National Football League

[Alpe d'Huez]

Recall Denver took this same action giving Peyton Manning a 5 year deal nearing his 36th birthday, and this was after his neck surgery and him missing a full year in Indy. This contract wasn't as binding as Wilson's however, and it was later restructured, but it was huge for the day at $96m. This isn't saying Wilson is on Manning's level. But Manning's first 2 years in Denver he picked up right where he left off in Indy. He started to slide after that, and his arm strength was fading, but he still had his uncanny ability to throw to the one single guy who was about to get open, and walked out a SB winner (though the Denver D was the reason). I am guessing this is exactly what they were expecting from Wilson.

Most teams do what Tampa did with Brady, or the Jets with Rodgers. Hand out a heap of cash, but on a 2-year deal. But keep in mind Rodgers actually is taking a pay cut for the Jets compared to what the Packers had been paying him. So injury or not, you can see what the Jets were thinking and how it could have made some sense.

Maybe Joe Flacco's agent can convince Denver to sign him next season to a 5-year, $240m deal, with $220m of it guaranteed?!

Deshaun Watson is only 28. Here's the thing though, he's shown flashes of excellence, but he's never been a winner. He's had more bad games than good ones. His best year in Houston was a lot of padded stats because the team lost a lot of games. His career record isn't very good, and when he has won, he heavily relied on the team to do so (like Cleveland this season). He's also quite frankly not the best person, has a sketchy background, and from what I can tell has shown little to no leadership for any team he's been on.

 

[Nomad]

Even QB drafting will be looked at differently after the Purdy pick and the constant fails of quite a few first round picks. Teams might start looking more at scheme fits, budget picks and QBs that won't need much development. The days of project picks like Lance with minimal college experience but with good athletic ability might also be over. Although many argued that Jones was the most NFL ready QB in his draft and he regressed quickly after a decent half season at the Patriots, Fields strength is still his athletic ability while Wilson hasn't showed enough of anything consistently and could end up like Lance, forgotten and not playing but still getting signed as a third option. Lawrence won't be confused with an elite QB Even QB drafting will be looked at differently after the Purdy pick and the constant fails of quite a few first round picks. Teams might start looking more at scheme fits, budget picks and QBs that won't need much development. The days of project picks like Lance with minimal college experience but with good athletic ability might also be over.

Nothing is going to change in continually drafting QBs in the 1st rd. In fact, I think it's only going to get worse. Owners are all looking for & willing to gamble on finding the next "Mahomes" - a rare super talent that can come in & instantly bring success to the team, leading them to the promised land.

Most of the mock drafts have QBs going 1, 2 & 3 - Caleb Williams/Drake Maye/Jayden Daniels.

Weiterleitungshinweis

www.google.com

And the nonsense has already started with comparisons being made with Williams & Mahomes, and Maye & Allen!

Weiterleitungshinweis

www.google.com

Weiterleitungshinweis

www.google.com

So, if this top three holds up in the upcoming draft here comes the huge rookie contracts & the outrageous signing bonuses, as well as the hype & expectations that these three guys will start day one & start leading their teams to the promised land.

And we recently saw a 1-2-3 QB selection in the 2021 draft with Lawrence, Wilson & Lance - and we all see how that's turning out! LOL

 

[Nomad]

Recall Denver took this same action giving Peyton Manning a 5 year deal nearing his 36th birthday, and this was after his neck surgery and him missing a full year in Indy. This contract wasn't as binding as Wilson's however, and it was later restructured, but it was huge for the day at $96m. This isn't saying Wilson is on Manning's level. But Manning's first 2 years in Denver he picked up right where he left off in Indy. He started to slide after that, and his arm strength was fading, but he still had his uncanny ability to throw to the one single guy who was about to get open, and walked out a SB winner (though the Denver D was the reason). I am guessing this is exactly what they were expecting from Wilson.

Manning really started to fall apart that last year at Denver (2015) missing almost half the season with the plantar fasciitis. And when he came back in time for the playoffs, he didn't look good at all. Recall he had the worst performance of any SB winning QB in the history of the big game. Truth be told - the Denver D won the day. And was surprising that Elway begged him not to retire & consider coming back for one more year (last year on his contract). But Manning, at 39, at least had the dignity to realize his declining health & retire in honor.

It's funny with all this hoopla on Flacco now. He's a major injury waiting to happen. And there's no way he could handle a full season. He's 38 with a plethora of past injuries. This was a complete desperation move by Cleveland, IMO (I'm surprised he passed the physical).

And I don't know what is with these old stiffs still wanting to play or coming back into the league way past their prime. After age ~35, their physical skills significantly start diminishing from the years of brutal accumulated hits, as well as age-related degenerative changes of the tendons & ligaments. Look at the Rodgers disaster: Just three plays into the start of his new season with the Jets and he blows his Achilles up! He's effin 40 yrs old with a pretty significant injury history...and still wants to play? Crazy, insane...massive ego? So, when they get hurt after getting clobbered by some 6-5, 275 lb, 4.5 40, stud DE/LB - or they rip a tendon or ligament on a non-contact play - I'm not feeling sorry for these guys one bit. Lol

 

[Sciatic]

Not sure what the Broncos were thinking giving Russ such a huge contract. He was a few months shy of 34 and had come off an injury plagued season. He’s played better than last year, but it seems like Payton is done with him.

Sounds striking similar to the contract a British/South African pro cyclist we all know!

 

[Sciatic]

What made the Wilson and Watson contracts so absurd was the huge amount of guaranteed money neither of whom has played near their peak for many years. I think Lamar's contract extension was also pretty heavy on guaranteed money as well but the Ravens had little options in that negotiation and he is still in his peak years anyway. No one is talking about his contract at the moment............

Watching Russ in pretty much every game (I’m in Seattle) during his last two years, two thoughts frequently came to mind. First, like every Hawk fan, you could easily see that he’d lost some quickness and some other quality (agility?) that had made him magical in his escapability before that. But, second, after watching his offensive get shoved back into his face play after play, I sometimes wondered if he could be even better than his peak passing years if he could sit behind an o-line like Dallas and a few other teams had in those years. But Seattle never made that investment. Did Denver believe they could provide that?
It’s true that a lot of his sacks in later years came from holding the ball too long. But for most of his years here he didn’t even have a good offensive line and never had a great on (possible exception of his two years).

 

[movingtarget]

Watching Russ in pretty much every game (I’m in Seattle) during his last two years, two thoughts frequently came to mind. First, like every Hawk fan, you could easily see that he’d lost some quickness and some other quality (agility?) that had made him magical in his escapability before that. But, second, after watching his offensive get shoved back into his face play after play, I sometimes wondered if he could be even better than his peak passing years if he could sit behind an o-line like Dallas and a few other teams had in those years. But Seattle never made that investment. Did Denver believe they could provide that?
It’s true that a lot of his sacks in later years came from holding the ball too long. But for most of his years here he didn’t even have a good offensive line and never had a great on (possible exception of his two years).

Agree and I was was amazed that he was rarely injured although he would get sacked quite a lot. He only really started getting injured at Seattle in his final two seasons and one of those was the hand injury that kept him out for a while. As a 49ers fan most of us were glad to see him go while appreciating how many times he broke 49er hearts especially with late wins !

 

[Oldermanish]

Not sure what the Broncos were thinking giving Russ such a huge contract. He was a few months shy of 34 and had come off an injury plagued season. He’s played better than last year, but it seems like Payton is done with him.

Let's call it what it was; a QB that prospered along with many other talented players that happened to be good on both sides of the ball. The next year could've been better with Marshawn doing what everyone in the World thought he could. The desperate efforts to regain that magic with Wilson's ambitions and image-building pretty much doomed any prospects. Why Denver, thankfully for Seattle; didn't recognize that Wilson's body-building regime and private coaching wasn't changing his dependence on stellar receivers and running backs making his options rich. Left to running for his life while he had lost that fluidity was obvious to many.
He can't be blamed for ambition. Those that fed it this deep into his career can only blame themselves for their own hubris, too.
Purdy, on the other hand; is a team investment like what a more humble Wilson provided. The lack of attitude, piety and a huge contract likely impresses the O-talent like the Line, recievers and the defense. SF's D probably loves knowing they can play aggressively and it's gotta be a fun team to be a player.

If you accept those two scenarios you can also appreciate why Flacco and Cleveland are loving life. I keep saying it but the same could hold true with Minshew and the Colts. Chemistry and confidence shouldn't be discounted. If A-aron Rodgers does play he should embrace that or be the least loved individual in New York City should he make it back.

 

[Oldermanish]

Watching Russ in pretty much every game (I’m in Seattle) during his last two years, two thoughts frequently came to mind. First, like every Hawk fan, you could easily see that he’d lost some quickness and some other quality (agility?) that had made him magical in his escapability before that. But, second, after watching his offensive get shoved back into his face play after play, I sometimes wondered if he could be even better than his peak passing years if he could sit behind an o-line like Dallas and a few other teams had in those years. But Seattle never made that investment. Did Denver believe they could provide that?
It’s true that a lot of his sacks in later years came from holding the ball too long. But for most of his years here he didn’t even have a good offensive line and never had a great on (possible exception of his two years).

Although the Seattle line wasn't great; Wilson's mobility was a novelty to the opposing defenses and his receivers were still very good.
After that; D's adapted.

 

[Sciatic]

Let's call it what it was; a QB that prospered along with many other talented players that happened to be good on both sides of the ball. The next year could've been better with Marshawn doing what everyone in the World thought he could.

Great points. Especially about Lynch: while he of course has tons of plaudits and praise for his downfield beastmode runs and bullish attitude, there is a one part of his game that is seems (to me) much underestimated but was critical to Wilson’s early success. Marshawn had the best lateral jump-cut at the line of scrimmage of any back in the league at that time. It saved Wilson’s butt even when the move didn’t produce a big run. But given the shaky quality of the line, it meant Lynch turned
a 2-yard loss into a 3-yard gain on a regular basis. So instead being in a 3rd and 12 situation it might 3rd and 6. Wilson excelled in the latter d&d because of the threat of his running and less time needed for patterns to develop.

This clip is obviously a move he makes out in space, not in the backfield (couldn’t find any of just that), but you get the idea:

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[Alpe d'Huez]

It's funny with all this hoopla on Flacco now. He's a major injury waiting to happen. And there's no way he could handle a full season. He's 38 with a plethora of past injuries. This was a complete desperation move by Cleveland, IMO (I'm surprised he passed the physical).

I think he's only playing because he's likely fully healed after barely playing the last 3 seasons, and he knows he'll only be playing a total of 61/2 games this season, plus playoffs. I also see zero chance he'd last a full season, and was joking that Denver would sign him to a big deal. I agree he's likely one play from being injured, and out for the season/career.

But this brings up another thought. I can see once the NFL goes to 18, or 20, 22 games, rosters expanding to 60, 70 players, that a team could have a platoon of QBs, and in such a season a 38 year old QB may only be asked to play 6 games!

I fully agree with you we'll see 3 QBs go in the first five picks in the draft, maybe 1, 2, 3. The hype on this year's draft is over the top. Yes, I think it's better than last year, but pundits are going nuts, just like you posted. I also think it's quite possible a full six QBs will be taken in the first round. The three you listed plus Penix, McCarthey, and Nix.

I've written many times on this phenomenon, about coaches and GMs getting giddy about college QBs, and I don't see it ending anytime soon.

It’s true that a lot of his sacks in later years came from holding the ball too long. But for most of his years here he didn’t even have a good offensive line and never had a great on (possible exception of his two years).

A few other things happened. First, they started paying Russ a heap of money. And he and his agent fought hard for those deals. Recall he was trying to get a fully guaranteed deal long before Watson managed to sucker Cleveland into it. As a result, their cap room dropped quite a bit, like it always does when most of your money goes to one guy. Next, Tom Cable was the Seahawks OL coach, starting with their SB win. He actually had been a HC, and many other offensive jobs, with some success, but for whatever the reason he wasn't able to make lemonade with what he was given on the OL in his last few years (2017).

 

[movingtarget]

Russell Wilson reveals Broncos approached him about contract during bye week

The Denver Broncos benching Russell Wilson surprised many this week, but not Wilson. Apparently, he'd known it might be possible since the end of October.

www.nfl.com

 

[Alpe d'Huez]

Sean Payton has said he had nothing to do with that, that he doesn't discuss contracts with players. Presuming this is true, it reveals a few things: Payton had to be aware of it, had to be discussing performance issues with George Paton, maybe even Greg Penner. Russ has been benched then for what reason? Because Stidham gives them a better chance to win? Based on what exactly? A horrible game by not only Wilson but the entire team against the Patriots? Colin Cowherd and a few others have implied Payton has a system he wants to run, and it looks like Russ wasn't running that system, instead running around making his own plays. Maybe.

One great game today, DET@DAL. Curious which team is ready for the playoffs.

 

[BullsFan22]

Sean Payton has said he had nothing to do with that, that he doesn't discuss contracts with players. Presuming this is true, it reveals a few things: Payton had to be aware of it, had to be discussing performance issues with George Paton, maybe even Greg Penner. Russ has been benched then for what reason? Because Stidham gives them a better chance to win? Based on what exactly? A horrible game by not only Wilson but the entire team against the Patriots? Colin Cowherd and a few others have implied Payton has a system he wants to run, and it looks like Russ wasn't running that system, instead running around making his own plays. Maybe.

One great game today, DET@DAL. Curious which team is ready for the playoffs.

Lions have been money in prime time, Cowboys have been money at home, but struggle against good teams. If both play well, I think the Lions take it.

 

[Nomad]

Sean Payton has said he had nothing to do with that, that he doesn't discuss contracts with players. Presuming this is true, it reveals a few things: Payton had to be aware of it, had to be discussing performance issues with George Paton, maybe even Greg Penner. Russ has been benched then for what reason? Because Stidham gives them a better chance to win? Based on what exactly? A horrible game by not only Wilson but the entire team against the Patriots?

FWIW, I occasionally listen to one of our local radio affiliates that covers Denver sports talk. The Broncos coverage team is Brandon Stokley (former Bronco/Colt) & Philip Lindsay (former Bronco RB). Their information is that Payton actually  believes Stidham is the future QB for the organization. Consider this to be somewhat of an audition for Stidham. Two winnable games to close out the season on a positive note & as well as momentum to carry into next season - if Stidham performs well enough to be the starter next year.

I don't know much about Stidham - you probably have a better analysis of him based on those 2 games he started at the Raiders last year. He's a little undersized by today's standards (6-2, ~218) but supposedly possesses an above-average arm & can make all the NFL throws - though he's deep ball is a little compromised.

The problem with Wilson is the super-high expectations that accompany a SB winning QB & future HOF - nonetheless the outrageous contract he was given! He's simply expected to perform miracles & win despite any legitimate offensive pitfalls. As we talked about so many times here, QBs of that caliber are expected to win a lot of games & lead the team to the promised land. Last year's poor performance by the team was conveniently blamed on Hackett & his staff (Payton calling Hackett the worst coach he's ever seen. Lol). This year with the mighty Payton & his staff, the expectations were for the Wilson-led Broncos to be contenders for not only the playoffs but the division title as well.

Clearly a failure this year (unless they win out & by some miracle make the playoffs). How much of this is Wilson & how much of this is Payton? I really don't know but there are times that Wilson could have played much better & not lose some games. The Houston game comes to mind when he had a chance to win the game in the closing moments but instead threw that costly pick in the endzone. There's been other turnovers by him that the other team capitalized on & scored points. These blunders simply can't happen with a QB of that status & the big $$$ he's being paid. He's expected to be a playmaker at all times & make things happen against the worst adversity. There's no margin of error for these caliber of players & the dough they make (recall what happen to the great Eli Manning at the Giants for poor performance & not winning enough games). That's the price that comes with iconic QBs who start to regress in the latter stages of their careers. People look at how Brady waltzed right into Tampa Bay & led the team to a SB victory his first season there! He made Bruce Arians look like a genius. Lol.

So, it's the Stidham show & his audition for the starting role next year:

Weiterleitungshinweis

www.google.com

 

[Alpe d'Huez]

I don't know much about Stidham - you probably have a better analysis of him based on those 2 games he started at the Raiders last year. He's a little undersized by today's standards (6-2, ~218) but supposedly possesses an above-average arm & can make all the NFL throws - though he's deep ball is a little compromised.

That's him! I have a feeling he's well versed in the playbook and probably will follow coaching instructions to a T. He can get rid of the ball quick, 1-2 progressions and let it rip. He moves okay with a pocket, and can throw on the move okay too. He played quite well in a losing cause against SF last year. Then against KC when the Raiders fell behind, they challenged him to throw deep, and as you noted, he could physically get the ball there but not exactly with Drew Brees like accuracy.

I honestly don't know if Stidham is a true starting QB. But he's not bad, and I see no problem in his future being a coveted backup QB for several years. I was hoping the Raiders would keep him, thinking he could at least be a "bridge" QB until the Raiders found a future QB they really like.

Apparently former GM Dave Ziegler wanted to keep Stidham, see if they could trade up to get CJ Stroud, if not, then sign Jacoby Brissett, then maybe draft a QB in the mid-rounds, keep 3rd stringer Chase Garbers (not much of an arm, but decent decision maker) or wait and see what 2024 held. But Josh McDaniels vetoed him, signed Jimmy Garappolo (who Ziegler didn't want, thinking he was injury prone, past his prime, and far too costly) and before the Raiders could do much Stidham signed with Denver, and I can't blame the guy. The more info that leaks out, the more it appears Ziegler made most of the good decisions (what there were), and McDaniels made most if not all the bad ones for the Raiders. But Dave came from the same faucet and got thrown out with the bath water. Apparently Mark Davis had considered keeping Ziegler when McDaniels was fired, but he also previously considered promoting Champ Kelly to GM when Ziegler got hired, so Mark was very comfortable with Champ stepping up when Mark made Pierce HC. So far, so good with them both, and I think it would be a real travesty if Davis doesn't keep them both.

Ziegler will get GM attention this off season, and if not a job offer, he should get signed somewhere as a player personnel or head of scouting.

 

[movingtarget]

Detroit and Cowboys been an arm wrestle so far. More defense than offense.

 

[Alpe d'Huez]

What a cluster of an ending. Game was close, some aggressive defense, but a lot of mistakes and sloppy play. It's hard to tell if the Lions botched it, the refs botched it or what. It sure seemed like the football gods wanted the Cowboys to win this game, but who knows. Either way, I didn't come away impressed with either team, and have just about lost faith both to win much of anything in the playoffs.

A heap of games in the morning tomorrow.

 

[BullsFan22]

The refs botched it, for some reason the nfl really hates the Lions. That said, just kick the ep and send it to ot.

 

[movingtarget]

If the Eagles lose and the 49ers win which is probably unlikely, 49ers wrap up the one seed.

 

[movingtarget]

Analyzing NFL's head coaching carousel as end of 2023 regular season looms

NFL Network Insiders Ian Rapoport and Tom Pelissero take a snapshot look at some of the NFL’s hot seats and plans for three jobs that are open already, based on conversations with numerous NFL sources.

www.nfl.com

 

[jmdirt]

I'm back to civilization!

SEA with the win!

I don't agree with going for 2 (three times), like DET just did.

 

[Alpe d'Huez]

Another disastrous game for NFL officiating. An absolute, total embarassment. I spent too much time reading up on this, re-watching it.

That extra point play is a perfect example why the ref's need to be mic'd up, which I have said before, that the XFL did with great success. This would have solved everything.

Dan Campbell post-game said he clearly explained to the officials what he was attempting to do, players and everything. But we will never know. Taylor Decker (who caught the pass) talked to the referees, but we will never know what he said, or they said. But after he talked to them, the other tackle, Dan Skipper also talked to them. We will never know what he said either. The Dallas stadium announcer (apparently) reported Skipper as eligible. Did the officials mention this to the stadium officials? We will never know. Decker caught the pass, Lions take the lead. But then the officials threw the flag. And a group of officials were discussing the play. At first the Lions appeared happy with the call, and my guess is because someone on the team (Goff? He was standing there) heard something about the tackle reporting eligible. But we'll never know, because the ref's weren't mic'd up. They then changed their mind or whatever they did (if only they were mic'd up), and called the penalty effectively giving the game to Dallas. One of the announcers said it could have been illegal formation. However, from what I read on line, that's not true presuming only Decker reported eligible, and Skipper was not. Again, we'll never, ever know.

Watching the Cowboys collapse at the end was something. Watching the Lions inability to execute much of the game something else. Why the Lions didn't go for 1 and feed off the energy from the highly questionable call into OT, we'll never know.

 

[movingtarget]

Miami missing Waddle and Mostert from the Ravens game. Not good..........seems Mostert might play after all but Ramsey is also in doubt

 

[SHAD0W93]

Looking at just the score it’s easy to say both teams offense played bad and defense played well but both offenses were moving the ball. Cowboys definitely got the turnovers when it needed them (and a big reason why they won) and a fourth and goal stop but its own offense was worse compared to their 30 plus points per game at home average. I think the Lions overall played better than Cowboys but Lamb was absolutely destroying Lions defense. Another game decided in a way as well by going for it and not attempting the 3 points. Then at the end like Alpe, said we will never know who’s at fault but Lions are 100000% pointing the blame at the refs with the video evidence. The first 2 point conversion attempt was fine, but after that I think they should have kicked the extra point and see what happens in OT. Absolutely they should have done gone for the PAT on the third attempt because their defense had been playing well against the Cowboys, Lamb was the one beating them up and Lions in theory would be rejuvenated by in their mind an inaccurate penalty.

'No (Bleeping) Way!' Did Cowboys Beat Detroit? Or Did Refs Screw Lions on 2-Point Conversion?

'No (Bleeping) Way!' Did Dallas Cowboys Beat Detroit 20-19? Or Did Refs Screw the Lions on 2-Point Conversion?

www.si.com

This shows video of Goff sending them to report to the refs and them speaking to the ref. But we will never know what was said unless one of the players was mic’s up(doubtful),

Overall I think both teams can make it to the divisional round but think Lions can still do something in the playoffs.

I'm back to civilization!

SEA with the win!

I don't agree with going for 2 (three times), like DET just did.

I agree with the first time, especially by at first they looked like they got it but the other two were questionable, especially the last. But that’s how Campbell isn

 

[SHAD0W93]

Miami missing Waddle and Mostert from the Ravens game. Not good..........

There’s always hope without them


Right now I’m in that spot of wanting Bills to do well so they keep the 6th seed and go to Chiefs to knock them off while Dolphins win the division but most likely it’s going to come down to their rumble in Miami.