Teams & Riders Nairo Quintana discussion thread

[ray j willings]

Re:

Im satisfied with yesterday's performance cuz he at least tired Froome a bit and thats what Nairo needs for final week.OTOH It still will be extremely difficult to get those 3 minutes.

Note to those who say Froome is better climber...you will look like fool after few days, I think its clearly visible now that Quintana is getting into a top form and will climb better than Froome when in top form.

To that guy who said best climber is about results than LMAO as its about proving yourself with great moments and great numbers.Its like saying Armstrong was a better climber than Pantani cuz he won more Tours lol

"satisfied with yesterday's performance cuz he at least tired Froome a bit "

But Quintana somehow used less energy ? How exactly did he do that?
So all those beatings that Froome as given Quintana are part of the plan Lose 3 minutes is the way to win

Qunitana is not good enough right now. He needs to step up. Lets up the roles reverse but for now Froome is stronger.

And unless he does step up " I hope he does" he's not on the same level as Andy Schleck. Andy went mano v mano with the very best and proved himself one of the great climbers. Quintana has work to do.

 

[Mr.White]

Valverde: “I and my team are working to win the Tour with Quintana, but if I make the podium it would be incredible.”

Instead of working to win the Tour, they're thinking of making podiums. The loser mentality syndrome by Team Movistar

Alejandro Valverde and Eusebio Unzue (aka Movistar) won just way too much to be called loosers!

 

[Angliru]

Valverde: “I and my team are working to win the Tour with Quintana, but if I make the podium it would be incredible.”

Instead of working to win the Tour, they're thinking of making podiums. The loser mentality syndrome by Team Movistar

In just one sentence your reading comprehension is non-existent. What is your problem?

 

[cineteq]

Valverde: “I and my team are working to win the Tour with Quintana, but if I make the podium it would be incredible.”

Instead of working to win the Tour, they're thinking of making podiums. The loser mentality syndrome by Team Movistar

In just one sentence your reading comprehension is non-existent. What is your problem?

No problem there. I know Alejandro, actions speak louder than words.

 

[Fernandez]

Valverde: “I and my team are working to win the Tour with Quintana, but if I make the podium it would be incredible.”

Instead of working to win the Tour, they're thinking of making podiums. The loser mentality syndrome by Team Movistar

In just one sentence your reading comprehension is non-existent. What is your problem?

No problem there. I know Alejandro, actions speak louder than words.

Valverde is thinking in reaching the podium by helping Quintana. Quintana is thinking in getting time on Froome, I dont have a dude about that.

 

[hfer07]

Re: Re:

Quintana kind a remind me of Andy Schleck.. A young climber, who is one of the best at a very young age, but never really improve his climbing skills very much. I still don't think Quintana has become better since Tour 2013.

FYI Quintana has already won a GT & multiple single/weekly stage races at the age that A Schleck could barely pedal. Please get informed

I also don't like Schleck, but at the age Andy was 2nd in the Giro, Quintana's best result was the KOM in Catalunya

Perhaps I should have been more specific- I meant Quintanita at his current age.
but nonetheless - point well taken Netserk & thanks for the observation Cheers

 

[hfer07]

now going back to the topic - and Valverde

I currently don't find any conflict at all between Valverde's aspirations & Nairito's goal- there are two different things. I also like to highlight the superb job that Valverde is doing for Nairito so far, and how he's playing tactics to break the Sky train, to force them to chase & even to sprint in order to prevent the Alien to get seconds on Nairito- so i'm cool with his quote.

 

[Arredondo]

now going back to the topic - and Valverde

I currently don't find any conflict at all between Valverde's aspirations & Nairito's goal- there are two different things. I also like to highlight the superb job that Valverde is doing for Nairito so far, and how he's playing tactics to break the Sky train, to force them to chase & even to sprint in order to prevent the Alien to get seconds on Nairito- so i'm cool with his quote.

Well, Bala is hardly doing any tactics to break the Sky train. He put in some small attacks on Pierre Saint Martin and Plateau de Beille, but with reserve. He just rides for himself. And that's completely logical and acceptable imo. The guy won LBL and FW this season, and is the number 1 on the WT-ranking. He sees there is a chance of finally achieving that podium spot. He never thought that after last years disaster.

A big champion like Valverde has to ride for himself. That's why he's hardly doing anything for Quintana, or to break Froome. And don't expect a long range attack (let's say on Allos, Glandon or Croix de Fer) in order to put Froome under pressure in favour of Quintana and thereby screwing his podium chances.

 

[capuldemetal]

http://t.co/H61Guo4SAM huh!

 

[ray j willings]

now going back to the topic - and Valverde

I currently don't find any conflict at all between Valverde's aspirations & Nairito's goal- there are two different things. I also like to highlight the superb job that Valverde is doing for Nairito so far, and how he's playing tactics to break the Sky train, to force them to chase & even to sprint in order to prevent the Alien to get seconds on Nairito- so i'm cool with his quote.

Well, Bala is hardly doing any tactics to break the Sky train. He put in some small attacks on Pierre Saint Martin and Plateau de Beille, but with reserve. He just rides for himself. And that's completely logical and acceptable imo. The guy won LBL and FW this season, and is the number 1 on the WT-ranking. He sees there is a chance of finally achieving that podium spot. He never thought that after last years disaster.

A big champion like Valverde has to ride for himself. That's why he's hardly doing anything for Quintana, or to break Froome. And don't expect a long range attack (let's say on Allos, Glandon or Croix de Fer) in order to put Froome under pressure in favour of Quintana and thereby screwing his podium chances.

"That's why he's hardly doing anything for Quintana"

Are you watching this race or are you playing pro cycling manager on the PlayStation.

 

[cellardoor]

To be honest, if Quintana is going to win this race, it's going to be by climbing faster than Froome in the Alps. He's a pure climber, if he can't do that it was always unlikely he'd win the Tour. The team don't need to crack the Sky train, he just needs to attack and then climb at a speed that forces Froome to go it alone and, again, if he can't climb faster than G and Porte then he doesn't have the climbing form to win anyway. Any forays off the front by Valverde are a waste of time as Froome isn't interested in him and Valverde, whilst in decent form, is not really showing signs of being able to do much other than hang in and sprint for seconds. They should just let Valverde ride his own race for the podium now and see if Quintana can drop Froome on the remaining stages.

 

[ray j willings]

Re:

To be honest, if Quintana is going to win this race, it's going to be by climbing faster than Froome in the Alps. He's a pure climber, if he can't do that it was always unlikely he'd win the Tour. The team don't need to crack the Sky train, he just needs to attack and then climb at a speed that forces Froome to go it alone and, again, if he can't climb faster than G and Porte then he doesn't have the climbing form to win anyway. Any forays off the front by Valverde are a waste of time as Froome isn't interested in him and Valverde, whilst in decent form, is not really showing signs of being able to do much other than hang in and sprint for seconds. They should just let Valverde ride his own race for the podium now and see if Quintana can drop Froome on the remaining stages.

I agree. Let Valverde off the leash. Who knows what might happen ,long attacks etc etc.
Your spot on. It all comes down to Quintana defeating Froome, all those digs attacks Valverde has put in have done nothing for Quintana and made no impact on Froome . In fact Valverde would be higher placed if he rode for himself.

 

[Tonton]

Clearly, only Quintana can beat Froome. Hopefully, he'll peak in the Alps. That's quite a time deficit to overcome, though. And he can't wait until 5Ks to go to launch an attack. In response to hfer07's post, yes, there may be a conflict, as in PdB, when Quintana attacked. Valverde didn't wait enough, bridged the gap and Froome used him to come back. Valverde should have delayed his attack on Froome IMO. When he sees TJVG and/or Contador struggling, it will be hard for him to stay a bit patient. That's a conflict.

 

[Mr.White]

Re:

To be honest, if Quintana is going to win this race, it's going to be by climbing faster than Froome in the Alps. He's a pure climber, if he can't do that it was always unlikely he'd win the Tour. The team don't need to crack the Sky train, he just needs to attack and then climb at a speed that forces Froome to go it alone and, again, if he can't climb faster than G and Porte then he doesn't have the climbing form to win anyway. Any forays off the front by Valverde are a waste of time as Froome isn't interested in him and Valverde, whilst in decent form, is not really showing signs of being able to do much other than hang in and sprint for seconds. They should just let Valverde ride his own race for the podium now and see if Quintana can drop Froome on the remaining stages.

It might come just to pure strength, you're maybe right. But, you never know, things might get complicated and presence of a teammate may be crucial. Valverde is stronger than Porte and Thomas, and will be especially in the 3rd week. And when the opportunity arises having him by your side might be big advantage. He can tire Froome, you're not right that Froome isn't interested in him, he marked every move of Valverde. He can attack on the descents, Froome will be in big trouble if isolated. He can make alliances, imagine him and Nibali on the Allos descent, nobody would catch them in a million years. There's many ways he could be helpful...

Of course, as you said, it could just come to pure strength in the mountains.

 

[hfer07]

now going back to the topic - and Valverde

I currently don't find any conflict at all between Valverde's aspirations & Nairito's goal- there are two different things. I also like to highlight the superb job that Valverde is doing for Nairito so far, and how he's playing tactics to break the Sky train, to force them to chase & even to sprint in order to prevent the Alien to get seconds on Nairito- so i'm cool with his quote.

Well, Bala is hardly doing any tactics to break the Sky train. He put in some small attacks on Pierre Saint Martin and Plateau de Beille, but with reserve. He just rides for himself. And that's completely logical and acceptable imo. The guy won LBL and FW this season, and is the number 1 on the WT-ranking. He sees there is a chance of finally achieving that podium spot. He never thought that after last years disaster.

A big champion like Valverde has to ride for himself. That's why he's hardly doing anything for Quintana, or to break Froome. And don't expect a long range attack (let's say on Allos, Glandon or Croix de Fer) in order to put Froome under pressure in favour of Quintana and thereby screwing his podium chances.

check once more those two words you wrote: "with reserve"
If Vala was riding his very own race discarding Quintana's leadership-then he could have gone for stage wins very early & attacked without stopping to check on Nairito....

Everything else I completely agree with you-in addition to that- I truly believe Unzué would cream his pants having Alejandro on the podium

 

[Mr.White]

Clearly, only Quintana can beat Froome. Hopefully, he'll peak in the Alps. That's quite a time deficit to overcome, though. And he can't wait until 5Ks to go to launch an attack. In response to hfer07's post, yes, there may be a conflict, as in PdB, when Quintana attacked. Valverde didn't wait enough, bridged the gap and Froome used him to come back. Valverde should have delayed his attack on Froome IMO. When he sees TJVG and/or Contador struggling, it will be hard for him to stay a bit patient. That's a conflict.

Don't know what you're talking about, I didn't saw that. Could you please tell when exactly this happened?

 

[BlurryVII]

Re:

Luckily, Froome really wants to win Alpe d'Huez wearing the yellow jersey. Nibali, Quintana, Contador will all want to go all out on that stage too, as they did at the very fist MTF, which Froome utterly dominated. If he dominates the first MTF and wins the last, there is absolutely no doubt as to who the best climber in the race (and hence the world) is.

What ? It's pretty easy to say that when Contador is in sh,it form. Reverse the roles, send Froome and Quintana to do the double and you have Contador crushing everyone at the Tour.

Quintana shouldn't even be in the debate, he is the only one performing at his level and he is getting crushed. He is just inferior, Contador would eat him in top form .

He just isn't explosive enough, and his climbing pace doesn't make up for that, he isn't robobasso. Andy Schleck 09 / 10' is a also a much better climber. It's just ridiculous how this guy is overrated.

 

[Gigs_98]

Re:

To be honest, if Quintana is going to win this race, it's going to be by climbing faster than Froome in the Alps. He's a pure climber, if he can't do that it was always unlikely he'd win the Tour. The team don't need to crack the Sky train, he just needs to attack and then climb at a speed that forces Froome to go it alone and, again, if he can't climb faster than G and Porte then he doesn't have the climbing form to win anyway. Any forays off the front by Valverde are a waste of time as Froome isn't interested in him and Valverde, whilst in decent form, is not really showing signs of being able to do much other than hang in and sprint for seconds. They should just let Valverde ride his own race for the podium now and see if Quintana can drop Froome on the remaining stages.

Sorry but thats nonsense. Quintana just has to be stronger than froome and he doesn't have to crack the sky train? You might have forgotten it but NQ is 3 MINUTES down on froome. Do you think Quintna can take this time on froome on only 3 mtf's (and one of those is only 2nd category) without any big move by him or moviestar? The sky train has to be cracked because otherwise (for example) if he attacks at the bottom of the alp and has to climb all the way up on his own froome will use G and P and make a MTT up there. If you think quintna can pull out much time in this circumstances you are just naive.

 

[Arredondo]

now going back to the topic - and Valverde

I currently don't find any conflict at all between Valverde's aspirations & Nairito's goal- there are two different things. I also like to highlight the superb job that Valverde is doing for Nairito so far, and how he's playing tactics to break the Sky train, to force them to chase & even to sprint in order to prevent the Alien to get seconds on Nairito- so i'm cool with his quote.

Well, Bala is hardly doing any tactics to break the Sky train. He put in some small attacks on Pierre Saint Martin and Plateau de Beille, but with reserve. He just rides for himself. And that's completely logical and acceptable imo. The guy won LBL and FW this season, and is the number 1 on the WT-ranking. He sees there is a chance of finally achieving that podium spot. He never thought that after last years disaster.

A big champion like Valverde has to ride for himself. That's why he's hardly doing anything for Quintana, or to break Froome. And don't expect a long range attack (let's say on Allos, Glandon or Croix de Fer) in order to put Froome under pressure in favour of Quintana and thereby screwing his podium chances.

check once more those two words you wrote: "with reserve"
If Vala was riding his very own race discarding Quintana's leadership-then he could have gone for stage wins very early & attacked without stopping to check on Nairito....

Everything else I completely agree with you-in addition to that- I truly believe Unzué would cream his pants having Alejandro on the podium

That would be suicide for Bala. He's not the guy to attack from 10 km out and holding off Froome. He just has to follow the best and doing a really strong last km.

 

[ray j willings]

And get 30 seconds That's not enough and he wont gap Froome on every stage. He needs to kick ass like he did earlier in the year when he dropped Bertie.

Quintana needs to go for Victory or nothing.

 

[ILovecycling]

Re: Re:

To be honest, if Quintana is going to win this race, it's going to be by climbing faster than Froome in the Alps. He's a pure climber, if he can't do that it was always unlikely he'd win the Tour. The team don't need to crack the Sky train, he just needs to attack and then climb at a speed that forces Froome to go it alone and, again, if he can't climb faster than G and Porte then he doesn't have the climbing form to win anyway. Any forays off the front by Valverde are a waste of time as Froome isn't interested in him and Valverde, whilst in decent form, is not really showing signs of being able to do much other than hang in and sprint for seconds. They should just let Valverde ride his own race for the podium now and see if Quintana can drop Froome on the remaining stages.

Sorry but thats nonsense. Quintana just has to be stronger than froome and he doesn't have to crack the sky train? You might have forgotten it but NQ is 3 MINUTES down on froome. Do you think Quintna can take this time on froome on only 3 mtf's (and one of those is only 2nd category) without any big move by him or moviestar? The sky train has to be cracked because otherwise (for example) if he attacks at the bottom of the alp and has to climb all the way up on his own froome will use G and P and make a MTT up there. If you think quintna can pull out much time in this circumstances you are just naive.

Very good post, I agree.Of course those risky attacks will depend how much better (or not) will be Quintana in the 3rd week and how much worse (or not) will be Froome.

But I think they should go for it pretty hard on the very first alpine stage.

 

[Mr.White]

now going back to the topic - and Valverde

I currently don't find any conflict at all between Valverde's aspirations & Nairito's goal- there are two different things. I also like to highlight the superb job that Valverde is doing for Nairito so far, and how he's playing tactics to break the Sky train, to force them to chase & even to sprint in order to prevent the Alien to get seconds on Nairito- so i'm cool with his quote.

Well, Bala is hardly doing any tactics to break the Sky train. He put in some small attacks on Pierre Saint Martin and Plateau de Beille, but with reserve. He just rides for himself. And that's completely logical and acceptable imo. The guy won LBL and FW this season, and is the number 1 on the WT-ranking. He sees there is a chance of finally achieving that podium spot. He never thought that after last years disaster.

A big champion like Valverde has to ride for himself. That's why he's hardly doing anything for Quintana, or to break Froome. And don't expect a long range attack (let's say on Allos, Glandon or Croix de Fer) in order to put Froome under pressure in favour of Quintana and thereby screwing his podium chances.

check once more those two words you wrote: "with reserve"
If Vala was riding his very own race discarding Quintana's leadership-then he could have gone for stage wins very early & attacked without stopping to check on Nairito....

Everything else I completely agree with you-in addition to that- I truly believe Unzué would cream his pants having Alejandro on the podium

That would be suicide for Bala. He's not the guy to attack from 10 km out and holding off Froome. He just has to follow the best and doing a really strong last km.

Yet I saw him many times attacking from 10,20,30 km or even more, little confusing..

 

[ray j willings]

If Quintana wants to win he has to throw caution away. 3 minutes to Froome is a lot of time if he leaves it to the end of each mountain stage I doubt very much he will get that time back.
In reality, if he can get some time back before the Alp's a minute at least, then Froome will be under pressure. Then he has a chance for a big attack in the alps. I think Froome will have a bad day but you have to attack him to find out. If he's sitting there sucking Sky wheels and no one has the balls to attack then the tour will be lost without even trying " in fear" Froome only can loose. Quintana maybe Bertie " a long one" can only win if they try something and don't get mentally worked over by the Sky train.

 

[SeriousSam]

Quintana is very unlikely to win the Tour, but will he have the dubious pleasure of being the strongest climber of the Tour without winning it? Thus far, Froome has equaled or beat him on every occasion.

By my count, he lost 11 seconds at MdH, 63 seconds at PTM and 1 second after the Mende climb for a total of 75 seconds.

If he can gain more than 75 seconds in the Alps through climbing, he would be the strongest climber of the Tour.

 

[ray j willings]

Re:

Quintana is very unlikely to win the Tour, but will he have the dubious pleasure of being the strongest climber of the Tour without winning it? Thus far, Froome has equaled or beat him on every occasion.

By my count, he lost 11 seconds at MdH, 63 seconds at PTM and 1 second after the Mende climb for a total of 75 seconds.

If he can gain more than 75 seconds in the Alps through climbing, he would be the strongest climber of the Tour.

That's a good stat. I had almost forgot about the early split. That in the end could be the winning moment for Froome.