Isaac Del Toro thread

[Red Rick]

Doubling down, its a bold strategy Cotton, lets see if it pays off for him...

If anything his winning of a lot of Italian one day races has rewritten the perception of his weaker performances in the Giro completely

 

[Red Rick]

I think I'll let del Toro's legs do the talking. Seems to work pretty well, don't you think?...

They were pretty silent at the critical junctions in May

 

[ChewbaccaDefense]

If anything his winning of a lot of Italian one day races has rewritten the perception of his weaker performances in the Giro completely

I'd think almost any Pro Tour rider would take his weaker performance in their 2nd year, at the age of 21, dontchathink?

 

[ChewbaccaDefense]

They were pretty silent at the critical junctions in May

They're speaking pretty loudly to everyone except you.

 

[Brullnux]

Del Toro's Giro did show some weaknesses, but I don't think it's particularly good evidence point to lack future GT capabilities because he is, uh, 21.

What is definitely true is that he's more naturally suited to hilly one day races, especially under a certain distance. I genuinely think only Pogacar beats him at Giro dell'Emilia or even like Fleche Wallone. He's absolutely elite at those, and his acceleration is supreme

 

[Unchained]

Del Toro's Giro did show some weaknesses, but I don't think it's particularly good evidence point to lack future GT capabilities because he is, uh, 21.

What is definitely true is that he's more naturally suited to hilly one day races, especially under a certain distance. I genuinely think only Pogacar beats him at Giro dell'Emilia or even like Fleche Wallone. He's absolutely elite at those, and his acceleration is supreme

Del Toro never had his Giro, he was given the keys to Juan Ayuso's Giro and UAE said do the best you can, all your training and plans to support Juan are in the trash. When Del Toro and his team plan a grand tour debut he will be prepared, so will they

 

[Unchained]

Smell something fishy.. Del Toro scratched from one race, will race with President Pogacar at Tres Valli.2_days later will do Piemonte.. Lombardi on the 11th..don't be surprised if he's a scratch at Piemonte and goes with Pog to Lombardi.. He was able to really back off today, got dragged around for a long time as everyone was chasing Yates unsuccessfully. Really thought will his form and rolling along Isaac was going for gravel rainbow.. Bummer

 

[KZD]

15 wins this season, massive success and hopefully keeps improving next year

 

[Cycling111]

200 kilometer syndrome, like Roglic, like Ayuso...

 

[AlfaLum]

Superb performance again. 5th in a 240K+ monument at the age of 21 after such a tough breakthrough season is an incredible performance.

 

[James M]

Superb performance again. 5th in a 240K+ monument at the age of 21 after such a tough breakthrough season is an incredible performance.

For sure, great performance, just as Seixas. The engine for monuments and those distances usually comes with age and experience.

An incredible season and extraordinarily talented and considering his remarkable leap this year, he will be one of the focal points to follow next season for sure. I hope he cap the season of by going to Mexico NC which is rumoured.

 

[Red Rick]

Getting dropped from the back wheel when the likes of Storer can still follow and then just barely winning the sprint for 5th goes down as an underperformance to expectation in my book.

That is, if we're holding to the standards we're hyping him to. But I expect that we won't cause that's how we do things.

 

[James M]

Getting dropped from the back wheel when the likes of Storer can still follow and then just barely winning the sprint for 5th goes down as an underperformance to expectation in my book.

That is, if we're holding to the standards we're hyping him to. But I expect that we won't cause that's how we do things.

Expectations are subjective, in general I agree if everyone expected him to be 3, thats not warranted expectations based on results imo - yet. Not everyone did that though.

Its also not a given he can win monuments but when we put context which matter into it, given his age and extraordinary leap this year, a betting man like you on the black market would say its inivitable and a matter of time.

 

[Netserk]

Getting dropped from the back wheel when the likes of Storer can still follow and then just barely winning the sprint for 5th goes down as an underperformance to expectation in my book.

That is, if we're holding to the standards we're hyping him to. But I expect that we won't cause that's how we do things.

Yeah. I would have liked to see more of how he rode with Simmons and how much time he lost to the chase group on Bergamo Alto.

 

[Red Rick]

Expectations are subjective, in general I agree if everyone expected him to be 3, thats also not warranted expectations based on results imo - yet. Not everyone did that though.

Its also not a given he can win monuments but when we put context which matter into it, given his age and extraordinary leap this year, a betting man like you on the black market would say its inivitable and a matter of time.

He may win a monument or more in the future, but he hasn't shown nearly enough for me to call it an inevitability. Especially when being on Pogacar's team.

 

[Unchained]

View: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=tMa8t0ANmSQ


Fortunately you don't need to speak Spanish to understand the video.

 

[Unchained]

Absolutely heartbreaking to see the top 10 at gravel worlds including a UAE winner and Tim Wellens up there, also a sub prepared Pidcock also top 10..I am sure it was a mutual decision but Isaac should have went for the rainbow..

 

[Offline]

Absolutely heartbreaking to see the top 10 at gravel worlds including a UAE winner and Tim Wellens up there, also a sub prepared Pidcock also top 10..I am sure it was a mutual decision but Isaac should have went for the rainbow..

Wasn’t the best course for him

 

[Logic-is-your-friend]

how riders typically mature into monuments and longer distances

Do they typically? Monument winners often already showed early on that they don't suffer from the distance. Evenepoel, Pogacar, Boonen... at that age already showed the distance was not an issue.

 

[Salvarani]

How is it an issue when he finished 7th in WC and 5th in Lombardia.

Seems like handles the distance pretty damn well.

It is hard to win a monument when Pog and MVDP is around, who has won 14 out of the last 16 or something between them.

Del Toro one of few riders who could potentially win one in the future. Together with a couple of other young riders emerging.

Saying long distances is a problem... seems way too premature. You need more evidence and support for such a claim.

And arguably he has done quite well having finished 7th and 5th already in longer/tough races.

 

[James M]

Do they typically? Monument winners often already showed early on that they don't suffer from the distance. Evenepoel, Pogacar, Boonen... at that age already showed the distance was not an issue.

I think, in typical fashion, yes more often than not, they mature into it in general. Wasnt just Seixas now the youngest top 10 in 100 years in a monument or am I mistaken?

Those three are not the usual Monument winners lets be real..Boonen is royalty.. Evenepoel is not, but hes a victim of the generation he's in, and Pogi is not a standard anyone should be judged upon.

 

[Logic-is-your-friend]

How is it an issue when he finished 7th in WC and 5th in Lombardia.

Seems like handles the distance pretty damn well.

It is hard to win a monument when Pog and MVDP is around, who has won 14 out of the last 16 or something between them.

Del Toro one of few riders who could potentially win one in the future. Together with a couple of other young riders emerging.

Saying long distances is a problem... seems way too premature. You need more evidence and support for such a claim.

And arguably he has done quite well having finished 7th and 5th already in longer/tough races.

The point isn't that his result was bad, the point is that at a certain point in the race, he blew up and got kicked back by minutes. While that doesn't have to mean he will not improve or will never be able to win a monument, it should be taken into account for a talent that has been dominantly winning <200km classics. He is looking like a podium contender until 200-210k in two different races, and then suddenly he's gone and gets mopped up by guys that got dropped much earlier, losing minutes.

I think, in typical fashion, yes more often than not, they mature into it in general. Wasnt just Seixas now the youngest top 10 in 100 years now in Lombardia or am I mistaken?

Those three are not the usual Monument winners lets be real..Boonen is royalty.. Evenepoel is not, but hes a victim of the generation he's in, and Pogi is not a standard anyone should be judged upon.

Hehe. Evenepoel won CSS (227k) at 19, WCC and LBL at 22 and who knows what would have happened without his crash. If there is one of those 3 that fits your narrative best, it's actually Pogacar who has made the biggest leap from an outsider when he was 22 to who he is now. But quite often do monument winners already have results at that age to show that the distance is not the issue (which includes Pogacar). Cancellara finished in the same time as the winner of PR when he was 23. Boonen was 21 when he podiumed PR. Unfortunately MvdP didn't race at that age yet. Those who were much older, usually have a clinic past or they were one hit wonders in terms of monuments. Merckx won the very first monument he raced (age 20). Hinault was 22 when he won LBL.

So for a precocious supertalent as Del Toro, who has already won many classics below 200k, who already podiumed a GT, it would be quite normal to see him do better in 250k races.

 

[Salvarani]

Finishing 7th and 5th showcase already that he can handle it.

He didnt finish 25th or 40th.

 

[Logic-is-your-friend]

Again, not the point. Both times he was at the front of the race, both times he lost minutes, which is at the very least peculiar for a guy who has been bossing <200k races.

 

[Offline]

Del Toro doing crit race in Andora this weekend with Pogacar. So he'll not race the 2 Veneto races..

For me Del Toro still had 4 wins in him. 2x Veneto and 2x NC