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Lack of personalities in cycling

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Jul 16, 2010
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cantpedal said:
El Pistolero said:
CTQ said:
El Pistolero said:
Nibali also has a personality, he's always good for some drama. Just recently he called out Froome for riding like a "sprinter".

It takes more personality \ character climbing on the Astana bus during the 2015 Tour de France as did Froome to talk face-to-face with Nibali.

Froome is a coward that complains when other riders attack him on the road. He has no personality and that's why the majority of people don't like him and why it's becoming harder and harder to find sponsors for WT teams in cycling. The sport has become a bore. When somebody dares to attack him he tries to ride them off the road.
LOL . no one that rides a bike down a mountain at the speeds they do or mixes it up in a bunch sprint is acting cowardly. cowardice is making such accusations against someone in a forum like this where the accused cannot defend themselves

It was on camera for everyone to see. He's a coward that hides behind his team, like Nibali said.
 
I have never really thought cycling lacks personalities. But then again, every sport has a different fanbase. I suppose you'll be even less likely to see these "colourfull" personalities in golf for example. Personally, I don't mind our favorite sport lacking people like Balotelli, Ibrahimovic or Barton.

Picking from my list of favorite riders; I think Boonen, Alaphilippe, Zakarin, T. Martin and Bakelants have very interesting personalities.
 
There’s plenty of personalities in cycling, it’s just that only a handful are brash.

I’ve always found riders like Chaves, Scarponi (RIP), Boonen, Cort, Greipel, de Kort, Hansen, Tony Martin and less recently Zabriskie to be very interesting personalities from what we get to see. TBH I’m even starting to warm to Sagan now he’s realising that he doesn’t have to go around pinching podium girls and chasing attention like a small child with ADHD. Interesting things happen around him anyway thanks to the way he races his bike.

The media may want more of Cav, Bouhanni, Ricco etc but that’s not borne out of the sport’s best interests IMO.
 
Adam Hansen, I presume. Jesper really seems like one of those guys who'd prefer it if he could just avoid the media part altogether.
And Zabriskie, well... that guy was/is a special case right there...
My favourite story is the "can I get some whiskey" thing he did after crashing out of the 2011 Tour. And then of course Vaughters had to go out and explain to everyone that he had not in fact hit his head, he's just crazy.
 
There are plenty of personalities to pick from and different people are drawn to different personalities as well.
I can promise you that introverts can do interviews and do not always mind them as long as they are focused on things that actually make sense. I'm an introvert and have a degree in broadcasting. I was the sideline reporter for the local broadcasts for our (college) football games.
Valverde is my favorite rider and part of the reason is his personality along with the type of rider he and how he races.
Today social media helps us see some of the riders personalities more than we otherwise would have. A few of my favorite riders are on that list because of their personalities and not necessarily what they have done in races. For me Jaunjo Laboto and Ruben Fernandez are two of my favorite riders and their personalities are huge part of why.
I also agree with Emotional Cobble Guy that the media/commentators have a lot to do with what we know of the personalities of different riders. In the US many of the riders who don't speak English well enough to do interviews without interpreters basically get ignored. So yeah, as an American not only is it hard being a cycling fan in the first place (not many races are on TV over here, have to find races on line and many times watching in who knows what language), being a fan of a rider who doesn't speak very good English makes it even more difficult. Thanks to social media and the internet it makes that a bit better, but still can be difficult.
 
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RedheadDane said:
Adam Hansen, I presume. Jesper really seems like one of those guys who'd prefer it if he could just avoid the media part altogether.
And Zabriskie, well... that guy was/is a special case right there...
My favourite story is the "can I get some whiskey" thing he did after crashing out of the 2011 Tour. And then of course Vaughters had to go out and explain to everyone that he had not in fact hit his head, he's just crazy.
Yeah, that’s Adam Hansen. Anyone who makes a habit of taking a beer on the last climb of a GT has to be cool. Then there’s his eccentricities with kit - dude even has his own stripped down weight weenie race radio :eek:

Zabriskie is a basket case. Would love to see him go into commentary.
 
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Koronin said:
In the US many of the riders who don't speak English well enough to do interviews without interpreters basically get ignored. So yeah, as an American not only is it hard being a cycling fan in the first place (not many races are on TV over here, have to find races on line and many times watching in who knows what language), being a fan of a rider who doesn't speak very good English makes it even more difficult. Thanks to social media and the internet it makes that a bit better, but still can be difficult.

Not really the case here. Riders are usually entitled to their mother tongue provided they have interpreters. Sporza can translate riders speaking in Italian, French, German and of course (far too often) English. Actually - and I have been ridiculed here for saying it's very bad for us - they are making their own riders speak English. :rolleyes: So when I read you saying that US commentators don't even bother interviewing riders with poor command of English while we are making our riders speak English as much as Dutch, I feel like we are colonised people.

But a rider speaking Italian for instance and then getting translated (or even with subtitles sometimes) can be appreciated by the viewers. Andrei Tchmil ended up being very popular while just speaking French on Dutch-speaking Belgian TV (not at the start though, he was seen as a traitor or an individualist up until 1996 or so).
 
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42x16ss said:
RedheadDane said:
Adam Hansen, I presume. Jesper really seems like one of those guys who'd prefer it if he could just avoid the media part altogether.
And Zabriskie, well... that guy was/is a special case right there...
My favourite story is the "can I get some whiskey" thing he did after crashing out of the 2011 Tour. And then of course Vaughters had to go out and explain to everyone that he had not in fact hit his head, he's just crazy.
Yeah, that’s Adam Hansen. Anyone who makes a habit of taking a beer on the last climb of a GT has to be cool. Then there’s his eccentricities with kit - dude even has his own stripped down weight weenie race radio :eek:

Zabriskie is a basket case. Would love to see him go into commentary.

He'd be brilliant for the nothing is actually happening, just gotta talk nonsense situations.


As for language; I dunno how the situation is in other countries - obviously - but here it seems like there's a commentator/journalist for pretty much each of the major languages, so they just translate live whenever possible. Then there are the situations in which a rider is literally speaking Russian, nobody seems to have figured that out yet.

And of course a rider's willingness/ability to speak in a language other than his own says something about his personality. It's not just "other languages" to English, it's also English to "other languages", and "other languages" to "other languages."
 
Sky has a collective personality but maybe Moscon has become the fox in the hen house............he never read the fine print on how to be a valued member of the collective. Group sessions will be needed for him. Richie still sounds like he is part of the Sky team but his de-progamming continues and BMC were heartened to see that Chris almost killed Richie twice in the Dauphine which can only hasten Richie's return to individual status and the freedom to act accordingly !
 
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RedheadDane said:
And of course a rider's willingness/ability to speak in a language other than his own says something about his personality. It's not just "other languages" to English, it's also English to "other languages", and "other languages" to "other languages."

Perhaps it says something but you cannot demand it to a rider. In my ideal every rider has a right to his own native language. Of course it's not always possible because media channels don't always have interpreters for any language but ideally it should be so. Journalists need to adapt, not riders. Riders are athletes, not linguists. They are just expect to perform, period. Even if the rider is willing to speak English and is fluent in it, it's a matter of principle. Speakers of English generally speaking do not bother to learn foreign language while we have to. Sometimes I regret having studied English. It's really being subservient to Western Imperialism. :Neutral:

I still have a case in mind. Gérard Holtz of France 2 is interviewing Max Sciandri after a Tour of France stage. In French! Sciandri is asking whether he could speak Italian. Holtz: "no French!" A few questions afterwards, Sciandri has to say "Je ne comprends pas" ("I don't understand"). Then since Sciandri is half British the interview went on in English. I find it a disgrace for France TV.

The Flemish channel Canvas aired a series of shows these last few years called "Belga Sport". They would interview the athletes as often as they can in their native languages. For example, your compatriot Leif Mortensen was interviewed in Danish in a show about Jean-Pierre Monseré, his rival. Only Andrei Tchmil was interviewed in French because they probably didn't have Russian interpreters. I find it very nice.

A champion like Gino Bartali would often tell French journalists: "I am Italian. Talk to me in Italian" while he was fluent in French. That says a lot about his personality indeed. :p

And then I can't help sharing this anecdote that I've translated from Marc Madiot's book. I find it so tasty. ;)

I was a DS for Cholet - Pays de Loire. I arrive at the reception centre at the town hall. [...] Didier Simon, a breton commissar, comes to tell me: "Marc, there's a little problem. The President of the Jury does not speak French. Keep Calm"

And I answered: "Are you kidding? No question I should keep calm. If he does not do his meeting in French in a French town hall, on the eve of the town elections, I go out, take journalists and I disclose the whole thing. It is a matter of principle. You translate into English if you want to but you do not strictly do the meeting in English."

[...] If I wasn't there - and this is not bragging - they would have done the meeting in English and nobody says anything ! Cycling is also a power balance, like in many fields.
 
Re: Re:

Echoes said:
RedheadDane said:
And of course a rider's willingness/ability to speak in a language other than his own says something about his personality. It's not just "other languages" to English, it's also English to "other languages", and "other languages" to "other languages."

Perhaps it says something but you cannot demand it to a rider. In my ideal every rider has a right to his own native language. Of course it's not always possible because media channels don't always have interpreters for any language but ideally it should be so. Journalists need to adapt, not riders. Riders are athletes, not linguists. They are just expect to perform, period. Even if the rider is willing to speak English and is fluent in it, it's a matter of principle. Speakers of English generally speaking do not bother to learn foreign language while we have to. Sometimes I regret having studied English. It's really being subservient to Western Imperialism. :Neutral:

That's what I'm saying; every rider should be allowed to speak in whatever language(s) he choses*. And if media doesn't have a direct interpreter - someone who can translate live as the interview is happening - for a specific language it doesn't mean that the riders who prefer speaking said language should speak it another language, it simply means that we - as viewers - just gotta be patient and wait until the interview can get subtitled.
As for English speakers' lack of willingness to learn other languages; that might be so for the "real" world, but it seems like a lot of Anglo-riders are still able to speak some other language, probably something to do with the fact that the majority of them still lives - at least for the road season - somewhere in (continental) Europe.

If a rider will only answer interviews in his (or her) native language, either due to simply not having the language skills, or personal preferences. Cool.
If a rider is a linguistic genius who happily switches around multiple languages in interviews. Cool.
If a rider can and will speak other languages on occasion, but still prefer his/her own language. Cool.
If a rider wants to answer interviews with interpretive dancing. Cool. Unlikely, but cool.


*A team having an "official language" isn't factored in here. This is simply for interviews.
 
Re: Re:

Echoes said:
Koronin said:
In the US many of the riders who don't speak English well enough to do interviews without interpreters basically get ignored. So yeah, as an American not only is it hard being a cycling fan in the first place (not many races are on TV over here, have to find races on line and many times watching in who knows what language), being a fan of a rider who doesn't speak very good English makes it even more difficult. Thanks to social media and the internet it makes that a bit better, but still can be difficult.

Not really the case here. Riders are usually entitled to their mother tongue provided they have interpreters. Sporza can translate riders speaking in Italian, French, German and of course (far too often) English. Actually - and I have been ridiculed here for saying it's very bad for us - they are making their own riders speak English. :rolleyes: So when I read you saying that US commentators don't even bother interviewing riders with poor command of English while we are making our riders speak English as much as Dutch, I feel like we are colonised people.

But a rider speaking Italian for instance and then getting translated (or even with subtitles sometimes) can be appreciated by the viewers. Andrei Tchmil ended up being very popular while just speaking French on Dutch-speaking Belgian TV (not at the start though, he was seen as a traitor or an individualist up until 1996 or so).

This is for US broadcasts. The US announcers for the most part don't pay much attention to the guys that don't speak English. The British broadcasts, when I can get those streaming, are much better about talking to and talking about riders who don't speak English or don't speak it very well. Here's an example with US broadcasts. We all know the prohibitive favorite for Fleche Wallone and Liege is Valverde. We also know his English is at best very bad. The US announcers do their best to ignore him until he gives them no choice.
 
Aug 18, 2017
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yaco said:
Mario Cipollini is still a personality and he retired 12 years ago.

the return of il Re Leone
"“I will be riding the Santos Tour Down Under Challenge Tour and may even pack a special skin suit for the occasion!”
 
Jun 30, 2014
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Tim Booth said:
yaco said:
Mario Cipollini is still a personality and he retired 12 years ago.

the return of il Re Leone
"“I will be riding the Santos Tour Down Under Challenge Tour and may even pack a special skin suit for the occasion!”
The guy also allegedly choked his ex wife in a gym last year and this year another woman reported to the police that he slapped and threatened her, while they were at her place, I think that the sport can do without him.
 
Re: Re:

Mayomaniac said:
Tim Booth said:
yaco said:
Mario Cipollini is still a personality and he retired 12 years ago.

the return of il Re Leone
"“I will be riding the Santos Tour Down Under Challenge Tour and may even pack a special skin suit for the occasion!”
The guy also allegedly choked his ex wife in a gym last year and this year another woman reported to the police that he slapped and threatened her, while they were at her place, I think that the sport can do without him.
That really sucks if it's true :(

I loved Mario's antics back in the day. The chariot stunt for Caesar's birthday was brilliant.
 
I can't believe I exited before posting yesterday, mainly in response to Echoes and the "disgrace" label...

1. Up until Armstrong, the very few English speaking riders in the peloton came through European teams, thus they spoke at least one European language. For example Greg LeMond, whose accent conquered France. In '86, GL had half of France behind him when Hinault got greedy. Fact.

2. Up until recently, English speaking countries had no race worth racing, same was true for the entire American continent (except Duitama '95). Teams could race an entire season within their boundaries, make a few pirate raids on another GT or classic. Many races are gone, the calendar is different now...

3. Heck, Joop spoke French, Delgado too, Roche of course. The journos didn't feel the need (or at least the networks) to be multi-lingual. JP Ollivier spoke Italian, that was it. A couple of years ago, one infamous Thierry Adam couldn't translate a Sagan interview, made up the whole thing up. Disgrace yes, but that's incompetence, not bias, not xenophobia.

4. Small countries have long promoted the study of foreign languages. I have met Danes or Dutch folks speaking English flawlessly, without an accent betraying their origin. From countries that I would call Empires, that is not the case. Riders are not exposed to the need to be multi-lingual, they kind of want things to come their way. Armstrong, Wiggins, Froome...but also Pinot and Bardet, 99% of the Spanish speaking riders.

5. Personality comes across with communication, language can be an obstacle, and in some cases a blessing. LeMond...great communicator. But sometimes it's not an interview, just a clip, Alberto Tomba throwing a trophy at a critical journo. Sagan pinching a podium girl's butt (bad), doing wheelies and stunts.

Moscon/Bouhani or Nikki the AHoles are characters. Is that all?

Riders are learning about managing their brand. And in that respect, cycling is behind other sports in terms of PR. And it's a different sport. No disrespect to Federer, but in my book he never dug as deep for a win as much as any GT or monument winners in cycling. These athletes are the toughests of the toughests. As you gasp for air on a MTF, they will plant a dagger in your lungs with an attack. You get rattled on the cobbles, they put the hammer down and drop you.

So it's all about what we know, what they show, what we like. Or don't like, if we talk about personalities. Larger than life, larger than the sport. Sorry, we have no LeBron. Just some dull robots, a few aforementioned bad guys, and in my view some that either need to let us know who they are or have showed it and I like them: Roglic, Mas, Bernal, and the Tibo-Squalo, Dumoulin I don't know (vocal, it's good), Remco obviously.
 
Aug 18, 2017
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Re: Re:

Mayomaniac said:
Tim Booth said:
yaco said:
Mario Cipollini is still a personality and he retired 12 years ago.

the return of il Re Leone
"“I will be riding the Santos Tour Down Under Challenge Tour and may even pack a special skin suit for the occasion!”
The guy also allegedly choked his ex wife in a gym last year and this year another woman reported to the police that he slapped and threatened her, while they were at her place, I think that the sport can do without him.
Former world champion Mario Cipollini will appear before the court in Lucca, Italy on charges of aggravated assault. The 51-year-old is accused of having beaten his sister, Tiziana, during an incident on April 4, 2017.
https://www.gazzetta.it/Ciclismo/14-12-2018/lucca-ex-ciclista-mario-cipollini-processo-accusato-lesioni-sorella-3101258540621.shtml?refresh_ce-cp
 

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