LEMOND the DOPER

[Dr. Maserati]

Point acknowledged.

The reason I know Indurains history is that in 1991 he finished 2nd in the Vuelta even though he was their lead rider for the race.

I was talking to some friends right before the '91 when one said he fancied Indurain for the win. I laughed and said "Indurain will never win a Tour de France".....it was a long 5 years.

 

[flicker]

I hope Greg was clean, but the word on the street is that there was only one top level pro, Andy Hampsten. That is just heresay from a knowledgable source.

Doesn't matter about Greg though he has been retired for 20 years,

 

[Green Tea]

LeMond was on the juice, no question.

 

[ChrisE]

Who farted?

 

[red_flanders]

Is there proof he was clean, I mean, beyond "no positives"? No.
Is there proof he was racing with help? No.

I think you mean "evidence". No. None.

 

[patricknd]

I wouldn't call it sucking up. We owe Susan an apology. I wish to stand up here and be the first to admit I am ashamed at the way others were treating me last night.

I try to bring new perspective into the vast marketplace of ideas that is the world wide web. That is the only way we can continue to grow as people, and make a contribution to the world while respecting the opinions of others. I always appreciate the viewpoints of others, even if they are stupid, because there is always something to be learned. I learn alot about how not to be stupid in here, for example.

So, Hugh, my effort last night to steer the debate back on course was falling on deaf ears despite my feverish PM activity. This internet food fight was raging while Susan was asleep in Germany, and I was embarrassed this was going on behind her back. One poster even had the audacity to make fun of my dwelling, though how he knew I lived in a trailor house is beyond me.

I am a docile person, and it takes alot to provoke me. I think you know that I would rather run from a fight and make friends instead of spewing sarcasm or insults.

My contributions to this forum, among others forums I have not been banned from yet, only are as good as the intent of those receiving them. Hopefully we can act more respectful in the future towards eachother.

Chris

post of the year. made me proud to be an american

 

[Green Tea]

Of course, in the '90s drugs came on the scene, so the wattages have gone out. There are some things that are just not explainable, people with VO2 Maxs in the low 80s producing 500 watts. A physiologist friend of my said that for a person to do that, 500 watts, he has to have to have nearly 100 milliliters of Oxygen. There are a lot of questions there for me.

Greg, I have managed to put out 1,128 watts on a 2% gradient outside my house. My VO2 is in the very low 70's???... It was achieved straight after pulling 208Kg's in the deadlift.

Chris Hoy can put out 2300 watts of power & 800 watt intervals whilst training for the kilo record attempt.

Whats your point?.

Are we both doing EPO , LMAO.

The jealously & hate LeMond must have for Armstrong. Did LeMond ever train as hard as Armstrong?. Did LeMond ever lift weights? or do any weight training in his prime?.

Did LeMond ever do any training to improve max applicable power?. Or is he still rabbling on like hes still living in the 80's?.

 

[flicker]

Greg, I have managed to put out 1,128 watts on a 2% gradient outside my house. My VO2 is in the very low 70's???... It was achieved straight after pulling 208Kg's in the deadlift.

Chris Hoy can put out 2300 watts of power & 800 watt intervals whilst training for the kilo record attempt.

Whats your point?.

Are we both doing EPO , LMAO.

The jealously & hate LeMond must have for Armstrong. Did LeMond ever train as hard as Armstrong?. Did LeMond ever lift weights? or do any weight training in his prime?.

Did LeMond ever do any training to improve max applicable power?. Or is he still rabbling on like hes still living in the 80's?.

All I can say about Greg is he had mondo power and a magnificient style on the bike. I don't care if he doped or did not dope.

I just do not care for Gregs belligerent finger pointing and trash talking of other cyclists I do Not care who, if its floyd lance contador whomever is his target......as a pro or ex-pro who made a big paycheck Greg needs to tone it down. I am bracing for his next big stink at the Tour of California. A place where Greg can once again garner headlines"<LeMond Says....>"

Greg lighten up dude. I am out of work but I will kick in a fin for the 1 in 6 project. Lighten up..... lifes way to short....

 

[Dr. Maserati]

All I can say about Greg is he had mondo power and a magnificient style on the bike. I don't care if he doped or did not dope.

I just do not care for Gregs belligerent finger pointing and trash talking of other cyclists I do Not care who, if its floyd lance contador whomever is his target......as a pro or ex-pro who made a big paycheck Greg needs to tone it down. I am bracing for his next big stink at the Tour of California. A place where Greg can once again garner headlines"<LeMond Says....>"

Greg lighten up dude. I am out of work but I will kick in a fin for the 1 in 6 project. Lighten up..... lifes way to short....

Ya, am......Greg spoke last year at the InterBike trade show in Las Vegas. Of course if Greg returns to ask questions it could be a little awkward as I have a feeling Mr. Catlin will not be in attendance.

 

[Green Tea]

I hope Cancellara doesn't start putting out 600 watts of power at the ToC.

We won't hear the end of Gregs claims against Cancellara's EPO useage, even though he will go throughout his entire career with negative testing. I will take Gregs word for it though & his 80's way of thinking.

 

[flicker]

Greg knows the truth and will share it at the ToC. Greg has nothing better to do. Go Greg. Ra Ra.

 

[Alpe d'Huez]

This has to be the strangest thread in the history of the forum. We have an absurd and nasty title, followed by pointless accusations previously discussed to death - all of which had me close to closing and deleting the entire thing. Meshed between that however has been some great humor, and insightful, articulate posts.

I'm waiting for someone to make a post on topic set to a Dr. Seuss rhyme. Anyone?

 

[Race Radio]

Greg was asked for comment:


I would not dope in a boat
I would not dope in a car
I would not, could not dope in France

Would you? Could You? For some cash?

I would not, Could not for some cash

Greg I am, I am not Lance

 

[Dr. Maserati]

This has to be the strangest thread in the history of the forum. We have an absurd and nasty title, followed by pointless accusations previously discussed to death - all of which had me close to closing and deleting the entire thing. Meshed between that however has been some great humor, and insightful, articulate posts.

I'm waiting for someone to make a post on topic set to a Dr. Seuss rhyme. Anyone?

With respect 'AdH' I disagree.

No doubt the title is rather strange as the OP reasons are riddled with some obvious flaws as discussed earlier in the thread- however as you pointed out there has been some articulate and interesting points of view put forward.

This thread is at 200+ posts and while there has been nothing so far that I have not heard or read before the view that I have can be swayed and changed if i am presented with something new or a different opinion.
Closing this thread would imo be against the principle of a public forum.

However, I would not think it unreasonable to merge this thread in to an old Lemond thread.

I am personally against deleting posts (unless of course they are offensive) or indeed locking threads. IMO this option should only be done as 'a last resort'.

Quite frankly, if you were to delete or close threads that were silly, baiting and/or inflammatory there would be little on this forum.

I do not envy your role and appreciate that you are a volunteer 'Mod' and that making decisions will not please everyone - but if you are to end this then try not explain why, just post a picture of a giraffe.

 

[I Watch Cycling In July]

I did not know what they did in that room,
As a young boy I just wanted to zoom....
up over the hill,
with never a pill,
then down on the flat,
see you later that's that!

I did not know what they meant with their preps,
I said "doctor, I've done plenty of reps"....
Also I have these nice aero bars,
I have no need for what's in your jars!

 

[Susan Westemeyer]

Greg was asked for comment:


I would not dope in a boat
I would not dope in a car
I would not, could not dope in France

Would you? Could You? For some cash?

I would not, Could not for some cash

Greg I am, I am not Lance

One of the best postings ever. Thank you.

How many times did I read that book aloud. My son is now 16 and I think I can still recite a lot of that book and Cat in the Hat as well.

Susan

 

[Oldman]

Greg was asked for comment:


I would not dope in a boat
I would not dope in a car
I would not, could not dope in France

Would you? Could You? For some cash?

I would not, Could not for some cash

Greg I am, I am not Lance

I'll close my evening with this most excellent rhyme.

 

[Digger]

Been busy with work to add to this thread. Alpe, it's one of the worst I've seen on here. The vitriol I've seen sprouted by people towards Greg is incredible - especially by the OP, Flicker (who seems to lose his trolling role at times) and Green Tea. Everything from child molestation to mental issues to being shot has been brought into the equation. Flicker you could make a sh** load of money with those accusations that you continue to speak about on here. Lance's crew tried for years to get a story like that and failed. So yeah, contact them. After reading through this drivel, i feel like Moreau when he found out about Landis' defence:
"Here, we have reached rock bottom. He has created a fund to gather money for his defense. Landis is positive with his A and B samples and he has the nerve to go begging for dollars while his lawyers look for the comma that is out of place, that will show up some technical irregularity."

To all the people who think Lemond doped, the only thing you have is that you think everyone in the 80s doped, so he must have doped - oh and Flicker's 'rumour' that he keeps rehashing from time to time. No positive tests, no teammates, no doping programmes - no doping products found - NOTHING. So yee can clutch at straws all yee want, but the reality is that yee wanting Lemond to have doped, because he criticised the second coming, is not going to make it so. Yee have no evidence whatsoever - and as RR points out, if yee have, contact Lance's people, and there will be big money in it for yee.

 

[craig1985]

The stupid thing is, people know exactly that it is an attempt to troll when they click on the thread, they know this, and yet they still get involved.

Madness.

 

[ChrisE]

I'm glad Digger and Craig1985 have arrived to bring some maturity into the thread.

Next time can you guys please get here earlier and straighten things out before we waste so much time? Thanks.

 

[petethedrummer]

Greg, I have managed to put out 1,128 watts on a 2% gradient outside my house. My VO2 is in the very low 70's???... It was achieved straight after pulling 208Kg's in the deadlift.

Chris Hoy can put out 2300 watts of power & 800 watt intervals whilst training for the kilo record attempt.

Whats your point?.

What's your point? Do you know the difference between a sprint and a long aerobic effort?

 

[flicker]

Been busy with work to add to this thread. Alpe, it's one of the worst I've seen on here. The vitriol I've seen sprouted by people towards Greg is incredible - especially by the OP, Flicker (who seems to lose his trolling role at times) and Green Tea. Everything from child molestation to mental issues to being shot has been brought into the equation. Flicker you could make a sh** load of money with those accusations that you continue to speak about on here. Lance's crew tried for years to get a story like that and failed. So yeah, contact them. After reading through this drivel, i feel like Moreau when he found out about Landis' defence:
"Here, we have reached rock bottom. He has created a fund to gather money for his defense. Landis is positive with his A and B samples and he has the nerve to go begging for dollars while his lawyers look for the comma that is out of place, that will show up some technical irregularity."

To all the people who think Lemond doped, the only thing you have is that you think everyone in the 80s doped, so he must have doped - oh and Flicker's 'rumour' that he keeps rehashing from time to time. No positive tests, no teammates, no doping programmes - no doping products found - NOTHING. So yee can clutch at straws all yee want, but the reality is that yee wanting Lemond to have doped, because he criticised the second coming, is not going to make it so. Yee have no evidence whatsoever - and as RR points out, if yee have, contact Lance's people, and there will be big money in it for yee.

Sorry digger my associates have been around many more dinner tables then Betsy, Frankie or Jonathon.

I am not out to defame Greg. As I said before he is a champion and an American which I like.

I just do not like his attitutude. If he had issue with doping he should have attacked doping while he was on top of his game, when he was king. Digger please tell me Greg didn't know about doping while Greg was racing. Greg was a participant in Omerta.

At this point his attacks seem more out of jelousy, spite and a need to be in the limelite.

Gregs time is over, Greg have a seat.

 

[Ripper]

I hope Cancellara doesn't start putting out 600 watts of power at the ToC.

We won't hear the end of Gregs claims against Cancellara's EPO useage, even though he will go throughout his entire career with negative testing. I will take Gregs word for it though & his 80's way of thinking.

Green Tea, I just felt I needed to say that you are a dope. I am not going to address your numerous dopish points, because other posters have. Feel free to continue to respond to your own posts ... I am guessing you are the kind of person who speaks about himself in the 3rd person in your "regular" life.

 

[Digger]

Sorry digger my associates have been around many more dinner tables then Betsy, Frankie or Jonathon.

I am not out to defame Greg. As I said before he is a champion and an American which I like.

I just do not like his attitutude. If he had issue with doping he should have attacked doping while he was on top of his game, when he was king. Digger please tell me Greg didn't know about doping while Greg was racing. Greg was a participant in Omerta.

At this point his attacks seem more out of jelousy, spite and a need to be in the limelite.
Gregs time is over, Greg have a seat.

Unbelievable...the points I have highlighted surmise for me exactly what you're about.

And by the way, point me to something Greg has said which is untrue.
But yeah, he's only jealous etc. Is that on the livestrong website?

 

[ChrisE]

I just do not like his attitutude. If he had issue with doping he should have attacked doping while he was on top of his game, when he was king. Digger please tell me Greg didn't know about doping while Greg was racing. Greg was a participant in Omerta.

At this point his attacks seem more out of jelousy, spite and a need to be in the limelite.

Gregs time is over, Greg have a seat.

At the time of his retirement, he claimed he was getting his a$$ dropped because of some disease. Yet, he subsequently retracted that and now he says his power numbers were the same or better than previous years.

WTF? The old "I was sick and had no power" got changed to "I was stronger than ever" over the course of time.

I also, like you, scratch my head that he was clueless of what was going on around him. Apparently he only considers doping to be cheating only if the dope is good enough to enable others to beat him.

If Charly Mottet is relegated to also ran behind dopers Fignon and Delgado, then no big deal.

Something else....

GL claims to have stopped winning because of the "two speeds" of the peloton, which is claimed to be the result of oxygen increasing products like EPO superceding the useless steroids and cortisone.

Those types of products, along with other methods like infusions and now HGH, are still prevalent so there should still be two speeds.

Yet, people like Evans and Gilbert have this purity halo in here that they are clean. Taking that into consideration, one can only conclude that Evans and Gilbert are better cyclists than GL ever was because they can excel against the same type of doped competition that he failed at beating.

I'm not sure anybody in here would ever claim that, so hopefully somebody can clear up this bit of confusion brought on by simple deductive reasoning.

I hope this can be cleared up before Digger admonishes us for discussing these outlandish observations.