Teams & Riders Mark Cavendish Discussion Thread

[Angliru]

I honestly don't get why people here are still obsessing about the Haussler crash like that. **** happens in sprints. Sometimes blame can be assigned clearly, sometimes not.

Cavendish still has to take crap for something that happened two years ago and riders like Abdu and ****ing McEwen are being idolised? How many people did those make crash during their careers? And how many times did either of them apologise for hurting other riders?

Abdu takes crap to this day for his dangerous riding as does McEwen. Cav is obviously idolized by some based on the fervor at which he is being defended here by a several posters. There is virtually no difference in how they've been treated over the course of their careers. If there is a difference it is that Cav is the here and now, McEwen is past his prime with one leg out the door, and Abdu is a remnant of the cycling's past.

 

[El Pistolero]

I always liked Robbie just because of his personality. And back then, sprints were still interesting and you could never say for sure who was going to win... Boonen, Petacchi, Mcewen, Cipollini, Tom Steels, etc

Ps: I'm aware that not all the sprinters named here competed at the same time.

Nowadays it's always Cavendish and thus sprinting has become really boring. Not a big fan of his personality either...

 

[Angliru]

Hey guys sorry If I really upset anybody, as I say this black and white media is often too harsh and doesn't really allow you to inject some humour without someone getting the wrong end of the stick.

I have to admit to being mildy annoyed that a lot were blind to what I see when I look at that crash, I was thinking 'they haven't bothered to look properly again'.

As far as BroDeals comments go, I've tried to take them in good humour, after all you could easily take offence at some of them. I'm thinking 'hey get back in your pram!'

Mind you that one about '.....if you let him succeed' cracked me up!

As far as the 'odd' letters go I can't for the life of me see why they're odd?
I mean that one I wrote to the UCI, to my mind how can you fault the logic? When I saw what Haussler did I was determined that they shouldn't stick the whole thing on Cav (and I'm no fanboy if that had been Brice Feillu taking the barge from Haussler I'd have felt the smae and done the same).

To my mind the commissaires didn't look at it closely enough, and if you look at it real time its all a bit too quick to reveal what actually happened. At the end of the day the commissaires are paid to do a job and do it properly, that day they didn't.

Ciolek should have had some kind of caution for the massive switch - that was far worse than Cav gradually closing the door and who can blame Cav after being on the receiving end of that switch? That kind of sudden movement could really get someone hurt, people have ended up in wheelchairs after lesser flicks than that.

To me it is just common sense, gradual line changes are one thing (Cav's not quite as 'Abdu' there as some make out) sudden switches and barges are something else and they should have been punished.

Could you please delete 2 of the 3 posts that you have here that are repeated? Thanks!

 

[Angliru]

Cav just tweeted:

"So @petatodd & I have decided to have a final 'date' before I'm a dad. Doing it oldskool. Pizza & cinema."

Sure I'm happy for him to have a baby but when I read it, I had to laugh because he definitely shouldnt be eating any Pizza especially after being dropped on every tiny Cat 5 hill over the last few weeks.

Perhaps I'm wrong and since he got the rainbow jersey and new lucrative multi year contract he can eat pizza left and right. Way to go Cav and perhaps one day we will be seeing you on TV doing the "Biggest Loser" show. You are definitely on your way

CQM

Cyclists are known to treat themselves with "normal" food on occasion between key points in their seasons.

 

[El Pistolero]

Yeah, Devolder ate fries after his victories in the Ronde(and last year as well just to comfort him self).

 

[Angliru]

I understood what you meant with the abbreviations I just don't see having a 'sans jour' at Milan - San Remo and misfortune at Gent - Wevelgem as 'It all going wrong'. It's not great, but he's won KBK before that and there's plenty of the season left.

Eating Pizza, not winning his last two races... To the tower!

It isn't "all going wrong" but his performances in both events had to be quite disappointing considering the high expectations that he and Sky had leading up to them, especially in MSR where he was out of the running with 30 km still left, with no reason other than he just couldn't handle the pace on the climbs. If he and his fans considered him to be more than a one-trick pony then performances like these in big one day events shouldn't happen.

 

[spalco]

Abdu takes crap to this day for his dangerous riding as does McEwen. Cav is obviously idolized by some based on the fervor at which he is being defended here by a several posters. There is virtually no difference in how they've been treated over the course of their careers. If there is a difference it is that Cav is the here and now, McEwen is past his prime with one leg out the door, and Abdu is a remnant of the cycling's past.

I don't get the impression at all that they have to take crap for it. In fact it seems to me like riders like them are actually admired for their hard-nosed, don't give a ****, take no prisoners, do whatever it takes attitude.
Partly I'm sure that's nostalgia, similar to how fans view the dopers and *******s of earlier times. I suppose that natural, but still, there's a clear discrepancy, or might I say hypocrisy, compared to current riders.

Oh well. Maybe in 20 years even Pistolero will say something like: "GTFO, that new phenom XY is way overrated. Remember Cavendish? THat was a hell of a sprinter!".

 

[Angliru]

And Rojas has won six races in six years. The idea that he is a better cyclist because he finishes 8th in a lumpy stage and 5th in a sprint stage is stupid.

...and where did anyone even imply that was the case? All that was pointed out was that Rojas and Cavendish were faced with the same dilemma, one where Rojas didn't give up and Cavendish seemingly did. An incident where Cav quickly blamed his failure on a rider he didn't hesitate to name for allowing a gap to develop that he chose not to attempt to bridge or simply couldn't.

 

[El Pistolero]

Yeah, no one said Rojas was a better cyclist LOL.

And ever since Hrorta told me something "personal" about Rojas, he can go to hell.

 

[El Pistolero]

I don't get the impression at all that they have to take crap for it. In fact it seems to me like riders like them are actually admired for their hard-nosed, don't give a ****, take no prisoners, do whatever it takes attitude.
Partly I'm sure that's nostalgia, similar to how fans view the dopers and *******s of earlier times. I suppose that natural, but still, there's a clear discrepancy, or might I say hypocrisy, compared to current riders.

Oh well. Maybe in 20 years even Pistolero will say something like: "GTFO, that new phenom XY is way overrated. Remember Cavendish? THat was a hell of a sprinter!".

Cavendish is one hell of a sprinter. He just sucks at everything else... Well, team time trials perhaps...

 

[Angliru]

But why the obsession with being an all-rounder. It's specific to cycling. No-one cares that Glenn McGrath can't bat or Lionel Messi can't tackle.

Rojas may be able to do various things quite well. He may be the 10th best sprinter and the 30th best climber, but he's not great at anything. Who cares about that?

Sport is about excellence in specific areas, not competence in many areas.

The bottom line in this discussion is that Cavendish chose to place the blame for his failure on the rider that allowed the gap to develop, not on his inability or lack of willingness to bridge the gap. It's not about if Rojas is a more rounded cyclist.

 

[Angliru]

Generally Cav is very, very good at quick decision- making and positioning, probably the best in the peleton IMO.

...and how can you make this statement with any degree of confidence considering the number pro's there are with vastly more experience than Cavendish? A rider could be less of a natural talent with a fraction of his results and still be better than Cav in these areas.

 

[spalco]

The bottom line in this discussion is that Cavendish chose to place the blame for his failure on the rider that allowed the gap to develop, not on his inability or lack of willingness to bridge the gap. It's not about if Rojas is a more rounded cyclist.

Yeah, it was a stupid comment by Cavendish on several levels. Can't it just be left at that? Nobody's claiming he's a master diplomat or rocket scientist.

 

[Angliru]

I don't really know where Rojas came from. There's no way he should be in a discussion with the greats.

Cavendish will probably not rival the all round achievements of the likes of van Looy, Kelly, Maertens etc.

But so what. He is the best at what he does - maybe the best ever. The idea of a more 'rounded' cyclist is more eclectic (a debate for the cycling fan). Wins are what counts. Cav has many. They may not be your favourites. But he has won many races due to an extraordinary ability.

You've got to kidding. Should we exclude every other rider that doesn't have an impressive palmares from all discussions because you don't deem them worthy? Maybe you should supply us all with a list of the riders that we have your approval to mention when discussing this sport of cycling. Apparently everyone else is on some blacklist that we aren't privvy to.

 

[Angliru]

The problem you are struggling with is that you think that only one of the two can be a great - despite being quite different. It's like comparing Dickens to Shakespeare.

Here's the simple plan for you:

Tom Boonen: All time great classics rider and sprinter
Mark Cavendish: Phenomenal bunch sprinter - maybe the best ever.

Do you see that two great cyclists can be lauded at the same time?

You, and any others, need to learn to discuss cycling rather than argue about it.

You need to get a grip and come back to earth. Or are you the one here who decides who and what gets discussed in this forum? I don't see a moderator/admin title by your avatar.

 

[Richeypen]

You need to get a grip and come back to earth. Or are you the one here who decides who and what gets discussed in this forum? I don't see a moderator/admin title by your avatar.

You just justified his point.

 

[Angliru]

And you, as soon as you see my name, has a pop. Really, grow up.
Try to have a discussion for once, rather than an arguement. You'll find it better son.

An argument based on being misinformed or simply jumping the gun without reading further into the origins of a discussion is what you seem to have started.

 

[Angliru]

Yeah, it was a stupid comment by Cavendish on several levels. Can't it just be left at that? Nobody's claiming he's a master diplomat or rocket scientist.

...because he felt the need to drop the name of the rider as if said rider had committed a crime of some sort. Admit you couldn't bridge the gap, take responsibility and move on.

 

[hmsgenoa]

Could you please delete 2 of the 3 posts that you have here that are repeated? Thanks!

If doughnuts like you were to take onboard what is abundantly apparent the first time round I wouldn't have had to repeat myself

 

[hmsgenoa]

That's the problem with cranks. They like to project their disorders onto others, and they are always muttering about beating someone in arguments based purely on the voices in their head.

I just got back from three hours of riding. You should try it sometime instead of spending your Saturday mooning about Chav.. The calming effect might help with your treatment.

Have you got a profile on Strava? We'll have to compare notes, you might not like it though.

 

[The Hitch]

Yeah, no one said Rojas was a better cyclist LOL.

And ever since Hrorta told me something "personal" about Rojas, he can go to hell.

hrotha or Rojas?

If its about Rojas you mind sharing?

 

[Zam_Olyas]

hrotha or Rojas?

If its about Rojas you mind sharing?

I think hrotha said rojas is a francoist?. sorry senor pistol

 

[Caruut]

hrotha or Rojas?

If its about Rojas you mind sharing?

He called Franco his political idol. Cav's silly comments in interviews and on twitter pale in comparison to what Rojas has done by saying that.

 

[hmsgenoa]

You need to get a grip and come back to earth. Or are you the one here who decides who and what gets discussed in this forum? I don't see a moderator/admin title by your avatar.

I can't see what Mambo95 has said is wrong here, it's common sense. To be honest I think he's hit a raw nerve with you and a nail on the head

Some of the posters on here do like to argue about the minutiae and cannot see the wood for the trees. You put plain evidence in front of them and they'll argue black is white. You inject a bit of humour into proceedings and they leap from their pram (that's you Angliru and Brodeal - I mean after all who could take my American/Farrar comment seriously, but you certainly took the bait).

Show them something they hadn't noticed and they seethe because inside they cannot understand why they didn't see it in the firstplace.

And if you are reading this Brodeal, the only reason I was on here yesterday was because I was at home looking after my children -any 3 hour rides I do are normally between 9pm and 12 midnight on my mtb after they're tucked up in bed - http://app.strava.com/rides/3585887

 

[Waterloo Sunrise]

I do love an opportunity for the bien pensant types getting horribly upset by 5 figure rightwing attrocities and being remarkably 1-eyed about 8 figure left wing attrocities.

I'm not going to reply again, because these discussions are off-topic, and tedious.

Sounds like Rojas is a ****, but no more of a **** than the lefties who fete Stalin/Guevara/Castro/Mao etc, and who greatly outnumber him and his type.