Teams & Riders Mark Cavendish Discussion Thread

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And that's what I'm saying. Cavendish would have still been dominant against Greipel and Kittel if they were on other teams in his dominant era.
Just like his team refused that year, the race organizers started refusing inviting Cipo because of his antics. If you don't make him Italian, suddenly he has far far less Italian wins. You can't have it both ways.
You really need to take the Cav fanboy hat off. No way would Cavendish have been winning as frequently against Kittel at his best. 36 year old Petacchi could still beat Cav on occasion for Gods sake.

And of course Cipo would not have won as many Giro stages if he had focused on the Tour, but I bet he would have had similar figures to Cav in Tour stages. If people think Cav is the greatest, there is a good case for that, but when I see people saying undisputed or undoubted GOAT, I just think that is nonsense. Cav and Cipo have very similar palmares, except one is skewed toward Tour stages v Giro stages which reflects their respective priorities based on Nationality, teams and respective eras. Also Cipo has 3 Ghent-Wevelgem titles to his name. Flip their respective nationalities/priorities and I bet the results would be similar.

Also on the opposition thing in 2008-10

2010 TDF Stage 18 Top 5
  1. Cav
  2. Dean(35)
  3. Petacchi(36)
  4. McEwen(38)
  5. Freire(34)
That is their respective ages, not wins lol. Of course there was also Hushovd(over 30) who won a total of 3 Tour Bunch sprint stages across 7 Tours before Cav arrived. Hardly prolific. Then lets look at the rest of the non over 30s opposition for Cav in those Tours

Farrar, Feillu, Hutarovich, Rojas, Ciolek, Duque, Forster, Steegmans, Seb Chavanel, Mondory, Hinault, Galinzyanov, Boasson Hagen, Bonnet, Chicchi.

They combine for a Total of 4 Tour de France sprint stage wins, and less than 20 GT stage wins between them. And people want to argue that Cav's opposition when he was at his peak were not weak. A bunch of old guys who Cipo was better than, and a lot of very average sprinters.
 
Getting some serious PTSD from tennis era arguments now. Arguments get entirely circular, not to mention this is some embarrassing cherry picking.

Nadal never beat a multiple RG winner on clay.
Dude, I picked that stage cos it's funny. How often do you see that many oldies in a sprint together? I listed all of Cav's rival in the Tour during that time. Put them in whatever order you want, it doesn't change the fact it was a bunch of old guys and a load of average sprinters. A far cry from Cipollini, Abdu & Zabel facing off in their pomp.
 
And of course Cipo would not have won as many Giro stages if he had focused on the Tour, but I bet he would have had similar figures to Cav in Tour stages. If people think Cav is the greatest, there is a good case for that, but when I see people saying undisputed or undoubted GOAT, I just think that is nonsense. Cav and Cipo have very similar palmares, except one is skewed toward Tour stages v Giro stages which reflects their respective priorities based on Nationality, teams and respective eras. Also Cipo has 3 Ghent-Wevelgem titles to his name. Flip their respective nationalities/priorities and I bet the results would be similar.
Cipollini never won on the champs elysees, not sure he ever even made it that far. Cavendish won 4 in a row.

And even in cipo times there was more money and prestige in the tour, probably even for italians.
 

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