Is pro racing getting more dangerous?

[Red Rick]

I agree with the sentiment that none of us are even remotely qualified to answer this question. But I have to say that I'm massively annoyed by all the people thinking they can put this down to one factor.

This is not just a consequence of a new approach in stage design. Downhill finishes have existed for decades and decades. This is not just a consequence of races nowadays being decided by seconds, not minutes. Mäder was neither fighting for the stage win nor riding for gc. Of course it's important to learn from the past but people have to stop searching for the one reason to blame for such a tragic event. That reason doesn't exist.

Mountain stages existed for decades before there ever was a mountain finish.

 

[Red Rick]

I agree with the sentiment that none of us are even remotely qualified to answer this question. But I have to say that I'm massively annoyed by all the people thinking they can put this down to one factor.

This is not just a consequence of a new approach in stage design. Downhill finishes have existed for decades and decades. This is not just a consequence of races nowadays being decided by seconds, not minutes. Mäder was neither fighting for the stage win nor riding for gc. Of course it's important to learn from the past but people have to stop searching for the one reason to blame for such a tragic event. That reason doesn't exist.

It's not that noone is qualified. It's that a lot of it would be basic data scraping I'm gonna bet we're all too lazy to do. Not having the data, it can still be worthwile discussing certain changes that happened in the sport and if they made it safer or not.

Right now, I just think emotions are running very hot, and that's logical. I also think it's pretty normal to look for some factor to blame even if this accident was mostly a tragic statistical outlier.

 

[MartinGT]

La Gazzetta dello Sport posted an article on their website about the 10 deaths during races (don't ask me if this is the total fatal incidents in cycling), and the first occured in the 1935 Tour, when a rider descending the Galibier went off the side of the mountain much as Gino did yesterday. Also discussed were Simpson on Mount Ventoux in the 67 Tour, Casartelli and Weylandt, noting that each decade has had its victim.

It's a fact that fatal crashes in cycling are very rare, but that they happen at all is testimony to the inherent dangers of the sport. Is cycling more dangerous than before? I don't know, but I suspect, given that fatal race incidents or those resulting in serious injury have not increased significantly since the first death during a race in 1935, I'd say not really.

Frankly I'm more concerned about the situation out on the roads on training rides. Population growth and increased automobile traffic, has made training outside increasingly dangerous. But apart from trying to educate drivers and riders towards peacefull coexistance on the roads, I fear it's only going to get worse.

Simpson died going UP hill and was ill and had drugs & alcohol in his system,

Re the last paragraph, totally agree. There seems to be more, or more coverage of accidents and riders knocked off on training rides than in races

 

[zlev11]

id say riding in regular traffic is still more dangerous than anything a race presents.

 

[Netserk]

At least the continued urbanisation and fertility collapse will make it safer to train in the countryside.

 

[Extinction]

Simpson died going UP hill and was ill and had drugs & alcohol in his system,

Re the last paragraph, totally agree. There seems to be more, or more coverage of accidents and riders knocked off on training rides than in races

I know that. The article was about those who died during races, not specifically those who died on descents, so there's nothing to disagree with. Today's road traffic is indeed a great concern.

 

[JayKosta]

Poorly designed courses are a problem.
A question - what about the number of competitors who are in position to actively compete for the win at the finish line?
With multiple riders neck-and-neck at the end, someone might be more willing to take dangerous risk.
The sport should be about 'athletic ability', not 'bad judgement'.

 

[Extinction]

Poorly designed courses are a problem.
A question - what about the number of competitors who are in position to actively compete for the win at the finish line?
With multiple riders neck-and-neck at the end, someone might be more willing to take dangerous risk.
The sport should be about 'athletic ability', not 'bad judgement'.

But you can't police bad judgment. Cycling has always had these courses, while measures have been taken to improve rider safety and will continue to do so. Unfortunately, however, the sport is frought with dangers. It is in it's very nature.

 

[Dekker_Tifosi]

unfortunately its something of all times and i disgree with the fact it's more dangerous or getting more dangerous since I vividly remember the racing from 30 years ago on worse bikes, without helmets and with worse safety measures.

 

[kingjr]

30 years ago Abdoujaparov was sprinting without helmet putting people (including himself) into barriers left and right and barely got relegated for it. I like to think we have made progress since then.

 

[Dekker_Tifosi]

30 years ago Abdoujaparov was sprinting without helmet putting people (including himself) into barriers left and right and barely got relegated for it. I like to think we have made progress since then.

i remember the finishes with barriers not even placed together with people standing in between. In a mass sprint stage.

 

[bNator]

But you can't police bad judgment. Cycling has always had these courses, while measures have been taken to improve rider safety and will continue to do so. Unfortunately, however, the sport is wrought with dangers. It is in it's very nature.

I agree it’s impossible to control the outcome in a sport as inherently dangerous as this one. In my opinion, however, not enough is done to provide safety where it could be provided. I won’t go into details as there are many examples (potholes in the middle of neck breaking descents being a very obvious one) and this particular case may not have been any different if all the measures in the world had been taken to prevent it. I do feel however, and I have felt that way before the accident, that riders are sometimes being treated as gladiators unnecessarily…

 

[Leinster]

Frankly I'm more concerned about the situation out on the roads on training rides. Population growth and increased automobile traffic, has made training outside increasingly dangerous. But apart from trying to educate drivers and riders towards peacefull coexistance on the roads, I fear it's only going to get worse.

This. I hope ways can be found to make descents like the one where Mader crashed safer, either by adding barriers, or reducing speed, etc. I still remember as a teenager watching the stage where Casartelli died.

But if I’ve noticed an area where more cyclists are getting severely injured or worse in recent years, it’s the training rides, much more than the races, that are the issue.

 

[Savant12]

It is not getting more dangerous; riders know the risks involved in bike racing. As viewers, I think we would acknowledge that we love the thrill of a fast [technical] descent, seeing riders like Nibali, Sagan, Mohoric, Pidcock etc just making it look effortless.

I've crashed twice in my cycling life:
1) Misjudging an off-camber bend on a descent, getting my line wrong and hitting the barrier; lucky to break somewhat and only bruised and got back on the bike.
2) Being wiped out in a final sprint during a race and toppling down a small embankment; fractured shoulder and slightly concussed.

As a result, I now take it easy on descents and avoid amateur racing due to all the hotheads.

 

[ManicJack]

It is not getting more dangerous; riders know the risks involved in bike racing. As viewers, I think we would acknowledge that we love the thrill of a fast [technical] descent, seeing riders like Nibali, Sagan, Mohoric, Pidcock etc just making it look effortless.

I've crashed twice in my cycling life:
1) Misjudging an off-camber bend on a descent, getting my line wrong and hitting the barrier; lucky to break somewhat and only bruised and got back on the bike.
2) Being wiped out in a final sprint during a race and toppling down a small embankment; fractured shoulder and slightly concussed.

As a result, I now take it easy on descents and avoid amateur racing due to all the hotheads.

You crashed on a bike. Thank God you're alive.

 

[Savant12]

You crashed on a bike. Thank God you're alive.

Do you have anything else to contribute? Or just trolling?

 

[ManicJack]

Do you have anything else to contribute? Or just trolling?

Start a new thread about weekend warriors and their mishaps. Trolling? What does your experience have to do with the thread topic?

 

[Cookster15]

This can't be blamed on any one factor. Having read through some of the responses including Liberty's post I can't see any compelling reasons for this tragedy which stand out. This was a tragedy in a sport where risk cannot be eliminated unless we compete on Zwift. But I do think steep and technical descents after a hard climb are dangerous because riders are in a state of exhaustion and exhaustion affects judgment. The brain needs oxygen. I also disagree that gaps are getting smaller or that this is contributing to heightened danger - is there any data to support that?

 

[Cookster15]

As a result, I now take it easy on descents and avoid amateur racing due to all the hotheads.

I think similarly on descending these days, but pretty sure professionals take more risks and crash more frequently than hot head amateurs?

 

[capuldemetal]

cycling is and will be allways dangerous.as many other sports.if descents would od been cancelled froome wouldn't have wone tdf and salvoldelli giro.

 

[Savant12]

I think similarly on descending these days, but pretty sure professionals take more risks and crash more frequently than hot head amateurs?

Every race, every positioning into descents, climbs, sprints etc has risks and also there are Pros who make stupid mistakes I.e taking out half the peloton because you rode in rough ground on the side and lost control through a deep puddle.

 

[Extinction]

I agree it’s impossible to control the outcome in a sport as inherently dangerous as this one. In my opinion, however, not enough is done to provide safety where it could be provided. I won’t go into details as there are many examples (potholes in the middle of neck breaking descents being a very obvious one) and this particular case may not have been any different if all the measures in the world had been taken to prevent it. I do feel however, and I have felt that way before the accident, that riders are sometimes being treated as gladiators unnecessarily…

I was referring to how a rider behaves, which rests upon the rider. The problem is that to err is human (errare humanum est). Add this to a context of racing at 90-100 kph down a mountain and it's a statistical certainty that eventually something disastrous will go wrong.

Having said that I agree with your concern over not enough being done to lessen the probability of horrific incidents, which, however, in a sport as inherently dangerous as cycling, simply can't be totally eliminated. For instance, why can't curves with huge drop-offs, like the one that proved fatal to Mader, be lined with massive nets of the kind regularlly used in downhill ski events?

 

[Blanco]

cycling is and will be allways dangerous.as many other sports.if descents would od been cancelled froome wouldn't have wone tdf and salvoldelli giro.

Froome won TDF on descent?

 

[Izzyeviel]

I forget what year it was, but Froome who was already in yellow did attack going over the top of a climb and destroyed everyone on the descent. I loved that one.

 

[QueenStagiaire]

I forget what year it was, but Froome who was already in yellow did attack going over the top of a climb and destroyed everyone on the descent. I loved that one.

Ok, he won a stage in the 2016 TdF on a descent by like 15 seconds and he wasn‘t in yellow.