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Is Radioshack a retirement village for old cyclists?

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horseman said:
If he and Bruyneel can then keep that Shack team going and give it some of the knowledge and experience of both men then it could be a good place for some of todays younger riders to begin making their way in the cycling world.

That should be their primary goal, not something to consider, after LA can no longer turn the pedals.
There is a large core of VERY experienced riders, getting together for one last gig.
Seems to me they just want to recapture that which cannot be recaptured.
It's a self-centred project.

It should be about a benevolent Lance and associates, rounding up young US talent and fostering them for the future good of the sport.
Teaching them to be competitive on the world stage.
 
Aug 6, 2009
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What about the trek livestrong riders? Do not know much about them but I assuming there is an option for further developing those younger guys e.g. Taylor Phinney who would no doubt sign for a possible future pro tour team
 
Mar 10, 2009
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the vagabond said:
Do you even understand what I mean by relative to the number of guys riding? There are other races besides the TdeF, but even so, Armstrong, Leipheimer, Horner, Hincapie and five other guys over 34 could win the team contest in the 2010 Tour de F. What is my idiotic theory? That all sports are getting older? That you can't just eliminate older guys from sports because you're tired of hearing about them and prefer new faces?

actually, you said that you could put together a team of mostly american 35-39 year olds and win the team classification in next years TdF (when they will all be another year older). that prospect is distinctly improbable.

you are right though that pro sport is ageing. this has all to do with improvements in medical treatment (in whatever form) and nothing to do with a lack of motivation on the part of the emerging generation of cyclists.
 
Mellow Velo said:
That should be their primary goal, not something to consider, after LA can no longer turn the pedals.
There is a large core of VERY experienced riders, getting together for one last gig.
Seems to me they just want to recapture that which cannot be recaptured.
It's a self-centred project.

It should be about a benevolent Lance and associates, rounding up young US talent and fostering them for the future good of the sport.
Teaching them to be competitive on the world stage.

LA/JB are creating a team from scratch. we're in no position to tell them what their primary goal is. livestrong/SRAM already exists to develop young talent, you cannot accuse LA of not doing this. unlike in previous decades there are numerous teams based on US soil pursuing grand tour success who are developing young riders, the responsibility does not rest solely on LA. he was 3rd on GC in the TDF. he is a contender, a looooong shot IMO but he still has every right to pursue that success.

the shack is likely to have age issues but we're rushing to judgement on the retirment home scenario. transfers cannot be announced until 9/1. those will only be the early announcements. teams will take shape slowly over time thru-out the Fall. we all need to sit back and relax a bit.

LA's presence elevates the profile of a sport with image concerns that is struggling to find financing in an economic downturn. this doesn't exactly hurt young talent either. i don't love the guy and i'm not asking anyone else to love him either but let's see LA for what he is. An overwhelmingly positive influence on the sport with considerable flaws of personality and character. it ain't perfect.
 
Mellow Velo said:
There is a large core of VERY experienced riders, getting together for one last gig. Seems to me they just want to recapture that which cannot be recaptured.
This is what I see. A lot of people are looking at this team with blinders on, thinking it's 2001 again. Like all they have to do is get the same guys, and we can go back in time. But I don't see it happening. Lance was very fortunate to finish as high as he did in this year's Tour. Next year he will be a year older and closer to retirement. Much of his team will. All this while riders such as Contador, the Schlecks, Nibali, Kreuziger, etc. move into their primes. The will also have Pellizotti, Le Mevel, Gesink, LL Sanchez, J Rodriguez, Sammy Sanchez, who are in their prime age to contend with. Plus Basso, Sastre, Evans who aren't done yet, and younger than this team.

Does anyone really think this team can win the Tour? Or anything major? Maybe a better question is: Are there any serious cycling fans outside the United States, who thinks this team can win big?

lean said:
LA/JB are creating a team from scratch.
From scratch? Come on.

LA's presence elevates the profile of a sport with image concerns that is struggling to find financing in an economic downturn. this doesn't exactly hurt young talent either. i don't love the guy and i'm not asking anyone else to love him either but let's see LA for what he is. An overwhelmingly positive influence on the sport with considerable flaws of personality and character. it ain't perfect.
I question that. It is my opinion that the biggest problem cycling has with it's image is doping. Doping is decimating the sport. Despite the attempts to clean up with things like the biological passport, it's painfully clear that doping is a major problem, and a damning one at that. Merely testing negative, and having a lot of testing isn't altering that. It's gotten to the point where someone in the sport is going to have to be more proactive, and push hard to speak out against doping and dopers, and especially the omerta. Lance, to me, is almost the opposite of that. He is part of the problem, not the solution here. He has frequently shown which side of the doping issue, and omerta he is on. I won't re-post all that, you can argue for yourself in the Clinic. But his presence elevating the sport is more like that of a short lived fire. There is no contingency plan for when he's gone. The long term solution for cycling is to get the sport cleaned up. Not have Lance hang around and show his face in front of cameras over and over, and having his Twitter posts regurgitated everywhere.
 
lean said:
LA's presence elevates the profile of a sport with image concerns that is struggling to find financing in an economic downturn. this doesn't exactly hurt young talent either. i don't love the guy and i'm not asking anyone else to love him either but let's see LA for what he is. An overwhelmingly positive influence on the sport with considerable flaws of personality and character. it ain't perfect.

Oh come on. With what? A company that makes ham radio parts and p_sshand computer components? Give me a friggin break. What good is RadioShack to cycling. They will bail once Sir Lance-alot decides he wants to get back on the clubbing circuit. They are not NIKE, they are not a fortune 500 company. What a waste of time. They are not here to sponsor cycling. I mean Radioshack. What a joke.

I just watched the IAAF world 100m championship for men. Oh my god. Now there is the greatest living 100m runner of all time. Greatest sportsman ever possibly. Now I didn't see Bolt sniping at the competition, or stealing his team-mates car or any other nasty games. He's simply good. Full of confidence and loves the stage but never gets nasty. So stop this crapola about bringing sponsors to the game. If Bolt were a cyclist he would be picking a choosing who he wants to sponsor his team. Not begging some nerdy electronics company thats come to sponsor a team because the overweight CEO hasn't got laid in 10 years and thinks he can pick up some of Lance's scary crumbs.

Just stop the nonsense.
 
Aug 16, 2009
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Hey Hogg, you know anything about Bolt or what?

I suppose you never actually watched his olympic performance where he was ripped by the media worldwide, you should probably get your facts straight:

Costas called Bolt's disrespectful to his competitors, to the Olympic Games and to the fans who deserved to see Bolt at his best. And Boldon went even further: "It was a display that should not have been there," Boldon said. "You kids at home, this is not how you behave as an Olympic champion."


And it seems you are sure Lance dopes even though he has never been caught. Well many feel the same about Bolt who has emerged from virtual unknown into the fastest man history. Call me skeptical.
 
Jul 23, 2009
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altark123 said:
I suppose you never actually watched his olympic performance where he was ripped by the media worldwide, you should probably get your facts straight:

Costas called Bolt's disrespectful to his competitors, to the Olympic Games and to the fans who deserved to see Bolt at his best. And Boldon went even further: "It was a display that should not have been there," Boldon said. "You kids at home, this is not how you behave as an Olympic champion."

And it seems you are sure Lance dopes even though he has never been caught. Well many feel the same about Bolt who has emerged from virtual unknown into the fastest man history. Call me skeptical.

At the risk of running this thing off the rails, I will say that these were the opinions of two NBC broadcasters, and were not shared by the Canadian or European broadcasters that I watched. If you have other examples of the 'worldwide' media, I stand to be corrected.

As for your last paragraph, I suggest that you visit the many threads in The Clinic where Lance's positive tests and other issues related to his possible doping have been discussed ad nauseam.
 
Aug 17, 2009
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altark123 said:
Well many feel the same about Bolt who has emerged from virtual unknown into the fastest man history. Call me skeptical.

Do you actually know much about Usain Bolt? Let's see, setting records and winning on a world level since age 16. Youngest ever male World Junior gold medalist. World Junior 200m record at the age of 18. Set a national 200m record in 2007 at the age of 20 (no small feat being Jamaican). Was in the 2004 Olympics at the age of 17. Yup, sounds like an unknown.
 
Aug 13, 2009
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bikernewb said:
Do you actually know much about Usain Bolt? Let's see, setting records and winning on a world level since age 16. Youngest ever male World Junior gold medalist. World Junior 200m record at the age of 18. Set a national 200m record in 2007 at the age of 20 (no small feat being Jamaican). Was in the 2004 Olympics at the age of 17. Yup, sounds like an unknown.

Impressive record.....it sounds just like Marion Jones'
 
Aug 16, 2009
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Response....

To the poster who cited Bolt's resume', please take note that I do not disregard those states but those are all 200m accomplishments and he was considered by many to be an unknown commodity in the 100m.

To the one about worldwide criticism of Bolt, Ato Bolden, whom I cited, is from Trinidad and Tobago.
 
thehog said:
Oh come on. With what? A company that makes ham radio parts and p_sshand computer components? Give me a friggin break. What good is RadioShack to cycling. They will bail once Sir Lance-alot decides he wants to get back on the clubbing circuit. They are not NIKE, they are not a fortune 500 company. What a waste of time. They are not here to sponsor cycling. I mean Radioshack. What a joke.

Again, there are more eyes on the sport when LA is involved. the entire peloton gains exposure. radioshack's business model and the length of their commitment is irrelevent, they're endorsing the checks. i'm sorry to ruin your hate fest and bad jokes with logic.

i know that this phenomenon is difficult to stomach for people with strong dislike, it makes me a little uncomfortable too but i'm not one to burry my head in the sand and ignore it.
 
Alpe d'Huez said:
From scratch? Come on.

is someone else other than LA/JB responsible for putting this team together? is that even a point to be debated?

Alpe d'Huez said:
I question that. It is my opinion that the biggest problem cycling has with it's image is doping. Doping is decimating the sport. Despite the attempts to clean up with things like the biological passport, it's painfully clear that doping is a major problem, and a damning one at that. Merely testing negative, and having a lot of testing isn't altering that. It's gotten to the point where someone in the sport is going to have to be more proactive, and push hard to speak out against doping and dopers, and especially the omerta. Lance, to me, is almost the opposite of that. He is part of the problem, not the solution here. He has frequently shown which side of the doping issue, and omerta he is on. I won't re-post all that, you can argue for yourself in the Clinic. But his presence elevating the sport is more like that of a short lived fire. There is no contingency plan for when he's gone. The long term solution for cycling is to get the sport cleaned up. Not have Lance hang around and show his face in front of cameras over and over, and having his Twitter posts regurgitated everywhere.

huh? television ratings don't lie. they were up this year in the US and most everywhere else compared to last year. they are a driving force which i hope i don't have to explain. i don't like the public in-fighting with teamates any more than you. i've been VERY critical of it in these forums. i've been critical in the clinic. check for yourself. it doesn't change the fact that LA's influence is massive. it's not his responsibility to design a contingency plan for when he's gone and he's no more responsible for the omerta than countless others. all i ask is to be a tiny bit fair and grounded in reality with these criticisms.

thehog said:
Oh come on. With what? A company that makes ham radio parts and p_sshand computer components? Give me a friggin break. What good is RadioShack to cycling. They will bail once Sir Lance-alot decides he wants to get back on the clubbing circuit. They are not NIKE, they are not a fortune 500 company. What a waste of time. They are not here to sponsor cycling. I mean Radioshack. What a joke.

Again, there are more eyes on the sport when LA is involved. the entire peloton gains exposure. radioshack's business model and the length of their commitment is irrelevent, they're endorsing the checks for now. i'm sorry to ruin your hate fest and bad jokes with logic.

i know that this phenomenon is difficult to stomach for people with strong dislike, it makes me a little uncomfortable too but i'm not one to burry my head in the sand and ignore it.
 
bikernewb said:
Do you actually know much about Usain Bolt? Let's see, setting records and winning on a world level since age 16. Youngest ever male World Junior gold medalist. World Junior 200m record at the age of 18. Set a national 200m record in 2007 at the age of 20 (no small feat being Jamaican). Was in the 2004 Olympics at the age of 17. Yup, sounds like an unknown.

fun to watch. sprinters are a different lot. big motor and so strong. if he stays
healthy, look out.:cool:
 
Mar 11, 2009
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I think Lance has profited more from cycling than cycling has profited from Lance.

There is a lot of hype out there.
The crowds at the tour were big.Granted,but if you look at some of the old photo's from years ago you will see even larger crowds.
The whole Lance saves the sport is really about perspective.
Some people might have thought the sport was doing fine before he came along.
 
altark123 said:
And Boldon went even further: "It was a display that should not have been there," Boldon said. "You kids at home, this is not how you behave as an Olympic champion."

So tell me which part of Bolt running doesn't Boldon like? The bit where he's so much better? or the bit where Bolt reminds Boldon of his arrogant self? Can't see a lot of handshaking going on here. Maybe because he was never an Olympic champion it hurts to see Bolt so good.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7xhCe11Q53A
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bh5N5-LmH0w

The Hog rests his case and RadioShack is still a retirement home for old cyclists.
 
Mar 13, 2009
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dolophonic said:
I think Lance has profited more from cycling than cycling has profited from Lance.

There is a lot of hype out there.
The crowds at the tour were big.Granted,but if you look at some of the old photo's from years ago you will see even larger crowds.
The whole Lance saves the sport is really about perspective.
Some people might have thought the sport was doing fine before he came along.
+1. Armstrong is one huge externality like the US treasury deficit, that Verbruggen ushered in, and the sport has one legacy. Even without Armstrong, there would have been a new compromised winner, but not one who really exaggerated the medical program as the key variable in performance. Before it was a default input. Now it is a KPI.
 
lean said:
is someone else other than LA/JB responsible for putting this team together? is that even a point to be debated?



huh? television ratings don't lie. they were up this year in the US and most everywhere else compared to last year. they are a driving force which i hope i don't have to explain. i don't like the public in-fighting with teamates any more than you. i've been VERY critical of it in these forums. i've been critical in the clinic. check for yourself. it doesn't change the fact that LA's influence is massive. it's not his responsibility to design a contingency plan for when he's gone and he's no more responsible for the omerta than countless others. all i ask is to be a tiny bit fair and grounded in reality with these criticisms.



Again, there are more eyes on the sport when LA is involved. the entire peloton gains exposure. radioshack's business model and the length of their commitment is irrelevent, they're endorsing the checks for now. i'm sorry to ruin your hate fest and bad jokes with logic.

i know that this phenomenon is difficult to stomach for people with strong dislike, it makes me a little uncomfortable too but i'm not one to burry my head in the sand and ignore it.

Firstly, eyes are on Lance, not the sport of cycling. If they were on the sport in general, there would not have been such a drop off after he retired and a significant increase again this year. Now many times have I seen people post that the Tour is not interesting without Lance which is plain ridiculous.

For me, a cycling fan is somebody who follows the sport year round, Classics, Giro etc not just the Tour, that is like me watching Wimbledon, French Open. I hardly count as a tennis fan, I dont have a favourite tennis player but I enjoy watching these events. I rarely play myself or watch anything else.

I have posted this many times, in Ireland in the 80s, cycling was massive because of Kelly, Roche, same in Colombia Parra/Herrera. In the 90s, cycling became big in Denmark/Germany because of Riis/Ullrich, cycling is gaining in Britain at the moment because of Olympic success and Cavendish/Wiggins. However, the popularity of cycling in these countries dropped after these guys retired. There was no lasting legacy of the sport.

In 2 years, how likely is it that RadioShack will continue with sponsorship of a non-Lance team. Your average major sponsor usually hangs around for more than 2 years, RadioShack is purely a vehicle for Lance. Discovery Channel didnt hang long after Lance retired.

I would like to see Lance really back the US scene and help develop cycling there because that is where he has most influence. He should be trying to rope in more sponsors for races, teams etc. In the 3 years he was retired, what exactly did he do for the sport in the US?

He is coming to the Tour of Ireland this week but it has been reduced from 5 to 3 days, apparently due to the recession, if he is so important & attractive, where are the extra sponsors lining up to back the race? However there is a rumour that the redution in length might be due to paying Lance to race as the organisers are sure the race will be 5 days again next year.

In summary, the US is the one place where Lance has had a major impact but I dont think he has done enough to really help improve the domestic scene using his popularity & power. That is where I would really like to see him wield his influence. He is not a necessity on Europe.
 
pmcg76 said:
In summary, the US is the one place where Lance has had a major impact but I dont think he has done enough to really help improve the domestic scene using his popularity & power. That is where I would really like to see him wield his influence. He is not a necessity on Europe.

Hi pmcg76.

I heard that Lance sometimes turns up to local races in the US to beat 2nd rate amateurs. But this hasn't been confirmed. Would this be developing the domestic scene? Beating the sh*t out of local riders?
 
thehog said:
Hi pmcg76.

I heard that Lance sometimes turns up to local races in the US to beat 2nd rate amateurs. But this hasn't been confirmed. Would this be developing the domestic scene? Beating the sh*t out of local riders?


Well, according to some, he saved the Tour of Gila this year. I am sure if he focused on the US scene, he would definitely bring more interest, sponsors that potentially could be used to build up a stong scene. Even if he was just to hang around races a la Eddy Merckx, it would create interest in the US.
 
Apr 11, 2009
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Mellow Velo said:
Is Bolt rumoured to be signing for the Shack?
I'd recommend the Jamaican anti doping policy.

You bet, heard Lance has his eye on the green jersey and wants a leadout man. :D Bolt would be great for drafting behind (at 70mph). Also will keep the mood on the team bus nice and relaxed.

(But there are some probs at Trek. Bolt's broken a few frames when he tries to sprint; been ripping off the pedals of the PowerTap too).

Here we go:

2qmivys.jpg


Bolt has already finished, had lunch, caught a plane, and overturned his Beamer.

Thomas Rice, 81, left, Robert Bruce, 81, and Edward Cox, 82, competed in the 100-meter run at a U.S.A. Masters Outdoor Track & Field Championships event in East Stroudsburg, Pa., in June.

See doping issues among seniors:

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/08/19/us/19athletes.html?_r=1&hp

You gotta laugh at this: "After setting the age-group record in the 400-meter run in 3 minutes 20 seconds at the regional championships in East Stroudsburg, Pa., on June 27 — Michael Johnson holds the world record at 43.18 seconds — Mr. Levine was exhausted and elated."

Ha, ha, ha. 3:20 for 400 metres is the record! :eek: Isn't that like 12 min/miles=walking pace? I, or even TheHog, could get competitive here.
 

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