McQuaid: Cut Down the Giro and Vuelta, Embrace California

[jens_attacks]

Respectfully, sir you are a hater. Why would you not want another race on the UCI calandar.

well those quotes were too funny.in an extremist way.
california is gorgeous.a bike race there is welcomed.but don't sell it like that because you look like idiots.that's all.

 

[Skip Madness]

All that being said... there is the idea that extremely hard races encourage doping. I'm not sure if I agree with that or not, but at least that argument isn't completely idiotic.

I wouldn't be so sure about encouraging doping - the argument about well there wouldn't be doping at the 100m sprint/masters' criterium racing may be old, but it still holds true. For me the main concern would be rider health because of things like weight loss. Obviously a grand tour can be completed by a clean rider and it's meant to be an extreme physical test and three weeks of hard work, but if this...

Maybe a 15 stage event with 1 rest day would be better then 20-21 stages with two rest days.

... or shorter stage lengths, or a mixture of both, were decided to be a reasonable safety measure I wouldn't think it sacrilege (which I know many would).

The other main reason I wouldn't mind shorter grand tours is that you generally get about a week's worth of fairly crap stages in any grand tour anyway, although I suppose it's likely that rather than getting rid of six crap stages, you get rid of two and keep four, who knows.

The important point is that any reasonable discussion about the lengths of the grand tours should not be impacted upon by the ambitions of what is generously a third-tier stage race.

 

[Mellow Velo]

Same goes for the TDU, if names equate to the toughness of races.
Given the choice of having either Andy Schleck, Cancellara and that old bloke, in my race, or the Zoncolan, Mortirolo and Colle delle Finestre, I know which I would want..........every time.

Some posters only seem to know one way to post: By baiting. End of.

I haven't seen much in the way of constructive ideas for global expansion, other than the nice idea of having Cali in October or November.

Take the TDU. Why does it sit in the not so splendid isolation of January, with the next PT/WT event not scheduled until March?

I would move the TDU to November (last big race of the season) and link it with Cali,(first race)the Tour de San Luis, a Columbian showdown, possibly the Beijing bash. Also add some meaningful one-day events.

No excuses for riders climbing off their bikes in July, but time to have a mid-season rest break.
Expansion must, by definition mean extending the season.

 

[Vonn Brinkman]

McQuaid you are a chubby elf / leprechaun muppet.
This is just ridiculous.
Next he'll promote the Tour of Ireland to become a three week GT.

 

[md2020]

As a resident of southern California I'm glad to see the ToC gain exposure but let's get real, there's no way a cycling event of that size can survive in the US. It's been tried over and over (Coors Classic, Tour DuPont, Tour of Georgia) and there just isn't the public interest here to keep it going.

 

[flicker]

As a resident of southern California I'm glad to see the ToC gain exposure but let's get real, there's no way a cycling event of that size can survive in the US. It's been tried over and over (Coors Classic, Tour DuPont, Tour of Georgia) and there just isn't the public interest here to keep it going.

I think for cycling (top tier)to survive in the US it needs to be promoted properly.
For cycling really the idea of races in October,November the Europeans here know, do you think that top tier riders would be interested in keeping form at that time.?
I think the Vuelta could be re-scheduled and the worlds could be re-scheduled. You might get better riders with that format.

 

[mastersracer]

As a resident of southern California I'm glad to see the ToC gain exposure but let's get real, there's no way a cycling event of that size can survive in the US. It's been tried over and over (Coors Classic, Tour DuPont, Tour of Georgia) and there just isn't the public interest here to keep it going.

public interest has never been the problem. ToC crowds have always been large, and this year 50 cities applied to host a stage. The issue has always been title sponsors. Amgen is in the last year of their extension as title sponsor for 2011. Hopefully, AEG will have the clout to secure an extension or bring in a new sponsor for 2012 and beyond. Public interest is not what keeps potential title sponsors away - it's whether pro cycling is good to be associated with.

 

[skidmark]

You know, this statement really is illuminating as to the approach McQuaid and the UCI take to things:

"I think we can reduce the duration of the Giro and Vuelta [a España],” he added. “The Tour is untouchable, it’s the biggest race in the World; it’s our showcase.”

Sick. Really, is it that much of a stretch to think of him or Hein saying 6 years ago, behind closed doors, "I think we can afford a suspension of Hamilton and Heras... Lance is untouchable, he's the biggest racer in the World; he's our showcase"...

 

[dolophonic]

Well put Skid.. that really tip's their hand as to the way the UCI are thinking.
Bogus.

 

[Mellow Velo]

I think for cycling (top tier)to survive in the US it needs to be promoted properly.
For cycling really the idea of races in October,November the Europeans here know, do you think that top tier riders would be interested in keeping form at that time.?
I think the Vuelta could be re-scheduled and the worlds could be re-scheduled. You might get better riders with that format.

Why not?
If the season were 10 months long, instead of 8, there would be no excuse for riding flat out for just one month.

Besides, which non-US top tier riders have come to the TOC with form and raced seriously?
Having the race in October might find a few guys trying to prove a point.

 

[flicker]

Why not?
If the season were 10 months long, instead of 8, there would be no excuse for riding flat out for just one month.

Besides, which non-US top tier riders have come to the TOC with form and raced seriously?
Having the race in October might find a few guys trying to prove a point.

October ToC now we could call it the tour of redemption, might be a great idea.


Now that Amgen has finished their contract with the ToC I think the Euros might be right, the ToC may hit the skids......

 

[Berzin]

I wouldn't necessarily be totally opposed to shorter grand tours, but if it were to happen I'd like to see it applied to all three rather than just the Giro and Vuelta.

The Tour is the main cash cow for all parties involved. They'll never reduce it from three weeks. Never.

I do believe three week stage races are a problem. Do you cut the distance per stage or cut the overall days raced?

Are two rest days really enough?

Three weeks is a long time to be racing one particular race. But the respective countries count on these never-ending caravans to generate money.

It's like the NFL-they want to cut down on concussions but see no problems extending the season to 18 games.

 

[Francois the Postman]

The Tour is the main cash cow for all parties involved. They'll never reduce it from three weeks. Never.

I do believe three week stage races are a problem. Do you cut the distance per stage or cut the overall days raced?

Are two rest days really enough?

Three weeks is a long time to be racing one particular race. But the respective countries count on these never-ending caravans to generate money.

It's like the NFL-they want to cut down on concussions but see no problems extending the season to 18 games.

It is more like reducing the season to 12 games in the US, and knocking one quarter of the Superbowl, to make room for NFL teams playing some games in the IFL calendar, whilst insisting that the IFL final is rapidly becoming the 4th most important game on the calendar. All in the name of "making the sport grow globally", tapping into an "obvious" growth market. That's the Italian American Football League for you.

 

[Skip Madness]

The Tour is the main cash cow for all parties involved. They'll never reduce it from three weeks. Never.

I'd never say never (except twice just there), but it's not something I can foresee in the conceivable future, either. The thing I was emphasising was that I find it equally inconceivable that the Giro would allow itself to be reduced if the Tour weren't, at least under Zomegnan's directorship.

I do believe three week stage races are a problem. Do you cut the distance per stage or cut the overall days raced?

Are two rest days really enough?

Personally, I think more than two rest days would get a bit frustrating (with exemptions for things like the crazy Giro plans in Washington DC, whatever the deal is there still).

As I said, in principle I'm not opposed to shortening the races through either method, but stage distances are a more conceivable method. Maybe impose a maximum kilometrage? Say it has to be less than 3,000 km or something, maybe less - 2,800 km?

 

[md2020]

public interest has never been the problem. ToC crowds have always been large, and this year 50 cities applied to host a stage. The issue has always been title sponsors. Amgen is in the last year of their extension as title sponsor for 2011. Hopefully, AEG will have the clout to secure an extension or bring in a new sponsor for 2012 and beyond. Public interest is not what keeps potential title sponsors away - it's whether pro cycling is good to be associated with.

We're talking about different scales of public interest. Live crowds and host city interest isn't really what sponsors want today. They want TV exposure and I don't think that the ToC really gives them that. It may work short term but it'll be interesting to see what kind of ratings Versus can get with the ToC this year without Lance.

Also, what's different this time compared to all the previous US stage races which have come and gone?

 

[md2020]

I think for cycling (top tier)to survive in the US it needs to be promoted properly.
For cycling really the idea of races in October,November the Europeans here know, do you think that top tier riders would be interested in keeping form at that time.?
I think the Vuelta could be re-scheduled and the worlds could be re-scheduled. You might get better riders with that format.

I don't know. I think the sports landscape is too cluttered as it is for cycling to make it as a pro sport in the US. It's been tried numerous time and has failed. I would love to see it work but not at the expense of classic, well established races like the Giro or Vuelta. Also, moving to October presents another set of problems because then you're competing against the NFL for interest and that's a losing battle.

 

[whittashau]

This is unbelievable, well at least it should be, but I know living in New Zealand that we do get tv coverage of The ToC, but not the Giro so clearly some people have some warped ideas about cycling.

 

[auscyclefan94]

Yes, In aus we got live coverage of the ToC with Dumb and Dumber (Phil & paul - not sure who is dumber) but only got 1/2 an hour highlights of the giro on SBS 2

 

[flicker]

Yes, In aus we got live coverage of the ToC with Dumb and Dumber (Phil & paul - not sure who is dumber) but only got 1/2 an hour highlights of the giro on SBS 2

paul and phil rule

 

[Michielveedeebee]

paul and phil rule

No they're not, Michel (Wuyts) and Tom (Steels) rule.
And ACF that sucks for you :s

 

[Libertine Seguros]

Michel Wuyts met de versnelling!

As has been said earlier... the Vuelta might be shortened but can expect to see Guillén hiding behind the ASO if it's actually SERIOUSLY threatened; Zomegnan will tell McQuaid where to stick it. RCS will take their races from the ProTour, and since ASO's stake in the Vuelta is too high, they could be put in a difficult position.

But, ultimately, they hold all the cards.

Do any of you follow motorsports?

The thing is, what McQuaid wants is something like F1. Everything's under one easily controllable umbrella, he can pick and choose what the important races are, the same people are at every race, and the FIA are in charge and everybody has to jump to their tune. They have their favourites, of course, but that's just part and parcel of the competition.

Unfortunately for McQuaid, cycling is more like sportscar racing. In that, you have teams that simply can't afford to do ALL the sportscar racing in the world, so you have a number of regional series (ALMS, Asian LMS, LMS, FIA GT, JGTC, Grand Am, etc etc etc) with various classes of racing; some with everybody at the same level (GT1 World Series etc), some with multiple classes of racing (ALMS, LMS). The FIA set a variety of rules for the different classes of racing, but ultimately, sportscar racing is about a small number of endurance events such as the 24hr Daytona, the 12hr of Sebring, and most importantly, the 24h du Mans. Everybody who has a sportscar wants to race at Le Mans. The exposure there is just so much more than the other events. As a result, you get the big teams swanning in for warmup races at whichever series is convenient for them, and the FIA set their regulations, but ultimately, when the ACO (who run the 24h du Mans) set THEIR regulations, unless the FIA rules are so close that the changes can be made easily and still compete under both sets of regulations, then nobody will bother racing the FIA's series, because they can't get in at Le Mans. Therefore, the ACO's rules become more or less the default, and anytime the FIA get too shirty, the ACO just threaten to exclude all the FIA-series teams, and the ACO usually win or get a compromise.

 

[Barrus]

Why would Wuyts be included this year, I did not catch him make too big mistakes. His normal ones, sure. But nothing really major

Oh wait, I now understand why you were talking about Wuyts, Libertine. And I am also in the wrong topic, I thought this was the moron of the year topic

And I need to agree, I love it when Steels is there, although I would reckon he won't be there as often next year

 

[Libertine Seguros]

Why would Wuyts be included this year, I did not catch him make too big mistakes. His normal ones, sure. But nothing really major

I think we're saying that Wuyts rules - compared to Phil and Paul, Paulo Martins is good mind you.

Ok, maybe I shouldn't go that far.

 

[Barrus]

I think we're saying that Wuyts rules - compared to Phil and Paul, Paulo Martins is good mind you.

Ok, maybe I shouldn't go that far.

Jeez, you react fast, I didn't even have time to edit my post

 

[Matthijs]

Sorry in the US there is little interest in those races(Vuelta,Giro)

No coverage outside of cycling mags and computer cycling geeks. The Vuelta and Giro GTs are absolutly alien to our US culture. If you want to have the sport grow, the markets need to be expanded. Listen to McQuaid.

yeah, and besides western europe, there isn't much interested in Cycling outside the TdF. So does that lead to the conclusion that all other races must be reduced? Only the last 2 hours are broadcasted live in most races, so lets drop the first 2-4 hours should we?

The Giro is perfectly fine. In the interview PMQ says about the Vuelta that it has long boring stages. Every cycling fan knows the Vuelta is the GT with the shortest stages. Does this guy even follow cycling outside the TdF and ToC?

I can imagine one day with really important races on other continents. I can imagine one day we have sort-of-GT's of about 2 weeks in the US and maybe somewhere else. And one of Vuelta or Giro is dropped as a high level race. But as long as the majority of spectators and followers on television, crowds along the rowds, are all Europeans...