LeMond's letter to McQuaid

[Northern rider]

Lemond speaking in 2009, almost certainly posted before in other threads but worth a review right now. He gets onto UCI corruption at around 20 mins in.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wDy5NLVkliU

 

[poupou]

Of course hypocresy is everywhere in the world of cycling. They all know what is going on, they have always know. Everyone, the journalists that now play the surprised card, the cyclists, the UCI, USADA. It is all a farce, and only because of political struggles we get to know how rotten this world is. If Armstrong had not created so many enemies he would have got away with it all.

And the only reason Lemond is the aim of my ire is becuase he wants to be portrayed as the moral anti doping crusader when he only used selective doping attacks for his own interest, to tell us how good he was, to tell us how others beat him, to let the world that he is still the number one American cyclist and to vent his fury at being sacked, ignoring so many episodes where he should have been as critical or more if his anti doping stance was really genuine.

Allegations.

Lemond has done what he should do at the time he could do it. Before Armstrong's fall, he would have been bashed for a such position.

 

[Benotti69]

troll babble

10 characters

 

[hiero2]

. . .
If Lemond doped or not is irrelevant. but refusing to even consider it, is. I personally believe he was as clean as possible, mainly because he raced at a time where IT SEEMS you could win a Gran tour without doping, and because EPO was still not around. (although blood doping, anphetamines, etc, were)

Still, I think he did everything in his power to win the TDF. what about the aerobars, helmet, bike in TDF 89? that was a kind of shady thing. yes right, it's no doping, but it WAS getting every possible little thing to win. He looked for and found a small edge that no one was using, and used it for his advantage. I remember before the final TT, discussions about if they were legal. Now we know it's a huge advantage to race on a TT bike.

So it is a FACT that greg was willing to do tricky things to win. You can argue it's not the same as doping, but I think you see my point.
. . .

The whole sport needs to be reformed.

...

That doesn't sound quite like what you were saying before - but I will agree with this part. And, I will say, since you apparently missed it, we had a former team mate of Greg's state his opinion that Greg would have done everything legal that he could. But not across that line.

And we have had many conversations in the past about how credible it might be that Lemond doped. They are still posted, you can read them. It really isn't a credible idea.

And yes, the whole sport needs to be reformed.

 

[hiero2]

Thread TLDR. Not enuff time. Srry.

I didn't see much attention paid to Greg's comment to end USA Cycling along with the UCI. Some attention - not much.

Frankly, I find this idea interesting. From what I have read from other posters, and from openly available information, main players in USACycling sound like unsavory characters to me, and quite possibly just as involved in the corruption or maintenance of corruption as McQuaid. Players like Weisel (spelling?) sound like arrogantly cutthroat businessmen (he put the partners who hired him when he was young out of business). Nasty characters. Characters like this can love cycling, but I don't think they necessarily need to be in leadership positions.

Sorry I don't have time to post links or anything - but I wanted to highlight that this idea needs thought, consideration, attention, and MORE conversation and work.

I wonder if Greg could propose and start a counter organization to USACycling? Restart the USCF?

 

[roadfreak44]

Wrong, as usual.

THEIR INCOMPETENCE IS NOT GOING TO BE IGNORED? EXCELLENT...
Thanks for letting me know bro...
seriously tho if they are competent how could armstrong and so many have slipped through their fingers? The problem is more than obvious..

 

[roadfreak44]

THEIR INCOMPETENCE IS NOT GOING TO BE IGNORED? EXCELLENT...
Thanks for letting me know bro...
seriously tho if they are competent how could armstrong and so many have slipped through their fingers? The problem is more than obvious..

fyi-UCI did NOT and does not administer drug tests. I have no dount they colluded but the testing was up to WADA and USADA and there is overwhelmingly obvious incompetence there..

 

[Snafu352]

THEIR INCOMPETENCE IS NOT GOING TO BE IGNORED? EXCELLENT...
Thanks for letting me know bro...
seriously tho if they are competent how could armstrong and so many have slipped through their fingers? The problem is more than obvious..

Rather than whining hysterically i suggest you read the USADA document on the cheat; how positive testing was avoided is clearly laid out.

 

[Benotti69]

Rather than whining hysterically i suggest you read the USADA document on the cheat; how positive testing was avoided is clearly laid out.

Alternatively you could just continue with your pathetic whining.

Do not feed the troll

 

[Snafu352]

Do not feed the troll

Sorry

 

[lean mean &green]

fyi-UCI did NOT and does not administer drug tests. I have no dount they colluded but the testing was up to WADA and USADA and there is overwhelmingly obvious incompetence there..

huh?

there are countless important mistakes in your posts.

if you are genuine and simply uninformed than i might suggest reading instead of writing for awhile. said another way, you are talking when you should be listening.

EDIT: ...also, if you ask genuine questions the right way, clinicians are suprisingly polite and swift at providing you with answers.

 

[blutto]

Allegations.

Lemond has done what he should do at the time he could do it. Before Armstrong's fall, he would have been bashed for a such position.

...funny but you do realize that you seem to have confirmed much of what Albatros said in his post....

Cheers

blutto

 

[poupou]

...funny but you do realize that you seem to have confirmed much of what Albatros said in his post....

Cheers

blutto

That is not funny that I have done a such mistake, I am going to make a donation to UCI as repentance
Sorry.

 

[thegripo]

That doesn't sound quite like what you were saying before - but I will agree with this part. And, I will say, since you apparently missed it, we had a former team mate of Greg's state his opinion that Greg would have done everything legal that he could. But not across that line.

And we have had many conversations in the past about how credible it might be that Lemond doped. They are still posted, you can read them. It really isn't a credible idea.

And yes, the whole sport needs to be reformed.

While Travis Tygart tried to paint Lance’s teammates as victims of Armstrong’s unethical scheme, that same empathy could just as easily be transferred up a level to Lance himself. It’s true that no one put a gun to the head of any of these fine young American bike racers and forced them to dope, but each and every one of them knew that if they wanted to win – sincerely wanted to prevail at cycling’s highest level – they needed to compete on the playing field that UCI put before them.

The buck shouldn’t stop with Lance. Kudos to LeMond for taking the conspiracy up a level.

^^ this
http://www.chicagonow.com/easy-as-r...down-greg-lemond-steps-up-can-cycling-change/

 

[DirtyWorks]

fyi-UCI did NOT and does not administer drug tests.

I'm still not sure what you think you know, but it's not true. They don't need to get their hands dirty. The rules do it for them! http://velonews.competitor.com/2012...ci-knew-drug-testing-system-was-flawed_261599

... but the testing was up to WADA and USADA and there is overwhelmingly obvious incompetence there..

An elaborate system specifically designed so all but the dumbest athletes can pass and where WADA and their national agencies are woefully underfunded, with no authority to open cases on their own and STILL manages to nail cheats is incompetent? Really?

Seriously, give it up. I read somewhere you can post junk like this on slowtwitch. Maybe you'll have better luck in that echo chamber.

 

[Albatros]

Allegations.

Lemond has done what he should do at the time he could do it. Before Armstrong's fall, he would have been bashed for a such position.

That is your interpretation, obviously different to mine

Why didn't he start making accusations from the moment he arrived in professional cycling? His answer. It took him six years to realise cyclists were doping.

I mean, I wouldn't be surprised that Lemond extreme fanboys would believe such crap. I give you the benefit of the doubt and ask you if you believe he told the truth. Didn't he learn anything about what cycling had been over the years before he became professional? That is autism at is best, not to mention that he even won a race thanks to Pascal Simon being disqualified for doping. And his room mate was Fignon, a big doper who shared even lines of cocaine with him. Not even him, Greg?

Ok, after 6 years keeping his big mouth shut regarding doping issues. he starts to make wide accusations, but never specifying any names, just saying that he is getting beated in a random race by guys he used to beat easily.

That is his antidpoing instance. They are beating me with it.

Then he moves to PDM. One year, poor performance, not a single word about doping.

He gets the sack and then suddenly we are told that they wanted to introduce him to the world of doping. How curious. Only after they sack you. And what about the bespectacled Frenchman who shared room with you? Did he never try to introduce you to the world of doping or you just bonded sharing lines of coke?

And then you move to Dr Bellocq's team the guru of hormone rebalancing, and you don't have a bad word to say about him? Common mate, you did it with PDM. And then ADR and Van Mol, who has been found later as a big doping doctor. Not only you don't criticise him but look out for him to give you medical advice once he is not in your team.

And what were your words when Fignon confessed to doping? I am pretty sure you knew that well before, but playing autistic fanboy, weren't you surprised by it! Didn't he deserve a comment. After all, he might have robbed you of two Tours. You could have had 7 Tours not counting the ones the EPO cheaters robbed you of.

And this is the leader of the anti doping crusade. Do you really think that with someone like him at the helm cycling would ever clean its act?

 

[DirtyWorks]

the thing that interests me is that .... blah blah blah

Still no specifics. You have NOTHING then. Just like the Lemond thread, this one ends with Lemond being America's only legitimate Tour de France champion.

Now, Lemond's suggested action has problems. The primary one being, Wiesel's USACDF lives on to encourage riders to dope if members stop spending money on USA Cycling. There's also the funding from the USOC they get that can sort of keep things going.

Greg's heart was in the right place though.

 

[DirtyWorks]

That is your interpretation, obviously different to mine
Blah, blah, blah.

Many pages back, I requested specific allegations. You still have posted none and hopelessly confuse doping eras among other major problems with your broken conspiracy theory.

If you have specific facts post them in the Greg Lemond thread. Since you don't have any substantial facts to prove your argument simply repeating failed arguments accomplishes nothing.

 

[pmcg76]

That is your interpretation, obviously different to mine

Why didn't he start making accusations from the moment he arrived in professional cycling? His answer. It took him six years to realise cyclists were doping.

I mean, I wouldn't be surprised that Lemond extreme fanboys would believe such crap. I give you the benefit of the doubt and ask you if you believe he told the truth. Didn't he learn anything about what cycling had been over the years before he became professional? That is autism at is best, not to mention that he even won a race thanks to Pascal Simon being disqualified for doping. And his room mate was Fignon, a big doper who shared even lines of cocaine with him. Not even him, Greg?

Ok, after 6 years keeping his big mouth shut regarding doping issues. he starts to make wide accusations, but never specifying any names, just saying that he is getting beated in a random race by guys he used to beat easily.

That is his antidpoing instance. They are beating me with it.

Then he moves to PDM. One year, poor performance, not a single word about doping.

He gets the sack and then suddenly we are told that they wanted to introduce him to the world of doping. How curious. Only after they sack you. And what about the bespectacled Frenchman who shared room with you? Did he never try to introduce you to the world of doping or you just bonded sharing lines of coke?

And then you move to Dr Bellocq's team the guru of hormone rebalancing, and you don't have a bad word to say about him? Common mate, you did it with PDM. And then ADR and Van Mol, who has been found later as a big doping doctor. Not only you don't criticise him but look out for him to give you medical advice once he is not in your team.

And what were your words when Fignon confessed to doping? I am pretty sure you knew that well before, but playing autistic fanboy, weren't you surprised by it! Didn't he deserve a comment. After all, he might have robbed you of two Tours. You could have had 7 Tours not counting the ones the EPO cheaters robbed you of.

And this is the leader of the anti doping crusade. Do you really think that with someone like him at the helm cycling would ever clean its act?

I pointed this out to you before and as you are ignoring it, will do so again. Bellocq worked with Z-Peugeot in 87 and with GAN in 93. Same team but different sponsors. He did not work for the team in the intervening years between 87-93. So when you say LeMond joined Bellocq's team, that is incorrect. Bellocq was not at Z in 1990 when LeMond joined.
http://www.cyclisme-dopage.com/portraits/bellocq.htm

The connection between Bellocq and LeMond was the 93 season when Bellocq actually passed away in June of that year and LeMond had his worst season resulting in him not being selected for the GAN Tour team. If that is the your big evidence against LeMond, it is pretty weak.

Oh yeah, about the PDM thing, it was LeMonds contract lawyer who revealed the statement about PDM forcing their riders to dope, not LeMond. Clearly both parties had discussed the issue when LeMond was trying to get out of PDM but it wasn't him who made it public. The lawyer made the claim in the LA Times shortly after LeMond won the Tour in 89.

 

[Albatros]

I pointed this out to you before and as you are ignoring it, will do so again. Bellocq worked with Z-Peugeot in 87 and with GAN in 93. Same team but different sponsors. He did not work for the team in the intervening years between 87-93. So when you say LeMond joined Bellocq's team, that is incorrect. Bellocq was not at Z in 1990 when LeMond joined.
http://www.cyclisme-dopage.com/portraits/bellocq.htm

The connection between Bellocq and LeMond was the 93 season when Bellocq actually passed away in June of that year and LeMond had his worst season resulting in him not being selected for the GAN Tour team. If that is the your big evidence against LeMond, it is pretty weak.

Oh yeah, about the PDM thing, it was LeMonds contract lawyer who revealed the statement about PDM forcing their riders to dope, not LeMond. Clearly both parties had discussed the issue when LeMond was trying to get out of PDM but it wasn't him who made it public. The lawyer made the claim in the LA Times shortly after LeMond won the Tour in 89.

Sorry but Lemond was named in Le Soir as one of Bellocq clients among many top cyclists and yes, it was Lemond's lawyer who stated that PDM had tried to drug up his client.

I am sure you are not naive enough to believe his lawyer did that without Lemond consent. Are you implying they were lying?

 

[DirtyWorks]

it was Lemond's lawyer who stated that PDM had tried to drug up his client.

And Lemond didn't do it. Every effort you make to paint Lemond as a doper just backfires. At what point do you give up?

 

[Albatros]

And Lemond didn't do it. Every effort you make to paint Lemond as a doper just backfires. At what point do you give up?

I wasn't expecting anything else from you. You are the brass of the fanboy brigade. Don't worry, with you I gave up a long time ago.

 

[blutto]

Greg's heart was in the right place though.

...fine analogy except for the fact that is not his heart that's his wallet...

Cheers

blutto

 

[rhubroma]

So Lemond was a doper, if that were the case, but what does this have to do with Pat?

 

[blutto]

...herein is found the definitive solution to the problems currently facing cycling, the world as we know it and darn near everything else( you know, those 10,11 or 12 other dimensions our reality is anchored in and of which we have but a vague understanding )...

http://www.cyclismas.com/2012/10/kim-jong-un-speaks-out-in-support-of-the-uci/

Cheers

blutto