Is Contador THAT hated in U.S

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Apr 12, 2009
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kurtinsc said:
You are confusing "interesting" with "excellence".

I would never call TO a "great sportsman". But I'd be more likely to listen to a TO interview then a Jerry Rice interview. Rice was 10 times the reciever TO was/is... but he probably had less of a fan following in his prime then Owens has now.

I'll never say anything bad about Contador's cycling. He's the best in the game when it comes to stage races right now. He seems like a very nice guy too. But he's not interesting. I can't see myself ever trying to follow him as a fan.

But I AM a fan of guys like Dave Zabriskie and Brad Wiggins who are interesting people... even if they're not nearly as good in terms of their cycling ability.

I was always more of a fan of Cipollini then Abdoujaparov or Zabel when it came to sprinters for the same reason (though Super Mario had equal or greater talent too).



People in general seem to like to be fans of people who are "a character" as well as "a talent". Contador has the same persona as guys like Menchov or Sastre. Consumate professionals... very talented... but very dull. I'll take someone like Evans who's a bit... odd... off the bike over someone who seems like a robot giving interviews.
Well I disagree with you but you're entitled to your opinion but there's a difference between liking an athlete for being a character(Cipo) and liking an athlete for being an champion aka lance. Anyway I don't get all the hate about Contador hell I even remember in 2008 when a lot of Americans liked Contador because he was associated with Bruyneel but then Armstrong comes back and people started hating him and now I here excuses about his victory salute really that's why you hate a guy who might be dirty but still a guy who tries to win every time he starts a race and I could understand if he's an champion but I've met him twice and he's a nice guy what else except the Armstrong effect could it be.
 
Mar 22, 2010
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pmcg76 said:
I get the people who say they like the arrogant, a-hole type personalities, they add colour to the sport. In general though I think people dont like this type of character.

However it is totally different to dislike somebody because they are not arrogant or an a-hole. That is plain ridiculous because that includes the vast majority of sportspeople. They may be bland but they are still great sportspeople who have done nothing to be disliked other than be humble.

Fact is, AC beat Lance the US hero, and then Lance and his cronies tried to paint him in a certain way which obvioulsy worked with the less uneducated cycling fans and I am sure that is why so many US fans hate Contaodr.

If its the lame pistol thing that gets you, then thats sad.
Ernest Hemingway is reputed to be a flaming a-hole in real life, but God how his books moved me. Sometimes it's best to detach the great/noble/heroic act from the actor.
 
Nov 17, 2009
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pmcg76 said:
Hey, how popular was Filippo Simeoni in the US? He won a stage at the Vuelta in 01, stopped just before the finish line, kissed his bike, picked it up, held it in the air and walked across the line as a victory salute. All this was in tribute to those killed in 9/11 amd made the news in many newspapers around the world. Character, personality!! I think Simeoni was a very hated man in the US and a subject most Lance fans are still afraid to go near. How does that put the cat amongst the pigeon?
Honestly... if I had seen it I would have become a fan immediately.

But Vuelta and Giro coverage in the US isn't easy to come by. And most people in the US who know Lance and are fans don't know who Simeoni is. They watched him in the Tour every year and assume he was the best cyclist ever... but they aren't educated about all the other stuff.

Simeoni isn't hated by Lance fans... he's invisible.
 
Apr 17, 2009
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therhodeo said:
I'm not a huge Contador fan (more uncaring than hating) but I've got to say that the pistolero thing is 100x cooler than the stupid phone call thing Cavendish does.
I think Cav only did that once in the Tour. I liked it because it at least tied in the new sponsor (HTC makes smart phones).

Personally I liked this one from Cav, merely for the reasoning behind it


“I offered Cavendish a hefty bonus yesterday if he dedicated the win. I don't know if you noticed his victory salute," Zabriskie said after being asked how DZ nuts were holding up. "So I had to give him a large wad of cash and a couple of packs.”
P.S. I can't stand Cav 99% of the time because he's an a-hole. But there's nothing wrong with a joke
 
alberto.legstrong said:
Ernest Hemingway is reputed to be a flaming a-hole in real life, but God how his books moved me. Sometimes it's best to detach the great/noble/heroic act from the actor.
Much easier with a 20th century writer than a 21st century athlete/celebrity.

Particularly in cycling where one's persona is such an integral part of the art of it.
 
Nov 17, 2009
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pmcg76 said:
I get the people who say they like the arrogant, a-hole type personalities, they add colour to the sport. In general though I think people dont like this type of character.

However it is totally different to dislike somebody because they are not arrogant or an a-hole. That is plain ridiculous because that includes the vast majority of sportspeople. They may be bland but they are still great sportspeople who have done nothing to be disliked other than be humble.

Fact is, AC beat Lance the US hero, and then Lance and his cronies tried to paint him in a certain way which obvioulsy worked with the less uneducated cycling fans and I am sure that is why so many US fans hate Contaodr.

If its the lame pistol thing that gets you, then thats sad.
I don't dislike Contador.

I just don't find him interesting. Impressive? Absolutely. Professional? No doubt. Someone I'd cheer for? Ehhh... not really.

Lance was interesting in his prime... because of his arrogance, anger and talent. He'd go out on the bike telling people he'd crush them... and then he'd crush them.

Now... he's much less interesting. Still talks the talk but when you can't back it up anymore that turns boring pretty quickly.


Evans is a little insane with his freak outs over his dog or bringing a stuffed animal to interviews. Wiggins is a smarta$$, as is Zabriskie. Horner is a goof-ball. Ricco has no filter, is brash, cocky and arrogant. DiLuca is angry all the time.

It's human nature to be more interested in guys like this who show some personality over guys like Contador, Menchov or Sastre who seem stone-faced all the time.
 
Mar 18, 2009
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kurt, you found Abdoujaparov - the Tashkent TGV/Tashkent Terror - boring?? Did you ever see the man sprint?? You know he's the reason why a rider isn't allowed to shift off his line in a sprint (the so called Abdou Rule)?? He was the craziest sprinter of them all so to call him lacking in personality has quite flabbergasted me.

Can't square not liking Abdou with liking riders who are arrogant, mouthy and aggressive
 
kurtinsc said:
I don't dislike Contador.

I just don't find him interesting. Impressive? Absolutely. Professional? No doubt. Someone I'd cheer for? Ehhh... not really.

Lance was interesting in his prime... because of his arrogance, anger and talent. He'd go out on the bike telling people he'd crush them... and then he'd crush them.

Now... he's much less interesting. Still talks the talk but when you can't back it up anymore that turns boring pretty quickly.


Evans is a little insane with his freak outs over his dog or bringing a stuffed animal to interviews. Wiggins is a smarta$$, as is Zabriskie. Horner is a goof-ball. Ricco has no filter, is brash, cocky and arrogant. DiLuca is angry all the time.

It's human nature to be more interested in guys like this who show some personality over guys like Contador, Menchov or Sastre who seem stone-faced all the time.
TBH, Lance never talked about crushing people during his Tour winning streak, he never said "I will crush everyone". Thats BS. However, he was arrogant and disrespectful towards people who even remotley questoned the myth.

Lance was invisible for most of the year and usually showed respect to his rivals pre retirement, especially Ullrich. As for the look, he even downplayed that himself, saying he just happened to be checking out his rivals form and the camera caught him.

He has definitely become more arrogant since he announced his comeback but that is due to the fact, more people have been critical of him. Lance was no more colourful than Contador in his prime, he just had the cancer angle followed by the Sheryl Crow thing. We only seen the nasty, narccistic side when people questioned him or crossed him, Bassons, LeMond, Simeoni etc.

If anything Lance was more arrogant and a bigger a-hole pre cancer but then you didnt know him then.
 
kurtinsc said:
Honestly... if I had seen it I would have become a fan immediately.

But Vuelta and Giro coverage in the US isn't easy to come by. And most people in the US who know Lance and are fans don't know who Simeoni is. They watched him in the Tour every year and assume he was the best cyclist ever... but they aren't educated about all the other stuff.

Simeoni isn't hated by Lance fans... he's invisible.
Then perhaps they should learn about Simeoni and it might help them figure out why Lance is so disliked. I know thats the biggest reason I started to dislike him.

The OP was why is Contador is so hated in the US, your personal opinion is because he is bland. I dont think that it the same reason as most other people. Its the hatchet job by Lance, Bruyneel, P & P.
 
kurtinsc said:
Lance was interesting in his prime... because of his arrogance, anger and talent. He'd go out on the bike telling people he'd crush them... and then he'd crush them.
For one race out of the year. With the help of a team full of riders doped to the gills.


kurtinsc said:
Now... he's much less interesting. Still talks the talk but when you can't back it up anymore that turns boring pretty quickly.
Apparently many have not reached that fatal stage of boredom. Many still think Lance IS cycling. This year's set of races has shown that he certainly is not.


kurtinsc said:
It's human nature to be more interested in guys like this who show some personality over guys like Contador, Menchov or Sastre who seem stone-faced all the time.
Personality? Is that what it's called now? Since his comeback, look at the behavior he's resorted to. Not good for cycling, and as I've stated, the sport goes on and has done very well with his limited presence merely an uninteresting talking point. He's a clown walking a tightrope oblivious to the fact that the top has come down on his circus.
 
A

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kurtinsc said:
Honestly... if I had seen it I would have become a fan immediately.

But Vuelta and Giro coverage in the US isn't easy to come by. And most people in the US who know Lance and are fans don't know who Simeoni is. They watched him in the Tour every year and assume he was the best cyclist ever... but they aren't educated about all the other stuff.

Simeoni isn't hated by Lance fans... he's invisible.
He is invisible only because 99% of "Lance fans" know more about corn flakes than they do about cycling. Useless lot most of 'em.
 
Mar 26, 2010
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alberto.legstrong said:
I have never seen the pistol on a stage he didn't win. He didn't win Arcalis did he? (OK, I went and looked cuz I wasn't sure, Brice Feillu won the stage to Arcalis)

It's a credit to the hypersensitivity of some people that THAT is the thing that latch onto. Weak, imo. I look forward to seeing it a lot over the next couple years. The fact that some people choose that as the icon for their hatred only makes it more fun.
Obviously you have since you've seen races pre 2008. Which brings me back to my question. What is the story behind the pistolero gesture? Did he just make it up himself (like Ricco with the cobra) or is there something more to it all?
(and for the record - I'm Alberto neutral - just hate the pistol thing)
 
Apr 28, 2009
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PinchFlat said:
Obviously you have since you've seen races pre 2008. Which brings me back to my question. What is the story behind the pistolero gesture? Did he just make it up himself (like Ricco with the cobra) or is there something more to it all?
(and for the record - I'm Alberto neutral - just hate the pistol thing)
heard of google?

oh and I spy too....
 
Mar 22, 2010
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red_flanders said:
Much easier with a 20th century writer than a 21st century athlete/celebrity.

Particularly in cycling where one's persona is such an integral part of the art of it.
Most of these so-called celebs and many of these athletes are all style and maybe just a side order of talent. It's more important to max out their value by building their brand rather than actually doing whatever it is they are supposed to do. And that means vomiting their every waking moment into twitter and websites and getting on E! or Access Loserwood and hiring a publicist to get a photo of them just casually running out for coffee published in People like it was just happenstance.

But the ones with REAL talent. They don't need to blow smoke 24/7. Is Tom Wolfe even on twitter?
 
Mar 22, 2010
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PinchFlat said:
Obviously you have since you've seen races pre 2008. Which brings me back to my question. What is the story behind the pistolero gesture? Did he just make it up himself (like Ricco with the cobra) or is there something more to it all?
(and for the record - I'm Alberto neutral - just hate the pistol thing)
Well I saw Alberto win the tdf in 2007 but can't recall if he ever won a stage and if he did whether he did it or not.

....hates the pistol thing but is neutral on AC....too uninterested to even ask why
 

flicker

BANNED
Aug 17, 2009
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I rode with one of my friends on a TREK today and we talked and I told him Contador got third in fleche and he said argh not that contador guy again.
 
Mar 12, 2009
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flicker said:
I rode with one of my friends on a TREK today and we talked and I told him Contador got third in fleche and he said argh not that contador guy again.
Apparently you didn't tell him/her that Evans actually won?
Great input btw.
 
Mar 9, 2010
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kurtinsc said:
I don't dislike Contador.

I just don't find him interesting. Impressive? Absolutely. Professional? No doubt. Someone I'd cheer for? Ehhh... not really.

Lance was interesting in his prime... because of his arrogance, anger and talent. He'd go out on the bike telling people he'd crush them... and then he'd crush them.

Now... he's much less interesting. Still talks the talk but when you can't back it up anymore that turns boring pretty quickly.


Evans is a little insane with his freak outs over his dog or bringing a stuffed animal to interviews. Wiggins is a smarta$$, as is Zabriskie. Horner is a goof-ball. Ricco has no filter, is brash, cocky and arrogant. DiLuca is angry all the time.

It's human nature to be more interested in guys like this who show some personality over guys like Contador, Menchov or Sastre who seem stone-faced all the time.
it sounds like you don't even really like cycling, or any sport for that matter. you are only interested in a-hole type personalities. pro wrestling is probably more your thing.

i couldn't give a crap whether a cyclist is "interesting" or not. someone like savoldelli was always criticized for being a bland character, regardless of his skills on a bike. whatever. if you can't be a fan of someone like jerry rice, who never displayed anything short of pure class, on and off the field, well...then it's obvious you are not a football fan, but rather a drama queen.

if you don't like cycling or admire the great athletic accomplishments and beauty of the sport, why even follow it? you can stay home and watch daytime tv and indulge yourself in all of the "interesting" people you want.

i don't care too much about the personality. i just like to watch great bike racers racing bicycles in great races. it's what happens ON the bike that matters.
 
Feb 14, 2010
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BikeCentric said:
I've been using the Speedplay ti spindle pedals for the last 3 years with no issues.

However I weigh 140 pounds so keep that in mind.

PS if you race crits go Speedplay - they have boatloads of cornering clearance and you can pedal right through corners while guys behind you are smashing pedals into the pavement.
!!! Thanks, will keep that in mind if I ever learn to lean more than 10 degrees without dumping. :D:mad: (my balance issues are not all mental:) )
 
kurtinsc said:
Yes. And I found Bjorn Borg boring as well. I like Nadal more now, and Mcenroe back in Borg's day. I never liked Pete Sampras either.
I see what you mean then. I find Federer boring too - every champion needs a story, or a flaw, or some characteristic which makes them appeal to the masses. Being amazing and winning everything counts for winning a lot of hearts and minds, but not all.

Cycling presents so many different personalities. Contador's appeal to English speakers, particularly American's probably isn't that great, given he's never appearing on TV, doing interviews in English and talking to "them". Nadal on the other hand was doing English interviews within a year of his breakout season.

I think Contador is humble, or even shy... boring, maybe.

The problem is, nothing is going to happen whilst Armstrong is still around, and competing directly against him for the adoration of Americans. Armstrong's story is the ultimate sporting fairytale, so it's virtually impossible for a quiet Spaniard who doesn't speak much English to encroach on him.
 
Jun 18, 2009
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Ferminal said:
I see what you mean then. I find Federer boring too - every champion needs a story, or a flaw, or some characteristic which makes them appeal to the masses. Being amazing and winning everything counts for winning a lot of hearts and minds, but not all.

Cycling presents so many different personalities. Contador's appeal to English speakers, particularly American's probably isn't that great, given he's never appearing on TV, doing interviews in English and talking to "them". Nadal on the other hand was doing English interviews within a year of his breakout season.

I think Contador is humble, or even shy... boring, maybe.
Contador is anything but boring on the bike. I'm not a fan of his, but when he's in form and attacking it is a sight to behold. I was cheering for Evans in the 2007 Tour, but had to admit that the better man won.

I'd much rather an attacking rider like Contador wins over a defensive rider like Leipheimer. After what was a very defensive Giro win, Contador came good again for the subsequent 2008 races, and he's been an attacking rider ever since. It's great sport.

Races like E3 this year are what make us cycling fans. Hard men turning themselves inside out to win. Pozzatto showed he can be more than a mouthy wheelsucker on that ride; Boonen killed himself to keep the gap, and Cancellara dropped his companions with a deft move at the death.

I couldn't give a rat's ar$e how boring they are to interview, if they give us entertainment like that on the road.
 
Ferminal said:
I see what you mean then. I find Federer boring too - every champion needs a story, or a flaw, or some characteristic which makes them appeal to the masses. Being amazing and winning everything counts for winning a lot of hearts and minds, but not all.

Cycling presents so many different personalities. Contador's appeal to English speakers, particularly American's probably isn't that great, given he's never appearing on TV, doing interviews in English and talking to "them". Nadal on the other hand was doing English interviews within a year of his breakout season.

I think Contador is humble, or even shy... boring, maybe.

The problem is, nothing is going to happen whilst Armstrong is still around, and competing directly against him for the adoration of Americans. Armstrong's story is the ultimate sporting fairytale, so it's virtually impossible for a quiet Spaniard who doesn't speak much English to encroach on him.
but does AC has to "please" the English-Speakers at all? since when it became a requirement? as someone mentioned- he's been misquoted many times by American media, & now they have the nerve to ask him to speak the language? yes- English reaches wider audience around the world, but I think AC isn't quite interested in "calling the world's attention" or become a "media wh0re" like certain Texan.

Talent & skills are "universal values" regardless any language barrier-even more when the person is "humble" and at least is trying work on it.....
 

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