Lance and triathlon

[Surfdelux]

Was Lance on the juice when he won the half ironman races this year in Panama, Florida and Hawaii?

His regular marathon times have been around 2:50, which is good but not world class. Regular working Dads regularly crank out 2:50 maras. Then all of a sudden he runs a 1:22 half, off the bike, in Hawaii, beating Macca's record.

Unbelievable?

 

[Surfdelux]

1:15 half marathon that is.

 

[Maxiton]

What do you think?

 

[mikkemus23]

Of course he was on the juice.

He started swinning as fast as the best swimmers in spite of his horrible tecnique. I say this as a former (low level) swimmer.

I think it`s funny that he is really an average athlete w/o doping. Club level.

What has he ever achieved clean, just asking?

 

[sittingbison]

...He started swinning as fast as the best swimmers in spite of his horrible tecnique...

who can forget his memorable 5th place in the U12 swimming carnival. Its where he first displayed his potential as a GC contender

surfer, its not like he has been doped since 16 years of age or anything like that. He was forced into it by bullying Big George and Hog (who sent saucy txts to Kik) or he would get flung off the team, then went home and has a breakdown. He has not been doped since 2006.

 

[Surfdelux]

I guess I was asking a loaded question. Armstrong sold a pup to a generation of cyclists who got inspired watching postal in the mid-90's. I so hope we never see him at a triathlon again. We don't need another generation of athletes in another sport disadvantaged and corrupted by this punk. Adios!

 

[armchairclimber]

Having put cycling through the mincer, he's now going to bring another sport into disrepute....with the complicity of greedy race organisers.

 

[sittingbison]

...We don't need another generation of athletes in another sport disadvantaged and corrupted by this punk. Adios!

surfer, he was juiced to the gills to beat the cat 4 fatties at frog

Luckily for tri, he has a world wide lifetime ban, and can only compete at unsanctioned family day fundraisers. Still has to dope even for them though.

 

[Nederick]

Well, if he was juiced in Panama, he'll probably be chasing a refund coz I'm pretty sure he didn't win that one.

 

[Surfdelux]

ok, I stand corrected, it was a second at panama, just 31 seconds behind docherty, world champ in 2004, a hardman who's been at it since 2000.

 

[Pantani_lives]

He started swinning as fast as the best swimmers in spite of his horrible tecnique.

He started swining many years ago.

 

[zigmeister]

Of course he was on the juice.

He started swinning as fast as the best swimmers in spite of his horrible tecnique. I say this as a former (low level) swimmer.

I think it`s funny that he is really an average athlete w/o doping. Club level.

What has he ever achieved clean, just asking?

He was doing triathlon before he got into Road racing...get some clue here buddy. His swimming is pretty darn strong obviously. You don't know the first thing about technique clearly by your "low level" proclaimation.

Give us proof otherwise.

 

[Cloxxki]

He was doing triathlon before he got into Road racing...get some clue here buddy. His swimming is pretty darn strong obviously. You don't know the first thing about technique clearly by your "low level" proclaimation.

Give us proof otherwise.

One of the most serious swim coaches I've come across online did an analysis of Lance's swimming from a short home underwater video, and concluded that while not a perfect one, he's a very good swimmer, and with his (overhyped) aerobic capacity should hold his own in a pro tri field, or something to that tune.
Also, Lance has claimed to have always kep swimming. Didn't like every one of his houses have a pool? Also he seems ADHD to me, he doesn't get tired, so having a pool handy is great. i know an ADHD'er that got Olympic swim gold while on 2 master studies besided a 4-hour-a-week job. Swimming keeps you same if you have too much energy. And drowns you when you're weak like most.

Totally horrible runner though. Where's the marginal gains, high cadance and ultimate efficiency here? If he'd run fast that would be a proof of doping right there.

 

[mikkemus23]

My point was that w/o juice he really is a mediocre swimmer. He has no business staying with the best.

 

[veganrob]

Didn't the USADA report indicate that Lance has kept his relationship with Ferrari to the present time?
I only skimmed over it but thought I read that.

 

[thehog]

Didn't the USADA report indicate that Lance has kept his relationship with Ferrari to the present time?
I only skimmed over it but thought I read that.

Yes. At the 2010 Tour when things went pear he was already emailing Ferrari about a Tri program.

He's a serial drug user and transfuser. He's been using since 93. No wonder he got sick.

 

[DominicDecoco]

One of the most serious swim coaches I've come across online did an analysis of Lance's swimming from a short home underwater video, and concluded that while not a perfect one, he's a very good swimmer, and with his (overhyped) aerobic capacity should hold his own in a pro tri field, or something to that tune.
Also, Lance has claimed to have always kep swimming. Didn't like every one of his houses have a pool? Also he seems ADHD to me, he doesn't get tired, so having a pool handy is great. i know an ADHD'er that got Olympic swim gold while on 2 master studies besided a 4-hour-a-week job. Swimming keeps you same if you have too much energy. And drowns you when you're weak like most.

ADHD has nothing to do with having a better fatique.

And even if it gives a slight edge there are 10 weaknesses over one strengh.

 

[veganrob]

Yes. At the 2010 Tour when things went pear he was already emailing Ferrari about a Tri program.

He's a serial drug user and transfuser. He's been using since 93. No wonder he got sick.

The only way Lance is a freak of nature is that he has been able to dope for so long and still be alive. THAT is amazing. I wonder what kind of program he is really on now. He is probably doing even more drugs just to keep going because his body is gonna fail big time one day.

 

[Cloxxki]

The only way Lance is a freak of nature is that he has been able to dope for so long and still be alive. THAT is amazing. I wonder what kind of program he is really on now. He is probably doing even more drugs just to keep going because his body is gonna fail big time one day.

Amazing to me is that is seems he started on EPO only in 1995 with Ferrari. As he was buddybuddy with Carmichael and gang, we have to assume he was either intensionally clean and World Champ in 1993, then didn't improve really in 1995 (winning is winning), must have been transfusing old school style for worlds to have a shot against the likes of Indurain, on top of the high school cocktails and pot Belge.

 

[thehog]

The only way Lance is a freak of nature is that he has been able to dope for so long and still be alive. THAT is amazing. I wonder what kind of program he is really on now. He is probably doing even more drugs just to keep going because his body is gonna fail big time one day.

From all accounts the party drugs are getting a good working over.

 

[veganrob]

Amazing to me is that is seems he started on EPO only in 1995 with Ferrari. As he was buddybuddy with Carmichael and gang, we have to assume he was either intensionally clean and World Champ in 1993, then didn't improve really in 1995 (winning is winning), must have been transfusing old school style for worlds to have a shot against the likes of Indurain, on top of the high school cocktails and pot Belge.

Exactly. No way do I buy clean WC

What is pot Belge?

 

[veganrob]

From all accounts the party drugs are getting a good working over.

Has it ever been established if he was on some sort of drugs or therapy for mental disorders at an early age. If not he probably should have. Just the fact that he either sought out or anyway the PEDs found him as early as high school tells me he had some serious issues back then. And of course still continue to this day. Really he is just a junkie at this point.

 

[sittingbison]

Carmichael was administering them testosterone and HGH from teenagers. He was not an endurance rider as evidenced from all those withdrawals from TdF.

But by his cancer in 1996 (started woth Ferrari) he told the Dr at the hospital he was using the whole pharmacy - test, insulin, steroids, HGH and EPO. Have I missed something?

BTW he can't swim for ****. He was waaaayyyu behind in the swim at frog, he catches everyone up on the bike.

He runs like a girl.

 

[Tinman]

Contrary to popular belief, and very sadly so, controlled low dose EPO and occasional steroid use for recovery is not that dangerous, even longer term. The other **** like HGH etc is quite a different story. And the problem is that there are few users that start on the stuff who don't want to test the upper limits to squeeze out more performance. And that's where the health problems occur.

Triathlon swimming is the most technical of the 3 disciplines, and time lost there easier to pick up later. Doping would have the least impact on the swim, the most on the bike. Good long term cyclists who haven't kept up a running base always struggle. It takes many years of hard labor to become a fast triathlon runner. Hence Lance struggling there I guess.

 

[Surfdelux]

I agree with this analysis Tinman. Lance has reasonable high level swim technique as analysed by swimsmooth - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V-pgQ-gpmNk - His scissor kicking style aint elite class that's for sure, any half decent swimmer can see that. Despite this, in triathlon races he ended up swimming a bit faster than swimsmooth thought he would. Poor technique swimmers only go fast if they muscle it. LA doesn't have big upper body muslces to draw on. So a strenght boost was coming from somewhere maybe. Or he improved technique and fittnes fair and square.
Cycling, we know he can do that.
Running? Again I come back to some times as evidence that one ought to be suspicious. Marathons around 2:50 as a rule post pro cycling, I think 2:46 was the best. Chris McCormack ran a best 2:42 off the bike at Hawaii IM (!) He does all three sports exceptionally well. Now Lance beats a Macca race record over the half distance after just a couple of years of resumed triathlon training. Is this a training effect or an outside effect?
Problem with LA is it might be imposssible to find a non-doped performance of his to benchmark the suspected doped ones against. I thought the marathons post cycling might be one window of honest racing.