how long before Sagan trips the tripwire

[hfer07]

sagan is the next wunderkind can climb and tt like Mig, and sprint like Cav, and beats fellow chargers by a coupla lengths without a train. How long will he last...

FOA -you got it all wrong
Sagan has yet to prove "those skills" that you claim he's capable of-because "He can neither TT like Big MIg"-nor can he "Sprint like CAV"-let alone climbing among the best.....

If I have to describe him as a rider- I would say he's "a Predator" with this voracious appetite to win-no matter what kind of terrain he's on. As far as how long will he last- I guess as long as the desire & the motivation in him stays intact -I'd say until he stops riding

 

[zigmeister]

I always love these threads. Some internet loser can't comprehend what genetics and superior talent does for someone. So they create a thread making the assumption they are a doper.

TS, go back to your Doritos and Fish/Chips and sit in front of the telly and continue to wonder why you can't walk up a flight of stairs without nearly having a coronary.

 

[Hugh Januss]

the OP asked the right question.
it's not whether he dopes, but whether he can stay below the radar.

when was the last time a promising young pro-rider got popped? That's not in the uci's interest.
and if the uci want to develop cycling in countries other than france, spain, italy and the netherlands, probably the uci's intention will be to let sagan develop himself further and put cycling on the map in slovakia.
and sagan doesn't look like the shoot-yourself-in-the-foot-kind of type either.
he's mentally probably more balanced than ricco. so we might see more of this guy before he gets popped.

This here is the correct answer. As an up and coming superstar from a relatively untapped fan base Sagan is most likely solidly in UCI's good books, and as it seems he is not doing anything outside the norm in terms of "program" he will not get caught. Where the OP's logic fails is when he equates winning 4 straight sprint finishes at a secondary 1 week stage race against virtually no front line sprinters with "time trialing like Indurain" and whatever other sillyness he wrote.

 

[zigmeister]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RDS6izhk1ZE&feature=related

Even if Boonen and Kittel are in the group, both likely to have suffered more on the hills than Sagan. Just look at the 2nd place the whole time. He's beaten Haussler 4 times, it's not like it's Cavendish, Gilbert, Cancellara, Contador that he's beaten on the flat, the hills, the cobbles and the mountains respectively. He's beaten another semi-sprinter 4 times.

Semi sprinters? Seriously? Kittel, Boonen, Hausler?

:eyes roll:

 

[Hugh Januss]

Semi sprinters? Seriously? Kittel, Boonen, Hausler?

:eyes roll:

Ah, so you're saying he is doping then?

 

[Semper Fidelis]

BlackCat is putting forth the question. You cats on the other hand are getting a little carried away with your defense of a cyclist.

 

[hrotha]

BlackCat is putting forth the question. You cats on the other hand are getting a little carried away with your defense of a cyclist.

Few people here have said or even implied that Sagan is clean. The replies have focused on pointing out how *** the OP is.

 

[classicomano]

Where are the chin comparisons?

 

[sniper]

Note that Sagan speaks really fluent italian. Near-natively I'd say.
He definitely could not have acquired that level of competence in the two years he's been with Liquigas.
Wonder what contacts he had in Italy before turning a pro.

Anyway, Sagan has everything: talent, looks.
I don't expect this guy to get popped any day soon, at least if Pat has anything to say about it.

 

[Zam_Olyas]

Not exactly tt like indurain.

 

[mewmewmew13]

Note that Sagan speaks really fluent italian. Near-natively I'd say.
He definitely could not have acquired that level of competence in the two years he's been with Liquigas.
Wonder what contacts he had in Italy before turning a pro.

Anyway, Sagan has everything: talent, looks.
I don't expect this guy to get popped any day soon, at least if Pat has anything to say about it.

YOU should stop trying to make trouble where there is none.

 

[hrotha]

Note that Sagan speaks really fluent italian. Near-natively I'd say.
He definitely could not have acquired that level of competence in the two years he's been with Liquigas.
Wonder what contacts he had in Italy before turning a pro.

Hahaha, what? And you complain about Florecita.

 

[robow7]

Not exactly tt like indurain.

Yea, he killed that TT today, wonder what he was on? Oh yea, his bike Finished in 52 nd place, good way to throw everyone off his PED trail.

 

[Caruut]

Semi sprinters? Seriously? Kittel, Boonen, Hausler?

:eyes roll:

Well, Haussler was the only one I actually called a semi-sprinter if you read my post, but I guess that would be too much work. He's not an out-and-out sprinter, hence a semi-sprinter. The point being, if Haussler is getting all these 2nds, then the sprint field isn't exactly stellar. Kittel is a pure sprinter, but he's not even been in the top 10 on any stages yet. More a case of Kittel's absence than Sagan's dominance with respect to Sagan vs Kittel. Boonen hasn't raced for ages and is getting back into form, but he also isn't quite as fast as he used to be.

If you look are the riders who've top-10'd, there are very few really good sprinters. Marc de Maar and George Hincapie have got top-10s. A few SpiderTech lads too. If Sagan had beaten Cavendish, Greipel, Goss, Feillu, Farrar and Hushovd, then you would have to think "This is a bit out of the ordinary". So far it's been as much the rest of them lacking in quality as Sagan having it in abundance.

 

[Caruut]

Note that Sagan speaks really fluent italian. Near-natively I'd say.
He definitely could not have acquired that level of competence in the two years he's been with Liquigas.
Wonder what contacts he had in Italy before turning a pro.

Anyway, Sagan has everything: talent, looks.
I don't expect this guy to get popped any day soon, at least if Pat has anything to say about it.

He speaks Italian, so the conclusion is that he learned it not from, say, a teacher, but from nefarious Italian doping contacts? So he has all these dodgy Italian contacts supplying him with drugs and making his Italian better than it would have been had he spent 2 years living and working in Italy, with Italians. Once he's learned Italian from his dodgy contact he thinks "**** it. I'm going to Belgium". Then, after getting turned down by QuickStep, he says to himself "Hang on a minute, I know fluent Italian, why don't I try and get a ride in Italy?". Seems legit.

 

[Zam_Olyas]

He speaks Italian, so the conclusion is that he learned it not from, say, a teacher, but from nefarious Italian doping contacts? So he has all these dodgy Italian contacts supplying him with drugs and making his Italian better than it would have been had he spent 2 years living and working in Italy, with Italians. Once he's learned Italian from his dodgy contact he thinks "**** it. I'm going to Belgium". Then, after getting turned down by QuickStep, he says to himself "Hang on a minute, I know fluent Italian, why don't I try and get a ride in Italy?". Seems legit.

 

[Semper Fidelis]

Few people here have said or even implied that Sagan is clean. The replies have focused on pointing out how *** the OP is.

Why attack BlackCat? Calling someone *** is classic bs retort. Surprised you can call someone a *** on this forum. Thanks for the use of this I will use it any time I do not agree with a thread or post.

 

[barn yard]

you cant say sagan is cheating based on 4 stage wins against america's best shop mechanics

 

[Caruut]

Why attack BlackCat? Calling someone *** is classic bs retort. Surprised you can call someone a *** on this forum. Thanks for the use of this I will use it any time I do not agree with a thread or post.

Calling someone *** is perhaps unnecessary, but at the same time, the OP's post was ridiculous. His argument that Sagan must be juicing is based the idea that he can:

TT like Mig - as today showed, this is clearly not true.
Sprint like Cav - clearly not true.
Beat fellow chargers by a couple of lengths without a train - not sure exactly who these chargers are, but I think Daniel Oss might take issue with the "no train" comment, and several of his wins were pretty tight.

It's hard to have a reasonable discussion when the initial point is completely fallacious.

 

[Ripper]

Why attack BlackCat? Calling someone *** is classic bs retort. Surprised you can call someone a *** on this forum. Thanks for the use of this I will use it any time I do not agree with a thread or post.

Go ahead and use it

Back on point, it is fair game to call out BC. He makes "points" that are actually quite false. Just one example - Sagan's TT today was hardly Mig like.

This not the first time BC has had some weird stuff to spout.

 

[sniper]

He speaks Italian, so the conclusion is that he learned it not from, say, a teacher, but from nefarious Italian doping contacts? So he has all these dodgy Italian contacts supplying him with drugs and making his Italian better than it would have been had he spent 2 years living and working in Italy, with Italians. Once he's learned Italian from his dodgy contact he thinks "**** it. I'm going to Belgium". Then, after getting turned down by QuickStep, he says to himself "Hang on a minute, I know fluent Italian, why don't I try and get a ride in Italy?". Seems legit.

funny, but:
not sure what quickstep or his current appointment at Liquigas have to do with anything. he clearly acquired italian prior to turning a pro.
you don't learn italian that fluently without going there on a regular basis (afaict). The two years at Liquigas don't suffice for reaching that level (imo), so does he have family there? or other contacts? you're not gonna find out if you don't ask the question, are you?

 

[sniper]

YOU should stop trying to make trouble where there is none.

I was being semi-sarcastic, for which there is no icon.
and then YOU had to start yelling at sniper. And YOU had to start make sniper's eyes rain. YOU are taking this stuff too heavily mewmew.


EDIT: take the whole thread + OP, there is a clear grain of irony in there, the proverbial "grain of salt", etc.
(Caruut, 6 posts, hrotha 4, in a thread you find ridiculous?)

BlackCat is putting forth the question. You cats on the other hand are getting a little carried away with your defense of a cyclist.

+1

 

[TomasC]

funny, but:
not sure what quickstep or his current appointment at Liquigas have to do with anything. he clearly acquired italian prior to turning a pro.
you don't learn italian that fluently without going there on a regular basis (afaict). The two years at Liquigas don't suffice for reaching that level (imo), so does he have family there? or other contacts? you're not gonna find out if you don't ask the question, are you?

From my own experience I think it's perfectly normal to speak Italian as he does after 2 years (even less) of living and working there (if you have at least some talent for languages).
What usually helps a lot is a native girlfriend, I don't know if this was the case though

 

[sniper]

From my own experience I think it's perfectly normal to speak Italian as he does after 2 years (even less) of living and working there (if you have at least some talent for languages).
What usually helps a lot is a native girlfriend, I don't know if this was the case though

the part in bold is very true. I was struggling alot with my German, until...

We seem to agree that you don't get that fluent in italian just by visiting an Italian language course in Slovakia. Romance languages are quite a bit away from Slavic languages.
As you say, he'd need to have a very decent talent for languages to become that fluent in Italian in two years. Surely it's not impossible, and indeed the girlfriend could have made all the difference.

 

[hrotha]

Why attack BlackCat? Calling someone *** is classic bs retort. Surprised you can call someone a *** on this forum. Thanks for the use of this I will use it any time I do not agree with a thread or post.

I didn't call him a ***. I said his post was ***. Or at least that was my intention - maybe OP doesn't mean what I thought it does.

It's OK to disagree about stuff. It's not OK to say Sagan climbs and TTs like Indurain, because that's just stupid.