence we are seeing authentic performances.
T
All true - and I think we are seeing mostly authentic performances.
ilrumne said:
The logic of the topic starter is as follows: if he wins, he's a cheater, if he doesn't, well, then maybe he isn't. That's just pathetic. They obtained 4 minutes in the valley for free - . . ..
Not at all my logic - but it can be easy to misread logic in a forum mssg. De Gendt is no stranger to lone breakaways, which speaks in his favor. But he was just too strong when EVERYBODY else was clearly dieing. He had been through the same race - pretty much the same effort, and all of a sudden puts this effort in, and makes it look easy. If he blew up, then I could care less if he doped or not - it didn't change the results enough for me to get emotional over.
Ferminal said:
His Stelvio time ended up being slower than the others, didn't it? Nothing remarkable about his performance relative to the best climbers in the race, this stage was decided on tactics.
What IS remarkable, in my thinking, is his performance relative to everyone else. His performance compared to historical performances is not remarkable.
Caruut said:
You really also have to factor in that the favourites followed a very slow VDV for quite a long time. In the valley as well, no-one wanted to drive it on whatsoever. Hesjedal didn't feel that threatened, and those who were actually threatened by it (JRod, Scarponi, Basso) saw it as an opportunity to get Hesjedal to spend energy before Stelvio, so they could weaken him. It only started settling a bit once they had conceded so much time that some domestiques caught up with the favourites.
VDV wasn't that slow - he kept bringing the gap down - and doing a yoeman's job of it! I don't think it was tactics so much as nobody else had anything to answer with! Basso admitted as much - and Rodriquez, not Ryder, had the most to lose! If Rodriguez had more left, he would have launched it. With the time trial tomorrow, he knows he is still under threat! He admits to having no confidence of keeping Ryder at bay in the time trial.
Caruut said:
Did you watch the stage? That's exactly why they rode half-arsed - nobody wanted to ride full-arsed on the flat before the Stelvio, the bloody Giro was on the line! They spent ages watching each other, while De Gendt had Carrera pulling for him and Izaguirre pulling for Nieve, and then Nieve and Cunego to work with for a bit. The group behind were playing games while he was just riding.
Did I watch the stage? You betcha! In Italian and English both! All the way from the first climb. I still say the pink jersey group didn't softpedal it - there wasn't anything left to throw on the fire. De Gendt had a fantastic break group to help him off - all tried and true attackers - but that final launch just looked too good. Too good to be true.
I didn't quote the letter showing the interview - which I have to say is convincing. But it still just looked too good to be true. I have not convicted the guy in my mind, but I am extremely suspicious. It IS possible - but how many times did I think exactly the same thing in the late 90's, and the first decade of this century? So many.
Maybe it was because the top riders today in the Giro are from the runner-up squad. Great, strong riders - but just behind the heroic caliber. As much as I cheer Ryder on to win - how many times has he been "almost there"? And Basso, Popovivo, the rest? Rodriguez? This is the first time I have ever heard of him. We are in the gap between greats, excepting Cav and the sprinters. So, perhaps such a performance, without enhancement, was possible. But, on the other hand, in a clean peloton, a little refreshment on the red blood cells alone could have made that difference.