everyone knows eva marie b was the podium girl with paul weller on the podium to play some sartre brit pop
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Say what you want about Johan's presence at the track, but his response to the outrage was measured and calm. And fair enough. They banned him from sport, not buying tickets to an event.
Johan's response was far less aggressive than the anti-doping-for-life crusader who blocks people left and right on Twitter and puts them down as basement dwellers to anyone who will listen.
Johan's response was far less aggressive than the anti-doping-for-life crusader who blocks people left and right on Twitter and puts them down as basement dwellers to anyone who will listen.
Re:
To be fair, the Johann Brunyeels of other sports are treated as legends and wise old heads. They don't get banned in the first place to be put in that situation.
red_flanders said:
To be fair, the Johann Brunyeels of other sports are treated as legends and wise old heads. They don't get banned in the first place to be put in that situation.
although it has been shown time and again no one in cycling cares a bit about what I think, I will venture my opinion:
Nothing about that event was cycling-related enough for me to care whether Bruyneel attended in person or watched it on the tv in his prison cell.
Nothing about that event was cycling-related enough for me to care whether Bruyneel attended in person or watched it on the tv in his prison cell.
Re:
I was waiting to post that invite to the person who picked Johan in the fantasy doping draft. Alas, it looks as though he's not going to get picked, and everyone in the doping draft is going to miss one hell of a wedding.
blackcat said:everyone knows eva marie b was the podium girl with paul weller on the podium to play some sartre brit pop
I was waiting to post that invite to the person who picked Johan in the fantasy doping draft. Alas, it looks as though he's not going to get picked, and everyone in the doping draft is going to miss one hell of a wedding.
Re: Re:
thats not even white trash. its not even a meta white trash. its not even white trash with a fake tan, or a tanning salon tan. its not even albino trash.
its blind trash. it is not even a braille trash.
its an ineffable trash.
it is like the USPS medical waste that the Froggie journos found when they tailed the swannies of USPS in an unmarked USPS swannie vehicle and they trashed the medical waste in the trash and then the journalists in their unmarked journalist vehicle found the medical waste with ampoules of insulin from the usps diabetic mechanic and the acto-acto-acto-acto"what" calves milk bottles in the medical trash.
the delgados said:
thats not even white trash. its not even a meta white trash. its not even white trash with a fake tan, or a tanning salon tan. its not even albino trash.
its blind trash. it is not even a braille trash.
its an ineffable trash.
it is like the USPS medical waste that the Froggie journos found when they tailed the swannies of USPS in an unmarked USPS swannie vehicle and they trashed the medical waste in the trash and then the journalists in their unmarked journalist vehicle found the medical waste with ampoules of insulin from the usps diabetic mechanic and the acto-acto-acto-acto"what" calves milk bottles in the medical trash.
I think it is GREAT that Bruyneel attended the hour record attempt as a VIP, despite his ban. This is the UCI telling the very last thick-headed moron who refuses to get it: "Nothing has changed and (will you please believe us this time) nothing is ever going to change."
Re:
As to the first post, it would be a perfect reflection of what MarkvW is suggesting, and probably the most honest thing the UCI has done for years...maybe ever.
Sciocco said:
MarkvW said:
As to the first post, it would be a perfect reflection of what MarkvW is suggesting, and probably the most honest thing the UCI has done for years...maybe ever.
Re:
Mark, with respect I think you are wrong. Bruyneel bought his own ticket. He is not banned from attending UCI events as a spectator.
Your comment "Nothing has changed" is out of context. When it comes to Bruyneel a lot has changed. He cannot be in the cycling world in any capacity (other than a spectator) whatsoever. That is a huge change. He is no longer able to construct his fraud and deceit. His reputation and his right to earn a living in cycling is ruined. That is as it should be.
I was as gagged and upset as anyone at seeing Bruyneel at the event and yukking it up with McQuaid. It was unseemly and surreal. It tarnishes the image of the UCI. It perhaps says more about McQuaid than Bruyneel. But like it or not they both have the right to be there.
MarkvW said:
Mark, with respect I think you are wrong. Bruyneel bought his own ticket. He is not banned from attending UCI events as a spectator.
Your comment "Nothing has changed" is out of context. When it comes to Bruyneel a lot has changed. He cannot be in the cycling world in any capacity (other than a spectator) whatsoever. That is a huge change. He is no longer able to construct his fraud and deceit. His reputation and his right to earn a living in cycling is ruined. That is as it should be.
I was as gagged and upset as anyone at seeing Bruyneel at the event and yukking it up with McQuaid. It was unseemly and surreal. It tarnishes the image of the UCI. It perhaps says more about McQuaid than Bruyneel. But like it or not they both have the right to be there.
If we don't let in Bruyneel, why should we let in Vaughters.
1 reason will suffice.
Agree with Kingboonen that from JB's perspective it probably wasn't a good idea, but don't agree that the organizers should've kept him out.
1 reason will suffice.
Agree with Kingboonen that from JB's perspective it probably wasn't a good idea, but don't agree that the organizers should've kept him out.
Re: Re:
I think the point isn't whether Bruyneel bought his own ticket or not, it's the fact that the UCI (apparently) did nothing to dissuade him from attending, or if they didn't know in advance, did nothing to ensure that he was asked to leave or at least leave the (very highly visible) VIP area.
In my long experience attending pro cycling and motor sports events, EVERYONE who is ANYONE involved in the event knows exactly who will be in the VIP area (aside from possibly the VIP's guests) long before the event. Whether it's a sponsor tent, or an organizer's paddock, they know who's there. They also know that, aside from the actual competition, the VIP area is most likely to attract the most media attention and is most likely to be photographed.
The real point that's been made already, is that the UCI seems nonplussed by a man who is currently serving a ban as the mastermind behind the biggest scandal the sport has ever seen (and the total fallout from which maybe hasn't even been seen yet), happily hobnobbing at what has to be considered one of the sport's showcase events (at least from a PR perspective).
RobbieCanuck said:
I think the point isn't whether Bruyneel bought his own ticket or not, it's the fact that the UCI (apparently) did nothing to dissuade him from attending, or if they didn't know in advance, did nothing to ensure that he was asked to leave or at least leave the (very highly visible) VIP area.
In my long experience attending pro cycling and motor sports events, EVERYONE who is ANYONE involved in the event knows exactly who will be in the VIP area (aside from possibly the VIP's guests) long before the event. Whether it's a sponsor tent, or an organizer's paddock, they know who's there. They also know that, aside from the actual competition, the VIP area is most likely to attract the most media attention and is most likely to be photographed.
The real point that's been made already, is that the UCI seems nonplussed by a man who is currently serving a ban as the mastermind behind the biggest scandal the sport has ever seen (and the total fallout from which maybe hasn't even been seen yet), happily hobnobbing at what has to be considered one of the sport's showcase events (at least from a PR perspective).
Definitely would be happy if this guy was banned from being anywhere near professional cycling and events of any kind. He's a kuhnt.
Bruyneel will continue to 'network' the cycling community for the next decade and return with a team. No doubt about it. He is appealing his 10year ban. Plenty will welcome him, just look at the backlash he got from the sport by turning up a Wiggins hour, Nothing!
I say again it will take a monumental change in attitude and testing to make it a majority of clean participants. That will not happen because those who run the sport don't want change.
I say again it will take a monumental change in attitude and testing to make it a majority of clean participants. That will not happen because those who run the sport don't want change.
Re:
Many will say cause he was involved with armstrong he approved the 'bully" approach of him.
We can't know that for sure of course but even then that has nothing to do with the sport itself. He's in the same boat as many others, who are still praised by the ones shouting at his presence in the event.
sniper said:
Many will say cause he was involved with armstrong he approved the 'bully" approach of him.
We can't know that for sure of course but even then that has nothing to do with the sport itself. He's in the same boat as many others, who are still praised by the ones shouting at his presence in the event.
Given the number of folks that say they threw up or gagged when they saw Bruyneel in the VIP zone its too bad WADA or the UCI does not make stronger sanctions like the Italians seem to. This is a google translate from a article describing the sanction of an Italian mtn. bike athlete. This athlete was then caught and further reprimanded for competing in a fondo type event in 2012.
" with effect from 22/10/2009 and expiring on 21/10/2012, to cover in future posts or positions within the CONI, the FSN, the DSA, or in Italy to attend the sports facilities, the spaces for the athletes and personnel or to take part in the events or sporting events that are held throughout the country and are organized by the said sports bodies."
I am not getting into the discussion of fairness of those sanctioned vs those not. It certainly can make for an uncomfortable situation when clean athletes and sanctioned individuals mix. Not saying that would happen much at a Pro Mens cycling event though. Johan knew exactly what he was doing by showing up and posing for pictures at such a high profile UCI branded event.
So telling that the cycling fraternity center of track was all smiles and handshakes. Cultural shift?...what cultural shift???
" with effect from 22/10/2009 and expiring on 21/10/2012, to cover in future posts or positions within the CONI, the FSN, the DSA, or in Italy to attend the sports facilities, the spaces for the athletes and personnel or to take part in the events or sporting events that are held throughout the country and are organized by the said sports bodies."
I am not getting into the discussion of fairness of those sanctioned vs those not. It certainly can make for an uncomfortable situation when clean athletes and sanctioned individuals mix. Not saying that would happen much at a Pro Mens cycling event though. Johan knew exactly what he was doing by showing up and posing for pictures at such a high profile UCI branded event.
So telling that the cycling fraternity center of track was all smiles and handshakes. Cultural shift?...what cultural shift???
Re: Re:
It's true. However, I still find this particularly shameless, since everyone in the sport knows that the entire world knows how dirty the guy is. If someone hasn't been banned in the first place, most fans don't know how much of a doper they are. See all current GT winners not convicted of doping...
This is the equivalent of inviting Ray Rice to the NFL women's charity banquet.
The Hitch said:
It's true. However, I still find this particularly shameless, since everyone in the sport knows that the entire world knows how dirty the guy is. If someone hasn't been banned in the first place, most fans don't know how much of a doper they are. See all current GT winners not convicted of doping...
This is the equivalent of inviting Ray Rice to the NFL women's charity banquet.
Re: Re:
Oh come on. This is nothing at all like inviting Ray Rice to the NFL women's charity banquet. Bruyneel wasn't invited, he bought a ticket. And Bruyneel didn't beat the *** out of people. That's a rather sordid comparison.
For F's sake I understand why people so strongly dislike the guy but he's not a violent abuser. He's just a cheater.
Oh come on. This is nothing at all like inviting Ray Rice to the NFL women's charity banquet. Bruyneel wasn't invited, he bought a ticket. And Bruyneel didn't beat the *** out of people. That's a rather sordid comparison.
For F's sake I understand why people so strongly dislike the guy but he's not a violent abuser. He's just a cheater.
Re: Re:
I hear you loud and clear. It is just as a former criminal defence lawyer, I recognize certain rights that others may not take into account. I agree the UCI could have tried to dissuade him from attending, but legally it does not appear they could have kept him away. His ticket is a contract. He pays the money and gets the benefit of the ticket and everything that is reasonably implied as accompanying that. The UCI was probably aware of his rights. We don't know if they tried to dissuade him because they have refused any comment on the matter.
The idea of making the ban from cycling broader was perhaps the way to go with Bruyneel. The USADA order could have precluded him from attending any UCI sanctioned event. But there again USADA is stacked with lawyers who would have recognized there is a limit to the kind of banning order they can make. The Americans are particularly conscious of freedom of assembly under their Constitution as are most western legal systems, especially Britain. In Canada we have a specific right under our Charter of Rights that states as follows:
2. Everyone has the following fundamental freedoms;
(c) freedom of peaceful assembly
It was particularly galling to see him there, especially with his gold watch, his vino and yukking it up with McQuaid. He apparently paid Eu/L(?)800 for his ticket and for three other friends so it does not appear he is hurting financially.
The optics were horrible to the cause and insulting to the intellect of those who want clean cycling.
MacRoadie said:
I hear you loud and clear. It is just as a former criminal defence lawyer, I recognize certain rights that others may not take into account. I agree the UCI could have tried to dissuade him from attending, but legally it does not appear they could have kept him away. His ticket is a contract. He pays the money and gets the benefit of the ticket and everything that is reasonably implied as accompanying that. The UCI was probably aware of his rights. We don't know if they tried to dissuade him because they have refused any comment on the matter.
The idea of making the ban from cycling broader was perhaps the way to go with Bruyneel. The USADA order could have precluded him from attending any UCI sanctioned event. But there again USADA is stacked with lawyers who would have recognized there is a limit to the kind of banning order they can make. The Americans are particularly conscious of freedom of assembly under their Constitution as are most western legal systems, especially Britain. In Canada we have a specific right under our Charter of Rights that states as follows:
2. Everyone has the following fundamental freedoms;
(c) freedom of peaceful assembly
It was particularly galling to see him there, especially with his gold watch, his vino and yukking it up with McQuaid. He apparently paid Eu/L(?)800 for his ticket and for three other friends so it does not appear he is hurting financially.
The optics were horrible to the cause and insulting to the intellect of those who want clean cycling.
Re: Johan Bruyneel defends his presence at Wiggins' UCI Hour
Btw, he talked about some friends he brought with... maybe LieStrong, Thom Weisel, or The Archsatan himself Dr. Michele Ferrari (in barmaid costume, perhaps, )? First try jush half-incognito, and if it goes through without much hassle, next time it can go half official.
Btw, he talked about some friends he brought with... maybe LieStrong, Thom Weisel, or The Archsatan himself Dr. Michele Ferrari (in barmaid costume, perhaps, )? First try jush half-incognito, and if it goes through without much hassle, next time it can go half official.
Re:
Well they were certainly appropriate in a negative sense. I gather what you mean is this kind of optic is exactly what we have come to expect from the leadership in cycling, so no big surprise, and it was appropriate in the sense it has epitomized everything we have come to disrespect from cycling's "leadership." The image of Bruyneel/McQuaid did not do the UCI any favours.
But you cannot control his legal right to be there as garish as it was.
SeriousSam said:
Well they were certainly appropriate in a negative sense. I gather what you mean is this kind of optic is exactly what we have come to expect from the leadership in cycling, so no big surprise, and it was appropriate in the sense it has epitomized everything we have come to disrespect from cycling's "leadership." The image of Bruyneel/McQuaid did not do the UCI any favours.
But you cannot control his legal right to be there as garish as it was.
Make no mistake, Bruyneel's presence was a big f-you to everyone who thinks the so-called clean cycling project actually means riders are dope-free. He was clearly just taking the piss.
The title of his ghost-written book pretty much says it all.
The title of his ghost-written book pretty much says it all.
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