Hinault Taking a Shot at Armstrong

[BroDeal]

BigBoat's earlier point about narcissicistic personality disorder (see the Wikipedia entry on this) seems relevant. If you watch the Giro videos of the One, narcissim was the word that came to mind. Reality shows and Twitter etc. today are promoting a sort of general unbridled exhibitionist narcissim among lots of people.

Then again, most people act out of mixed motives, some base, some pure, including philanthropy (which could be a mix of both). Look at Bill Gates: great at philanthropy, but it came after bruising court battles where his image was battered. He's a human being, like everybody else.

That was me saying Armstrong has a NPD. I am pretty sure it is true...or very nearly true.

Gates follows a long line of robber barons who broke the law and harmed society to get uber wealthy, but then bought their way to respectability using philanthropy. It is disgusting that this sort of thing works with the sheople in America.

 

[Anonymous]

That was me saying Armstrong has a NPD. I am pretty sure it is true...or very nearly true.

Gates follows a long line of robber barons who broke the law and harmed society to get uber wealthy, but then bought their way to respectability using philanthropy. It is disgusting that this sort of thing works with the sheople in America.

+1

.....as I use a PC to post this. I really do detest Gates about as much as Armstrong. I guess if I were less into cycling and more into computers, I would invert that.

 

[whiteboytrash]

Pot kettle.

.... P00f !

 

[BigBoat]

Not all great champions are nice people, they are often ruthless, agressive and selfish. It sort of goes with the territory.

Hinault has a ferocity and a directness that looks majestic expressed in a bike race but a little inappropriate in a press conference or media interview.

It's quite common in sport. You can be gladiatorial in the sporting arena and it is celebrated. It's one of the things many athletes enjoy (and miss when they retire) - you can think, say and do things on the road, playing field, water, mat, ice... that are unacceptable in normal life.


I quite like directness myself

You think Hinault is out of line here I think.... I dont agree. Just look at the facts:

If Lance raced against these men of the past during the 1980s Lance would have never ever stood a chance even with what was available. This has whats changed and its what ****es off these old timers (legends).

Hinault's V02 max was 90 I believe and this was with an undoped crit. He'd have atleast 5% more FT power per kilo than Lance, along with a long long list of guys that can get better than 82 V02 max... Hinault won his tours on born muscle, so did Indurain and Riis and Ullrich! All had undoped V02 maxes and FTPs far higher than Lance. You have to look at Lances pre- Dr. Ferrari Tour rides which were a DNF in 1993, a DNF in 1994, a 36th in 1995 and another DNF in 1996. Lance was a "mule" for some other future Tour winner or at best a stage winner while jacked on epo and HGH. Things have become so wacked with Lance, and he has become so incredibly arrogant, shooting off about all his hard work "busting his as$" which is a load of CRAP! Pre-Ferrari he knows damn well he never ever would have been top 30. Clean he'd have been dropped by the pack and DNFd the opening stages.

 

[bianchigirl]

Not quite sure why Armstrong thinks Hinault is a w*nker? Isn't he saying what Armstrong has always claimed his success is built on - that the French need to train harder?

That's an interesting debate, of course - I recall Chavanel gave a series of interviews to Equipe at the beginning of the season where he claimed he'd never trained so hard as he has with Quickstep. And the earpiece comments are bang on - just because we have technology doesn't mean we have to slavishly employ it.

 

[nobody]

If Chavanel hoped to have access to some miraculous O2 expander he has to explain why he will improve... the hard work is always a good argument

 

[Alpe d'Huez]

July is just going to be one long Armstrong media fest

That's the one thing that bothers me most. Just like the Giro, we'll see endless camera shots of him and talk of him, even if he's not close to contention. Is that all there is to the sport? What a shame.

Anyone here remember in about 1992 when Merckx was asked what he thought of Indurain, Bugno, Rominger and he blurted out "These guys would carry my luggage." He later laughed about it, and gave the PC answer that champions on one era are champions in another, blah, blah. But I think that first answer really was what he felt considering about the time Indurain started mopping up, the era of bold attacking went away.

In order to rise to the level these guys are, you have to be hyper driven and competitive.

The big problem I have with Roger Federer is that he sold his soul to Nike. The guy has swooshes plastered all over himself. It's disgusting. Isn't his winnings enough, that he has to sell out to big corporate? And Nike at that? (Of course, this applies to other athletes as well, but Roger may be the most).

 

[BikeCentric]

I smell a rat........... methinks this is just the beginning. Hinault is in on this with Armstrong. Build enough French resentment to make the story even more overblown than it already is. July is just going to be one long Armstrong media fest and now Hinault and ASO are buying into it as they know everyone stands to benefit from it. To the Armstrong fanboys who eat this stuff up - you're man is taking you for a ride.

As I perused the papershop this morning I thought about purchasing one of the Tour de France guides as I like to keep the route map of each stage near the TV. Not this year. Of the three guides published each of them has a front cover with the line "Armstrong Comeback - Can he win again ?" No mention of any other cyclist. Give me a break.

You're right about this, and I'm already getting worried about Le Tour. Every damn summer the Tour is the same thing for me - it's like an ex-girlfriend that I KNOW I shouldn't get back together with but I just can't help myself. And of course the first week is just AMAZING. Then as the weeks go on all the old dirty laundry comes back out to the forefront and I remember why it was such a bad relationship and how I shouldn't have gotten involved with it again.

That's the Tour! Should we make predications on who's going to get thrown out this year?

 

[BroDeal]

That's the one thing that bothers me most. Just like the Giro, we'll see endless camera shots of him and talk of him, even if he's not close to contention. Is that all there is to the sport? What a shame.

After a while I just turned the sound off to the live Giro coverage. Even after it was clear Armstrong would be lucky to squeak into the GC top ten and US got a new commentator, they seemed to play up the possibility that Armstrong might pull a Landis at any moment and vault into he lead.

Maybe the french video team will prove to not be a bunch of bootlickers like the italian one was. We can hope.

 

[Anonymous]

That's the one thing that bothers me most. Just like the Giro, we'll see endless camera shots of him and talk of him, even if he's not close to contention. Is that all there is to the sport? What a shame.

Anyone here remember in about 1992 when Merckx was asked what he thought of Indurain, Bugno, Rominger and he blurted out "These guys would carry my luggage." He later laughed about it, and gave the PC answer that champions on one era are champions in another, blah, blah. But I think that first answer really was what he felt considering about the time Indurain started mopping up, the era of bold attacking went away.

In order to rise to the level these guys are, you have to be hyper driven and competitive.

The big problem I have with Roger Federer is that he sold his soul to Nike. The guy has swooshes plastered all over himself. It's disgusting. Isn't his winnings enough, that he has to sell out to big corporate? And Nike at that? (Of course, this applies to other athletes as well, but Roger may be the most).

I was watching the Prefontaine Classic this weekend, and the women's 1500 came on, and with the exception of two runners (the rabbit and a runner from the University of Colorado), all of the women were in yellow "Livestrong" singlets. It honestly made me want to puke.

 

[BikeCentric]

After a while I just turned the sound off to the live Giro coverage. Even after it was clear Armstrong would be lucky to squeak into the GC top ten and US got a new commentator, they seemed to play up the possibility that Armstrong might pull a Landis at any moment and vault into he lead.

Maybe the french video team will prove to not be a bunch of bootlickers like the italian one was. We can hope.

In the US you know we're going to be stuck with Phil and Paul and as you know those two only talk about English speaking riders anyway so we're going to have to O.D. on pharmstrong whether we like it or not. Why can't that ******* just retire and go away?! I may have to quit watching this sport again just to get away from LA. But what sport is there to watch in July? NFL training camps?! No thanks.

 

[BroDeal]

I was watching the Prefontaine Classic this weekend, and the women's 1500 came on, and with the exception of two runners (the rabbit and a runner from the University of Colorado), all of the women were in yellow "Livestrong" singlets. It honestly made me want to puke.

There is a sick plan there. Promote a brand for cancer awareness and then commercialize it.

 

[Anonymous]

There is a sick plan there. Promote a brand for cancer awareness and then commercialize it.

The Nike swoosh was quite visible....

Couldn't find a picture of the women's but here is one from the men's: http://photos.oregonlive.com/oregonian/2009/06/prefontaine_track_meet_june_7_16.html

Cancer not only sells bikes, but shoes and shorts and golf equipment and....well, just as with Trek, they will never get a cent of my money.

 

[whiteboytrash]

There is a sick plan there. Promote a brand for cancer awareness and then commercialize it.

- Well there is a reason for this mass commercialization and its not awareness......
______

Even The House That Lance Built, the expansive 447-acre property near Dripping Springs, Texas, has been hurt by the suffering economy.

Placed on the market early this year for $12 million, the five- bedroom, five-bathroom, 4,241 square-foot home, has been reduced in priced to $10.5 million.

The house, which Armstrong built in 2003 has a negative-edge pool, fire pits, outside living and dining areas and a recreation building with a full bathroom.

The acreage also has seven miles of hike-and-bike trails, Hill Country views, 1,886 feet of frontage on the Pedernales River and ownership in Dead Man's Hole, the famous natural swimming pool.

Armstrong owns another Austin home, but currently lives with with girlfriend Anna Hansen in a newly built home in Aspen, Colo. Armstrong and Hansen announced the birth of their son, Max, last week.

http://image.examiner.com/images/blog/wysiwyg/image/lance'shouse1.jpg

 

[whiteboytrash]

...and the money just keeps rolling in. This comeback was a great idea for awareness........

______

RTTNews) - Monday, Hartford Financial Services Group Inc. (HIG: News ) announced it is joining forces with the Lance Armstrong Foundation to offer a product aimed at helping Americans protect their physical and financial health against cancer. In an ongoing effort to battle the disease and support cancer survivors, Hartford has launched the LIVESTRONG Wellness Protection Plan, a guaranteed-issue, multi-benefit product that helps promote early detection of cancer and financial protection in the case of a diagnosis.

The company said by purchasing the LIVESTRONG Wellness Protection Plan, consumers will help further the fight against cancer. A percentage of each policy's premium will be given to the Lance Armstrong Foundation. - 45c in the dollar just to Lance folks ! The guy is a crook !

Click here to receive FREE breaking news email alerts for Hartford Financial Services Group Inc. and others in your portfolio

 

[ElChingon]

Armstrong was unimpressed and let fire on his Twitter feed. "What a whanker. Five TdF wins doesn't buy you any common sense," he stated, referring to the comments and further fanning the flames.

When did Lance start to use British slang? Is he trying to be like Madona and gain an English accent (at least in writing)?

Makes me think he has some English writer boy doing his twits as of late.

 

[BigBoat]

I was watching the Prefontaine Classic this weekend, and the women's 1500 came on, and with the exception of two runners (the rabbit and a runner from the University of Colorado), all of the women were in yellow "Livestrong" singlets. It honestly made me want to puke.

Yeah I totally agree with your bro... I was going to say something about it but it wouldnt have been appropriate.

 

[COLIN LAING]

Yellow singlets

It also annoyed me that after watching an excellent track-meet, I realised why almost all the athletes wore yellow , A close-up shot then informed me of the LIVESTRONG LOGO,,,it very nearly made me send back my yellow, plastic wrist band, except I didn't buy one in the first place...

 

[franciep10]

Listen this is the one thing that I detest with you guys, whatever the man has done in his racing career, I appreciate Livestrong, I appreciate what it has done to help my best friend and mother so you talk about you want to puke when you see a band that's ridiculous, fine he's an *** he has contributed to destroying cycling but I appreciate Livestrong, hell I own a livestong band not in support of him but in acknowledgment to what they have done for my family and freinds.

 

[BroDeal]

It also annoyed me that after watching an excellent track-meet, I realised why almost all the athletes wore yellow , A close-up shot then informed me of the LIVESTRONG LOGO,,,it very nearly made me send back my yellow, plastic wrist band, except I didn't buy one in the first place...

A couple of months ago I was googling for the number of calories in some kind of food, clicked a link to a site I had never heard of, thedailyplate.com, and found out it was owned by or in cahoots with Livestrong.com.

It looks like there has been a massive effort to monetize the brand.

 

[davidg]

"What a whanker. Five TdF wins doesn't buy you any common sense,"

I think it has been misquoted.

"What a vainqueur, ..doesnt buy you common cents"

which before the Euro of course it would have bought Hinault French Francs. So nothing inflammatory at all really.

 

[Anonymous]

Listen this is the one thing that I detest with you guys, whatever the man has done in his racing career, I appreciate Livestrong, I appreciate what it has done to help my best friend and mother so you talk about you want to puke when you see a band that's ridiculous, fine he's an *** he has contributed to destroying cycling but I appreciate Livestrong, hell I own a livestong band not in support of him but in acknowledgment to what they have done for my family and freinds.

What you don't understand the the fact that cancer is now marketed to put money in the pockets of Nike and Trek and Mr Armstrong's. See, those "Livestrong" singlets are much more likely to result in the sales of jerseys than they are donations Mr Armstrong's foundation. Yea, 1 cent on the dollar (unscientific, but I suspect pretty close to the mark mind you) MIGHT make it to actual charitable work, but the profit wrought by the corporations FAR EXCEEDS the net taken in by the actual charity. In light of that, riddle me this, what is the real sell here? Cancer charity or cancer used to sell things. I for one firmly believe in the latter considering that Nike has used 8 year old children to make their shoes because their delicate little hands do more precise work......and they will work for a month for what it costs you to buy a cup of coffee at Starbucks. I am guessing that while everyone abhors cancer, Nike would dump the whole thing in a heartbeat if the margins shrunk.

You'll have to excuse me if I don't feel the need to put "Livestrong" on a pedestal above the man himself or his sponsors. And again, I worked in a camp for kids with cancer 6 summers, my mother had cancer, and I have lost two friends to cancer. Pardon me if I don't fall all over myself at the sad tales told by people who believe Mr Armstrong. I for one find nothing but greater disdain for Mr Armstrong because of you story.

 

[Anonymous]

It also annoyed me that after watching an excellent track-meet, I realised why almost all the athletes wore yellow , A close-up shot then informed me of the LIVESTRONG LOGO,,,it very nearly made me send back my yellow, plastic wrist band, except I didn't buy one in the first place...

so hang on, one minute you are all moaning because lance is promoting himself and not cancer awareness and livestrong

next you are critising him for the livestrong brand and awareness being promoted...

(i have actually done some research into the dot com funding since someone said the .com was just exploiting people for money. interesting what ive found out..)

but anyway..

i thought hinaults comments about lance where completely uninteresting compared with his comments about french riders etc...

nobody got any thoughts on those.. bunch of lazy bhastards he seemed to imply they where..

 

[franciep10]

What you don't understand the the fact that cancer is now marketed to put money in the pockets of Nike and Trek and Mr Armstrong's. See, those "Livestrong" singlets are much more likely to result in the sales of jerseys than they are donations Mr Armstrong's foundation. Yea, 1 cent on the dollar (unscientific, but I suspect pretty close to the mark mind you) MIGHT make it to actual charitable work, but the profit wrought by the corporations FAR EXCEEDS the net taken in by the actual charity. In light of that, riddle me this, what is the real sell here? Cancer charity or cancer used to sell things. I for one firmly believe in the latter considering that Nike has used 8 year old children to make their shoes because their delicate little hands do more precise work......and they will work for a month for what it costs you to buy a cup of coffee at Starbucks. I am guessing that while everyone abhors cancer, Nike would dump the whole thing in a heartbeat if the margins shrunk.

You'll have to excuse me if I don't feel the need to put "Livestrong" on a pedestal above the man himself or his sponsors. And again, I worked in a camp for kids with cancer 6 summers, my mother had cancer, and I have lost two friends to cancer. Again, pardon me if I don't fall all over myself at the sad tales told by people who believe Mr Armstrong. I for one find nothing but greater disdain for Mr Armstrong because of you story.

I hear what you're saying and I thought exactly the way you did about livestrong when my friend said his doctor contacted them, but then they started helping out with doctors finding great doctors that work with them so he get's a big discount in fees and when he couldn't pay they paid his doctor and hospital bills, they also helped my mom before she passed on. Now I don't believe what armstrong says I don't like what he does on the bike and I know livestrong is a business and like most they'll do just about anything for money, but nonetheless. I appreciate Livestrong not LA.

 

[Anonymous]

Imagine this though, what if he had kept the last name on his birth certificate, Gunderson. "Liveunderson" just doesn't have that PAZZAZ now does it? I will give the guy one thing, he is lucky.