Moderators

[Spider1964]

Forum Wars

I hate off season coz we get more arguing in this forum of ours.

None of the contests rival Rocky Balboa v Clubber Lang, but here's my take on the main combatants ATM -

Thread with their Combatants
Quadafi's death The Hitch v Ramjambunath (& others)
General Politics rhubroma v ScottSoCal v RedTreviso v GreGod v sheesh v Glenn Wilson v The World (& others)
Lance Armstrong Polish v RaceRadio, CimaCoppi49, The World (& others) FFS bring on the indictments!
Crank Length FrankDay v CoachFergie (Probably my personal favourite... these guys just keep bashing the sh!t out of each other with no end in sight, world wars have lesser time frames)
Babes on Bikes Krebs303 v The Mods. Go Krebs… fight the good fight.
Any thread that mentions a Columbian RyoHazuki v Everyone including aliens and a previously unknown race of pygmies in the Amazon rainforest who wish to argue just because.
Any Thread that mentions Cadel ACF94 v The World
109 clenbuterol positives in U17 football WC
Dr Maserati v Python (See Crank Length Thread above, these guys have settled in for the long haul!)

We indeed live in interesting times.

 

[Martin318is]

Babes on Bikes Krebs303 v The Mods. Go Krebs… fight the good fight.

There is definitely no fight between Krebs303 and the Mods in that thread.

We are on the same side - battling to keep it open against the poor photo choices of the new entrants that if left unchecked would get the thread closed..

 

[krebs303]

I have no quarrel with the moderation other than a post being banned for "no religious themes" rather than simply offensive. I have no problem with it being deleted. But obviously "no religious themes" poses a huge problem. does it mean no pictures that have a star of david,cross or crescent moon, of course not. I have many posts in the last 2 days that are religious references in some form. no complaints no deletions. If a post is is tagged as offensive than fine but to say no more posts in that genre is a overbearing. Do you really want to censor this it is a religious theme

I think not. I know I'm carrying to extremes but you get my drift.
Censor posts if they are offensive. Not subject matter

And I apologize once again for my tirade but couldn't you have given me a 24 hour suspension. I've never been suspended like all the cool guys

 

[BroDeal]

I am offended. As a practicing member of the Crimson Cult, worshipper of Cthulhu, and devotee of the Great Old Ones, making light of exorcism is deplorable. Exorcism is the banishment of our gods' servants from the material plane. It is murder of those who could bring about the glorious return from the depths of the earth of those we hold most sacred. To make light of this using cats is shocking.

 

[pedaling squares]

The difficulty I have is that do we have to treat each word individually, and then come up with some ruling which is apparently the most fair and in the best interests of the forum.

When does a word become socially acceptable, or antisocial. We can't decide this, not a few moderators, not a few dozen members, yet this is the task we face.

Is it acceptable for Gilbert to destroy, murder, assault, obliterate, annihilate or wage war on the peloton, but unacceptable for him to rape it? Are we okay with Pat's reign being described as cancerous?

Personally I think the key is intent.

Very well said, Ferminal.

It annoys me to hell when people use the word...

An entirely reasonable response

It should be used in one context only...

None of us are in a position to say in which context a person can use a word. Except perhaps the author, who can speak to his/her intent.

 

[ramjambunath]

None of the contests rival Rocky Balboa v Clubber Lang, but here's my take on the main combatants ATM -

Thread with their Combatants
Quadafi's death The Hitch v Ramjambunath[ (& others)
General Politics rhubroma v ScottSoCal v RedTreviso v GreGod v sheesh v Glenn Wilson v The World (& others)
Lance Armstrong Polish v RaceRadio, CimaCoppi49, The World (& others) FFS bring on the indictments!
Crank Length FrankDay v CoachFergie (Probably my personal favourite... these guys just keep bashing the sh!t out of each other with no end in sight, world wars have lesser time frames)
Babes on Bikes Krebs303 v The Mods. Go Krebs… fight the good fight.
Any thread that mentions a Columbian RyoHazuki v Everyone including aliens and a previously unknown race of pygmies in the Amazon rainforest who wish to argue just because.
Any Thread that mentions Cadel ACF94 v The World
109 clenbuterol positives in U17 football WC
Dr Maserati v Python (See Crank Length Thread above, these guys have settled in for the long haul!)

We indeed live in interesting times.

.......

 

[Polish]

"By 2050—earlier, probably—all real knowledge of Oldspeak will have disappeared. The whole literature of the past will have been destroyed. Chaucer, Shakespeare, Milton, Byron—they'll exist only in Newspeak versions, not merely changed into something different, but actually contradictory of what they used to be. Even the literature of the Party will change. Even the slogans will change. How could you have a slogan like "freedom is slavery" when the concept of freedom has been abolished? The whole climate of thought will be different. In fact there will be no thought, as we understand it now. Orthodoxy means not thinking—not needing to think. Orthodoxy is unconsciousness."

As long as we have flying cars and personal jetpacks, I'm good.

 

[Luke Schmid]

It seems like a pretty accurate description to me. How else should I describe someone who reads typical forum banter and thinks to himself, "OMG! Someone used a word in a way I don't agree with. I should do something about this."? Of all the things to complain about in the world, words passing into slang use is what he complains about?

I never said I wanted the moderators to do anything, I just raised an issue for discussion. I mentioned self moderation would be good. If people wish to use phrases like it knowing that some of the people reading it will not be able to enjoy reading the post and get the meaning of the communication as intended then there is not much to be done. I am not really in favour of the word being banned outright although if that happens I will not be complaining either. It might cause a problem if a rider is accused or the victim of rape that is a discussion point.

 

[gregod]

None of the contests rival Rocky Balboa v Clubber Lang, but here's my take on the main combatants ATM -

...
General Politics rhubroma v ScottSoCal v RedTreviso v GreGod v sheesh v Glenn Wilson v The World (& others)
...

wow, you have a good understanding on what is going on.

however, i don't believe i am anyone's adversary in the GP thread. i try to be on the side of reality. i am against the personal attacks, though. but, much to my discredit, i do not think i have spoken up against it forcefully enough. the reason being i do not want to provoke the mods into acting. i would rather that reason win out.

 

[Luke Schmid]

I now believe my decision to post my concerns about rape in this thread was a mistake. I did not think it warrented a thread of its own but I was wrong. Sorry for taking this thread down the wrong path, I should have made a dedicated thread.

 

[Spider1964]

wow, you have a good understanding on what is going on.

however, i don't believe i am anyone's adversary in the GP thread. i try to be on the side of reality. i am against the personal attacks, though. but, much to my discredit, i do not think i have spoken up against it forcefully enough. the reason being i do not want to provoke the mods into acting. i would rather that reason win out.

All good GreGod my friend. My original post was tongue in cheek and in response to Zam Olyas and his contention that there was more arguing going on at the moment in the many forums that inhabit this site. Politics and Religion are always the most vociferously debated, here and in the real world. Although maybe the Lance debate would be making a run for second around here? Closely followed by the length of ones crank?

And Martin318, I think the mods do as good a job as is humanly possible with the many and varied 'personalities' (or in some posters case... multiple personalities!) that are prevalent on this site. I know that you are not fighting Krebs303 (and Kreb's303... keep the dream alive )

 

[gregod]

All good GreGod my friend. My original post was tongue in cheek and in response to Zam Olyas and his contention that there was more arguing going on at the moment in the many forums that inhabit this site. Politics and Religion are always the most vociferously debated, here and in the real world. Although maybe the Lance debate would be making a run for second around here? Closely followed by the length of ones crank?

And Martin318, I think the mods do as good a job as is humanly possible with the many and varied 'personalities' (or in some posters case... multiple personalities!) that are prevalent on this site. I know that you are not fighting Krebs303 (and Kreb's303... keep the dream alive )

in my judgement, lance wins again. it is amazing that he can be even more controversial than politics and religion.

certainly this debate is between one and one's significant other?

spider = one of the coolest car designs ever.
1964 = the year of the dragon and the tokyo olympiad.

 

[Martin318is]

I've deleted a few recent posts because they have strayed too far away from discussion of moderation on this site. As Luke Schmid says, the wider discussion around the word rape probably belongs in its own thread rather than this one. If I have the time I will try to unpick some of that and create a thread.

 

[gregod]

I've deleted a few recent posts because they have strayed too far away from discussion of moderation on this site. As Luke Schmid says, the wider discussion around the word rape probably belongs in its own thread rather than this one. If I have the time I will try to unpick some of that and create a thread.

freaked me out. i posted a response and then the original post was gone. was it really necessary to delete anything?

 

[Martin318is]

freaked me out. i posted a response and then the original post was gone. was it really necessary to delete anything?

Yep - unfortunately I needed to precisely because there is more than enough in those posts to turn this thread into something unusable.

for this thread to have value for everyone, it needs to remain concise and to the point so that when anyone - the mods in particular - views it, the issues are as clear as possible. that is why we try to avoid the jokes etc in this thread.

To be clear - the jokes themselves were fine, they just didnt belong here and I couldnt see the point in creating a thead to house them. If someone disagrees then I guess I can resurect them and do so (but.. meh).

 

[Martin318is]

I started to try to unpick the discussion of the word rape out of this thread into its own one but it is so heavily laced into the conversation about moderation that I lost energy and gave up.

Can we please try to stay on the moderation side of the issue in this thread and if its absolutely necessary create a seperate thread to continue any followup discussion regarding the severity of the word and words like it. (probably unnecessary given the above but still the option is there).

 

[gregod]

Yep - unfortunately I needed to precisely because there is more than enough in those posts to turn this thread into something unusable.

for this thread to have value for everyone, it needs to remain concise and to the point so that when anyone - the mods in particular - views it, the issues are as clear as possible. that is why we try to avoid the jokes etc in this thread.

To be clear - the jokes themselves were fine, they just didnt belong here and I couldnt see the point in creating a thead to house them. If someone disagrees then I guess I can resurect them and do so (but.. meh).

i understand. the posts don't really deserve a new thread. it just sucks when one takes the time to reply to someone and it just disappears. there must be a better way.

i just had an idea. if there are some posts that are replies to other posts go off topic and are not deserving of a new thread, would it be possible to redirect them as PMs to the correspondent? posts that are not directed to another user maybe could be redirected as a PM to the poster and she/he can decide whether or not to find an appropriate place for it.

 

[gregod]

I started to try to unpick the discussion of the word rape out of this thread into its own one but it is so heavily laced into the conversation about moderation that I lost energy and gave up.

Can we please try to stay on the moderation side of the issue in this thread and if its absolutely necessary create a seperate thread to continue any followup discussion regarding the severity of the word and words like it. (probably unnecessary given the above but still the option is there).

maybe i am being thick, but i thought the rape discussion was germane to this thread. viz, the discussion centered around whether or not the word should be subject to moderation.

 

[Martin318is]

i understand. the posts don't really deserve a new thread. it just sucks when one takes the time to reply to someone and it just disappears. there must be a better way.

i just had an idea. if there are some posts that are replies to other posts go off topic and are not deserving of a new thread, would it be possible to redirect them as PMs to the correspondent? posts that are not directed to another user maybe could be redirected as a PM to the poster and she/he can decide whether or not to find an appropriate place for it.

Intresting idea. I'll have a think about it over the weekend. Obviously this would work a lot better for the 'odd one or two' posts like that and would be impossible when people off the rails in a fast flowing thread for instance. non-the-less, I'll think about it.

 

[Martin318is]

maybe i am being thick, but i thought the rape discussion was germane to this thread. viz, the discussion centered around whether or not the word should be subject to moderation.

No, you are correct - sort of. What I saw happening was a split developing between two lines of conversation and the gap was widening. Essentially it comes down to

1) Is 'rape' an offensive word? - why, who by, whether its the word or references to the act, etc..

2) what the mods should do about it. - block the word, moderate based upon circumstances...etc

While its true that the answer to 2 is largely dependant upon the conclusion of 1, topic 1 is starting to have a life of its own. When people get to the point of geo-politic in discussing something, it needs its own location for the discussion because it has broken the banks of any conversation about moderation.

For instance, if you look at the section between ThoughtforFood and Maxiton you can see a lot of topic 1 and virtually no topic 2.

With all that said, the really interesting thing is that discussion of whether I am taking the right approach in this would be pretty much on topic in the Moderators thread.... weird, eh?

 

[gregod]

Intresting idea. I'll have a think about it over the weekend. Obviously this would work a lot better for the 'odd one or two' posts like that and would be impossible when people off the rails in a fast flowing thread for instance. non-the-less, I'll think about it.

cheers.

No, you are correct - sort of. What I saw happening was a split developing between two lines of conversation and the gap was widening. Essentially it comes down to

1) Is 'rape' an offensive word? - why, who by, whether its the word or references to the act, etc..

2) what the mods should do about it. - block the word, moderate based upon circumstances...etc

While its true that the answer to 2 is largely dependant upon the conclusion of 1, topic 1 is starting to have a life of its own. When people get to the point of geo-politic in discussing something, it needs its own location for the discussion because it has broken the banks of any conversation about moderation.

For instance, if you look at the section between ThoughtforFood and Maxiton you can see a lot of topic 1 and virtually no topic 2.

With all that said, the really interesting thing is that discussion of whether I am taking the right approach in this would be pretty much on topic in the Moderators thread.... weird, eh?

way too meta for my head.

 

[Luke Schmid]

Well my post opening the discussion belongs to 1 not 2 I guess. It was more to inform the moderators as to what was happening and generate discussion than to get the moderaters to do anything. If I wanted something to be done about it use I would have reported a specific post. Strictly speaking I don't think the posters who have used the word have done anything wrong, I just happen not to like it usage in that context and put forward that point of view.

 

[gregod]

Well my post opening the discussion belongs to 1 not 2 I guess. It was more to inform the moderators as to what was happening and generate discussion than to get the moderaters to do anything. If I wanted something to be done about it use I would have reported a specific post. Strictly speaking I don't think the posters who have used the word have done anything wrong, I just happen not to like it usage in that context and put forward that point of view.

just to further the discussion: what about using the word "kill" for defeat as someone brought up earlier? most people would agree that "kill" is worse than "rape". yet, everyone knows this is not literal. perhaps the difference is "kill" is not very specific while "rape" conjures up definite images of violence. on the other hand, "crush" is also used as a synonym for defeat and it is specific. what, if anything, makes rape different?

i don't want to orphan this topic, so perhaps it would be good to move to this forum blows. quote this and click on the link and we can continue this there if you are interested.

 

[Luke Schmid]

just to further the discussion: what about using the word "kill" for defeat as someone brought up earlier? most people would agree that "kill" is worse than "rape". yet, everyone knows this is not literal. perhaps the difference is "kill" is not very specific while "rape" conjures up definite images of violence. on the other hand, "crush" is also used as a synonym for defeat and it is specific. what, if anything, makes rape different?

i don't want to orphan this topic, so perhaps it would be good to move to this forum blows. quote this and click on the link and we can continue this there if you are interested.

I have answered.

 

[Zam_Olyas]

None of the contests rival Rocky Balboa v Clubber Lang, but here's my take on the main combatants ATM -

Thread with their Combatants
Quadafi's death The Hitch v Ramjambunath (& others)
General Politics rhubroma v ScottSoCal v RedTreviso v GreGod v sheesh v Glenn Wilson v The World (& others)
Lance Armstrong Polish v RaceRadio, CimaCoppi49, The World (& others) FFS bring on the indictments!
Crank Length FrankDay v CoachFergie (Probably my personal favourite... these guys just keep bashing the sh!t out of each other with no end in sight, world wars have lesser time frames)
Babes on Bikes Krebs303 v The Mods. Go Krebs… fight the good fight.
Any thread that mentions a Columbian RyoHazuki v Everyone including aliens and a previously unknown race of pygmies in the Amazon rainforest who wish to argue just because.
Any Thread that mentions Cadel ACF94 v The World
109 clenbuterol positives in U17 football WC
Dr Maserati v Python (See Crank Length Thread above, these guys have settled in for the long haul!)

We indeed live in interesting times.

Mine too. history channel should make a documentary about it.