Kimmage unleashes hell, counter-sues Verbruggen & McQuaid

[MarkvW]

This is basic partnership law, dudes. It isn't even hard.

 

[Race Radio]

Nope. If the partner handling finance embezzles, then the partner handling marketing is responsible.

It's all about the partnership. That is a fact of enormous legal significance.

When Lesli discovered the issues what did she do? Immediately addressed the issue and tried to fix it. When it became clear this was not possible she took the legal route.

You can pretend that she share responsibility in order to get a response from other posters but most rational people have already come to the conclusion that the blame lies 90% with Brown and 10% due to Lesli' trusting nature.

 

[Digger]

Pointless.....

 

[MarkvW]

When Lesli discovered the issues what did she do? Immediately addressed the issue and tried to fix it. When it became clear this was not possible she took the legal route.

You can pretend that she share responsibility in order to get a response from other posters but most rational people have already come to the conclusion that the blame lies 90% with Brown and 10% due to Lesli' trusting nature.

My conclusion is based on the assumption that one partner embezzled funds while the other partner knew nothing of the embezzlement. In that circumstance, the partner who knew nothing of the embezzlement would still be liable for the embezzlement. It's called joint and several liability.

The unknowing partner could later sue the embezzler (lot of good that usually does).

You're just wrong.

The underlying rationale for this rule is that as between the partner and the innocent third party it is the partner who should bear the loss rather than the innocent third party. The partner is better placed than the innocent third party to act to avoid the loss. This is basic stuff.

 

[MarkvW]

Yeah i am proud we started it.
I am deeply sorry he became involved. A chain of events occured the first day and if things had worked out as I had originally hoped, then cyclismas, and by default Aaron, would not have had access to the account. But I ran into difficulty and Lesli, like the lady she is, helped me out.
So I am sorry for my part in getting him involved. But Lesli is an awesome person and a good woman. As is Andy Shen - good, honest people, who put time into it all. And showed great generosity.
I look back and think were we naive? My original plan was for me and Andy Shen to have access to the account. But that hit problems which were my fault. Lesli helped me out. And helped us all out really.
What hurts me most is this: We had one chance to get it right, no second chances. And it went so well, far better than anyone could have imagined. JV said to me we might get 50 grand - we got double. Ilooked everyday at the chipin and saw the amount grow - And it's in that context I am proud of Andy, Lesli and myself.
But yeah it's all f***ed now and you rubbing it in makes me feel so good,

Dude. You don't need to make admissions here. Seriously.

 

[Digger]

Dude. You don't need to make admissions here. Seriously.

You are a real POS - why are you still on this forum? You said 12 mths ago you were leaving. But your hatred of landis kepy you coming back,

 

[Race Radio]

My conclusion is based on the assumption that one partner embezzled funds while the other partner knew nothing of the embezzlement. In that circumstance, the partner who knew nothing of the embezzlement would still be liable for the embezzlement. It's called joint and several liability.

The unknowing partner could later sue the embezzler (lot of good that usually does).

You're just wrong.

Nope, I am not wrong. Most rational people have come to the same conclusion as I have. I am not talking about the legal liability I am talking about the conclusion most rational people have arrived at by now.

I am well aware of joint and several liability but babbling on like Lesli some jerk who played a significant role in the money disappearing is just nonsense

 

[thirteen]

Yeah i am proud we started it.
I am deeply sorry he became involved. A chain of events occured the first day and if things had worked out as I had originally hoped, then cyclismas, and by default Aaron, would not have had access to the account. But I ran into difficulty and Lesli, like the lady she is, helped me out.
So I am sorry for my part in getting him involved. But Lesli is an awesome person and a good woman. As is Andy Shen - good, honest people, who put time into it all. And showed great generosity.
I look back and think were we naive? My original plan was for me and Andy Shen to have access to the account. But that hit problems which were my fault. Lesli helped me out. And helped us all out really.
What hurts me most is this: We had one chance to get it right, no second chances. And it went so well, far better than anyone could have imagined. JV said to me we might get 50 grand - we got double. Ilooked everyday at the chipin and saw the amount grow - And it's in that context I am proud of Andy, Lesli and myself.
But yeah it's all f***ed now and you rubbing it in makes me feel so good,

Digger, i've said it to you before and i'll say it again. i think what you did, what you tried to do was awesome. it was all heart! and it gave us all a chance to show where we really stood -- by putting our money where our mouth was -- to show that it was more than just talk.

as one of the earliest donors (along with D-Queued) i was told my monies would not be accepted because of your problems setting up the fund. i was ****ed and even wrote something nasty on Andy's site (which i then asked him to retract when it was fixed). in a split second Lesli stepped in, like the lady she is, and all was good.

there's no way you or Lesli or Andy could have known where this would all end... Aaron played you all. he even played Paul the other weekend and that is just so sick and sad.

despite where we are now, thank you. thank you for starting it. for bringing in Andy. for bringing in Lesli (AB was obviously screwing her over anyways). you're good people. you gave us a voice.

thank you.

and, please, tell Paul not to lose the faith. we need him.

 

[ChewbaccaD]

Digger, what you guys did was admirable and deserves the respect of everyone. One person will not defile a great outpouring like that. It was cool to watch the fund grow, and as I and others have said, I would donate again and will donate again if something has happened to all that money, and Kimmage needs funds in the future. I bet most of the people who donated would do the same again.(though I'm sure they'd want some indication that it will be safer)

I can't speak for everyone, but you don't owe me an apology.

 

[mewmewmew13]

not sure why everyone bothers to answer him. ...
Ridiculous and intent is to draw in...




We all know who the good guys are in the Fund.
Thank you

 

[MarkvW]

Can we settle on "good, but negligent?"

 

[BroDeal]

Can we settle on "good, but negligent?"

Have any evidence she was negligent?

 

[The Hitch]

Digger, i've said it to you before and i'll say it again. i think what you did, what you tried to do was awesome. it was all heart! and it gave us all a chance to show where we really stood -- by putting our money where our mouth was -- to show that it was more than just talk.

as one of the earliest donors (along with D-Queued) i was told my monies would not be accepted because of your problems setting up the fund. i was ****ed and even wrote something nasty on Andy's site (which i then asked him to retract when it was fixed). in a split second Lesli stepped in, like the lady she is, and all was good.

there's no way you or Lesli or Andy could have known where this would all end... Aaron played you all. he even played Paul the other weekend and that is just so sick and sad.

despite where we are now, thank you. thank you for starting it. for bringing in Andy. for bringing in Lesli (AB was obviously screwing her over anyways). you're good people. you gave us a voice.

thank you.

and, please, tell Paul not to lose the faith. we need him.

Good post 13. Totally agree with it

 

[hrotha]

Hey Digger, don't feel bad. All this obviously sucks but the most important thing is that the Fund you set up did its job, and what's happening now can't change that.

 

[MarkvW]

Have any evidence she was negligent?

From reading between the lines of the complaint, it does appear that she abdicated all the money management of the partnership to Brown. Look at paragraph 16. It appears that she never received a previous accounting, for a business that started a year and ten months ago.

She didn't start to inquire about the Kimmage fund status until after Brown failed to pay Cyclismas' bills. (paragraphs 22-23).

No written partnership agreement detailing rights and responsibilities. (paragraph 14).

She allowed the Kimmage account to be in her name, but she did not assume any control over the account. (paragraphs 13, 20). If she didn't know that the fund was in her name (a fund that she was publicizing), then that would also be negligent.

This is just from the complaint--a document intended to place her in the best light.

 

[ChewbaccaD]

 

[BroDeal]

From reading between the lines of the complaint, it does appear that she abdicated all the money management of the partnership to Brown.

Abdication? Really? Like the typical situation where two people go into business. One handles sales and marketing, the other development. Without any prior signs, the development guy wakes up one day to find out the guy handling the money is a crook? That sort of "abdication" that happens to small business partnerships all the time? That warrants some piece of sh!t on the Internet to blame the victim.

 

[MarkvW]

Abdication? Really? Like the typical situation where two people go into business. One handles sales and marketing, the other development. Without any prior signs, the development guy wakes up one day to find out the guy handling the money is a crook? That sort of "abdication" that happens to small business partnerships all the time? That warrants some piece of sh!t on the Internet to blame the victim.

And the innocent partner has to pay for the guilty partner's malfeasance all the time. Not minding the store has consequences. Arguing that not minding the store is reasonable is kind of silly.

 

[Race Radio]

And the innocent partner has to pay for the guilty partner's malfeasance all the time. Not minding the store has consequences. Arguing that not minding the store is reasonable is kind of silly.

Your glee is obvious.

While you may have got your law degree on the internet this forum is not a court of law. When Lesli is charged I am sure you will post up the documents and do a dance.

It is increasingly obvious that it was Brown's actions that caused this mess. You are welcome to dance around, hoping for the possibility that Lesli is further damaged by this but please forgive us if we do share your your schadenfreude

 

[Elagabalus]

And the innocent partner has to pay for the guilty partner's malfeasance all the time. Not minding the store has consequences. Arguing that not minding the store is reasonable is kind of silly.

Well, MarkW, out of those other 2999 people who got bilked I'm sure there are some who feel exactly like you. Now is your chance to really stick it to ol' Lesli and get back that $32.06 she owes you.

 

[MarkvW]

Your glee is obvious.

While you may have got your law degree on the internet this forum is not a court of law. When Lesli is charged I am sure you will post up the documents and do a dance.

It is increasingly obvious that it was Brown's actions that caused this mess. You are welcome to dance around, hoping for the possibility that Lesli is further damaged by this but please forgive us if we do share your your schadenfreude

Your mindreading is pretty far off.

Leslie would never be charged. She didn't do anything criminal. Brown's is perhaps a very different story. It appears that Brown's actions caused this mess.

If any humor is coming through, it's my response to all the insulting posts that challenge the obvious. I can't take them too seriously because they're the same posters who believe that Lance Armstrong corruptly influenced (one part of) the federal government. Tinfoil hat stuff. But you're entitled to your opinion.

I don't have any humor toward the loss of the donation money. None of this changes the fact that McQuaid and Verbruggen are cruel, corrupt and contemptible men who were trying to harm Kimmage for trying to tell the truth. And I'd like to see Brown criminally prosecuted. I hope he's being investigated right now.

 

[MarkvW]

Well, MarkW, out of those other 2999 people who got bilked I'm sure there are some who feel exactly like you. Now is your chance to really stick it to ol' Lesli and get back that $32.06 she owes you.

It will be interesting to see if Cyclismas honors its debt.

 

[Scott SoCal]

Your mindreading is pretty far off.

Leslie would never be charged. She didn't do anything criminal. Brown's is perhaps a very different story. It appears that Brown's actions caused this mess.

If any humor is coming through, it's my response to all the insulting posts that challenge the obvious. I can't take them too seriously because they're the same posters who believe that Lance Armstrong corruptly influenced (one part of) the federal government. Tinfoil hat stuff. But you're entitled to your opinion.

I don't have any humor toward the loss of the donation money. None of this changes the fact that McQuaid and Verbruggen are cruel, corrupt and contemptible men who were trying to harm Kimmage for trying to tell the truth. And I'd like to see Brown criminally prosecuted. I hope he's being investigated right now.

Embezzlement is the act of dishonestly withholding assets for the purpose of conversion (theft) of such assets by one or more individuals to whom such assets have been entrusted, to be held and/or used for other purposes

As a lawyer, you should know this stuff.

Maybe put down the shovel Mark.

 

[Scott SoCal]

It will be interesting to see if Cyclismas honors its debt.

It will only be made to if PK presses the issue. Do you see him wringing out Lesli?

 

[MarkvW]

As a lawyer, you should know this stuff.

Maybe put down the shovel Mark.

Your post doesn't make any sense. I've never suggested criminal liability for Ms. Cohen. I've only suggested the possibility of criminal liability for Mr. Brown.