Motor doping thread

[jens_attacks]

Re: Re:

if that wasn't a motor, i don't know what it was.

It looks to me like someone trying to mount a bike in the rain on a descent after a crash.

who would do something so crazy?

neah, motor i tell ya

 

[sniper]

Re:

Look at all you physicists.

if a physicist is "a person who uses his eyes, connects the visual input with a quarter of his/her brain, and subsequently makes assumptions drawing on his/her limited experience of the world as stored in that same quarter of a brain", then call me one!

 

[sniper]

Re: Re:

if that wasn't a motor, i don't know what it was.

It looks to me like someone trying to mount a bike in the rain on a descent after a crash.

who would do something so crazy?

after a century of procycling, here we finally have our second contender in the category "procyclists who try but don't manage to mount bike because bike moves quicker than they do".
Hesjedal going for gold.

 

[thehog]

Re: Re:

if that wasn't a motor, i don't know what it was.

It looks to me like someone trying to mount a bike in the rain on a descent after a crash.

who would do something so crazy?

after a century of procycling, here we finally have our second contender in the category "procyclists who try but don't manage to mount bike because bike moves quicker than they do".
Hesjedal going for gold.

It's my understanding that these cyclists are upset that their bikes have been doping without their knowledge

 

[Maxiton]

Re: Re:

if that wasn't a motor, i don't know what it was.

It looks to me like someone trying to mount a bike in the rain on a descent after a crash.

who would do something so crazy?

after a century of procycling, here we finally have our second contender in the category "procyclists who try but don't manage to mount bike because bike moves quicker than they do".
Hesjedal going for gold.

Exactly. Not the kind of bike handling you'd expect from a pro - not even Rasmussen, say. Could be perfectly innocent, though. That's the problem.

We don't know. We should have utter certainty that no rider is using a motor. So why don't we?

And what's more foolish, to see a motor where there is none; or to see no motor when one is being used?

 

[Freddythefrog]

Re: Re:

https://mobile.twitter.com/danslamusette/status/656092805891276800

These guys are making a fool of us for just watching their freak show.

Pretty much, yeah.

+1

They will have us believe that the demon, evil, genius leading the whole pack in the use of electric motors was a Belgian teenager and her parakeet stealing family.

"........honestly, we never knew it was possible to do such things. I am shocked, I am truly shocked."

Gulping air and trying to keep a straight face whilst asking the next question ...."Tell me Mr, sorry Sir David, are you more or less shocked than when you found out that Lance had doped to 7 Tour wins and tell me, as well, just how big is the your budget you commit to technological investigation and improvements, Sir David Brailsford ?"

 

[sniper]

maxiton & ftf well said

 

[roundabout]

Re:

Look at all you physicists.

This thread is turning into a cycling version of this

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/236x/db/8f/3c/db8f3c918b805dcd2ee1cf91aaceb5c6.jpg

 

[Cloxxki]

If it wasn't posted yet, scroll to #10 for the short clip version http://www.upcoming.nl/zwoebe/8274/de-10-grootste-ergernissen-van-wielrenners

 

[Metabolol]

Yeah, could be a motor. I remember watching that live on TV but didn't connect the dots at the time.

 

[dwyatt]

The only way forward now is to fit the same motors/ batteries to all bikes and let them use them during the race as they please. Should really make the racing tatical.

 

[Cloxxki]

Re:

The only way forward now is to fit the same motors/ batteries to all bikes and let them use them during the race as they please. Should really make the racing tatical.

Yeah, we heard such voices with doping. Perhaps brand cup races in autosport are something for you.

 

[dwyatt]

Re: Re:

The only way forward now is to fit the same motors/ batteries to all bikes and let them use them during the race as they please. Should really make the racing tatical.

Yeah, we heard such voices with doping. Perhaps brand cup races in autosport are something for you.

It was meant as a joke, however at least with motors no-one is risking their health

To be honest i am very worried, even if they somehow stop this in pro-cycling, how about amateur catagories etc - they won't have xray machines and radio signal detectors etc. I think this could wreck cycling as a sport far more than doping ever did.

 

[MarkvW]

Re: Re:

The only way forward now is to fit the same motors/ batteries to all bikes and let them use them during the race as they please. Should really make the racing tatical.

Yeah, we heard such voices with doping. Perhaps brand cup races in autosport are something for you.

It was meant as a joke, however at least with motors no-one is risking their health

To be honest i am very worried, even if they somehow stop this in pro-cycling, how about amateur catagories etc - they won't have xray machines and radio signal detectors etc. I think this could wreck cycling as a sport far more than doping ever did.

I'd suggest outlawing batteries and battery-type devices on the rider and the bicycle. Any EM signature, and boom, a ban. It would also make the races a lot more interesting.

 

[doperhopper]

How about motorized rear derailleur? Two little wheels to be micromotorized, batteries already there in electronic groupsets, just add some power bottle from the car... even as little as 20 watts in critical situations would be quite a marginal gain.

 

[blackcat]

Re: Re:

Exactly. Not the kind of bike handling you'd expect from a pro - not even Rasmussen, say. Could be perfectly innocent, though. That's the problem.

We don't know. We should have utter certainty that no rider is using a motor. So why don't we?

And what's more foolish, to see a motor where there is none; or to see no motor when one is being used?

such acuity

 

[blackcat]

parakeets > motor-doping

 

[Maxiton]

Re: Re:

Exactly. Not the kind of bike handling you'd expect from a pro - not even Rasmussen, say. Could be perfectly innocent, though. That's the problem.

We don't know. We should have utter certainty that no rider is using a motor. So why don't we?

And what's more foolish, to see a motor where there is none; or to see no motor when one is being used?

such acuity

What?

 

[blackcat]

Re: Re:

Exactly. Not the kind of bike handling you'd expect from a pro - not even Rasmussen, say. Could be perfectly innocent, though. That's the problem.

We don't know. We should have utter certainty that no rider is using a motor. So why don't we?

And what's more foolish, to see a motor where there is none; or to see no motor when one is being used?

such acuity

What?

good post

 

[blackcat]

it was a good post, the forum software does not allow one to "like" a post

 

[GJB123]

Re: Re:

https://mobile.twitter.com/danslamusette/status/656092805891276800

These guys are making a fool of us for just watching their freak show.

Pretty much, yeah.

if that wasn't a motor, i don't know what it was.

I don't see the crank turning and I thought we had covered the fact that hub-motors are very visible.

 

[Merckx index]

Re: Re:

It was meant as a joke, however at least with motors no-one is risking their health

Actually, they can be very dangerous. It's been pointed out that when the bottom bracket is opened to insert the motor, then resealed, it's structurally weakened, and is at risk for breaking during the race and causing a horrific accident.

 

[sniper]

Re: Re:

...
I don't see the crank turning and I thought we had covered the fact that hub-motors are very visible.

we had.
but we've also covered the fact that a host of alternative wheel-based systems have become available in recent years. With sky's budget you'll agree nothing is beyond reach.
The fact that we didn't know how Lance cheated, didn't mean he wasn't cheating.

That said, i agree that this bit of footage is not very compelling. But as maxiton and others have pointed out, the state of the sport is such that suspicion is totally warranted.
"Better to see a motor when there isn't one, then to not see a motor when there is one."
(i think i'm quoting maxiton here)

It was meant as a joke, however at least with motors no-one is risking their health

Actually, they can be very dangerous. It's been pointed out that when the bottom bracket is opened to insert the motor, then resealed, it's structurally weakened, and is at risk for breaking during the race and causing a horrific accident.

correct me if wrong: the fact that this hasn't happened yet I think can be taken to suggest two things:
1. (hubbased) motordoping isn't very widespread (yet)
2. the peloton has already moved on from hub-based systems or has found alternative ways to hide them

 

[Cloxxki]

Re: Re:

Yes, such as the available rim systems. And innovative teams don't need an over the counter solution. Never to find legal marginal gains, so why wait for illegal over the counter ones? Those hardly provide an edge over others. As in doping, it's about how much performance you can steal without being detected.

 

[VO2 Max]

Re: Re:

correct me if wrong: the fact that this hasn't happened yet I think can be taken to suggest two things:
1. (hubbased) motordoping isn't very widespread (yet)
2. the peloton has already moved on from hub-based systems or has found alternative ways to hide them

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dDJMrBP7QNY Rounder wheels!

Hub-doping that wouldn't require opening up the frame is easily imaginable. For example a well-designed gearing system between vertical actuator and horizontally-spinning bottom bracket should let you install the latter in the normal way (think of a cartridge-style rather than external cups) then press the actuator down onto it. Needs a freehub in there somewhere to stop it resisting normal pedalling but all doable.