Teams & Riders Nairo Quintana discussion thread

[Elos Anjos]

He has lost a lot of credit for me. First when he was caugh with a substance proven to improve performance, and not legal, and second when he said it has a contract with a World Tour team for 2023.

Tramadol doesn't improve performance.

 

[Bolder]

Tramadol doesn't improve performance.

It does if the alternative is not starting the stage due to pain!

 

[staubsauger]

Remember when Fuglsang rode on with a broken scaphoid and elbow, because Loulou had just given birth and he couldn't call it quits and go home with mere pain.

 

[fmk_RoI]

he couldn't sign for Ineos and several teams have zero tolerance policies now couldn't sign him either

Ineos' ZTP had a lot of escape clauses in it.

What other teams are you saying have ZTPs?

 

[Monte Serra]

Corratec manager denies that Quintana will sign for his team:

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1616137544122368005

View: https://twitter.com/inrng/status/1616137544122368005

 

[Elos Anjos]

Jesus Quintana (I don't mean the Big Lebowski one).

 

[tobydawq]

Remember when Fuglsang rode on with a broken scaphoid and elbow, because Loulou had just given birth and he couldn't call it quits and go home with mere pain.

Fuglsang's wife having the same name as Alaphilippe's nickname never stops confusing me.

 

[Sciatic]

Fuglsang's wife having the same name as Alaphilippe's nickname never stops confusing me.

Ha! Not as confuses as me—I though he was referring to Luis Leon, but I guess he’s Lulu?

 

[staubsauger]

Corratec manager denies that Quintana will sign for his team:

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1616137544122368005

View: https://twitter.com/inrng/status/1616137544122368005

Frankly it's getting a bit comical for Quintana!

 

[Escarabajo]

Well, Pellizotti didn't manage to crack the top 10 at the Giro d'Italia when he rode for Androni Giocattoli. And his Achilles verse always was his recovery. Except in 2008 & 2009 for well known reasons.

If Quintana was European or a young talent like Rujano & Co back in the day I would agree with you. But Quintana is Colombian and 33. His prime career is actually behind him. Corratec isn't Androni Giocattoli either.

The South American race circuit actually is the only meaningful local one outside of Europe. Does a major Colombian team really pay less than a small European one? Vuelta a Colombia should be the 4th most meaningful race or grand tour for him after the Giro d'Italia, Tour de France and Vuelta a Espana.

Quintana already won the Giro d'Italia & Vuelta a Espana. He's not going to win the Tour de France anymore. Neither is he going on until his 40 like Valverde, Rebellin, Sevilla, Rujano or Cardenas with his knee issues.

What's the deal for someone that's 33 and and a former GT winner to ride for an 8-15th spot in the 2023 Giro d'Italia? I certainly would have taken the contract offer by Medellin and tried to win the Vuelta a Colombia like my big idol Lucho Herrera. Or signed up for Savio to focus on Tachira & Colombia.

If he's a former winner of the 2014 Giro d'Italia, 2016 Vuelta a Espana and 2023 Vuelta a Colombia that's a recognizable palmares.

Noone going to give a *** Quintana places 7th at the 2023 Giro d'Italia instead.

Quinatna's best days are behind, that is correct, but Pellizotti was nowhere near Quintana's level.

 

[Escarabajo]

Corratec manager denies that Quintana will sign for his team:

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1616137544122368005

View: https://twitter.com/inrng/status/1616137544122368005

What budget?. I don't think he is asking for much. I heavily doubt that Quintana is asking for much at this moment. And I don't think that the Giro is concerned about having Quintana on his race as the Tour is. So what MPCC rules? I thought he was clear to race. Making a big deal of it.

 

[fmk_RoI]

So what MPCC rules?

MPCC have a rule against Tramadol. Quintana was caught using Tramadol. Twice.

 

[Escarabajo]

MPCC have a rule against Tramadol. Quintana was caught using Tramadol. Twice.

I know that. But didn't he het punished for that? otherwise what are the rules for? depends on the rider or what?
I have seen many riders come back to racing after completing their doping time to the WT level. Otherwise make a different rule. If you don't want to sign him just say so and be done with it!

 

[fmk_RoI]

I know that. But didn't he het punished for that?

1. It's as much an issue of optics as rules;
2. MPCC rules allow for extra punishment above and beyond what the UCI/relevant ADA imposes

 

[samhocking]

Ineos' ZTP had a lot of escape clauses in it.

What other teams are you saying have ZTPs?

Bahrain-Merida drops Kanstantsin Siutsou for AAF - Cyclist
Siustsou's team Bahrain-Merida have also confirmed that they have suspended the rider in 'accordance with our zero-tolerance policy' and have notified the ...

Samuel Sanchez provisionally suspended for adverse doping ...
BMC Racing reiterate zero tolerance policy
'In accordance with BMC Racing Team's zero tolerance policy and UCI regulation, Sánchez has been provisionally suspended with immediate effect. 'Until the results of the B sample are provided, no further action will be taken.

I'm sure plenty of teams have zero-tolerance policies to various extents compared to the recent past even if not publically shouted about or known explicitly like Ineos's. e.g. it's highly unusual for a sanctioned rider from a World Tour level team to return to World Tour team now. There's certainly not many riders springing to mind and if we take Aderlass those still racing quit the sport. Can we imagine someone like Stefan Denifl returning to World Tour after his 4 year suspension ends this June?

Obviously, at the MPCC level their rules include a zero-tolerance policy anyway because an MPCC member team can't hire anyone with a positive test in the last 2 years if their sanction was 6 months or more. We also see more indirect zero-tolerance such as when Sam Bennett was essentially withdrawn from racing by Lefevre who gave the reason he went outside the teams rules and used a private Dr in Monaco without the teams knowledge. I'd imagine nearly every World Tour team has such team policy. It was quite unusual to hear Quintana allowed to bring his own Dr in just for Le Tour last year. At least riders like Nibali would employ his personal Dr and he would be staff in the teams he signed for including at Astana.

 

[hfer07]

Time is running out for Nairo
At this point is all about getting a team -any team- so he can at least earn points this year and perhaps next season get to be back on a CT or a WT team.
quite worrying TBH

 

[staubsauger]

Quintana should've called Gianni the Savior weeks ago.

 

[Roku]

Forget about Coppi and Bartali, ultramythical battle on Vuelta a Colombia between Nairoman and Superman incoming.

 

[Elos Anjos]

His days are over and he didn't go down in the most elegant of ways.

 

[Scarponi]

Insane how riders like Basso, Valverde , Di Luca etc got second chances but he can’t with Tramadol

 

[samhocking]

I don't think Nairo will find another team, not at the international level. Everyone lost their marbles so much about alleged Tramadol use in Sky and that's when it wasn't even prohibited so Nairo is imo not employable now given the perspective the teams have due to public perception of that particular pain killer. It's like TUEs, riders state they prefer not to race than get one and it becomes public and deal with the fall out even though the TUE system clearly exists to be used otherwise it wouldn't exist.

 

[samhocking]

Insane how riders like Basso, Valverde , Di Luca etc got second chances but he can’t with Tramadol

Different era and attitudes in the team managements now, those days are gone at a team level.

 

[Ricco']

For me, the problem with Nairo is that it seems he burned too many bridges. He didn't have the most clean exit from Movistar regarding his relation to the team and even in Arkéa he didn't left in the best terms. He doesn't seem to be the easiest guy to connect to in a team environment, specially if it's a team without a big presence of spanish speaking riders and staff.

Add to that his apparent decline and the fact that he had a whole entourage that he may have wanted to take with him for too long (Dayer and Anacona only found a local team in Colombia last week) and he may have been asking for too much in a period where teams had the upper hand because many spots were already closed.

 

[Devil's Elbow]

Insane how riders like Basso, Valverde , Di Luca etc got second chances but he can’t with Tramadol

Pretty sure the last rider to return to PCT level or above after any sort of doping sanction remains Simon Yates, which is 6.5 years ago. There's a case to be made that the riders you list got off too easily, but the fact that freaking Tramadol is now a death sentence for a career tells us that zero tolerance is going too far. And made even worse by the fact that a fair few of the team managers not willing to take him on have been caught with bigger violations.

Unless there's something going on we don't know about, of course.

 

[Ricco']

Pretty sure the last rider to return to PCT level or above after any sort of doping sanction remains Simon Yates, which is 6.5 years ago. There's a case to be made that the riders you list got off too easily, but the fact that freaking Tramadol is now a death sentence for a career tells us that zero tolerance is going too far. And made even worse by the fact that a fair few of the team managers not willing to take him on have been caught with bigger violations.

Unless there's something going on we don't know about, of course.

I don't know if that's a decisive point because, to be honest, we don't have in the last years many cases of high or medium level riders who are caught on World Tour teams that even in normal conditions would deserve a place there.

The most well-known riders who have been caught since 2016 are Yates (WT rider), Sanchez, Brajkovic, Di Gregorio, Taborre, Pirazzi, Rosón, Preidler and Denifl. Apart from Yates, the first three were already retired or on a strong path of career decline, Taborre and Pirazzi were pro conti italian riders and I don't think Preidler and Denifl have already been cleared of their suspension. Roson is 30 already and imo, he didn't show much to deserve a place back in WT level after 4 years without racing.

But this is maybe a topic for another part of this forum. The thing is we don't have cases of high level riders been caught to test the team's zero tolerance policy. Of the previous list, only Yates deserved a place back on a WT team, and he is there.