I feel kind of bad for Horner

[Boeing]

Horner went back with Lance and didn't leave until Lance's last crash. Prior to that, it was clear he was barely working hard and Lance was suffering. At that point, the group was 2:30 to 3:00 back of the schleck/contador group, and Horner was allowed to go on his own.

He ended up 4:05 back... but I think it's fair to say that had he not been sent back for Lance, at the worst he'd have been around Wiggins time (1:45 back)... and maybe better. That was a solid solo ride for him up the last climb.

Sometimes you have to do what you are paid to do.

 

[kurtinsc]

Hey folks! Screw Horner, I agree with erader's comments on that matter. I feel really bad for Brajkovic. Play the tapes over, and look at his face did he even look like he was working at all during that chaperone assignment? He was up there, prior to todays debacle. But I guess he drew the short straw, and was assigned to escorting LA to the bitter end. So ends Janez's shot at a respectable finish. LA needed no company at the rate he was soft pedaling to the finish. And with the way RS is finishing the season after the TdF, the year is over for him too, at this point. After LA's third crash incident My wife proclaimed that LA won't finish the Tour...... let's see what happens next.

I agree about Brajkovic as well... I don't understand why Lance needed an escort once he quit. Why not let Brajkovic go too?

I understand why a single rider was sent back when Lance detached... maybe even two. He had just crashed before the cat-1 climb and perhaps the team thought he could reconnect on the descent with help.

But at a certain point, Lance quit. Horner and Brajkovic were no longer pulling. THAT's the point that I don't understand not letting BOTH of them go... Lance had already decided he was done.

It wasn't until a few minutes later (when the Contador group had gained another minute or so) that Lance had his last crash... and Horner was finally released. Brajkovic wasn't even pacing Lance... he was riding next to him. If Lance wanted company, he should have rode a bit slower and let Popovych catch back up. He'd already given up.

Heck, I'd have liked to see what Horner and Brajkovic could have done together chasing the main group... even starting from the point Lance crashed last. They might not have lost any additional time.

 

[lagartija]

Horner used to be kool, before he joined the shack, the minute i heard him say lance was the greatest cyclist , and smack talk contador from his arm chair view last year i realized he was drinking the koolade, to bad really, he HAD some integrity previously.............i realize he has a family to support but thats not a pass to spin reality into radio shack coloured glasses........be professional , keep your comments professional or dont make any at all

 

[S2Sturges]

Hey folks! Screw Horner, I agree with erader's comments on that matter. I feel really bad for Brajkovic. Play the tapes over, and look at his face did he even look like he was working at all during that chaperone assignment? He was up there, prior to todays debacle. But I guess he drew the short straw, and was assigned to escorting LA to the bitter end. So ends Janez's shot at a respectable finish. LA needed no company at the rate he was soft pedaling to the finish. And with the way RS is finishing the season after the TdF, the year is over for him too, at this point. After LA's third crash incident My wife proclaimed that LA won't finish the Tour...... let's see what happens next.

I think your wife is right... if RS don't do anything second stage in the Alps, he'll pack, citing his injuries or some such thing, use that as a excuse for his crummy form to save face

 

[eljimberino]

Horner knows what he's doing, no need to feel sorry for him:

"I'll ride for Lance any day," Horner says. "Off the front, off the back, in the middle. Whatever he wants. That guy's a legend."

 

[Angliru]

I agree about Brajkovic as well... I don't understand why Lance needed an escort once he quit. Why not let Brajkovic go too?

I understand why a single rider was sent back when Lance detached... maybe even two. He had just crashed before the cat-1 climb and perhaps the team thought he could reconnect on the descent with help.

But at a certain point, Lance quit. Horner and Brajkovic were no longer pulling. THAT's the point that I don't understand not letting BOTH of them go... Lance had already decided he was done.

It wasn't until a few minutes later (when the Contador group had gained another minute or so) that Lance had his last crash... and Horner was finally released. Brajkovic wasn't even pacing Lance... he was riding next to him. If Lance wanted company, he should have rode a bit slower and let Popovych catch back up. He'd already given up.

Heck, I'd have liked to see what Horner and Brajkovic could have done together chasing the main group... even starting from the point Lance crashed last. They might not have lost any additional time.

Some of us must have missed the part where one of the Shack management referred to everyone on the Tour team other than Armstrong as "slaves". They are there to support Armstrong. They know it and have gladly followed along with this plan.

 

[Benotti69]

I hope it pays well at least, since there won't be much prize money to go around in the end.

was there ever....reports are that riders didn't get it...

I heard Sean Kelly say that the TdF prize money is paid 1 year after it's won if you have left the team that you won prize money do you even see it?????

I bet Bruyneel allegedly put prize money into a slush fund for 'vitamins'....

 

[riobonito92]

Brajkovic will have his day.

 

[kurtinsc]

Horner knows what he's doing, no need to feel sorry for him:

"I'll ride for Lance any day," Horner says. "Off the front, off the back, in the middle. Whatever he wants. That guy's a legend."

The interesting part of that blog/article was the Demerol statement that stated that Horner was now the #3 RS rider for the team competition.

If true... then the logical thing to assume is that when "using up" riders for whatever purpose... Lance should do the work before Horner.... Lance wouldn't be getting protected.

I'll believe it when I see it... I'm expecting that if there are 4 riders left on a climb and Lance is one of them, then he'll have someone riding in front of him and won't be fetching any water.

 

[Mrs John Murphy]

Horner is a sell-out and gets everything he deserves.

 

[sublimit]

Must be frustrating having to soft pedal like that, I feel for him but he made the decision to join the Shack team and they pay him to nurse Lance.

 

[Cerberus]

I just can't see him as a GC threat - the guy is Armstrong age and unlike Armstrong he has never gotten a real GC result. My point is that I don't think there's any reason to pity him because he doesn't need the time he has lost.

 

[Timmy-loves-Rabo]

Look, I agree completely about the way Contador was treated, but seriously, give Horner a break here. The ONLY reason he was anti-Contador is because AC wanted his guy instead of Horner at the Tour.

When it's between Contador and feeding your kids..., well....

ridiculous statement. over dramatic much
I'm sure even if he retired before joining Astana he would have had enough money to feed the kids.

 

[ErmOkk]

As if LA will ever go get water bottles . I see him in a role of the last man before Klöden and LL, pushing the tempo in the air and realising all RS men have to drop too, and then getting dropped himself. See who laughs last .

 

[Moose McKnuckles]

ridiculous statement. over dramatic much
I'm sure even if he retired before joining Astana he would have had enough money to feed the kids.

He retires at 38 as a mid-level pro and has enough money? I rather doubt it. Establishing a connection with Armstrong/Bruyneel opens a lot of doors in pro cycling, and I'd wager that weighed on his mind.

Of course, soon those doors may lead to a 10x10 jail cell.

 

[kurtinsc]

He retires at 38 as a mid-level pro and has enough money? I rather doubt it. Establishing a connection with Armstrong/Bruyneel opens a lot of doors in pro cycling, and I'd wager that weighed on his mind.

Of course, soon those doors may lead to a 10x10 jail cell.

Depends on "enough".

According to what I've read, the average pro-team cyclist salary is about 250,000 a year (about 50,000 a year minimum salary). The average continental team salary is about 75,000 a year.

My completely unfounded guess on Horner... a top continental level rider and a lower-to-mid pro-team rider for the majority of his career... would be in the 13 years he rode prior to Astana he'd been paid somewhere around 2 - 2.5 million dollars prior to taxes. Averages out to around 190K per year.

While that's not a bad living... unless you are very dedicated towards investing then it's probably not enough to retire at 35.

I'd wager he's made that much again in his time with Astana and Radio Shack... probably more.

 

[flicker]

I think your wife is right... if RS don't do anything second stage in the Alps, he'll pack, citing his injuries or some such thing, use that as a excuse for his crummy form to save face

Crummy form, excuse me? Did you see the group he was riding with in the end?

 

[Race Radio]

ridiculous statement. over dramatic much
I'm sure even if he retired before joining Astana he would have had enough money to feed the kids.

Not really. Chris got whacked pretty hard in his divorce. Has some pretty big monthly payments and spent most of his career in the US not making a ton of cash. He needs to make as much as possible these last few years.

 

[Race Radio]

Depends on "enough".

According to what I've read, the average pro-team cyclist salary is about 250,000 a year (about 50,000 a year minimum salary). The average continental team salary is about 75,000 a year.

My completely unfounded guess on Horner... a top continental level rider and a lower-to-mid pro-team rider for the majority of his career... would be in the 13 years he rode prior to Astana he'd been paid somewhere around 2 - 2.5 million dollars prior to taxes. Averages out to around 190K per year.

While that's not a bad living... unless you are very dedicated towards investing then it's probably not enough to retire at 35.

I'd wager he's made that much again in his time with Astana and Radio Shack... probably more.

Most of Chris' career he was making a little more then $100k per year. When he was on FDJ he made less. When he went back to Europe on SD he made less. On Lotto he made around $200k per year, that increased to around $250k at Astana. I hear he is making around $350K plus some extras now.

Subtract taxes, living expenses, ex-wife, kids, and there is not much left. The guy needs to make as much money in his short career, even if that means supporting the insecure wonderboy.....who is no longer a boy.

 

[kurtinsc]

Most of Chris' career he was making a little more then $100k per year. When he was on FDJ he made less. When he went back to Europe on SD he made less. On Lotto he made around $200k per year, that increased to around $250k at Astana. I hear he is making around $350K plus some extras now.

Subtract taxes, living expenses, ex-wife, kids, and there is not much left. The guy needs to make as much money in his short career, even if that means supporting the insecure wonderboy.....who is no longer a boy.

He had to be making more then 250K at Astana. I just read an article from him from when he was finishing at Lotto and he was saying he expected a salary 2-3 times what he was making with his next contract.

I'd be shocked after reading that if he had ended up taking only 50K more. Surely Lotto would have paid that.

 

[Lady Luck]

Chris has been delighted to be at RadioShack this year. Seeing Lance from the inside, away from the gossip and rumors, has given him a whole new insight and appreciation for how he operates, and the team has inspired him to get a great tour win. Chris is the happiest he has been his entire career at RadioShack. He does not want you to feel sorry for him.

 

[Race Radio]

He had to be making more then 250K at Astana. I just read an article from him from when he was finishing at Lotto and he was saying he expected a salary 2-3 times what he was making with his next contract.

I'd be shocked after reading that if he had ended up taking only 50K more. Surely Lotto would have paid that.

His salary at Lotto was under 200 and he made another 50K or so in prize money and extras's. Yes, Chris expected a huge bump but did not get it. Astana was 150-200 more plus the opportunity to ride the Tour. When he did not ride the Tour he figured it cost him 40-50K.

I don't know what he is making these days but I do know that most on RS get paid crap wages. The support staff had to take a 10% cut from their Astana wages and most of the team are low paid domestiques. The only people getting rich are Lance, Johann, and a little bit for Knaggs.

 

[kurtinsc]

His salary at Lotto was under 200 and he made another 50K or so in prize money and extras's. Yes, Chris expected a huge bump but did not get it. Astana was 150-200 more plus the opportunity to ride the Tour. When he did not ride the Tour he figured it cost him 40-50K.

I don't know what he is making these days but I do know that most on RS get paid crap wages. The support staff had to take a 10% cut from their Astana wages and most of the team are low paid domestiques. The only people getting rich are Lance, Johann, and a little bit for Knaggs.

Okay... you meant 250 more... not 250 total. So he went from ~200 to ~350-450... which I can believe.

I just couln't understand a 50K bump.

I'd assume Levi, Kloden, and Horner are all paid more then they'd make elsewhere... they had other options. I'd assume Zubeldia got a pay raise... he was under contract still at Astana. I'd think Muryavev got more money too to leave his national team.

Maybe Brajkovic, Rubiera, Popovych and Paulinho had some loyalty to Bruyneel and took less then they'd make elsewehre to ride with him. Maybe some of the young guys like Busche and Bewley turned down other opportunities to ride with Lance (hero worship). Maybe Steegmans took a shot at RS for less to have a shot to be the main classics guy/sprinter on a team (which didn't pan out well). But for the most part... I think the riders on the team had better offers from Radioshack then anywhere else. With few exceptions, I think every rider who isn't a leader doesn't care about much with a team other then the paycheck. Yeah, someone like contador cares about what his support for the tour is like. But Zubeldia? He's not leading any races... he just wants his paycheck.

 

[Lady Luck]

The support staff had to take a 10% cut from their Astana wages and most of the team are low paid domestiques.

I think I see a narrative here.

That little global recession thing has effected all businesses and teams across the peloton.

I don't think Contador is willing to sacrifice his megga deal to offset that either.

 

[Lady Luck]

One thing that has always characterised Lance's teams is astonishing loyalty, not just from the riders but also from the wider team support staff.

To the great irritation of many....

Even if that breaks down in the coming months under tremendous legal pressure, it says a lot about how Armstrong operates that he manages to inspire such devotion across the board from people that don't even get paid big bucks.