Jonas Vingegaard: Something is Rotten

[meat puppet]

To me the implication is that they consider his Tour level not that much of a huge peak compared to his level throughout the rest of the year

Indeed. But that is interesting in its own right, and not exclusively in the clinic sense of things. A huge aerobic base to rule them all.

 

[Riek s]

So the same as sky? Wiggins also said he was better at 90÷ the whole year then a 100÷ peak.

Also the ' we didn't train to match Pog accelerations'... If they didn't train his explosiveness continuously he wouldn't be be close to any of Pog accelerations. He never had any form of being being top tier explosive until 2022.
Rather ironic that Pog trainer hailed to do more and more zone 2 training and was being studied to cure cancer is now bested by the fish saying they focus more on zone 2 as the reason he never tires. It's as if we should believe that all other riders don't train for it.. ( assuming that is what they mean with consistency)

 

[samhocking]

So the same as sky? Wiggins also said he was better at 90÷ the whole year then a 100÷ peak.

Also the ' we didn't train to match Pog accelerations'... If they didn't train his explosiveness continuously he wouldn't be be close to any of Pog accelerations. He never had any form of being being top tier explosive until 2022.
Rather ironic that Pog trainer hailed to do more and more zone 2 training and was being studied to cure cancer is now bested by the fish saying they focus more on zone 2 as the reason he never tires. It's as if we should believe that all other riders don't train for it.. ( assuming that is what they mean with consistency)

I'm not sure, according to Wiggins the whole Sky train thing and why they rode like they did against Contador and other more attacking riders with Wiggins & Froome was they worked out how as a team they could more-efficiently clear lactate at threshold up multiple mountains than the attacking riders, which is very related to endurance track where lactate is building up between rounds and you need to better clear it than your rivals so when you reach the finals you are less damaged. Wiggins also said he wouldn't have been able to cope with the sacrifices needed to get to GT winning form year after year like Froome, but I think that was more because he leans towards an Indurain than a Froome or Vingegaard type of rider.

 

[meat puppet]

I think consistency in this context means the capacity to absorb insane training loads day in day out.

E: Should like to add that beyond speaking about the well established fundamentals (progressive overload, specificity, etc) pro coaches just put out propaganda. San Millan's zone 2 is the perfect example. It is simply bread and butter base endurance training. Everyone has always done it. A lot of.

When he goes beyond that, the model questionably attributes magic to certain intensities (the hallowed zone 2) and, being based on lactate, has metabolism backwards (even short bouts at lactate producing intensities, think hills, supposedly hurt aerobic adaptations and their dampening effect on aerobic metabolism supposedly lasts for a prolonged time during a ride). When eg Coyle and Coggan studied this in the 80s, this was not their observation nor conclusion.

 

[Salvarani]

To me the implication is that they consider his Tour level not that much of a huge peak compared to his level throughout the rest of the year

He can obviously go much faster than he needed to do judging by the ITT.

"Today you show the world how strong you are" or what was it that they told him? He probably showed us too much, because the radio broke down and he did watts he had "never seen" before.

He hardly had to break a sweat in the end. He looked fresh as daises in the 3rd week. A real monster this guy, who I cant see anyone beating any time soon. They got him on rocket fuel that he responds to better than anyone else. Only a bad crash, illness or a big bust can stop him.

Lets see if this Hessman stuff affects the performance in the Vuelta and they are suddenly "bad" or out of "form". To be able to say "See, we are not invincible".

 

[Le Doper]

Jumbo taking a piss on the competition in Stage 6 today!

 

[ashhutch1997]

Jumbo taking a piss on the competition in Stage 6 today!

I do wonder how long it'll be until the other teams start to get p*ssed off..

 

[Le Doper]

I do wonder how long it'll be until the other teams start to get p*ssed off..

Indeed, especially with Kuss high-fiving fans before he even finished. Didn't look remotely fatigued!

 

[meat puppet]

It's as though the doping controls is the only piss they don't take

 

[Rob5091]

Those 5 weeks on the Chesterfield have really paid off.

 

[Krzysztof_O]

Our hero is looking more human now: no Basque, Dauphine or Tour form here. Let's see what happens next...

 

[Rob5091]

Our hero is looking more human now: no Basque, Dauphine or Tour form here. Let's see what happens next...

Let's wait until the TT to see how things are.

 

[Samu Cuenca]

Our hero is looking more human now: no Basque, Dauphine or Tour form here. Let's see what happens next...

Perhaps Roglič is his kryptonite? He's never won a stage race that they both have finished, while PR has won 4 of them, so he clearly needs to make sure he's the only one who makes it to Madrid.

 

[Ripper]

Vigo is getting ready for the slap down with the big fish

 

[Krzysztof_O]

Vigo is getting ready for the slap down with the big fish

Imagine Vingo actually beats the WC on a flat stage 10 TT
I still think Tourmalet and/or Angliru are places where JV will drop watt bombs.

 

[Rob5091]

Imagine Vingo actually beats the WC on a flat stage 10 TT
I still think Tourmalet and/or Angliru are places where JV will drop watt bombs.

I did write that if it happens the race thread should be moved to the Clinic like the Volta Portugal normally is. Stage 13 though should be a real good fun.

 

[Krzysztof_O]

I did write that if it happens the race thread should be moved to the Clinic like the Volta Portugal normally is. Stage 13 though should be a real good fun.

Haha, it may turn out that the following Belagua stage will be even better for that due to cumulated fatigue and brutal Larrau climb. We will see. Maybe Vingo can't generate his best wattage in the second consecutive GT and JV will prepare Rogla's bomb instead.

 

[Ripper]

Haha, it may turn out that the following Belagua stage will be even better for that due to cumulated fatigue and brutal Larrau climb. We will see. Maybe Vingo can't generate his best wattage in the second consecutive GT and JV will prepare Rogla's bomb instead.

Who knows? But Dopo-Jisma are presenting with a high level of hubris, and that is when things start to go right off the rails

 

[Krzysztof_O]

We will how he goes today. Most are expecting in-form Remco to put a moderate time into Skeletor. If he defends himself surprisingly well then today's rest day will be considered successful by JV cyberneticians (like the 2nd rest day at the Tour).

 

[Samu Cuenca]

We will how he goes today. Most are expecting in-form Remco to put a moderate time into Skeletor. If he defends himself surprisingly well then today's rest day will be considered successful by JV cyberneticians (like the 2nd rest day at the Tour).

This ITT doesn't suit him that much, and since his preparation hasn't been as optimal as the one he had for the Tour, I doubt we'll see one of his best time trial performances tomorrow (no matter what his DS says in his ear). It comes earlier than it did in this year's Tour, and he won't the same kind of confidence going into it either.

We'll probably see him deliver a 2022 Dauphiné like performance. A sure top 10, maybe top 5, but I don't think he'll be as strong as Remco, Roglič and Ganna, and then we'll see how good the UAE boys are on the day.

 

[Andy schleck]

With his current shape, if he survives tomorrow, and finish the TT with less than 1 minute in general classification behind remco, he's got a great chance of winning the vuelta.

 

[Krzysztof_O]

With his current shape, if he survives tomorrow, and finish the TT with less than 1 minute in general classification behind remco, he's got a great chance of winning the vuelta.

I don't think his current form is good enough to drop all his opponents: Primoz, Remco and co. He is good enough to be among the best but he'll need more to put a minute into his rivals. It's basically his worst form this year (alongside Paris-Nice).

 

[Andy schleck]

I don't think his current form is good enough to drop all his opponents: Primoz, Remco and co. He is good enough to be among the best but he'll need more to put a minute into his rivals. It's basically his worst form this year (alongside Paris-Nice).

With his current shape, he can win some time to remco on tourmalet and angliru, not a lot of time like he can do in the tour, but he can take 30/40 s on him, in that stages. That's why i think he has a chance of winning, if he survives tomorrow and loses just 30/40 s. I think he can follow the other favourites with this current shape.
If you look at PN, even in a sh** shape, he could follow the best in the long climbs.

 

[Krzysztof_O]

With his current shape, he can win some time to remco on tourmalet and angliru, not a lot of time like he can do in the tour, but he can take 30/40 s on him, in that stages. That's why i think he has a chance of winning, if he survives tomorrow and loses just 30/40 s. I think he can follow the other favourites with this current shape.
If you look at PN, even in a sh** shape, he could follow the best in the long climbs.

There's also Roglic, who could have some advantage over Vinge in the GC tomorrow. Vinge may not be able to change this, even more so considering they are from the same team and Rogla is more explosive.

 

[Andy schleck]

There's also Roglic, who could have some advantage over Vinge in the GC tomorrow. Vinge may not be able to change this, even more so considering they are from the same team and Rogla is more explosive.

I think a hilly TT would benefit more roglic, than a flat TT like tomorrow. I don't know if he will put time on vingegaard, even in his current shape.