Lance's victims: who he'll have to pay back

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What about all the junk branded liveswrong?

Some retailers might get cold feet about carrying it now. The stuff probably can't command the same price premium either.

Make no mistake, pushing that junk through retailers is a big, expensive business.
 
lostintime said:
He doesn't owe anyone anything.
This whole "retribution" thing .... when does it end ?
It's okay to lie under oath now? He claimed under oath that he didn't dope in the SCA litigation. It turns out he did. Uuuuhhh. Who's going to be more p!ssed? The courts or SCA?
 
Aug 13, 2010
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DirtyWorks said:
It's okay to lie under oath now? He claimed under oath that he didn't dope in the SCA litigation. It turns out he did. Uuuuhhh. Who's going to be more p!ssed? The courts or SCA?
Did he actually claim that? I thought that in the end it was proven that there was no such clause in there and hence it did not matter whether he did or didn't dope. I could well be wrong though.
 
Sep 25, 2009
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does anyone still remember how the downfall started ?

it was an uncomplicated request by floyd to help him get a modest-salary spot on the shack.

he was rejected contemptuously as an annoying disturbance.

and now more than 2 years down the road floyd accomplished what no one else could - he destroyed armstrong.

certainly the biggest balls award goes to floyd !
 
Jul 30, 2012
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TubularBills said:
Not the place or the thread (i.e. already covered) - but if LA was an owner of Tailwind which defrauded the USPS then...

http://www.cyclingweekly.co.uk/news/latest/491383/did-armstrong-own-a-stake-in-tailwind-sports-or-not.html

Does anyone know if a corporation has limited liability from a quasi-federal institution? & what about a now defunct corporation? Are the owners still liable if they have the means?

i.e. could I form a corporation, commit crimes against the government, dissolve my corporation and escape personal liability?

Boy this sounds as sticky as USADA, but somewhat different. i.e. USADA = act of congress, USPS authorized by the Constitution...

Another organization similar to the above, the Fed was commanding corporations like marionettes during the financial crisis, so...

US Government vs. Defunct Tailwind, who wins?
If Lance was personally involved in defrauding the government, any limitation on his liability as an interest holder in Tailwind is irrelevant. Interest holder liability limitations do not apply when the interest holder is an active participant in the activity giving rise to liability.
 
python said:
does anyone still remember how the downfall started ?

it was an uncomplicated request by floyd to help him get a modest-salary spot on the shack.

he was rejected contemptuously as an annoying disturbance.

and now more than 2 years down the road floyd accomplished what no one else could - he destroyed armstrong.

certainly the biggest balls award goes to floyd !
Armstrong destroyed himself. Continues to do so. You got to wonder if it was all worth it.
 
Jun 28, 2009
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Has a cyclist or team ever had to pay a sponsor back for doping? Phonak never went after Floyd, CSC never went after Ivan, the companies in Kazakhstan rehired Vino after his suspension, etc.
 
simo1733 said:
Surely this case will ultimately be decided by CAS.How could tbe UCI ignore them?
No CAS apparently as there was no arbitration to review???? This could be wrong though.

The UCI can ignore it because they answer to no one. The UCI hasn't processed the other USADA findings either.

The UCI and the money-side of the sport likes their dopers.
 
Don't be late Pedro said:
Did he actually claim that? I thought that in the end it was proven that there was no such clause in there and hence it did not matter whether he did or didn't dope. I could well be wrong though.
Tell me more. Seriously. I don't know the serpentine reasoning behind this.

Bottom line from the cheap seats is the guy cheated and lied his way to the bonus. It seems like a fundamental principal to any contract has been violated.
 
Jul 12, 2012
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Regarding SCA Promotions, I do have some concerns raised last night, that because this was an arbitration, the matter might be forever settled, as typically any arbitration agreement is final and includes wording that precludes further action by both parties.

Can any lawyer comment on the current state of arbitration finality?
 
Aug 3, 2009
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Turner29 said:
Regarding SCA Promotions, I do have some concerns raised last night, that because this was an arbitration, the matter might be forever settled, as typically any arbitration agreement is final and includes wording that precludes further action by both parties.

Can any lawyer comment on the current state of arbitration finality?
As I said in the other thread, SCA seems to think there is some opening:

SCA Promotions will monitor USADA case against Armstrong/US Postal Service

Now, six years after the settlement was made, company CEO Bob Hamman has said that SCA Promotions is aware of the new developments, and that it would consider taking an action if it became clear that there was scope for a successful outcome.

“We didn’t have any reason to believe this was coming, although we had heard some rumours,” he told VeloNation today. “There’s not much we can do right now, but we will watch this with interest. We will review this situation and if it looks actionable, we’ll certainly take action.”
They would surely be intimately familiar wit hthe terms of the settlement. If it was so airtight as some would suggest, why even bother "monitoring" the situation, or even suggesting the barest hint of the possibility of bringing action?
 
In June company CEO Bob Hamman confirmed that he was monitoring the USADA case with interest. Yesterday, the company gave its position at this moment in time.

“SCA fully supports both USADA’s mission to combat doping in the world of sport and the fair and transparent arbitration process it uses to do so; and Mr. Armstrong’s refusal to participate in this process is curious given the stakes involved,” it told VeloNation.

http://www.velonation.com/News/ID/12723/Armstrong-case-Sunday-Times-and-SCA-Promotions-considering-options.aspx
 
Aug 13, 2009
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There are 2 buckets of money SCA will go after, the $7.5 million settlement and the $4 million paid prior on previous "Wins"

This is just a start. Penalties, interest, court costs. His exposure on SCA is huge....and they will go after him. It is not a matter of if, but when. I expect it to happen the day after his is officially stripped by the UCI
 
KayLow said:
If Lance was personally involved in defrauding the government, any limitation on his liability as an interest holder in Tailwind is irrelevant. Interest holder liability limitations do not apply when the interest holder is an active participant in the activity giving rise to liability.
Thanks K-LO for the clarification.

I'm confident that his ownership stake vis a vis his status as leader at USPS will be a central and recurrent theme when and if they reopen the Fed case.
 
DirtyWorks said:
Tell me more. Seriously. I don't know the serpentine reasoning behind this.

Bottom line from the cheap seats is the guy cheated and lied his way to the bonus. It seems like a fundamental principal to any contract has been violated.
Don't be late Pedro said:
Did he actually claim that? I thought that in the end it was proven that there was no such clause in there and hence it did not matter whether he did or didn't dope. I could well be wrong though.
You're both right.

SCA had to pay because doped to win or not was irrelevant to the contract.

Only the win mattered.

As soon as LA is stripped and the wins vanish, SCA comes knocking.

In addition the perjury should also cause some problems for LA.
 
Jun 28, 2009
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hfer07 said:
Will ASO file lawsuit for damages to their race's image & fraud?
big money there-500,000 euros per tour plus interests plus whatever they can come with can sum up to 5 mills..
He made $28 million in 2005 alone
 
Lawyers for SCA Promotions, the Texas company that paid Armstrong a $7.5 million settlement after a bitter legal battle in 2007 based on SCA’s suspicion that he violated its contract by doping at the Tour de France, are ready to pounce on Armstrong once the* sordid secrets start rolling out, with witnesses finally freed to discuss the gangsterism behind the once-inspiring U.S. Postal Service cycling team.

The information will begin to emerge in the coming weeks, as the International Cycling Union (UCI) (which governs cycling, sometimes feebly) or the Amaury Sports Organization (ASO) (which runs the Tour de France) are obligated to recognize USADA’s actions or appeal them. USADA will provide them with a report. “They have to provide a rationale,” SCA Promotions vice president Chris Hamman told the Daily News, referring to USADA’s report. “We’re definitely monitoring the case and reviewing our options with our attorney.”

More detail on what at least 10 cyclists told USADA could materialize this fall in the arbitration case that Armstrong’s Belgian svengali, race director Johan Bruyneel, has elected to pursue. Or it will be published in the explosive tell-all book that best-selling journalist Daniel Coyle has written with Armstrong’s once-time sidekick, Tyler Hamilton, due out on Sept. 18.

It’s not clear if the Justice Department will join a pending qui tam whistleblower suit against Armstrong and some of the well-connected backers of Tailwind Sports, the company supporting Armstrong’s teams, including the USPS team. But if that lawsuit, filed by Floyd Landis, goes forward with the Department of Justice as a plaintiff, Armstrong will have to defend himself under oath or capitulate, as he did Thursday night by letting a do-or-die USADA deadline pass and instantly losing his standing.


After suing and smearing so many witnesses over the last 15 years, and creating so much confusion around some very basic facts, Armstrong’s own narrative is finally toppling into myth. Now that it has collapsed, the most interesting question is how much of his money and how many of his well-heeled friends were underneath it when it fell.

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/more-sports/lance-armstrong-fall-grace-beginning-usada-strips-tour-de-france-titles-article-1.1144779#ixzz24eVmyMym
 
Oct 16, 2010
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thehog said:
Lawyers for SCA Promotions, the Texas company that paid Armstrong a $7.5 million settlement after a bitter legal battle in 2007 based on SCA’s suspicion that he violated its contract by doping at the Tour de France, are ready to pounce on Armstrong once the* sordid secrets start rolling out, with witnesses finally freed to discuss the gangsterism behind the once-inspiring U.S. Postal Service cycling team.

The information will begin to emerge in the coming weeks, as the International Cycling Union (UCI) (which governs cycling, sometimes feebly) or the Amaury Sports Organization (ASO) (which runs the Tour de France) are obligated to recognize USADA’s actions or appeal them. USADA will provide them with a report. “They have to provide a rationale,” SCA Promotions vice president Chris Hamman told the Daily News, referring to USADA’s report. “We’re definitely monitoring the case and reviewing our options with our attorney.”

More detail on what at least 10 cyclists told USADA could materialize this fall in the arbitration case that Armstrong’s Belgian svengali, race director Johan Bruyneel, has elected to pursue. Or it will be published in the explosive tell-all book that best-selling journalist Daniel Coyle has written with Armstrong’s once-time sidekick, Tyler Hamilton, due out on Sept. 18.

It’s not clear if the Justice Department will join a pending qui tam whistleblower suit against Armstrong and some of the well-connected backers of Tailwind Sports, the company supporting Armstrong’s teams, including the USPS team. But if that lawsuit, filed by Floyd Landis, goes forward with the Department of Justice as a plaintiff, Armstrong will have to defend himself under oath or capitulate, as he did Thursday night by letting a do-or-die USADA deadline pass and instantly losing his standing.


After suing and smearing so many witnesses over the last 15 years, and creating so much confusion around some very basic facts, Armstrong’s own narrative is finally toppling into myth. Now that it has collapsed, the most interesting question is how much of his money and how many of his well-heeled friends were underneath it when it fell.

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/more-sports/lance-armstrong-fall-grace-beginning-usada-strips-tour-de-france-titles-article-1.1144779#ixzz24eVmyMym

Lance is gonna be plucked like a chicken, that much is certain.

With all this **** hitting the fan at such an exorbitant rate, what type of dope will Lance be taking to get some hours of sleep at night?

I'm really starting to feel for him, especially as long as his shoulders are the only ones carrying the burden. Time for Hein, Pat and Brownie to receive their share of the misery.
 
Mar 19, 2009
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I'm sure he'll start throwing them under as many busses as he can find when it becomes clear to him that there's no escape.
 
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