Look at me, I am a Vegan! Can I persuade you to become one too?

[simo1733]

Can vegans eat honey or is that verboten as well.

 

[Rip:30]

 

[Rip:30]

 

[GreasyMonkey]

Agreed, 1000x

 

[Polyarmour]

You mean this Nigella Lawson? The one who wore a burkini at Bondi? The one who had to crash diet 20kgs off her ever expanding frame? She might be a pretty face with an ample bust but let's not put her up as an icon of healthy living please.

 

[Altitude]

And I could just as easily find a fat, disgusting woman who eats meat and put her next to a fit, healthy vegan. What a useless post.

 

[elapid]

And I could just as easily find a fat, disgusting woman who eats meat and put her next to a fit, healthy vegan. What a useless post.

I think that is the point - Rip:30 posted these photos to show that DR's posts are useless because we can all find images to suit our agendas ... and DR certainly has an agenda. Rip:30 has done this elegantly, but I doubt it will even register on DR's radar because he is right and anyone not doing what he is doing is wrong.

 

[Rip:30]

Bacon cures hangovers

 

[Rip:30]

 

[Rip:30]

i don't really get in to the vegetables or anything else really

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Aj4ZkXmDN3Q&feature=related

 

[Rip:30]

You mean this Nigella Lawson? The one who wore a burkini at Bondi? The one who had to crash diet 20kgs off her ever expanding frame? She might be a pretty face with an ample bust but let's not put her up as an icon of healthy living please.

 

[Moose McKnuckles]

I'd like to find a happy medium between these two quotes:

"You only live once, but if you live like I did, once is enough." (Sinatra), and
"Nothing tastes as good as skinny feels." (McPherson).

 

[Rip:30]

I'd like to find a happy medium between these two quotes:

"You only live once, but if you live like I did, once is enough." (Sinatra), and
"Nothing tastes as good as skinny feels." (McPherson).

All things in moderation... including moderation?

 

[Captain Serious]

You know what is HILARIOUS about this post brah? Anthony Colpo is a local rider to me and NOW eats high carb, low fat. http://anthonycolpo.com/?p=2561
(He still doesnt want to hit the local bergs with me cos he knows I will kick his *** and make a blog post about it lol!) Come on AC, step up brah! Corkscrew is only 2.56km! .................etc, etc,
*i can smash all Team BMC*
*all people who eat meat are obese and will die of heart failure by the time they're 36*Etc etc...blah blah

Crikey! More ramblings. I'm worried about ya. When you eventually go to the doc for 'behavioural disturbances', make sure you tell him about the grossly insufficient 10% fat in your diet.

Yep, Colpo upped his carbs, coz he found that low carbs didn't work for his high activity (I'm not a low-carber and, even if i wanted to be, I'd never have the discipline), but he hasn't gone low-fat; that's more of your BS propaganda. The only way his fat intake dropped was to make some room for the extra carbs.

Unfortunately, I've seen some snippets of your Youtube videos.
Ya know, ya bang on and on about what's natural and instinctive, but this is probably the biggest joke about you and your 'philosophy':
I had a look at your website, and thank god you recommend taking b12*, but, by implication, this is an admission that a vegan diet is unnatural and inferior.

Ethics is one thing, but to make out that veganism is natural, but then tell everyone to take a vitamin which has its only useful form in animal products.....carm on, mate!!!! Crikey! In fact, you have to inject the stuff -- not just pop a couple of supplements -- because you acknowledge it's so important and in poor supply in your diet.

I've said some of this on here before, but:

Ethics are a convenience of those warm and full of belly (I made that up; feel free to use it, anyone ). In other words, it's very easy to feel sorry for the poor gazelle on tv being slaughtered by the group of lions when we're sitting on our comfee couch in our warm loungerooms, after a nice meal of 30 bananas (pfffft!). This ain't natural, dude (although this may change in 100,000 years, after we adapt to couch-'potatoing' ). And on the flip side on insntincts, even the most 'ardent' carnivore, like a shark or a lion, won't even think about ripping out your jugular if he's just eaten 15kg of buffalo.

I'll tell ya what's natural:

You, you're cute missus, a couple of little Durians and a group of family and friends are hunting and gathering around Africa about 50,000 years ago. Food isn't exactly plentiful; in fact, in this particular week, food is scarce. You haven't eaten for 3 days (oh no! No bananas!), nor has your immediate family, or the rest of your posse. Missus Durian (who's even hotter, coz she's thin 'as') is screaming at ya for some food. Your kids can barely walk, coz they're so weak from hunger, and may be showing some signs of malnutriton.

Now, in this true natural environment of yours/ours, what do ya reckon would happen to your instincts and vegan 'ethics' when a bunch of piglets wandered passed? We all know the answer: you would get your farkin flint-head axe and speer out of your jockstrap and slaughter a dozen of them piggies faster than I could say "Di2 and carbon seatposts are the biggest far'kin bling *** crap poser waste of money in the world." *ZING*

Scoreboard
Me: 10,000,000 bratwurst sausages
Durian: -30 bananas

Here's another one for ya:

It's around the same time period, you and your family have wandered up to North-East Europe, because there's more food. Winter comes pretty quick. It's really far'kin cold. Missus Durian and the little Durian pups are almost freezing to death, coz some bada'ss Neanderthal took most of your clothes. You're huddled in a cave when big hairy bison waddles passed the cave 'door'. Once again, in this natural scenario, you'd cut that lardo's throat in a second, and your missus would have a clean fur coat by dinner time. *ZING*

Our true instincts come to the fore when we're under pressure, not when we eat 3,000 calories a day, every day

Scoreboard
Me: 20,000,000 chicken wings
Durian: -60 avocados

I'll tell ya what's unnatural: living in a city with a few million other people, and have massive trucks deliver fresh food to us everyday, then, if we can be bothered, we waddle up to Woolworths to hand over some green paper for some grub. Ha!

Scoreboard
Me: 30,000,000 lamb chops
Durian: -90 hippy mung beans


And can ya stop calling 'us' carnivores? We (well, most non-vegos and non-vegans) are omnivores. The most carnivorous carnivores are felines, crocs, sharks, dolphins, most of the canine family, snakes, birds of prey, etc, etc. Are you really comparing me to a snake?

And do you really think that sleeping 14-hours-a-day is natural? Crikey! I suppose we could argue that highly active people need more sleep, but,,,jeebuz!


* For the uninitiated, the problem with b12 deficiency is that it can take up to 20 years before damage to the myelin sheath around nerves (b12 is a crucial component in the sheath) is detected, and the damage can be irreversible, leading to an MS-type condition.
This is a good site:
http://www.beyondveg.com

 

[craig1985]

Langer's Deli in LA is a Drive Up and they will serve a bike. Order the number 7 SOOOO SWEET OMG like butter in your ar$$

This seems perfect if somebody ever had the munchies.

 

[Polyarmour]

* For the uninitiated, the problem with b12 deficiency is that it can take up to 20 years before damage to the myelin sheath around nerves (b12 is a crucial component in the sheath) is detected, and the damage can be irreversible, leading to an MS-type condition.

Also sounds like the body is very forgiving of B12 shortages if it takes 20 years for the problem to manifest itself? If you get a bit short of B12 for a few years (or decades), no problem, the body will just re-absorb what you already have.

BTW Captain, that was a very amusing post.

Personally I have never subscribed to the argument that it is unnatural to eat meat. Just that in this day and age, for health , environmental and ethical reasons we can make a choice not to.

 

[Spider1964]

Crikey! More ramblings. I'm worried about ya. When you eventually go to the doc for 'behavioural disturbances', make sure you tell him about the grossly insufficient 10% fat in your diet.

Yep, Colpo upped his carbs, coz he found that low carbs didn't work for his high activity (I'm not a low-carber and, even if i wanted to be, I'd never have the discipline), but he hasn't gone low-fat; that's more of your BS propaganda. The only way his fat intake dropped was to make some room for the extra carbs.

Unfortunately, I've seen some snippets of your Youtube videos.
Ya know, ya bang on and on about what's natural and instinctive, but this is probably the biggest joke: about you and your 'philosophy':
I had a look at your website, and thank god you recommend taking b12*, but, by implication, this is an admission that a vegan diet is unnatural and inferior.

Ethics is one thing, but to make out that veganism is natural, but then tell everyone to take a vitamin which has its only useful form in animal products.....carm on, mate!!!! Crikey! In fact, you have to inject the stuff -- not just pop a couple of supplements -- because you acknowledge it's so important and in poor supply in your diet.

I've said some of this on here before, but:

Ethics are a convenience of those warm and full of belly (I made that up; feel free to use it, anyone ). In other words, it's very easy to feel sorry for the poor gazelle on tv being slaughtered by the group of lions when we're sitting on our comfee couch in our warm loungerooms, after a nice meal of 30 bananas (pfffft!)....or for those still-alive piglets wrapped in the big leaves. This ain't natural, dude (although this may change in 100,000 years, after we adapt ).

I'll tell ya what's natural:

You, you're cute missus, a couple of little Durians and a group of family and friends are hunting and gathering around Africa about 50,000 years ago. Food isn't exactly plentiful; in fact, in this particular week, food is scarce. You haven't eaten for 3 days (oh no! No bananas!), nor has your immediate family, or the rest of your posse. Missus Durian (who's even hotter, coz she's thin 'as') is screaming at ya for some food. Your kids can barely walk, coz they're so weak from hunger, and may be showing some signs of malnutriton.

Now, in this true natural environment of yours/ours, what do ya reckon would happen to your instincts and vegan 'ethics' when a bunch of piglets wandered passed? We all know the answer: you would get your farkin flint-head axe and speer our of your jockstrap and slaughter a dozen of them piggies faster than I could say "D12 and carbon seatposts are the biggest far'kin bling *** crap poser waste of money in the world." *ZING*

Scoreboard
Me: 10,000,000 bratwurst sausages
Durian: -30 bananas

Here's another one for ya:

It's around the same time period, you and your family have wandered up to North-East Europe, because there's more food. Winter comes pretty quick. It's really far'kin cold. Missus Durian and the little Durian pups are almost freezing to death, coz some bada'ss Neanderthal took most of your clothes. You're huddled in a cave when big hairy bison waddles passed the cave 'door'. Once again, in this natural scenario, you'd cut that lardo's throat in a second, and your missus would have a clean fur coat by dinner time. *ZING*

Our true instincts come to the fore when we're under pressure, not when we eat 3,000 calories a day, every day

Scoreboard
Me: 20,000,000 chicken wings
Durian: -60 avocados

I'll tell ya what's unnatural: living in a city with a few million other people, and have massive trucks deliver fresh food to us everyday, then, if we can be bothered, we waddle up to Woolworths to hand over some green paper for some grub. Ha!

Scoreboard
Me: 30,000,000 lamb chops
Durian: -90 hippy mung beans


And can ya stop calling 'us' carnivores? We (well, most non-vegos and non-vegans) are omnivores. The most carnivorous carnivores are felines, crocs, sharks, dolphins, most of the canine family, snakes, birds of prey, etc, etc. Are you really comparing me to a snake?

And do you really think that sleeping 14-hours-a-day is natural? Crikey! I suppose we could argue that highly active people need more sleep, but,,,jeebuz!


* For the uninitiated, the problem with b12 deficiency is that it can take up to 20 years before damage to the myelin sheath around nerves (b12 is a crucial component in the sheath) is detected, and the damage can be irreversible, leading to an MS-type condition.
This is a good site:
http://www.beyondveg.com

You win

Seriously... This is why I read these forums.. These little nuggets of comedic gold, that ram home the point.. But with humour. That's some funny **** you've just come up with.

Over to DR.. And in his rebuttal I'll bet London to a brick that he mentions his smokin hot GF.

Enough from me anyhow... Gotta grab a beer and cook tonight's dinner on the Barbie.. Steaks anyone?

 

[Captain Serious]

Personally I have never subscribed to the argument that it is unnatural to eat meat. Just that in this day and age, for health , environmental and ethical reasons we can make a choice not to.

Yep, it's fair enough for us to make choices, but I'm sure Durian could kill a cow if he hadn't eaten for a week.
And the full-on millitant types like him obviously get under our skin sometimes.

 

[lostintime]

the full-on millitant types like him obviously get under our skin sometimes.

And that is the sport of debate..... our beliefs are like boxing .... we smack each others around in the hopes of victory. It never lasts long though does it, 'cause theres aways another opponent . Pretty soon we all end up punch drunk.... but we do it anyways 'cause we love it.

meat eaters vs. vegans . . . . . round 58

 

[Martin318is]

you mean omnivores vs DurianRider.

I (and from what I have seen, the vast majority of posters in this thread) have zero problems with a person's ambition to remain vegan and will often applaud them for it.

What I - as a person for whom meat comprises much less than 5% of my diet - have reacted to here is the offensive nature of DurianRider's attitude to other people that do not automatically accept his point of view.

 

[Night Rider]

And that is the sport of debate..... our beliefs are like boxing .... we smack each others around in the hopes of victory. It never lasts long though does it, 'cause theres aways another opponent . Pretty soon we all end up punch drunk.... but we do it anyways 'cause we love it.

meat eaters vs. vegans . . . . . round 58

If our beliefs were truly like boxing then the vegans would be KO'd within 3, they just wouldn't have the energy or strength to go the distance

 

[simo1733]

If our beliefs were truly like boxing then the vegans would be KO'd within 3, they just wouldn't have the energy or strength to go the distance

Don't you know tha DR is 60 kg of pure muscle.Some meat eaters can take a dump that weigh's more than that.Just saying.

 

[Martin318is]

Don't you know tha DR is 60 kg of pure muscle.Some meat eaters can take a dump that weigh's more than that.Just saying.

This is the argument that is absurd in both directions - lets grab one person out of 7 Billion and state that they are some sort of proof of anything. The dumb auto-comeback to your point for example would be to say "Mariusz Pudzianowski eats meat therefore meat eaters are all stronger than vegans..."

but its simply not relevant.

 

[durianrider]

Well its pretty accurate as I have single digit body fat year round so its mostly muscle.

If I was into weights vs riding at 5.3 w/p/kg then I would be looking more like a body builder than a cyclist. I could put on a lot of muscle with this diet & lifestyle so keep away from the heavy weights.

Its funny cos people say carbs make you fat but then they say to me 'your too thin!'. I eat over 600-700g of carbs per day. Sometimes as high as 1500cals. I dont train much. Averaged 33km a day for 2011 and can out ride any vegan naysayers on this forum based on my garmin connect data.

#As for the b12 thing. Ive trained with all the big names in cycling in the last 5 years from Lance to Contador and all the team doctors have been present in the support car and we get chatting. All the teams get b12 shots or b12 sublinguals. Yeah its true that Lance has gone vegan again recently and Contador is a vegetarian but I challenge anyone to find me a pro athlete that DOESNT do b12 supplementation.

When someone says 'oh vegan isnt natural cos you have to supp b12' then they highlight their newbie status in the nutrition and human physiology world. Its like Grandma saying about your new Michelin Pro Race tyres 'oh look at the back tyre! its totally bald! your due for a new tyre! I thought you cared for your bike and your riding around with a dangerously bald rear tyre? good think Grandma was here to spot that eh? you think your a bike know it all and good ol Grandma taught you the basics about tyre maintenance...'

Thanks Grandma.

 

[Martin318is]

Well its pretty accurate as I have single digit body fat year round so its mostly muscle.

If I was into weights vs riding at 5.3 w/p/kg then I would be looking more like a body builder than a cyclist. I could put on a lot of muscle with this diet & lifestyle so keep away from the heavy weights.

All great, but as I said - its absurd to try to base a yes no statement of fact of this type on the evidence of the lifestyle of one person (or even 100 people). My example of Marius was a simple one of these in the other direction - the odds are he got there non-naturally anyway...

Anyway,
What we have all observed with your lifestyle is that you are constantly on the move - actively engaged in several aerobic/anaerobic activities often apparently simultaneously and have low intake of bad sugary foods such as soft drinks, sweets, etc. Your natural energy expenditure is several factors larger than most people.

So, does your body composition prove:

a) vegansim works
b) high levels of activity relative to energy intake works
c) avoiding synthetic foods and bad sugars works
d) its underlying genetics that causes these benefits

The answer is, it cannot prove any of them over one of the others. You can say that you are very healthy AND vegan (which is a good thing) but it is stretching credibility to say that your health is evidence that veganism is the key that works for everyone.

Keep in mind that the majority of people reading these pages are already cyclists and relatively health concious. The examples you use need to be modified to suit this. What has been said repeatedly in this thread is that if you looked at that and adjusted your message slightly to suit your audience then you would be a lot more effective. For instance, if you were to compare the benefits of a vegan diet across a population vs the pros/cons of a NORMAL omnivore diet (as opposed to ranting about carnivores that bite live pigs) then I think you would find that people are a lot more receptive.