Heras positive overturned

[Fearless Greg Lemond]

Rodirto was framed.

 

[BroDeal]

I have no problem with Heras being given back his title. His case was FUBAR. Mayo was screwed as well when his B sample did not come out as the UCI wanted so it was tested again in another lab. It was the ol' test 'til you get the result you want ploy.

 

[Old School]

Rodirto was framed.

Lance did it!

 

[python]

i really don't care who won the vuelta in 2005 or any year from about early 90's to mid-late 00's.

the chance that the podium-ers of the period were not epo/blood doped is less than 10% in my opinion. thus i believe that all grand tour winners of the period should be voided just like the tour did with the armstrong wins in the same period !

the 2 questions i really would like to know the answers to are:

-why spain allows its judiciary interfering in wada-domain sporting matters ?
-why having so many good arguments heras did not go to cas ?

 

[Fearless Greg Lemond]

Lance did it!

The truth is out there young grasshopper.

One thing is for sure, leaving Bruyneel/Lanceboy is allmost a garanty for a posive:
* Hamilton
* Heras
* Landis
* Contador

Could all be a coincidence of course, but still.

 

[will10]

The truth is out there young grasshopper.

One thing is for sure, leaving Bruyneel/Lanceboy is allmost a garanty for a posive:
* Hamilton
* Heras
* Landis
* Contador

Could all be a coincidence of course, but still.

It was either Tyler or Vaughters who pointed out that those who left USPS thought there'd be other doctors working with other teams who'd be just as good as Del Moral, Ferrari and Marti - but they weren't.

 

[ChrisE]

It was either Tyler or Vaughters who pointed out that those who left USPS thought there'd be other doctors working with other teams who'd be just as good as Del Moral, Ferrari and Marti - but they weren't.

That explains why FL did doping basically on his own the 2 years after he left USPS, and then got caught with something he claims he wasn't using rolleyes:, I know). All of the other cocktail of drugs he admitted to apparently went undetected. This back-of-the-shed doping scheme won the TdF in 2006, and if FL is to be believed then it doesn't matter who his doctor was; he got popped for something not in his system (so he claims) and won the tour without the help of a magic doctor. Go figure.

WTF does Vaughters know outside of USPS and CA? Aren't we to believe CA was clean? Of course then they didn't have a team wide doping program.

WTF is "just as good" of doctors? After USPS TH nearly won the Giro on a broken shoulder, won LBL, placed high in the tour on a broken collarbone, and was shredding the field in 2004 before going overboard. When in his career has TH shown that type of ability? Was it in 2000 and 2001 while getting shelled when the road turned up in the tour while with the good USPS docs?

Originally Posted by Fearless Greg Lemond
The truth is out there young grasshopper.

One thing is for sure, leaving Bruyneel/Lanceboy is allmost a garanty for a posive:
* Hamilton
* Heras
* Landis
* Contador

Could all be a coincidence of course, but still.

Yes, the wrath of LA laying in the weeds to strike at the right moment. It may be inconvenient but please recall the UCI tried to cover up AC's positive.

Why not get Heras popped at the tour where he was a threat, instead of in a race LA was not competing in, after he was retired?

Hamilton got warned, and then continued to dope apparently pretty blatantly. He sure was in LA's sights in 2002 and 2003.

There was massive incentive to squash AAF's, especially in races the cash cow was winning. There still is, as long as there is not an independent entity to administer drug testing and punishment.

 

[Fearless Greg Lemond]

Yes, the wrath of LA laying in the weeds to strike at the right moment. It may be inconvenient but please recall the UCI tried to cover up AC's positive.

Why not get Heras popped at the tour where he was a threat, instead of in a race LA was not competing in, after he was retired?

Hamilton got warned, and then continued to dope apparently pretty blatantly. He sure was in LA's sights in 2002 and 2003.

There was massive incentive to squash AAF's, especially in races the cash cow was winning. There still is, as long as there is not an independent entity to administer drug testing and punishment.

Keep breathing Chris. I merely make a link. Possibly Heras and the others didn't get the pre-control-warnings as stated the US Postals got? How about the email dear old Lance made about possible 'things' going on in Spain after he got beaten at the Dauphinee [http://autobus.cyclingnews.com/news.php?id=news/2004/jun04/jun08news2]?

How about the rift between Hamilton and dear old Lance about Lance's blabbermouthing?

 

[ChrisE]

Keep breathing Chris. I merely make a link. Possibly Heras and the others didn't get the pre-control-warnings as stated the US Postals got? How about the email dear old Lance made about possible 'things' going on in Spain after he got beaten at the Dauphinee [http://autobus.cyclingnews.com/news.php?id=news/2004/jun04/jun08news2]?

How about the rift between Hamilton and dear old Lance about Lance's blabbermouthing?

The only link that is there is what TH claims FL told him about the UCI heads up in 2004, which you note.

Possibly people didn't get pre-control warnings? Was that after TH had those 2002/03 seasons and early 2004? Was that after FL won the stage to Morzine, when he knew he would be tested? I am sure it was a shock that AC would be tested while wearing yellow.

Was it lack of pre-control warning that TH claims caused him problems in 2004? FL in 06? Surely in their present state of running their mouths this would have been one of the victim cards tossed out. You are straining to find a link here that doesn't exist.

I will remind you that Heras won the Vuelta in 2000, 2004, and 2005 while not on USPS. TH and FL showed much more ability after USPS. FL got popped in the wake of OP. There was a totally different landscape in 06 and 07 IMO, then back to business as usual.

I am unclear on why you don't think it is incentive to cover up positives, and just because LA throws a fit the UCI etal would bring that bad press upon themselves. Or, why LA thinks it would be good for business if all of his competitors got popped while he was beating them "clean".

 

[Fearless Greg Lemond]

I am unclear on why you don't think it is incentive to cover up positives, and just because LA throws a fit the UCI etal would bring that bad press upon themselves. Or, why LA thinks it would be good for business if all of his competitors got popped while he was beating them "clean".

I know 12 million dollars of incentive Chris. Hamilton and the Spaniards were getting pretty close to wonderboys level, he was scared sh@tless of Mayo and the other Fuentes rocketeers.

 

[DirtyWorks]

Possibly Heras and the others didn't get the pre-control-warnings as stated the US Postals got? How about the email dear old Lance made about possible 'things' going on in Spain after he got beaten at the Dauphinee [http://autobus.cyclingnews.com/news.php?id=news/2004/jun04/jun08news2]?

How about the rift between Hamilton and dear old Lance about Lance's blabbermouthing?

Funny how the UCI listened very, very closely to Wonderboy... How many different ways did Pat and Hein benefit from creating a 7x TdF winner myth?

 

[ChrisE]

I know 12 million dollars of incentive Chris. Hamilton and the Spaniards were getting pretty close to wonderboys level, he was scared sh@tless of Mayo and the other Fuentes rocketeers.

Nice diversion. You wrote this:

One thing is for sure, leaving Bruyneel/Lanceboy is allmost a garanty for a posive:
* Hamilton
* Heras
* Landis
* Contador

I admitted upthread the only proof we know of is Hamilton and Mayo, according to FL. You gave nothing other than babble about the others, and I have provided facts pointing to the opposite.

I stand by my assertion that there is much more incentive to cover up positives by the UCI, and much more incentive for LA not to have his competition failing drug tests, especially in the TdF or other races he was involved in. I take it that Hamilton/Mayo was a one off, and I will remind you again that Hamilton was only warned and still continued to transfuse. What a victim. I can imagine how many such 'warnings' occured when riders were too blatant with their testing that it would be hard to keep it under wraps.

It's also surprising that now Fuentes is making "rocketeers", much to the chagrine of those under the watchful eye of the wizard of oz Ferrari. I thought Fuentes was the sloppy huckster, no match for Ferrari's rocket science. Maybe you and will10 need to huddle up and get the story straight.

 

[the sceptic]

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/heras-sues-for-one-million-euros

Hopefully this clean champion will finally get some justice.

 

[Bullrun]

http://www.marca.com/ciclismo/2017/05/08/5910545fe2704e21038b45d2.html

Spanish taxpayers condemned to pay €724.000 in damages to Vuelta's record 3 times winner Robert Heras.

 

[ice&fire]

Re:

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/heras-sues-for-one-million-euros

Hopefully this clean champion will finally get some justice.

He almost got it! The Supreme Court has ruled a compensation of 724904 €

http://www.elespanol.com/deportes/ciclismo/20170508/214478757_0.html

 

[Valv.Piti]

Nice. Roberto is a legend of our sport, one of the best climbers, but is very easily forgotten. I have only fond memories of the guy.

 

[slowspoke]

Re:

Nice. Roberto is a legend of our sport, one of the best climbers, but is very easily forgotten. I have only fond memories of the guy.

Champion

http://www.cyclingweekly.com/news/latest-news/heras-crowned-world-champion-65866

 

[Cance > TheRest]

Re:

Nice. Roberto is a legend of our sport, one of the best climbers, but is very easily forgotten. I have only fond memories of the guy.

Sometimes he's a little forgotten, perhaps, but that's also largely because he chose his races very selectively and rarely showed much outside the Vuelta (at least after he switched from Kelme). He could have challenged Armstrong in the mountrains in the Tour, but he was either his domestique or riding a low-key-build-up for the Vuelta. Heras was my first true idol of the sport Seeing him seal the win in the 2005 Vuelta, the day Menchov cracked in the rain, remains the ultimate Vuelta memory for me.

 

[hrotha]

I get that, legally speaking, there was no choice but to overturn the verdict, but let's not turn Heras into a victim here. This is not "nice". This is another unrepentant doper walking away.

 

[BullsFan22]

The Spanish sure are friendly to their dopers. Surprising that they let Contador lose the titles he did after the 2010 positive.

 

[hrotha]

Re:

.............up there with 'never testing positive'

................my sample was mishandled

Mark L

It was mishandled. Outrageously so.

 

[movingtarget]

I'm sure the South Park creators could write something to do justice to this BS. Words fail me.

 

[Alpe d'Huez]

Never thought he was clean (was anyone who won anything back then?) but always thought he got the short end of the stick the way he was bounced from the Vuelta, then blacklisted from the sport.

There are interviews with Roberto out there (in Spanish) where he doesn't confess, but talks about regrets about decisions he made and who he associated with. You can sense he's remorseful, even shameful, about the dark days, but with all the endless lawsuits, it's impossible for him to come clean even if he wanted to, without tossing everything away, including large amounts of money.

He was definitely a great, great climber, and I always was disappointed that he never truly had a season where he focused solely on the Giro or Tour. But he did have some great Vuelta wins, and always a joy to watch in the mountains.

 

[BullsFan22]

Re:

Never thought he was clean (was anyone who won anything back then?) but always thought he got the short end of the stick the way he was bounced from the Vuelta, then blacklisted from the sport.

There are interviews with Roberto out there (in Spanish) where he doesn't confess, but talks about regrets about decisions he made and who he associated with. You can sense he's remorseful, even shameful, about the dark days, but with all the endless lawsuits, it's impossible for him to come clean even if he wanted to, without tossing everything away, including large amounts of money.

He was definitely a great, great climber, and I always was disappointed that he never truly had a season where he focused solely on the Giro or Tour. But he did have some great Vuelta wins, and always a joy to watch in the mountains.

Nice post Alpe!

 

[Benotti69]

Re:

I'm sure the South Park creators could write something to do justice to this BS. Words fail me.

I think you will find that laws and constitutions favour those that can afford 'justice' rather than applying 'justice' in every case.

But the world of professional sport has gone way beyond south park or the simpsons in its laughability.

Dopers being awarded big sums. Whislteblowers being hounded. You cant make this shite up!!!!