Great Descenders or Climax Fighter

[Nirvana]

Re:

Pantani was a great descender with his very own style prior to his Milano-Torino car crash. He took significantly lesser risks in the aftermath of that incident.

Rasmussen was a quite handy descender due to his mountain bike skills as well. In fact he was really good at cornering for lightweight like him. Since he was the training partner of Fuglsang he might have helped Jakub becoming such a great bike handler as well.

Didn't Savoldelli make up like 3 minutes on the Pantani group down the Fauniera? Rumor goes there ain't no live pictures of his downhill ride, because the motorbike driver couldn't follow him save as he was flying down the mountain. That's why they call him the hawk. I think either Mayomaniac, Eshnar or Giggs told me that story last year or so.

Rai commentators said so at the time, the only frame of him on that descent that I could remember was when he catched the Pantani group, in two slight turn he passed them at double speed and was gone.
At the time check on the top of Fauniera he was 2'38" down from the head of the race (2'06" from Pantani) whereas at the end of the descent was alone in the front 45" clear from the Pantani group. Then he gained another minute in the descent of Madonna del Colletto that was the last climb of the day.

 

[Nirvana]

Re:

Firenze wasn't on the Fiesole descent. And it certainly wasn't an attack.

Was near the end of the descent after the little bump of via Salviati.

 

[Netserk]

Re: Re:

Firenze wasn't on the Fiesole descent. And it certainly wasn't an attack.

Was near the end of the descent after the little bump of via Salviati.

Near the end of the Fiesole descent?

He was in the middle of the bunch and crashed when he hit the white painting when it was completely wet. To count that, in the context of how good a descender he is, is just poor.

 

[Nirvana]

From the profile could be difficult to understand because they took a deviation to use via Salviati interrupting the descent but the end is when you cross the Mugnone at Ponte Rosso (circa 2,5 km to the finish line), he crashed just before the 50 meters long ramp with 3 kms to go, it's probably the trickiest part with two sharp turns from via Bolognese to via Trieste (where he crashed) and to via Trento and the negative slope that rapidly increases in via Trieste approaching the turn to via Trento.

Yes, there are a lot of paintings on the ground because usually there are the cars parked on both sides of the street but he was the only one to crash here, he made a mistake like he often do when is wet, I don't think it's a coincidence, if you take risks it's easier to crash when it's wet.

 

[Netserk]

He wasn't the only one to go down there, and he was in the middle of the bunch. It was a technical corner, yeah, but it was hardly him misjudging a descent, he went down because of the white painting making the surface extremely sleek at places. How many riders crashed that day? A whole *** lot.

Unfortunately, I cannot find a video of it at this moment, but it is ridiculous to use such an incident as an example of poor descending.

 

[Gigs_98]

Was he even taking any risks at that point? After all that's what this discussion was originally about, right? Whether Nibali can only attack downhill by taking a lot of risk, which according to some people, is why he crashes a lot. But if you crash in the middle of the bunch that has something to do with inattentiveness, not with taking too many risks.

 

[Nirvana]

Re:

I'm pretty sure he was alone on the ground near the fences, i don't think there is a video but i remember i've seen some photos. A lot of crashes that day but in different moments not with him.

Anyways yesterday i posted a list of nine different crashes, not only this one.

 

[Flat Out]

I can't believe we are discussing Nibali's descending ability which won him a Giro, 2 Lombardia and a Sanremo. If he is not good, the peloton just sucks...

 

[42x16ss]

I’ve been giving the other half of the OP some thought - what about the guys who are good in totally sh!t weather?

In recent years there’s been Stannard and Paolini. Then there’s Hampsten’s epic ride on the Gavia in 1988.

At the other end of the spectrum, Wigans

 

[SafeBet]

Ciolek in Sanremo?

 

[Bolder]

Re:

The best descenders are not the best climbers ...we just see the climbers . The best descenders are the guys who chase behind to catch the climbers or the sprinters wanting to avoid the cut

Magnus Backstedt and Sean Kelly ...brilliant descenders but not top climbers

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zj-8Vwfjrxo

Bardet is known for his descending. At least when he knows the piste!

I'm a terrible descender. I get 2-3 corners right, then completely bollix one...

 

[42x16ss]

Re:

Ciolek in Sanremo?

That was insane...

 

[Tonton]

Years ago, but his name has to be mentioned: Eddy Merckx.

 

[chiocciolis_calves]

Re:

The best descenders are not the best climbers ...we just see the climbers . The best descenders are the guys who chase behind to catch the climbers or the sprinters wanting to avoid the cut

Magnus Backstedt and Sean Kelly ...brilliant descenders but not top climbers

100% correct.

 

[Pantani_lives]

Thor Hushovd, Axel Merckx, Stephen Roche... Currently Nibali and Bardet. I also remember Indurain taking Rominger back in a descent in 1993...

 

[EroicaStradeBianche]

There are a lot of crashes of Nibali:

*Stage 5 of 2009 Eneco Tour in the descent just before the finish in Sittard-Geleen.
*Montalcino stage of 2010 Giro in the descent before the sterrato.
*Lombardia 2010 in the descent of Sormano.
*Lombardia 2012 in the descent of Ghisallo.
*Pescara stage of 2013 Giro in the last descent trying to drop Wiggins.
*World Championship 2013 in the descent of Fiesole before penultimate lap.
*Lombardia 2013 in early stages of the race.
*Stage 19 of 2016 Tour in descent to Domancy before the final climb to Sanit-Gervais Mont Blanc.
*Angliru stage of 2017 Vuelta in the descent of Cordal.

And maybe I'm even missing some on minor races.

Montalcino stage i'm sure it was a peloton crash, apparently caused by Scarponi.
In Stage 19 of Tour 2016 Froome crashed in front of him.

But he crashes sometimes on the wet: Rio, Angliru, Florence

The others I don't know if they were his fault.



Savoldelli used to say that Cipollini was the best decider in the peloton

 

[rghysens]

Re:

Thor Hushovd, Axel Merckx, Stephen Roche... Currently Nibali and Bardet. I also remember Indurain taking Rominger back in a descent in 1993...

Yep, Tourmalet. Closing about a minute in the first 4km of the descent.

Years ago, but his name has to be mentioned: Eddy Merckx.

And considered by Merckx as the superior descender: Rinus Wagtmans. Wagtmans created the gap in the descent from Orcieres-Merlette that enabled Merckx to take back some minutes the day after.

 

[SHAD0W93]

There are a lot of crashes of Nibali:

*Stage 5 of 2009 Eneco Tour in the descent just before the finish in Sittard-Geleen.
*Montalcino stage of 2010 Giro in the descent before the sterrato.
*Lombardia 2010 in the descent of Sormano.
*Lombardia 2012 in the descent of Ghisallo.
*Pescara stage of 2013 Giro in the last descent trying to drop Wiggins.
*World Championship 2013 in the descent of Fiesole before penultimate lap.
*Lombardia 2013 in early stages of the race.
*Stage 19 of 2016 Tour in descent to Domancy before the final climb to Sanit-Gervais Mont Blanc.
*Angliru stage of 2017 Vuelta in the descent of Cordal.

And maybe I'm even missing some on minor races.

Montalcino stage i'm sure it was a peloton crash, apparently caused by Scarponi.
In Stage 19 of Tour 2016 Froome crashed in front of him.

But he crashes sometimes on the wet: Rio, Angliru, Florence

The others I don't know if they were his fault.



Savoldelli used to say that Cipollini was the best decider in peloton

Maybe that's why he never wanted to ride mountain stages besides in the Giro, so no one finds out.

 

[Leinster]

Re:

Thor Hushovd, Axel Merckx, Stephen Roche... Currently Nibali and Bardet. I also remember Indurain taking Rominger back in a descent in 1993...

If you go back to the 90s, Sean Yates was definitely up there. The Maillot Jaune group would be on the rivet through the valley after the 3rd col of the day and suddenly a Motorola jersey with short shorts and the bars dipped down to an almost Fred-like angle would appear on the front driving along.

 

[GuyIncognito]

About 2010 or so when the Tour de France peloton were asked to vote on the best (Thor Hushovd followed by Samuel Sanchez) and worst (David Moncoutie followed by Frank Schleck) descender, they interviewed one of the moto men who had driven one of the race motorcycles for a very long time, to get his opinion.

He said the best descenders he saw were all sprinters - which is common knowledge already - but did say one other was up there with them. Virenque. Eventually when pressed, he named Vichot - father not son - LeMond and Pantani as also quite good. Then he ended with "but Konyshev was better than all of them"