Is Contador THAT hated in U.S

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Oct 29, 2009
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kurtinsc said:
We'll have to agree to disagree.

My opinion is there were about 30 NBA players you could have teamed with Jordan and he would have won titles. In reverse... there weren't any other then Jordan that Pippin could have teamed with to win one. Okay... maybe one in Kobe at the end of Pippin's career, but that was it. If he couldn't get there with Barkley and Olajuwon in Portland, then I don't know who it was going to work with.

He averaged 12 points a game with Portland when they made the western conference finals. Rasheed Wallace was the reason for Portland's success, not Pippin.

But yes... this probably isn't the place... it was supposed to be an analogy to make my viewpoint more clear and instead we're lost in arguing details totally unimportant to the cycling topic. My apologies.
Fair enough. Being a former basketball player, I'll immediately respond to anythign about the game. I was living in Chicago for the first three peat and Jordan's subsequent retirement, so it's a testy subject for me. Hope my response wasn't too harsh; it wasn't meant to be.
 
Jun 18, 2009
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BikeCentric said:
I think it's incredible to see a skinny little GT rider contest the Classics and get 3rd at la Fleche. When was the last time this happenned? It's been a long time and it's good for cycling. Contador is a great champion in the mold of Indurain and he's very good for the sport.
+1, I have to agree with the bit on the classics and especially the below:

BikeCentric said:
Haters unite; it is the love of cancer that binds us.
 
Mar 22, 2010
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reeftom12 said:
Well, I really do not like AC. I think it's mostly the stupid pistol things he does, why not just be classy and give a two armed salute like all the other guys. His style of racing is not that great either, I prefer racers that can strike out on their own and TT to victory.
;):rolleyes:
I see no smilies, but I will add a wink and a roll of the eyes just to give you the benefit of the doubt

So am I to understand that if he didn't do the pistol shot, you would like him? Really?
 
michaeld05 said:
+1, I have to agree with the bit on the classics and especially the below:
Except for that Andy Schleck is a skinny little GT rider and he won LBL last year; Alejandro Valverde is hardly built like André Greipel, and won the last Grand Tour, and has two LBLs and Flèche in his back pocket (regardless of whether you think he should have been allowed to obtain them); Samuel Sánchez is 65kg and was 2nd in Lombardia and 4th at Flèche last year; Joaquím Rodríguez has been a super-domestique for Valverde for a few years, has two GT top tens and was 2nd yesterday in addition to 3rd at the Worlds and 2nd at LBL last year; Damiano Cunego is a GT winner who nowadays is far more likely to win in the classics than in GTs; Robert Gesink's range of top 5s and top 10s in the last two years include Amstel Gold, La Flèche Wallonne, Lombardia, two Vueltas and two Dauphinés... and Cadel Evans himself is hardly a big guy at 64kg, and just won Flèche after coming close the last two years.

Lots of GT riders ride the Ardennes.

Quite a lot of GT stars are
 
Apr 9, 2009
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Libertine Seguros said:
Except for that Andy Schleck is a skinny little GT rider and he won LBL last year; Alejandro Valverde is hardly built like André Greipel, and won the last Grand Tour, and has two LBLs and Flèche in his back pocket (regardless of whether you think he should have been allowed to obtain them); Samuel Sánchez is 65kg and was 2nd in Lombardia and 4th at Flèche last year; Joaquím Rodríguez has been a super-domestique for Valverde for a few years, has two GT top tens and was 2nd yesterday in addition to 3rd at the Worlds and 2nd at LBL last year; Damiano Cunego is a GT winner who nowadays is far more likely to win in the classics than in GTs; Robert Gesink's range of top 5s and top 10s in the last two years include Amstel Gold, La Flèche Wallonne, Lombardia, two Vueltas and two Dauphinés... and Cadel Evans himself is hardly a big guy at 64kg, and just won Flèche after coming close the last two years.

Lots of GT riders ride the Ardennes.

Quite a lot of GT stars are
You are right of course but I was simply trying to emphasize the difference between Contador and Lord Pharmstrong since this thread was about Contador being hated in my homeland where Fatstrong is from.
 
BikeCentric said:
You are right of course but I was simply trying to emphasize the difference between Contador and Lord Pharmstrong since this thread was about Contador being hated in my homeland where Fatstrong is from.
Just think . . . Lance gets 26th (or wherever he finished) at Tour of Flanders and that was a great showing. AC gets third and he's taking flak from some because he didn't win. Weird how that works. ;)
 
Mar 26, 2010
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reeftom12 said:
Well, I really do not like AC. I think it's mostly the stupid pistol things he does, why not just be classy and give a two armed salute like all the other guys. His style of racing is not that great either, I prefer racers that can strike out on their own and TT to victory.
That's pretty good. Maybe your right - the guy can ride (attacks in the mountains, solid TT, holds his own in the Ardennen) so maybe we are just grasping a straws to find a reason not to cheer for AC. Or maybe, just maybe it is because of stage 13 in the '08 vuelta when alberto simutaneously denied grandpa leipheimer of a GT victory and unleashed the pistol. It would be wrong to hate Alberto for Levi's shortcomings so the blaime must go to the pistol.

PS I take it smiles aren't cool so let me throw a couple in:cool::cool::cool::cool:
 
reeftom12 said:
Well, I really do not like AC. I think it's mostly the stupid pistol things he does, why not just be classy and give a two armed salute like all the other guys. His style of racing is not that great either, I prefer racers that can strike out on their own and TT to victory.
I sincerely hope you're being sarcastic here. If not, perhaps you should watch the stages to Arcalis and Verbier from last year's Tour.
 
Mar 26, 2010
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Moose McKnuckles said:
I sincerely hope you're being sarcastic here. If not, perhaps you should watch the stages to Arcalis and Verbier from last year's Tour.
So people are unintentionally sarcastic. I give credit for that sometimes. Besides.....doesn't Contador do the pistol salute in those stages???
 
Moose McKnuckles said:
I sincerely hope you're being sarcastic here. If not, perhaps you should watch the stages to Arcalis and Verbier from last year's Tour.
Or the stage to Angliru in the '08 Vuelta. Or the stage to Montagne de la Lure in last year's Paris-Nice. Or the stage to Mende in this year's Paris-Nice. Just backing you up!
 
Mar 9, 2010
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kurtinsc said:
It's a matter of showmanship.

When it comes down to it, sports is entertainment. And while excellence is entertaining to a certain degree... when someone is over the top it's even more so.

Charles Barkley, Mohammed Ali, Terrell Owens... these guys entertain with their personalities and antics as well as their on the field performance. Yes... guys like Art Monk and Tim Duncan are excellent and they are very "classy"... but they also are boring to a degree. Jan Ullrich always struck me that way in cycling.

I like the cocky guy who backs it up with great performance... like Lance Armstrong in his prime, Michael Jordan or Randy Moss when he is on.

I like the loud guy with talent who makes statements that are always quoteable and still perform well... like Brad Wiggins, Charles Barkley or Terrell Owens when he was in his prime.

I respect but sometimes get bored by guys who always do a great job but are very "classy" and professional... like Contador, Tim Duncan or Steve Largeant.

I get annoyed with guys that keep talking but no longer have the ability to back it up... like Lance now, Terrell Owens now, or Scotty Pippin without Michael Jordan playing next to him.


Sports is entertainment. Boring competitors aren't as entertaining.
so a guy like jerry rice is boring because he never talked any trash while racking up a string of super bowl rings and amassing the greatest personal statistics ever in his sport? and TO is a great sportsmen because he talks a string of trash while never winning a ring?!

i don't get it.


preposterous is the word that comes to mind.
 
Apr 9, 2009
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spanky wanderlust said:
so a guy like jerry rice is boring because he never talked any trash while racking up a string of super bowl rings and amassing the greatest personal statistics ever in his sport? and TO is a great sportsmen because he talks a string of trash while never winning a ring?!

i don't get it.


preposterous is the word that comes to mind.
And while we're on the subject of the NFL - Emmitt Smith was a huge fan favorite precisely due to the fact that he would never celebrate in the end zone (while scoring a lot of TD's of course) and never talked trash at all, people loved him for being a successfull class act.

LaDanian Tomlinson is the same way.

I'll never understand the "it's cool to be an a-hole" crowd.
 
Apr 14, 2010
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I'm not a huge Contador fan (more uncaring than hating) but I've got to say that the pistolero thing is 100x cooler than the stupid phone call thing Cavendish does.
 
Mar 22, 2010
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PinchFlat said:
So people are unintentionally sarcastic. I give credit for that sometimes. Besides.....doesn't Contador do the pistol salute in those stages???
I have never seen the pistol on a stage he didn't win. He didn't win Arcalis did he? (OK, I went and looked cuz I wasn't sure, Brice Feillu won the stage to Arcalis)

It's a credit to the hypersensitivity of some people that THAT is the thing that latch onto. Weak, imo. I look forward to seeing it a lot over the next couple years. The fact that some people choose that as the icon for their hatred only makes it more fun.
 
Nov 17, 2009
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spanky wanderlust said:
so a guy like jerry rice is boring because he never talked any trash while racking up a string of super bowl rings and amassing the greatest personal statistics ever in his sport? and TO is a great sportsmen because he talks a string of trash while never winning a ring?!

i don't get it.


preposterous is the word that comes to mind.
You are confusing "interesting" with "excellence".

I would never call TO a "great sportsman". But I'd be more likely to listen to a TO interview then a Jerry Rice interview. Rice was 10 times the reciever TO was/is... but he probably had less of a fan following in his prime then Owens has now.

I'll never say anything bad about Contador's cycling. He's the best in the game when it comes to stage races right now. He seems like a very nice guy too. But he's not interesting. I can't see myself ever trying to follow him as a fan.

But I AM a fan of guys like Dave Zabriskie and Brad Wiggins who are interesting people... even if they're not nearly as good in terms of their cycling ability.

I was always more of a fan of Cipollini then Abdoujaparov or Zabel when it came to sprinters for the same reason (though Super Mario had equal or greater talent too).



People in general seem to like to be fans of people who are "a character" as well as "a talent". Contador has the same persona as guys like Menchov or Sastre. Consumate professionals... very talented... but very dull. I'll take someone like Evans who's a bit... odd... off the bike over someone who seems like a robot giving interviews.
 

flicker

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Aug 17, 2009
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Contador can make any salute he wants because he is a champion.

I have always thought him a gentleman on and off the bike.

He has a personality and that is good.

How can anyone hate him? He is a good role-model for sport. Not a trash talker.

I do not like how he made everyone look stupid at Arcalis, but he had the right.Cannot hate a talent like Contador. There is no way he should have laid down for Lance last year at the tour. Best man won the tour....as it should be.
 
Mar 30, 2009
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BikeCentric said:
And while we're on the subject of the NFL - Emmitt Smith was a huge fan favorite precisely due to the fact that he would never celebrate in the end zone (while scoring a lot of TD's of course) and never talked trash at all, people loved him for being a successfull class act.
Add the great Walter Payton to that list of class acts who are loved by fans.
 
Nov 17, 2009
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BikeCentric said:
And while we're on the subject of the NFL - Emmitt Smith was a huge fan favorite precisely due to the fact that he would never celebrate in the end zone (while scoring a lot of TD's of course) and never talked trash at all, people loved him for being a successfull class act.

LaDanian Tomlinson is the same way.

I'll never understand the "it's cool to be an a-hole" crowd.
Who do you think had more of a fan following during the glory years for the Cowboys... Emmitt Smith... or Michael Irvin.


There is a difference between having respect for a players ability and being interested enough to follow them as a fan. I have nothing but respect for Emmitt Smith, Barry Sanders, Jerry Rice and others who are great competitors and professional in their approach.

But I'm simply not going to be a fan unless there's some sort of out-going personality present. It doesn't have to be an "a-hole", or a jokester, or insanity... but give me something other then the rote answers to questions that everyone gives.
 
Mar 22, 2010
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flicker said:
Contador can make any salute he wants because he is a champion.

I have always thought him a gentleman on and off the bike.

He has a personality and that is good.

How can anyone hate him? He is a good role-model for sport. Not a trash talker.

I do not like how he made everyone look stupid at Arcalis, but he had the right.Cannot hate a talent like Contador. There is no way he should have laid down for Lance last year at the tour. Best man won the tour....as it should be.

Someone's gonna do something that actually is NUTTY one day and this will all be put into perspective. I am thinking....like...stop at the finish line (obviously not a good idea for sprinters) and I dunno....maybe do a Riverdance, or Moonwalk, maybe a get smart shoephone (Take that Cav'!!).

Anyone remember Chi Chi Rodriquez's matador act when sinking a putt? That's a little something the Spanish contingency could get into. Of course, after WKRP in Cincinnati, he will forever remain Chai Chai Rod Rigwezz to me.
 
Nov 17, 2009
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hawkeye87 said:
Add the great Walter Payton to that list of class acts who are loved by fans.
And Jim McMahon had nearly the same amount of fans (if not more) during the superbowl run with less talent... because of his personality. (I won't say I was a fan of either... I was living in New England and cheering for the Patriots).
 
I get the people who say they like the arrogant, a-hole type personalities, they add colour to the sport. In general though I think people dont like this type of character.

However it is totally different to dislike somebody because they are not arrogant or an a-hole. That is plain ridiculous because that includes the vast majority of sportspeople. They may be bland but they are still great sportspeople who have done nothing to be disliked other than be humble.

Fact is, AC beat Lance the US hero, and then Lance and his cronies tried to paint him in a certain way which obvioulsy worked with the less uneducated cycling fans and I am sure that is why so many US fans hate Contaodr.

If its the lame pistol thing that gets you, then thats sad.
 
alberto.legstrong said:
Someone's gonna do something that actually is NUTTY one day and this will all be put into perspective. I am thinking....like...stop at the finish line (obviously not a good idea for sprinters) and I dunno....maybe do a Riverdance, or Moonwalk, maybe a get smart shoephone (Take that Cav'!!).

Anyone remember Chi Chi Rodriquez's matador act when sinking a putt? That's a little something the Spanish contingency could get into. Of course, after WKRP in Cincinnati, he will forever remain Chai Chai Rod Rigwezz to me.
Hey, how popular was Filippo Simeoni in the US? He won a stage at the Vuelta in 01, stopped just before the finish line, kissed his bike, picked it up, held it in the air and walked across the line as a victory salute. All this was in tribute to those killed in 9/11 amd made the news in many newspapers around the world. Character, personality!! I think Simeoni was a very hated man in the US and a subject most Lance fans are still afraid to go near. How does that put the cat amongst the pigeon?
 
Mar 22, 2010
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kurtinsc said:
And Jim McMahon had nearly the same amount of fans (if not more) during the superbowl run with less talent... because of his personality. (I won't say I was a fan of either... I was living in New England and cheering for the Patriots).
You are a certi-fried glutton for punishment. Those were lean times.
 

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