In Blood Stepped: The History Of Blood Doping In Sport

[Aragon]

Re: Re:

interesting article a.o. about ozon therapy among East German athletes (particularly rowers) since 1972:
http://www.nzz.ch/article80QSR-1.378004

In den Akten der ermittelnden Zentralen Arbeitsgruppe Geheimnisschutz (ZAGG) des MfS (Ministerium für Staatssicherheit) wird ausdrücklich festgehalten, «ohne Genehmigung des DRSV (DDR- Ruderverband)» sei im Rudern eine «Oxidations- Forschung» betrieben worden. Beteiligt waren einer der 15 DDR-Bezirkssportärzte und ein hauptamtlicher Rudertrainer im Klub.
Dazu kam ein ausserhalb des Sportsystems stehender Arzt - er war in einem vier Autostunden entfernten Berliner Krankenhaus tätig und unterstützte das Blutdoping von der medizinischen Seite: Blutentnahme, UV-Bestrahlung und Sauerstoffdurchflutung, Rücktransfusion in die Sportlervenen.

Why were the East Germans only picking up on the idea of Soda Streaming blood in 1972 when Maître Jacques was publicly doing this in 1967? Didn't they read La Gazzetta or Miroir des Sports? Just how far behind the curve were those cheating Comm'nist b'stards? It's amazing the Father of the American Doping Programme was able to lean anything at their knee, especially anything that all the American doping doctors didn't already know.

As East German's have been known to having had innovative in their use of doping methods, they have been under suspicion of blood doping at least from 1976, when in the Innsbruck Winter Olympics they were seen having bandages on their ears, which sparked speculations that they had received some extra blood from there. Medical experts pointed out immediately that the veins of ears are far too small for the needle to be attached to them. The public has still adopted almost without a second thought the idea that East Germans did use the method.

There was a Finnish documentary about Finnish blood doping program some fifteen years ago, where respected German doping-researcher Giselher Spitzer claimed that East Germans didn't actually use blood doping, but relied very heavily on hypoxic training instead. The program quotes a document that states that East Germans had indeed discussed about the method already in 1972 and had capability to use blood doping in 1986, but they were still uncertain about using transfusions because the blood was difficult to transfer to non-sosialistic countries.

...And the problem with the version of Mr. Spitzer? As mentioned now and then (Wheelmen , pp. 30-31 etc.) an East German coach allegedly told Eddie Borysewicz in 1984 the following, allegedly referring specifically to blood doping: "Why are you guys beating your brains out training at altitudes like this? We're going to get the same boost in fifteen minutes".

On the mysterious earlobe bandages, I have a recollection reading from somewhere (most likely Faust's Gold by Steven Ungerleider) that the bandages had something to do with blood drawn for lactic acid testing. Here is a link to the manuscript to the Finnish blood doping documentary, it looked almost readable through google translator.
https://web.archive.org/web/20010220210428/http://www.yle.fi/mot/110900/kasis.htm

 

[Aragon]

Re: Re:

TBH the whole did he, didn't he thing is almost beyond confusing. Post 84 everyone seemed to understand that he did. Then in 99 - sorry, doing this off the top of my head, but IIRC CN has a story on that, in the old autobus section, if you want I'll find a link later - he said he did. Then there was a retraction before 2013 (I remember discussing whether it was still permissible to say he had when he'd said he hadn't - again, I can find a link later if it's wanted). Someone with Italian and more knowledge might be able to help here, didn't Conconi write a book about that Hour?

(Also, can't recall how much of this is anecdotal, but when Moser came back back post-Obree to take on the Hour again there was, I seem to recall, talk of it being a bit of a game with Conconi, to compare transfusions and EPO. I could be way wrong, you know anecdotes, they take on a life of their own, but those mid-/late-90s Hours of his did, I think, bring the subject to the fore again.)

I totally agree that the latest Moser-revelation is just a new twist which confuses more than clarifies. On the various stories that have life of their own, it would be interesting to know where the often repeated story of "eight" blood donours aged "18 to 20" who visited Moser in México City emerged from, as it was almost the most repeated Moser-blood doping story in 1980s.

 

[fmk_RoI]

Re: Re:

On the mysterious earlobe bandages, I have a recollection reading from somewhere (most likely Faust's Gold by Steven Ungerleider) that the bandages had something to do with blood drawn for lactic acid testing. Here is a link to the manuscript to the Finnish blood doping documentary, it looked almost readable through google translator.
https://web.archive.org/web/20010220210428/http://www.yle.fi/mot/110900/kasis.htm

One of the things I was surprised by when reading Faust's Gold was the lack of talk about blood transfusions, how he was more into the pornography of pain than detailing the scope of the programme.

 

[fmk_RoI]

Re: Re:

I totally agree that the latest Moser-revelation is just a new twist which confuses more than clarifies. On the various stories that have life of their own, it would be interesting to know where the often repeated story of "eight" blood donours aged "18 to 20" who visited Moser in México City emerged from, as it was almost the most repeated Moser-blood doping story in 1980s.

What's funny about it is you've got Merckx, in 2012, discovering openness on the topic and around the same Moser is closing down. Though both end up with basically the same story: the knowledge was there but we didn't play that game.

IIRC the 99 confession, it was post-Festina and Moser did one of those "legalise all doping" things. I have this quote from him from that period:

"We'll have to live with doping. Pure cycling is just an illusion. There comes a stage when a rider must be told the effects of a medicine. Then if he wants to, let him take it."

And, as I have that Word file open, here's Hinault around the same time:

"Moser made use of auto-transfusion. So he was playing with his own blood. He did no more no less that the Finnish athletes, Lasse Viren and the others. It suffices to take some of ones own blood during the spring when it is rich, hyperoxygenated, and to reinject it when one is fatigued. Is that really doping? Maybe not, except if the blood is placed into a machine to reoxygenate it to the maximum."

 

[sniper]

Re: Re:

...
As East German's have been known to having had innovative in their use of doping methods, they have been under suspicion of blood doping at least from 1976, when in the Innsbruck Winter Olympics they were seen having bandages on their ears, which sparked speculations that they had received some extra blood from there. Medical experts pointed out immediately that the veins of ears are far too small for the needle to be attached to them. The public has still adopted almost without a second thought the idea that East Germans did use the method.
...
On the mysterious earlobe bandages, I have a recollection reading from somewhere (most likely Faust's Gold by Steven Ungerleider) that the bandages had something to do with blood drawn for lactic acid testing. Here is a link to the manuscript to the Finnish blood doping documentary, it looked almost readable through google translator.
https://web.archive.org/web/20010220210428/http://www.yle.fi/mot/110900/kasis.htm

As for pricking ears, there is an interesting article about that from 1977 whcich appeared in sports illustrated titles "pricking ears". Type it in Google and it'll pop right out. (I can't right now as I'm not behind my computer). You'll see the name Alois Mader there, an East German 'refugee' working for cologne lab.

edit:
http://www.si.com/vault/1977/10/31/626410/pricking-up-their-ears

Pricking up their ears

A test pioneered in East Germany, which involves a computer and a few drops of blood from the earlobe, may well alter U.S. methods of training and competition

 

[Tienus]

Pharmaceutical companies have sponsored cycling alot. What about companies that make biomedical equipment? Panasonic is one of them.

 

[Aragon]

Re: Re:

Again, this is not particularly new information as such, but only a notion that many cycling enthusiasts tend to portray certain episodes in too cyclo-centrist light, while many of the decision of the UCI took place in wider context and weren't necessarily too original for the sport of cycling. One should consider the following episodes:

- Whereas many sources make a sound thesis that the 1984 LA blood doping scandal led to the banning of blood doping in 1985, this isn't necessarily the whole truth. While the episode without doubt contributed to the decision by IOC to ban blood doping a year later, the ball against blood doping was already rolling as the International Ski Federation (FIS) had banned blood doping already in 1983.

- UCI didn't go forward alone with the heatedly debated hematocrit limits, as similar limits were already put into practice by the International Ski Federation (FIS) in the 1997 World Ski Championships at Trondheim, with significantly higher threshold values (men ~55.5 %, women ~49.5 %). The limits of FIS were based on data collected during competitions by several Scandinavian blood doping researchers from 1987 onwards, which showed a significant increase of mean and highest hemoglobin value from late 1980s until 1996. The brain behind the limits was Finnish researcher Tapio Videman, who admitted later that the limit "felt as a bad option" but that they had no other choice as "on the other side there was the increasing worry about health of the skiers". (Videman had been lobbied for blood tests from 1979 onwards and was a coauthor of a blood doping test as early as 1971).

- It is much touted that Michael Ashenden and an Australian team of hematologists developed the first test to detect homologous transfusions in 2002-2003, a test that was introduced in competitions in 2004. While the test is innovative, a homologous blood doping test based on another method was already developed in mid-1980s with practically 100 % accuracy. In addition, this method was applied first time in voluntary blood doping tests in 1987 and in the first mandatory blood doping tests in 1989 during the World Ski Championships in Lahti, Finland.

 

[fmk_RoI]

Re:

Pharmaceutical companies have sponsored cycling alot. What about companies that make biomedical equipment? Panasonic is one of them.

So they weren't paying Phil Anderson a fortune alleged to be on a par with LeMond's deal in order to sell hi-fis, VCRs and computers to the public, it was all ... what? Part of some super secret field test of biomed equipment? Should I guess that you're imagining it was their freezers and they had the tech to freeze blood? And that because Peter Post was the Panasonic boss and because Joop Zoetemelk rode for Post at Panasonic's prior incarnation, TI-Raleigh, this is clear proof - Zoetemelk to Post to freezers - that Panasonic blood boosted through the 80s and into the 90s and, clearly, it was the advent of EPO, which rendered the freezing technology redundant (all you needed with EPO was your bog standard Rupert the Bear flask), that caused Panasonic to fold and Post left the game, a technological dinosaur caught in the tar pits?

(This join the dot spoofery, it's too easy, there's no real challenge in it at all.)

 

[fmk_RoI]

Re: Re:

- Whereas many sources make a sound thesis that the 1984 LA blood doping scandal led to the banning of blood doping in 1985, this isn't necessarily the whole truth. While the episode without doubt contributed to the decision by IOC to ban blood doping a year later, the ball against blood doping was already rolling as the International Ski Federation (FIS) had banned blood doping already in 1983.

WRT the banning of blood doping by the IOC. You also had the thing in Italy at the same time. In fact, I asked John Gleaves about this recently, his Manufactured Dope paper paints an interesting picture. His basic argument - check out the paper yourselves, it's a good read - is that the IOC banned blood doping more because of HIV/AIDS than anything else. There's no mention of the Italy thing in the IOC minutes, Don Catlin - head of the California lab that covered the LA Games - was flavour du jour in Olympic Circles and, with his Californian base and background, HIV/AIDS was foremost in his mind when the issue of blood boosting came up. So it wasn't so much the there was blood doping at the LA Games and it wasn't that there was a public furore over it - and, it would appear, it wasn't to do with Donati or the FIS - it was all a health issue focused by the Games but running all over the media for several years before that.

The issue about the IOC banning blood doping is what interests me and was something I was trying to make time to get to earlier in the week, but was too busy. For me, the Zoetemelk story is most interesting in 1977, not 1976. The latter tells us a little, but not much, the former requires consideration of the public attitude to blood in general, not just blood doping. Allow me to go off one one here, without much preparation, so think of this as thinking aloud. Throughout history you can find ancient beliefs about the curative properties of drinking blood, or how drinking blood can give you the strength of the fallen. At the same time you have the belief that eating bulls' bollox would give you the strength of a bull. Even into the c19th you have the curative properties of drinking blood being talked up. Then, at the end of the c19th, you get Bram Stoker, latching on to whatever it was in the ether that he latched on to and - with the later help of Hollywood, stoking Stoker's paranoia - draping blood in a black cloak. For most all of the c20th, that was the view we had of blood (if you Google up cartoons from the LA 84 incident you have the cartoonists playing the vampire card). At the same time as all that, our attitude to eating bulls' bollox hadn't really shifted, or only to the extent that that became an adventure cuisine holiday. The fun part here, of course, is how c21st attitudes have changed: vampires are cool, vampires are cuddly, vampires are no longer about sublimated sexual desires, vampires are very much about sex (Twilight). Blood is no longer icky and nasty. If you really, really want to go off on one on the changing cultural attitudes, consider that the Twilight saga was at the height of its power in 2012. The very year Eddy Merckx appears to have found his voice on the subject of transfusions in his time and laughed at the fact that he had been offered one. (Given enough coffee, I could probably work Moser's 'retractions' into that same cultural shift.)

This cultural digression may seem silly, but to me it matters, it helps understand the silence on the subject from cyclists happy to talk about other forms of doping but not - publicly, privately they are different - of blood transfusions.

On the FIS. I recall there used to be a lot of confusion about Hein Verbruggen, with it often being said he had come into the UCI from the FIS (he didn't, he arrived from Mars via the FICP), the belief then being that skiing had been ahead of the game when it came to playing with blood and cycling learned the skills from there.

 

[sniper]

My understanding was IOC banned it in 1986, USOC in 1985.

 

[fmk_RoI]

Re: Re:

- It is much touted that Michael Ashenden and an Australian team of hematologists developed the first test to detect homologous transfusions in 2002-2003, a test that was introduced in competitions in 2004. While the test is innovative, a homologous blood doping test based on another method was already developed in mid-1980s with practically 100 % accuracy. In addition, this method was applied first time in voluntary blood doping tests in 1987 and in the first mandatory blood doping tests in 1989 during the World Ski Championships in Lahti, Finland.

The Berglund test mentioned here?

 

[sniper]

Re:

Pharmaceutical companies have sponsored cycling alot. What about companies that make biomedical equipment? Panasonic is one of them.

The possible role of sponsors in supoorting ped programs deserves a thread on its own.
The point about panasonic is certainly intriguing. But I can't see any clear patterns. A team I suspect of having bloodboosted their way into Europe was sponsored by 7 eleven

 

[fmk_RoI]

Re: Re:

Pharmaceutical companies have sponsored cycling alot. What about companies that make biomedical equipment? Panasonic is one of them.

The possible role of sponsors in supoorting ped programs deserves a thread on its own.
The point about panasonic is certainly intriguing. But I can't see any clear patterns. A team I suspect of having bloodboosted their way into Europe was sponsored by 7 eleven

Wow, the Sniper Method fails you here, and on such an easy one? 7-Eleven -> Slurpees -> freezers -> blood transfusions. Piece o' cake, that one.

 

[Aragon]

Re: Re:

- It is much touted that Michael Ashenden and an Australian team of hematologists developed the first test to detect homologous transfusions in 2002-2003, a test that was introduced in competitions in 2004. While the test is innovative, a homologous blood doping test based on another method was already developed in mid-1980s with practically 100 % accuracy. In addition, this method was applied first time in voluntary blood doping tests in 1987 and in the first mandatory blood doping tests in 1989 during the World Ski Championships in Lahti, Finland.

The Berglund test mentioned here?

The test was different from the autotransfusion test and was based on differences of minor blood types, but to be honest, I am not sure about technical details of the test and whether the approach of the FIS blood doping testing supervisors Tapio Videman and Inggard Lereim was identical to that of Bo Berglund and Peter Hemmingsson. I only know that it was different than the flow cytometer - based method developed by the Australian blood research team led by Michael Ashenden some decade and a half later. The whole existence of the method is usually mentioned in the literature almost in passing because - as you may already be aware - the most research was on the the autotransfusion test on which several different approaches were tested of which each had their own weaknesses.

Whereas with the flow cytometer, you run the blood through a machine and get a clear histogram, in the 1980s test, researchers put a substance on the blood sample and if they saw minor clots, it was a sign of foreign blood being present. The test was put into practice in 1987 in a ski world cup competition in Finland, when researchers put a sample of a transfusions patient among the voluntary blood samples to look whether they could find the positive. They found the sample in question with zero false positives. If there was some bitching about the "I know it when I see it" - approach of the flow cytometer histograms, the earlier test was truly based on that standard.

As an interesting anecdote, every Russian skier refused to donate blood to the researchers in the 1987 voluntary tests, which may have been a contributing factor causing Finns [sic.] and Canadians to accuse the Soviet team of blood doping a year later in the Winter Olympics of Calgary.

 

[fmk_RoI]

On the topic of sponsors proving doping. The daddy of em all, PDM, the team that became Festina. Phillips Dupont, the tech link is so obvious I don't have to go into it. Festina? They made watches which had alarm modes. To remind you when to take your EPO.

Then there was Renault. We all know all about CO doping. Cars make CO2. Coincidence? I think not. This also explains Peugeot, Subaru (Eddie Borysewicz!) and Nissan. And - whisper it quietly - Jaguar. Oh, and Mini.

The links? They're everywhere you look!

 

[Aragon]

Re: Re:

Just to clarify the origin of the Finnish test, Bo Berglund actually says the following about homologous blood doping test in his paper Development of techniques for the detection of blood doping in sport ("Sports Med. 1988 Feb;5(2):127-35.)

Heterologous transfusions have been used in sport but are most likely a minor problem due to the considerable medical risks. Such transfusions stimulate immune sensitisation and can hence be detected with immunological techniques. A method has been developed in Finland which has een used for detection of blood doping with the world Cup in crosscountry skiing in Lahtis 1987 (T. Videman, personal communication). However, there have been no published reports and relevant data is scarce, particularly the time interval after a transfusion during which blood doping can be detected.

So the test seems to be originally developed in Finland. The approach either had some issues or the problem was overshadowed by EPO, because Videman and his coauthors mention the following in a research paper some 15 years later:

To date, the governing organizations in endurance sports have not applied all of the latest methods and protocols available to identify doping practices. For example, despite straightforward, ironclad detection procedures, testing for homologous blood transfusions has only been performed 4 times: at the 1989, 1991, 1995, and 1999 Nordic World Championships and at the 1994 Winter Olympics.
(Abnormal hematologic profiles in elite cross-country skiers: blood doping or? Stray-Gundersen J, Videman T, Penttilä I, Lereim I. Clin J Sport Med. 2003 May;13(3):132-7.)

 

[sniper]

here's the link to that thread on the first epo users.
viewtopic.php?t=9589
Link to post about Winnen:
viewtopic.php?p=1909886#p1909886

 

[fmk_RoI]

Re: Re:

As an interesting anecdote, every Russian skier refused to donate blood to the researchers in the 1987 voluntary tests, which may have been a contributing factor causing Finns [sic.] and Canadians to accuse the Soviet team of blood doping a year later in the Winter Olympics of Calgary.

Similar to Brisson in 96 and CSAD in 99.

 

[sniper]

Re: Re:

Pharmaceutical companies have sponsored cycling alot. What about companies that make biomedical equipment? Panasonic is one of them.

The possible role of sponsors in supoorting ped programs deserves a thread on its own.
The point about panasonic is certainly intriguing. But I can't see any clear patterns. A team I suspect of having bloodboosted their way into Europe was sponsored by 7 eleven

Wow, the Sniper Method fails you here, and on such an easy one? 7-Eleven -> Slurpees -> freezers -> blood transfusions. Piece o' cake, that one.

Still butthurt right? It's ok. You put a lot of effort into that trilogy. Nobody expected the whole story to fit on three pages.

 

[sniper]

Re:

On the topic of sponsors proving doping. The daddy of em all, PDM, the team that became Festina. Phillips Dupont, the tech link is so obvious I don't have to go into it. Festina? They made watches which had alarm modes. To remind you when to take your EPO.

Then there was Renault. We all know all about CO doping. Cars make CO2. Coincidence? I think not. This also explains Peugeot, Subaru (Eddie Borysewicz!) and Nissan. And - whisper it quietly - Jaguar. Oh, and Mini.

The links? They're everywhere you look!

admittedly, this is one of your funnier attempts at being funny
But your still clogging the thread and it distracts from the great stuff that is being posted here. Including by yourself, mind. So why not focus on that a bit more.

 

[Tienus]

So they weren't paying Phil Anderson a fortune alleged to be on a par with LeMond's deal in order to sell hi-fis, VCRs and computers to the public

Part of some super secret field test of biomed equipment?

Who has told you this?

Should I guess that you're imagining it was their freezers and they had the tech to freeze blood?

Please dont as you guessing what I imagine will probably not be a valuable contribution.

All I know is that Panasonic biomedical could provide all equipment for a bloodbank. I also know that Harm Kuipers and van den Hoogenband where part of their medical staf. Harm Kuipers was interested in transfusions because of his medical study and wanted to become a sports medice doctor in 76.
http://www.delpher.nl/nl/kranten/view?query=hermens+kuipers+bloed&coll=ddd&identifier=ddd%3A011017610%3Ampeg21%3Aa0295&resultsidentifier=ddd%3A011017610%3Ampeg21%3Aa0295

You mention proof twice in a row in a reply to my post. To be clear: I did not and do not claim to have proof. I do
think there is a good chance that both Hermens and Kuipers where early 70's transfusers.

 

[Tonton]

FYI, I just deleted a bunch of reports. I will leave it at that, unless I see more negativity seep through the posts. Some great contributions BTW. Conclusion: let's agree to disagree and respect each other. Thank you .

 

[gillan1969]

The difficulty I have is that if blood doping stretches as far back as we are now joining the dots to...it must have been both pretty widespread and pretty sophisticated by 1990. Whilst EPO is far more convenient, it delivers similar performance benefits (or at least do we know the exact difference between a course of EPO and a few blood bags?). In that case we wouldn't have seen the big comparative jump in performance a la Gewiss circa 1993...or would we?

 

[fmk_RoI]

The difficulty I have is that if blood doping stretches as far back as we are now joining the dots to...it must have been both pretty widespread and pretty sophisticated by 1990. Whilst EPO is far more convenient, it delivers similar performance benefits (or at least do we know the exact difference between a course of EPO and a few blood bags?). In that case we wouldn't have seen the big comparative jump in performance a la Gewiss circa 1993...or would we?

Transfusions were logistically challenging and expensive, which limited their use. Not all teams, not all riders in all teams. EPO was available to all. The whole team could pull harder for longer.

 

[buckle]

The difficulty I have is that if blood doping stretches as far back as we are now joining the dots to...it must have been both pretty widespread and pretty sophisticated by 1990. Whilst EPO is far more convenient, it delivers similar performance benefits (or at least do we know the exact difference between a course of EPO and a few blood bags?). In that case we wouldn't have seen the big comparative jump in performance a la Gewiss circa 1993...or would we?

Coe's 800 WR survived 16 years and 6 of those include EPO assaults. Coe ran his outside the main circus in Florence. A significant train ride from Ferrara admittedly. So yes the programs were advanced pre-EPO especially if the controls were less than rigorous. Only two Kenyans have run faster.