Teams & Riders Jonas Vingegaard thread: Love in Iberia

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To the bolded, I don't think Vingo can't be good in classics (Liege and Lombardia, but, why not, MSR too - if he attacks and descends off the Poggio the way he did in this year's Tour TT...), it's just that Jumbo-Visma knows that another route for the Tour or GTs is optimal. Apart from Liege in an odd year, by the way, when has Rog done classics? They won't waste time, because their science has it that it's a waste of time. Now is this good for the tradition of the sport? No, but that doesn't mean Vingo can't do well in classics, but only that he's never tried.
Sorry, haven't read full thread but stopped here.

Since I noticed Vingo on the scene during his first Tour de Pologne participation my impression is, that he certainly CAN win one-day races. Just not when you maybe have two handfuls of the very best one day riders.

So to me it's always been to clarify between 'minor oneday races' (he has a winning chance) and classics, up against the specialists, also having both strength, technique and stamina for one day.

But what I especially have noticed since his bummer in his first TdP is rapidly building on his stamina in stage races. Already in Vuelta '20 my impression was he was the strongest into 3rd week, but impossible to do a valid measurement as he was in pure domestic role. And then LeTour'21 proved my thesis, and since he's just added to his fierce force within this field, ofcourse backed up by calendar planning.

However, my impression is, that if the two primes within GT's, Pogi and Vingo had identical calendar, it will turn out in Vingegaard's favor every time. In addition to having worked on it, his purely physiological data also backs this up with large lung capacity, high (extreme) VO2 max data and everything in that direction, which to that extent helps deep into the 3rd week. This strength is in less favor speaking one day races..

Though it is a tad different this year.
I observe that here at the start of 2023 he has focused a lot on his explosiveness. He will never beat Pogacar in a sprint, but the strength in itself I think is not bad in a one-day race.
I could imagine he would do quite better in a Lombardia this year compared to his previous try.
 
Post by Dr Ferarri on altitude tents

Altitude tent
What is the best procedure for an altitude tent? How many meters should I increase per week, what altitude should I start at, and how long before a big race should it be used? Is it possible or useful to use the altitude tent all season long? How many hours per day must I spend in it to see improvements?
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DrFerrari 2 Jan 2016
I do not like altitude tents , because bad quality of sleeping impairing recovery.
As recommended you should start with an altitude of 1500m increasing 250m/week,
til 2500m . Should be used for at least 4 weeks , 8-12h/day.
As altitude training camps can be repeated 3-5 times/year.

DrFerrari 5 Nov 2017
Natural altitude training is much more effective.
 
Article says it's about normobaric hypoxia, not hypobaric.
I'm struggling to find any evidence that normobaric hypoxia does anything for athletic performance.

Random study that doesn't show anything (BS elided by me)
Significant increases in total hemoglobin mass [...] were observed. However, these effects were not associated with normobaric hypoxia. [...] Regardless of normobaric hypoxia application, [...] training might improve hematological status in elite female cyclists [...] which could translate into enhanced endurance performance.
As far as I'm concerned, all talk about these tents is a smokescreen. Being generous, they're used to throw off the opposition, who will try to use them and just disrupt their own sleep.
 
I don't say he sucks at classics, but he ain't the favorite and its definitely what he's best at. Its blatantly obvious its stage races, and especially GTs, so its just better to maximize chances in these races. Not riding the classics mean its a lot more likely to do a double GT like this year as well and actually be good in both as well as the smallar stage races that he targetted this year. You will always be skipping important stuff if you wanna do well in the classics whether that being stage races, resting, targetted training etc etc.

I say stick to this and milk it. He will never be the favorite in Liege with Remco and Pogacar, and I'll dare say he'll never win it as long as long as they compete in good form. As far as Fleche, I believe Catalunya, Paris-Nice and Itzulia are bigger prizes, and it goes better with prepping for TdF as well.

Lombardia? Sure, ride it, but does it make sense when you do Tour + Vuelta? Again, in that case it makes a lot more sense to just stop after the Vuelta and get the good period of rest in psycically and mentally before the next season. It does matter a lot if you finish the season mid September or mid Oktober guys, especially if you wanna replicate doing what he has done this year being really good already in February.

I like the idea of Trine ALOT better: All 3 GTs in one season. One prep race before May and thats your season. Simple.
A lot of this has to do with what motivates Vingegaard. For sure, doing mostly/only stage races is the best way for him to get wins on the board.
He gives it a go with Tour-Vuelta this year, then he needs to asses how he feels about it, if he feels he can keep doing it. If he likes it, he goes that route if not he might go a different route.

I totally agree that if he goes the double(or tripple) GT route, he probably just sticks to doing stage races.

Yeah I think Vuelta takes the place of Lombardia in Vingegaards late season this year, unless he just get's a bad start at the Vuelta and drops out of GC, then maybe he can go strong in Lombardia.
 
Real big mountain stages are literally stage 13-14 and stage 17-18, so I have no clue what you are on about. Then you throw Arinsal, Javalamdre and Xorret Cati in the mix in week 1 and the TT on stage 10, and you have your most important stages, but you can definitely do the most damage in those 4 mentioned stages. Every one of them has the potential to end in massive gaps if ridden hard.
 
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Did Jonas puncture in the TTT? Obviously had a mechanical.

I wonder why this happened. One would guess it should be possible to ride a 14km TTT without having a mechanical.
He did. Riders could barely see where they were riding so things like little potholes were way harder to avoid. Ganna also had a puncture and apparently one of the SQS guys also punctured. Likely there were more.
 
Just heard the Vino interview before today's stage, who said the exact same thing as Evenepoel, that it was too dark to race yesterday (and then having to ride in the dark afterwards) and that today's neutralization makes no sense, thus, once again, the organization shows it doesn't care about us. He just said it with no verve or charisma.
 
Just heard the Vino interview before today's stage, who said the exact same thing as Evenepoel, that it was too dark to race yesterday (and then having to ride in the dark afterwards) and that today's neutralization makes no sense, thus, once again, the organization shows it doesn't care about us. He just said it with no verve or charisma.
Wasn't that when they still took GC times on Montjuic?
 
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What a lousy patron. Hinault or Eddy would have kicked him right back to Glyngøre and told him whats up. To have the audacity to tell DSM that they can't ride to protect their jersey and in turn being the reason they don't have it.

Isn't that exactly what they used to do, back in the dark days? Tell "lesser riders" that they couldn't go for the win on certain days?