Is Walsh on the Sky bandwagon?

[proffate]

Froome winning it multiple times will show that he is clean?

Didn't Armstrong, Contador, Indurain, win the Tour multiple times?

call him out on twitter? This seems like a fairly "objective" point to raise. After all it's not opinion that the two most recent multiple tdf winners are known dopers.

 

[LaFlorecita]

Go for it Hitchy however he may ask you if you ever think before you insult

 

[Dazed and Confused]

Don't forget that Hamilton told him that Fabian is Luigi and therefore 100% doper confirmed.

so according to Walsh we are operating in specific clean areas rather than what most of us clueless fans thought: the clean era.

 

[Ferminal]

so according to Walsh we are operating in specific clean areas rather than what most of us clueless fans thought: the clean era.

To be fair, from what I've seen there has been little regurgitation of the omerta "no one dopes anymore" talking points. Walsh went looking for his own reasons as to why Sky are clean. I'm sure if he went to the Tour with Movistar next year he could argue why they are clean, but withholds judgment until then.

 

[sniper]

To be fair, from what I've seen there has been little regurgitation of the omerta "no one dopes anymore" talking points. Walsh went looking for his own reasons as to why Sky are clean. I'm sure if he went to the Tour with Movistar next year he could argue why they are clean, but withholds judgment until then.

the only ones i can think of who've spoken of clean cycling are JV and Tinkov.

Walsh has mentioned an improved culture/mentality and antidoping(passport) as reasons why it is now cleanER, though.
For instance in the 'why i believe' article.

It was his [froome's] good fortune to enter the sport when anti-doping controls were becoming more effective and attitudes changing.

 

[Dazed and Confused]

To be fair, from what I've seen there has been little regurgitation of the omerta "no one dopes anymore" talking points. Walsh went looking for his own reasons as to why Sky are clean. I'm sure if he went to the Tour with Movistar next year he could argue why they are clean, but withholds judgment until then.

Not blaming him, the circumstances are almost impossible imo. Nevertheless when a professional decides to do a job, the finished product will be open for criticism. At best I see a rushed marketing job.

 

[MartinGT]

Was listening to the radio last night when I heard a guy talking about Walsh and his book. He said it was a great read and how Sky are awesome and clean.

He said that Walsh called all the people saying Armstrong was clean were just cheerleaders.

Oh the Irony

 

[sniper]

Was listening to the radio last night when I heard a guy talking about Walsh and his book. He said it was a great read and how Sky are awesome and clean.

He said that Walsh called all the people saying Armstrong was clean were just cheerleaders.

Oh the Irony

the irony is crazy.
still this summer he was explaining on dutch television how foolish journalists were who had asked armstrong et al directly about doping and had taken their answers at face value.
with sky he does exactly that.

...
At first Freeman wasn't convinced.

"I was confused because Chris hadn't performed with this consistency for the team and I wondered how he'd done it. Before I could be satisfied, I spent two weeks re-examining all of his blood samples from his two seasons in our team and looked at all the information in his biological passport.

"What I wanted was to compare blood results from the Vuelta with the blood tests he'd done previously to see if there were changes. There weren't. His blood values remained the same and whatever the reasons for him riding consistently in that Vuelta, in my opinion it wasn't down to him doing things he shouldn't have done." Freeman's admission of initial concern was reassuring.

http://pastebin.com/UXrzj16r

epic facepalms

 

[sniper]

Nigel Farquhar ‏@Wataboutya 9h

Listened to @DavidWalshST interview on @HumansInvent podcast - compelling, but in much the same way as @lancearmstrong is. Is it the drama?

Lance Armstrong ‏@lancearmstrong 9h

@Wataboutya @DavidWalshST @HumansInvent precisely. He and I are actually quite similar. #winatallcosts

 

[thehog]

the only ones i can think of who've spoken of clean cycling are JV and Tinkov.

Walsh has mentioned an improved culture/mentality and antidoping(passport) as reasons why it is now cleanER, though.
For instance in the 'why i believe' article.

LOL! Tinkov, Walsh and JV. Doping has ended!

 

[thehog]

Nigel Farquhar ‏@Wataboutya 9h



Lance Armstrong ‏@lancearmstrong 9h

Nah Walsh is just a nice guy who gets stubborn. Generally by his stupidity.

He's still looking for USPS styled doping.

I listened to his most recent podcast. All of them agreed clean riders can now best the times or dopers. But too many variables to compare the times.

Most convenient argument and that Froome and Porte are the only ones doing so!

Oh and Horner

 

[thehog]

Nah Walsh is just a nice guy who gets stubborn. Generally by his stupidity.

He's still looking for USPS styled doping.

I listened to his most recent podcast. All of them agreed clean riders can now best the times or dopers. But too many variables to compare the times.

Most convenient argument and that Froome and Porte are the only ones doing so!

Oh and Horner

Sorry. One more part was troubling me about the podcast. I've not come to any conclusions but just thinking it out loud.

Walsh sat down with head doctor Dr. Farrell for a on the record interview at the Giro 13.


They then walked back to the team bus Farrell tells Walsh he also wasn't convinced by Froome in 2011 and his rapid rise. He was sceptical and wanted to know more.

So after he joined in 2012 he went back over his passport. Said he saw nothing. Everything was in order and the same as he was in 2012.

This was off the record but Walsh wanted the story heard.

Farrell said he was sceptical, went back and checked previous data and it was the same. So badzhilla had no impact on the passport even though the UCI tests picked it up? I assume Farrell had access to other data such as power files etc.

Performances were down pre '11 Vuelta the shot up and all was the same?

It like Lance's clean urine story. It was too clean.

This is the same. I'm not sure what Farrell was looking for but I'm not convinced by the story.

 

[Dear Wiggo]

Sorry. One more part was troubling me about the podcast. I've not come to any conclusions but just thinking it out loud.

Walsh sat down with head doctor Dr. Farrell for a on the record interview at the Giro 13.


They then walked back to the team bus Farrell tells Walsh he also wasn't convinced by Froome in 2011 and his rapid rise. He was sceptical and wanted to know more.

So after he joined in 2012 he went back over his passport. Said he saw nothing. Everything was in order and the same as he was in 2012.

This was off the record but Walsh wanted the story heard.

Farrell said he was sceptical, went back and checked previous data and it was the same. So badzhilla had no impact on the passport even though the UCI tests picked it up? I assume Farrell had access to other data such as power files etc.

Performances were down pre '11 Vuelta the shot up and all was the same?

It like Lance's clean urine story. It was too clean.

This is the same. I'm not sure what Farrell was looking for but I'm not convinced by the story.

It's a minor point, but when JV talks about doing similar things - he can't access the passport values himself. He has to ask permission.

I find it curious that the Dr did not mention asking Froome for permission to access all his values. He just did it. Do they have a different set up with Sky?

 

[thehog]

It's a minor point, but when JV talks about doing similar things - he can't access the passport values himself. He has to ask permission.

I find it curious that the Dr did not mention asking Froome for permission to access all his values. He just did it. Do they have a different set up with Sky?

I can only assume a Dr. can address a patients file without authorisation?

Nevertheless I thought Badzhilla was a RBC eating disease and his passport looks normal? The reverse of EPO Froome said.

Walsh also confirmed the passport was normal.

Either Badzhilla wasn't real or the passport was fudged.

Or Badzhilla doesn't attack RBCs?

No wonder Walsh says there's nothing to see here.

 

[JMBeaushrimp]

I think I've come to the point where I'm pretty sure none of this matters.

Sky is beyond questionable.

Astana is totally sketchy.

Saxo has, via a new owner, approached full ***.

Garmin has nothing but past dopers to count on.

CSC has no leg to stand on.

Lampre is continuing the insanity.

Lotto has an awesome new kit.

OPQS is keeping the dream alive.

MtQubeka has an ironic new kit.

And, the Grinch of American cycling can't find a team.

Merry Christmas...

 

[The Hitch]

I think I've come to the point where I'm pretty sure none of this matters.

Sky is beyond questionable.

Astana is totally sketchy.

Saxo has, via a new owner, approached full ***.

Garmin has nothing but past dopers to count on.

CSC has no leg to stand on.

Lampre is continuing the insanity.

Lotto has an awesome new kit.

OPQS is keeping the dream alive.

MtQubeka has an ironic new kit.

And, the Grinch of American cycling can't find a team.

Merry Christmas...

Dont give up. That's what they want you to do.

Never give in--never give in, never, never, never. Never yield to force; never yield to the apparently overwhelming might of the enemy.

 

[JMBeaushrimp]

Dont give up. That's what they want you to do.

Never give in--never give in, never, never, never. Never yield to force; never yield to the apparently overwhelming might of the enemy.

To coin an Americanism: "If I stop watching, the terrorists have won".

#FYKTARX

Look it up...

 

[Ferminal]

It's a minor point, but when JV talks about doing similar things - he can't access the passport values himself. He has to ask permission.

I find it curious that the Dr did not mention asking Froome for permission to access all his values. He just did it. Do they have a different set up with Sky?

How does it work? It's a UCI thing isn't it?

Do riders have continuous access to results via ADAMS or something? Or do they have to request that info from the UCI? I presume only the rider can do that, for someone else to access they'd have to sign a release form or pass the data on themselves.

As part of the "medical checks" required for riders, they need to have blood tests quarterly (not official OoC tests but they do need to be tested in a WADA lab), and team doctors would have that data.

 

[AcademyCC]

The list of problems i have with this book is very long. Did anyone else laugh out loud turning nearly every page? or am I being harsh?

I mean, the whole book (even if sky were clean) is just completely ridiculous.

Ive had to stop reading. Pretty disgusted

 

[Catwhoorg]

Nevertheless I thought Badzhilla was a RBC eating disease and his passport looks normal? The reverse of EPO Froome said.

As has been said before, you thought wrong.

Malaria is an example of a RBC eating disease.

Schistosomiasis is not, it is more inflammatory, as the bodies fights the worms, and in some cases 'lodged' eggs.
There can be secondary effects on the blood, usually through blood loss in urine and/or faeces.


The main effect is going to be tiredness/fatigue.


Its possible that the elevated white cell count was noticed, but that isn't recorded in the passport, but this story has been told so many times, by different sources, (and repeated by different people) its hard to conclude what actually happened.

 

[Catwhoorg]

Oh and to be fair Froome is also wrong on occasions about this disease.

Any eggs in the body cannot develop into full blown adults, they MUST go through the water snail portion of the development. Once he is fully 100% cleared, the only way adults could reappear is reinfection.

 

[AcademyCC]

He says about Brailsford asking the press "What would you like to do to prove we are clean?" at the tour.

The mob say get him to do some lab testing for his VO2 max. Brailsford says no we don't do that.

What the...?

 

[sniper]

The list of problems i have with this book is very long. Did anyone else laugh out loud turning nearly every page? or am I being harsh?

you're coming a bit late to the party, but no, your not being harsh.
in addition to the book, look some pages back and you'll find a link to an interview on CN and to a podcast radio interview with Walsh providing staggering answers and arguments that should offend any cycling fan with half a brain.
as you say, there is a remarkably long list of senile arguments in which he either lies, presents halftruths, ignores signals, and completely neglects the high standards of scepticism with which he went after usps/lance.

I mean, the whole book (even if sky were clean) is just completely ridiculous.
Ive had to stop reading. Pretty disgusted

if you read back, you'll see that many clinicians feel like that.
outside of the clinic, there isn't much talk about this.
Digger of course expressed his opinions on twitter.
And Shane Stokes did a good interview. Check the link a coupla pages back. As for Kimmage, it's not hard to guess how he feels about the book, but he's wisely biting his tongue on this one.

He says about Brailsford asking the press "What would you like to do to prove we are clean?" at the tour.

yeah, if you get the chance, go back a few pages and check the Shane Stokes interview. This was discussed there.

 

[AcademyCC]

sniper - fair enough. Im probably very late on this but just needed to shout somewhere

 

[sniper]

sniper - fair enough. Im probably very late on this

better late than never.

but just needed to shout somewhere

yes, very understandable.
the old walsh is unrecognizable. we seem to have lost Walsh to the evil camp where money and hypocrisy reign and skepticism and transparency are taboo.